• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

RTTP: La-Mulana | The toughest archaeological action-adventure metroidvania ever!

1upsuper

Member
Hello, everyone. Today I’d like to talk about what is perhaps my favorite game of all time: LA-MULANA! It has taken me ten years to finally beat this game, and now I’m bursting at the seams to talk to people about it.

So what is La-Mulana?

According to the official website, La-Mulana is a “Ruins Exploration Archaeological Action Game.” What that means in practice is that the game is a mix of Indiana Jones, Maze of Galious (MSX metroidvania), and a bit of FEZ, plus incredibly challenging puzzles that make Shadowgate look like peek-a-boo.

There are two versions of LM:
the first was a 2005 freeware title that looks like an MSX game:
lamulana2.jpg

The second was a 2011 paid remake which is available on WiiWare (avoid this version if you can; it’s missing some cool bonus content), Steam, GOG, and Vita (this version adds a bestiary and some very minor puzzle tweaks. It’s technically the best version but by no means essential. The majority of players stick with the PC releases).
The remake changes a lot; lots of puzzles are different, bosses are almost completely different, it has a 16/32-bit pixel art style, and the bonus dungeon is completely redone. The remake looks like this:

If you’re curious about the story, here’s the basic premise. Lemeza Kosugi, an esteemed archaeology professor, gets a letter from his rival, who happens to be his father, saying that he has finally discovered the ruins of La-Mulana. If the fertile crescent is considered the cradle of civilization in the real world, LM is the cradle of every civilization – all the world’s different civilizations were born inside LM before expanding outward due to story reasons. Each area of the game is based on one or two real-world civilizations, such as Mesopotamia or India. Lemeza decides to chase after his father in order to learn the secrets of humanity in these treacherous ruins…

It’s easy enough to say the game plays like a metroidvania with an Indiana Jones-esque setting, but that really doesn’t get at what makes this game so unique. The gameplay is super solid, technical, and challenging, with a strict jump mechanic taken straight out of Maze of Galious. The closest comparison that most people would probably be familiar with is Super Ghouls ‘n Ghosts, though you do not start with a double jump in LM.

The real bread and butter of LM is the impressive amount of areas and puzzles, which make LM, in my opinion, the hardest game I have ever played. The puzzles are obtuse. They are not easily solved, and some of them are downright mean. The first area of the game, the Gate of Guidance, will probably make you feel like a genius before making you feel like an idiot for the rest of the game. The puzzles are everywhere, and you won’t even notice a lot of them are there. Most of the hints come from environmental clues as well as stone tablets, which are written in La-Mulanese. The main character, Lemeza Kosugi, carries around an MSX computer and you can buy and find various software for his computer that perform different functions. One provides a rudimentary map, for example. In addition, there are various equippable items that help you solve puzzles. One of the most important ones automatically translates La-Mulanese into readable English – it’s essential. At first, the tablets, which are always vague but never deceitful, are near their respective puzzles. But later on, you’ll find hints to puzzles in completely different areas, and you will need to write them down. Do it. Don’t assume you’ll remember them. You won’t. Write them down.

It is difficult to discuss what the puzzles are like since they’re so different from one another, but you get everything from block puzzles to button combos to breakable walls to using the right item at the right place, as well as many more complex and big-picture puzzles. Some of the hints simultaneously tell you about the ruins while also providing hints for certain puzzles.

The reason that I say the game is a bit like FEZ is that the game has some incredible reveals as you play that will really surprise you, and it has some really big-picture concepts and puzzles that show how incredibly well-crafted the game is. LM’s areas may seem self-contained, but you will quickly realize how deeply connected they are on multiple levels.

La-Mulana is not a game that I can recommend for everyone. It revels in the archaic idiosyncrasies of its influences, and it is even harder than you are imagining right now. But it is also the most rewarding game I have ever played. The rush you get when you solve a puzzle after piecing together hints from all over the place is so satisfying and really keeps you going. But I will tell you this: I am 99.9% sure you will get hopelessly stuck at some point and try as you might, you probably won’t figure out what to do. There are hints for every single puzzle and it is possible to solve them all without outside help, but some are still so challenging that you will probably need to look them up unless you want to brute force them or put in dozens and dozens of hours. I do not think you should avoid spoilers when you need them. There are hint guides online to help push you in the right direction when you need it. I’d say try your best on every puzzle, but when you feel hopeless, look up a hint. The game is too good to just stop playing and assume you’ll come back later, because that doesn’t work. You really need to play through the game within a couple months at most because you really need a good mental map of the world and a solid understanding of its mechanics to begin to work out some of its puzzles, and too much time away will make things too difficult.

