I'll make this short. I didn't really like it. FFXIII has better combat mechanic, but I do like how you can customize your gambits so the game can play for you. Once you level your character high enough, you can learn almost anything and everything. I stopped following the plot halfway. Beaten it once and that was enough for me. I prefer to play FFVII, FFVIII or FFX over FFXII anytime. Vaan was uninteresting. Balthier is by far my favorite though. No one from that cast even comes close.
If only FFXII was not limited by the hardware's limitations of PS2, it would be tremendously awesome (the queuing magic casting during battle sucks) from purely gameplay perspective. Had a blast performing hunts against various monstrosities (Gilgamesh's battles were so ridiculously awesome). Aah if only FFXII and FFXIII switched places...........
The story and characters though. Eh.... I felt utterly flat/nothing when I finished the game... they just did not connect me emotionally in any way. That's why when Vaan said to Ashe later during the game: "We're friends, right?" I literally said whaaaa......?
There's nothing wrong with magic in VS, its that VS has a mystical arc to the story that gets kinda loopy and convoluted towards the end. Tactics was worse in that regard so the whole thing with Venat/Vayne/Cid didn't bother me, it just struck me as par for the course.
There's nothing wrong with magic in VS, its that VS has a mystical arc to the story that gets kinda loopy and convoluted towards the end. Tactics was worse in that regard so the whole thing with Venat/Vayne/Cid didn't bother me, it just struck me as par for the course.
I personally found the battle system ok, just need some tweaks--like the retarded queue magic system, for example (but this, to my understanding was caused by PS2's limitations) and the License Board.
It's story is no less bad then XII's. XII just sounds better. They almost have the same story. I don't care if a game is linear. I could care less about the extra stuff in XII. Hunts are boring.
Aeana said:
I wish FF13 had gambits or some sort of ability priority system.
I personally found the battle system ok, just need some tweaks--like the retarded queue magic system, for example (but this, to my understanding was caused by PS2's limitations) and the License Board.
I was fine with the battle system after I set the character I controlled to full manual. After that, was all good.
Rahxephon91 said:
It's story is no less bad then XII's. XII just sounds better. They almost have the same story. I don't care if a game is linear. I could care less about the extra stuff in XII. Hunts are boring.
Quick aside, it's "couldn't care less". Folks on GAF, as I have observed from my time here, are real particular about that saying.
Anyway, you don't care about extra stuff? Hunts are boring? ...I'm just gonna agree to disagree with your opinions regarding FFXIII and call it a day. Have a good one.
There's nothing wrong with magic in VS, its that VS has a mystical arc to the story that gets kinda loopy and convoluted towards the end. Tactics was worse in that regard so the whole thing with Venat/Vayne/Cid didn't bother me, it just struck me as par for the course.
That mystical arc in VS is key to the plot and was interlaced from the beginning.
Remember, magic had leaked from Ivalice for eons, and very little was left except in wellsprings like Lea Monde which was actively bringing it from other planes. Hence why Sydney set up shop there. Hence why the Cardinal and later Guildenstern coveted it after confirmation that Sydney had mastered its drawing forth. Hence why Rosencratz was so dangerous against foes who had grown dependant on it.
I personally didn't care for the turn XII took towards the end, not because it became more mystical, but because it began ignoring other forces in the plot, and quite frankly became un-Matsunoey (you can tell easily where his touch was lightest).
It's story is no less bad then XII's. XII just sounds better. They almost have the same story. I don't care if a game is linear. I could care less about the extra stuff in XII. Hunts are boring.
There are a lot of factions, swerves, manipulations and betrayals, the questions about Sydney's intent, Guildenstern's intent, Lea Monde's true power, Ashe's past, the way its delivered that its easy to miss or misinterpret what the hell just happened. I don't think you can play the game once and get a real good grasp of exactly what happened. I remember being fairly bewildered when I finished it and the only thing I was really clear on was
Guildenstern was a cheap motherfucker
. There is just a shit ton going on and I honestly don't think it was told in the most concise way. To be fair, VS probably expects you to play it a few times and I still haven't done my second run through yet.
In terms of the Lucavi, you're right to a degree that they aren't necessarily convoluted, although somehow they control fate or destiny or whatever through the Nethicite King...I think it was more of them being unnecessary. Why does Venat have to influence/control Vayne, he could just be a crazy sociopath and that would have been reason enough.