If the above does not appeal to you, or if you don’t like obtuse puzzles and strict platforming, you should probably pass on this game, or at most try the freeware game to see if it appeals to you. It’s not for everyone, and that’s totally OK. But for those who are up for an incredible challenge, you will fall in love with La-Mulana. If you are OK with playing a game that doesn’t try to be accessible and will deeply challenge you, then please try LM.

I’ve had an on-again-off-again relationship with this game. I first tried the original freeware version a decade ago(?) and didn’t get very far. Over the years I’ve started this game many times and quit before getting too far in the game because I didn’t want to look up hints but I got too stuck on my own. Finally, about a month ago, I started the game again with the intention of finally beating it, and I DID, though I had to look up hints here and there. Sometimes I regretted looking up solutions, but other times I was so glad I did. I am thrilled that I finally played through the whole game because its one of those rare pieces of art/media/whatever that feels like it was custom made for me.

If I’ve sold you on LM, here are some helpful tips:

-Read the game’s manual. No really, read it. There’s one for the freeware version and the paid version. Pay close attention, too. Some helpful stuff might be just under your nose…

-Write down all the tablet hints and cross them off once you’ve solved the puzzle they relate to. There’s an in-game feature that lets you record tablet text at some point, but it has its drawbacks. Screencapping or writing them down on your own is much more helpful.

-If you get stuck, move onto another area. The game is surprisingly non-linear, and requires tons of backtracking. Take time away from the puzzle you’re stuck on and explore some other areas.

-Figure out all the nuances of the jump mechanic early. Some puzzles require you to really know how to work with it. Once you’ve got a handle on how it works, you can really use it to your advantage.

-Find the holy grail before you leave the Gate of Guidance. If you can’t find it, read the manual again and think outside the box a bit. You can find it before leaving that first area. Getting that item will make your life so much easier.

-Always keep lots of weights on you. There's no salty feeling quite like running out of them during a dais puzzle.

If you have any questions at all, please post them! I'd be happy to talk about this game or explain anything above in more detail. I love this game so much and I would love to talk about it here.

Edit: as SatelliteOfLove points out, LM has an amazing soundtrack. Even if the game doesn't appeal to you, I recommend you check out the OST. Here are some of my favorites:

The theme for the surface.
The Mausoleum of Giants.
The Tower of Ruin.

Edit 2: As some users below have pointed out, La-Mulana 2 is currently in the works! There was a kickstarter a couple years ago, but if you're itching to throw NIGORO some money, you can still pledge on playism's website. The game is supposed to come out this year.
 
Great thread.

I love this game, but in the way that I enjoy watching people who know what they're doing be good at it.

Like the speedrun at AGDQ was amazing and I really like watching Let's Plays of it when the person knows exactly what they're doing. It just makes for a really enjoyable experience.

As far as playing it, I totes blow at it.
 

Magikoopa24

Neo Member
Played a ton of this game a couple years ago, never got far but I've loved the let's plays I've watched (Deceasedcrab's reaction to hell temple's finale in both versions are beautiful). Can't wait for the sequel that I believe is coming this year, haven't seen anything from it.
 

Rhanitan

Member
Beat it twice before and loved it to death. It really feels like you are uncovering the mysteries of the world in those ruins.
 

tmarg

Member
Eventually I reached a point where I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing and quit. Also, some stuff wasn't really fair, like there was a boss I could get to but was completely impossible to beat without solving another puzzle.

Still really cool, I wish I had the kind of time it would take to actually beat it.
 
I played for a few hours before banging my head against some point where I just had no fucking clue what to do next. I still plan on going back to it at some point because I really appreciated just about every aspect of it I got to see.
 

1upsuper

Member
I played this for a few hours. It was hard as balls for me.

Eventually I reached a point where I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing and quit. Also, some stuff wasn't really fair, like there was a boss I could get to but was completely impossible to beat without solving another puzzle.

Still really cool, I wish I had the kind of time it would take to actually beat it.

I played for a few hours before banging my head against some point where I just had no fucking clue what to do next. I still plan on going back to it at some point because I really appreciated just about every aspect of it I got to see.