There are a lot of factions, swerves, manipulations and betrayals, the questions about Sydney's intent, Guildenstern's intent, Lea Monde's true power, Ashe's past, the way its delivered that its easy to miss or misinterpret what the hell just happened. I don't think you can play the game once and get a real good grasp of exactly what happened. I remember being fairly bewildered when I finished it and the only thing I was really clear on was
Guildenstern was a cheap motherfucker
. There is just a shit ton going on and I honestly don't think it was told in the most concise way. To be fair, VS probably expects you to play it a few times and I still haven't done my second run through yet.
In terms of the Lucavi, you're right to a degree that they aren't necessarily convoluted, although somehow they control fate or destiny or whatever through the Nethicite King...I think it was more of them being unnecessary. Why does Venat have to influence/control Vayne, he could just be a crazy sociopath and that would have been reason enough.
The universe of FFXIII is a lot more interesting to me, personally. Not how the story is presented during the game, but the overall universe. It's a lot more fascinating than FFXII.
It's a shame that Matsuno seem always inject magic mumbo-jumbo to his storylines--I would like to see his work going all political straight from the beginning to the end without any gods/goddesses/demons/whatever. FF Tactics and FFXII suffered from this, in my personal opinion.
Its been 11 years since I played it but the honest truth is I got a better grasp on the game's story reading about it on message boards and wikipedia than actually playing it. Just so we're clear, I'm not attacking VS or saying it sucks, I just think the story can get messy at times.
XII is really great. I recently went back and replayed it and gained a whole new appreciation for how detailed the game is.
Balthier-Best. Fucking. Character. In. The. Game. This is bar none. His mere presence just radiates badassery, and his voice actor did his job really well at portraying his slightly flamboyant and carefree attitude. You can tell he doesn't take Vaan THAT seriously in his dream, but there is a mutual respect that develops between them.
Other than Rosencrantz(who is so obviously a snake that even the people in the story are immediately repulsed) and Guildenstern, I don't remember many betrayals.
Prior to the ending Lea Monde is the vessel for the Gran Grimoire, which is essentially a lot of magical energy compressed and stored into a small area.
Ashley's past is purposely ambiguous to both the player and the character himself because his character arc is about him deciding to believe himself and not what others tell him to believe.
It only works if he is questioning himself. Wanting to know is kinda missing the point of his character.
truly101 said:
In terms of the Lucavi, you're right to a degree that they aren't necessarily convoluted, although somehow they control fate or destiny or whatever through the Nethicite King...
What are you talking about? Nethecite King? That stuff isn't in Tactics. Unless you meant the Occuria.
truly101 said:
I think it was more of them being unnecessary. Why does Venat have to influence/control Vayne, he could just be a crazy sociopath and that would have been reason enough.
She still is the main character, if you choose to term her so based on her importance to the story.
When people say "x should be the main character" I think you're saying you want to story to be told from their perspective? I think the story told from her perspective would have been boring.
Ondore might be the narrator of this story, but it's seen through Vaan's eyes, which is actually much more interesting than seeing it through the eyes of someone like Ashe.
Vaan's really not a bad character, unless you're talking about his appearance, which isn't that offensive either.
I really want to get this but my time of playing it elsewhere is only limited to an hour or two and I know there's more options but I don't really like how you just use the regular attack then wait around. I saw vids of a lot of people just running around with auto attack, not really doing anything. To me that just doesn't seem fun but IDK. It'd be better when you're doing more than this in heated battles but how often are those?
@Vert, Bel
You might have answered your own questions. It might not be for everyone.
My joy from the game comes from not having any battle transitions. Developing/leveling your character is quick and fun. XII zaps the cumbersome out of FF. If you enjoy making a lot of decisions during battle like in a traditional turn-based system you might not like it.
But I think most who play XII like the experience of setting up their team/gambits and then letting the battle unfold, making strategic adjustments in battle as necessary.
(and thanks to this thread I discovered my mid-playthrough of a lvl 90 New game+ in IZJS. Thanks!)
Like you, I to started playing FFXII, again, and my current time clocks in around 30+hours. My history with this game has been rocky. I could never finish the game from start to finish cause either I lost interest in it or a new game came out. This time around I knew I had to get something that will capture and hold my attention. So, I began seeking out what could divert said attention and also I needed to "remain" interested too. With no big games out and an idea of writing down my adventures in a Journal, I downloaded/sync a slew of podcasts into my ipod and began my journey.
I use the podcasts for times when I know for the next "x" amount of time I will be grinding and the Journal as a story reminder and refresher (which has helped amazingly). This has been a great experience for me cause now I have this new appreciation for the game and it's story, characters and of course the gameplay.