Yup, La-Mulana is no joke. This game is a real commitment, and one of the least accessible games I've ever played. It's an adventure like nothing else.
 

Airola

Member
This is the best game ever made.
My absolute Top 1 game of all time.

...and I still haven't beat it.
Can't beat the final boss.

However, my philosophy of video games is that games should not be beatable by default. The purest point of a video game is to be a challenge that only those who truly have the skills can beat it. A game of Solitaire would lose its point if it was something everyone would be bound to beat eventually. The same goes to Rubik's Cube. No-one is entitled to win the game. The game's premise should be that it beats the player. And this is what I've accepted long time ago. If I can't beat a game, it is not the game's fault. It is something the game was built to do from the get go. It's the natural state of the game. And only if I can build up my skills and understanding of a game to a certain level, then I might be able to beat it.

La-Mulana is the real evolution of video games.
It is the best game of all time.

I can't wait to play La-Mulana 2. I backed it on Kickstarter so it's already paid for me.
La-Mulana 2 and Twin Peaks season 3 are the Holy Grails of entertainment for me.
 

Solaire of Astora

Death by black JPN
I absolutely love la mulana, even though it's the game that beat me harder than any other. Had this game came out when I was a kid, I can definitely see myself persevering with the help of my friends. It's the kind of game where I think I would need to be part of a concentrated group effort over the course of months/years to beat. The kind of game where I'd really benefit from having regular discussions with my friends about what we found/hints that we read etc. But on my own, I only managed to beat the first boss and that took a lot of hints online just to get that far. I even watched a few speed runs, which is something I never do unless I've finished a game. I was hoping they'd offer some clues, but I felt left behind after a few minutes.

I really respect the developers of the game, because la mulana is a master class of game design. This game plays by its own rules. It offers up an amazing journey and demands a lot of commitment from players, and that's great. Too many games pander to the notion that games must be designed to be beaten, whereas La Mulana really feels like some twisted ruin that was designed to guard great secrets and kill those who dare to go after them.

So with that said, I'll be in on day one for la mulana 2, but I'm slightly conflicted in my expectations. On a personal level, I want to do better at the sequel. However, that may mean that the game is easier, and out of respect for those who persevered with the first game, I don't want the sequel to be an easier imitation of that.

Then again, perhaps with the help of other players on gaf that will come with getting into the game at launch, I may just do a little better.


However, my philosophy of video games is that games should not be beatable by default. The purest point of a video game is to be a challenge that only those who truly have the skills can beat it.

I really like the way you think.
 

xelios

Universal Access can be found under System Preferences
Wonderful game in my favorite genre of games. Hard as hell though. Like, brutal. I still haven't finished re-playing it via the Steam version because I got discouraged pretty early on.
 

Ilvocare

Member
I figure this is as good a place as any to mention that I was playing the remake of this not too long ago and got, like, hopelessly stumped at around the third or fourth area or so, where it feels like I can't proceed until I figure out some shit regarding the whole layout of the place...

Honestly the platforming is basic, the boss design (especially in the remake) seems both really simple and really unfair (as someone who tends to play games with minimal equipment most of the time, it took quite a bit of swallowing my pride to realize some bosses outright REQUIRE usage of subweapons if you want to take no damage. Good fucking luck beating
Sakit's second phase
with just the whip and no damage!), and the puzzles in this game feel like the worst kind of puzzle. i.e. the information to solving the puzzle is as difficult and obscure to uncover, if not more so, then actually solving it.

not to mention I feel like even when you DO have the information you need to make some ludicrous leaps of logic in order to interpret the info correctly

I have like two things in particular which bug me and I would gladly accept notifications from other people telling me how exactly the game hints at the 'solution'

-
Finding Iris's pendant feels like a fucking crapshoot. Oh ok it's in the Temple of the Sun. What's that? The room it's in is hidden by a completely nondescript ceiling that's not shown on your map at all and which you will probably end up abusing the hitbox of the whip to accidentally break? And where was this note to cracking the code again???
-
I feel like there's more to the "Jump into the Sun" riddle than I'm giving it credit for. I beat the boss in the temple but that just hardwires me to a dead fucking end. Also I thought I had to go through the magma caverns beforehand but that just seems silly upon reflection...
 