@Vert, Bel
You might have answered your own questions. It might not be for everyone.
My joy from the game comes from not having any battle transitions. Developing/leveling your character is quick and fun. XII zaps the cumbersome out of FF. If you enjoy making a lot of decisions during battle like in a traditional turn-based system you might not like it.
But I think most who play XII like the experience of setting up their team/gambits and then letting the battle unfold, making strategic adjustments in battle as necessary.
(and thanks to this thread I discovered my mid-playthrough of a lvl 90 New game+ in IZJS. Thanks!)
I have, to my recollection, never tag quoted anyone. Though I considered it here...
Seriously though, I guess I don't know where you're coming from. I'm currently playing through XIII and find myself constantly thinking "Man, wish this was the gambit system". What they have in XIII is so rudimentary and takes so much control away I just do not understand how you could equate the two systems. Imo, they are very different.
One is fun, deep, and rewarding... the other is retarded (might as well be that stupid FF thing where you switch people's clothes to change abilities or whatever crap that was).
Still no Bazaar encyclopedia in the game. There's also the failure of having characters stats growth not linked to their jobs. Stats growth is different for each characters and is independant from their jobs. Some characters are thus better at jobs than others. For instance, Basch is always the worst mage because of his lower MPs and Magic score.
Job grids are way too small. By the time I reach the first Cid Battle I have my grid maxed aside the expensive FF Weapons licenses. Granted I do a lot of exploration/loot hunting/stealing but that's just sad to have a limit that can be reach so easily.
I liked it a lot. Wish the story went a bit longer and expanded more in the backstory/details. I wanted to explore more of the world. Also I never disliked Vaan as much as other people did.. he acts so inoffensive compared to other FF protagonists that I don't care if he looks goofy.
I love the battle system so much~
The International Zodiac Job System makes it better.. wish they'd thought of that in the original version.
God, I can't believe I picked it up so close to the end of the PS2's life. Loved it. Tried to acquire every special weapon, went toe to toe to every summon, which was fucking balls to the walls sometimes; especially the thunder one.
Mained each person in one speciality, Vann being the only jack of all trades (but mostly sword and shield), and loved it. Especially the hostile/passive monster system, and weather design. How the hell could SE not expand on that!? Loved walking up to an elemental for the first time, feeling badass, only to almost get my entire party wiped out.
Whoever say's FFXII is mediocre, fine, that's your opinion, and I won't begrudge you that, but those who say that it's bad, or the worst in the series? Get the fuck outta here and stop drinking whatever the hell is making you crazy; because you're fucking crazy.
I have, to my recollection, never tag quoted anyone. Though I considered it here...
Seriously though, I guess I don't know where you're coming from. I'm currently playing through XIII and find myself constantly thinking "Man, wish this was the gambit system". What they have in XIII is so rudimentary and takes so much control away I just do not understand how you could equate the two systems. Imo, they are very different.
FFXIII takes XII's idea of a more macro battle system with programmable AI and attempts to make a more involved/actiony system. The roles of the paradigm system are just pre-programed gambits that you switch between to depending on the situation.
That's how I see 13's system. A kind of streamlined approach to XII's system. A reaction to all the complaints about XII's battle system not feeling involved or fun. If you value complete control then I see how it displeases you.
One is fun, deep, and rewarding... the other is retarde
I'm playing FF12 Zodiac edition right now. I stopped playing it to type this message.
I love having access to the majority of gambits so early in the game. It makes replaying it much easier and more fun. Especially with the fast forward feature.
I'm playing FF12 Zodiac edition right now. I stopped playing it to type this message.
I love having access to the majority of gambits so early in the game. It makes replaying it much easier and more fun. Especially with the fast forward feature.
the only ff story i didn't care about, yet i don't care that i don't care. ff12 is endorphin rush after endorphin rush, and by the time i reached the skyline in archades, i wanted to hurl myself off it because i know that a video game, or real life for that matter, will never grant me that feeling of adventure that ff12 gave me. the worldbuilding is absolutely insane.
it also didn't help the story's pacing when you're granted all those exploration and sidequest avenues that i was dying to check out.
This is a terrible argument... because FFXIII does play itself! You have zero control. Pick a paradigm and watch!
At least in XII you can design the battle strategy. Yeah... you watch, but you watch your own design. You cannot do this in XIII. And in XII, you can do shit manually if you want. You cannot do this in XIII.
If anything... the "playing itself" criticism applies more to XIII than XII.