Airola

Member
I have the WiiWare version, what's it missing?
(Maybe I'll finish it one day...)

It doesn't have the Hell Temple. I recall the Japanese WiiWare version has that as DLC but the versions in other regions don't.

It's an extra hyper hard area. Completely optional. The funny thing is that even if you get the DLC you still have to "unlock" the area by solving harder puzzles than most in the normal game are.
 

Sayad

Member
Love this game. Are there any good lore videos for it? Always wanted to go back and try to figure out the story behind the ruins but never got the chance to do so.
 

Sayad

Member
-
Finding Iris's pendant feels like a fucking crapshoot. Oh ok it's in the Temple of the Sun. What's that? The room it's in is hidden by a completely nondescript ceiling that's not shown on your map at all and which you will probably end up abusing the hitbox of the whip to accidentally break? And where was this note to cracking the code again???
Remember one of the stones mentioning Iris's location in relation to some of the other gods in that ruin. The problem is that you have to know that the map doesn't always show everything and also know about destructible walls for the hinted position to make sense, something you don't really grasp until later on in the game.
 

Poppy

Member
i respect the hell out of la-mulana but it is absolutely hard for hard's sake. if it was just the puzzles that'd be one thing but the controls and the difficulty just turn it into a goddamn slog sometimes that i can't deal with

i mean this is a game where if you whip the wall to try and find secrets you often get blasted to shit and yet there are STILL areas where you need to blindly whip at the wall to find things. the game is made to inflict pain

it's really good though, just...i don't know if it's actually fun
 
I got sucked into the two years ago when testing out the Vita TV (pro-tip, you can bind R2/L2). It's a game I'd call frustrating but not as a negative. I loved and hated my time with it.
 

dogen

Member
Apart from the music, would you say the freeware version is better than the remake released on Steam? I am about to playthrough La Mulana and so I want to decide which version I play first.

I've actually never finished either, and only played a little bit of the the 2005 one.

But I think people recommend to play the remake first, then the original. Apparently they removed some puzzles and areas, but those were some of the harder ones I guess.
 

_mail

Member
La-Mulana is really a unique awesome game, great thread! The way the ruins are put together is such a masterwork ( especially when one solves the 'final' puzzle).

This isn't a game that you marathon though! Keep a journal and write down notes, this will allow you to chip through the game's dense interior over time without resorting to outside walkthroughs.
 
Awesome thread! La-mulana is definitely one of the best game i ever played, PERIOD! The huge ruins with a lots of area to explore, how everything is connected, how all puzzles are well put togheter, how you unfold the lore through the background, puzzles and ennemy, the music, the challenge! This game is so great, i wish more people would like it!

Can't wait to play la-mulana 2 that i backed on kickstarter!

here's a very nice metal cover that i requested some times ago :

Interstice of the dimension (GAMETAL)
 
At one point this was my favorite indie game I'd ever played. Even today I love the music of the ruins and had a lot of fun trying to figure out the puzzles. I did maybe 40-60% of the game in the classic Freeware version, but only messed around a bit with the remake. I love the old MSX look of the first one although the QoL changes to the remake make it less intimidating in those important early stages for newcomers.

I want to cross this one off the bucket list one day.

A journal is required. I screenshotted every tablet and wrote down where I found things. If I ever tried again I may replay it using my old notes to get up to speed quickly.
 

1upsuper

Member
It warms my heart to see some fellow La-Mulana fans. I'm glad this game has resonated with others like it has with me.

This is the best game ever made.
My absolute Top 1 game of all time.

...and I still haven't beat it.
Can't beat the final boss.

However, my philosophy of video games is that games should not be beatable by default. The purest point of a video game is to be a challenge that only those who truly have the skills can beat it. A game of Solitaire would lose its point if it was something everyone would be bound to beat eventually. The same goes to Rubik's Cube. No-one is entitled to win the game. The game's premise should be that it beats the player. And this is what I've accepted long time ago. If I can't beat a game, it is not the game's fault. It is something the game was built to do from the get go. It's the natural state of the game. And only if I can build up my skills and understanding of a game to a certain level, then I might be able to beat it.

La-Mulana is the real evolution of video games.
It is the best game of all time.

I can't wait to play La-Mulana 2. I backed it on Kickstarter so it's already paid for me.
La-Mulana 2 and Twin Peaks season 3 are the Holy Grails of entertainment for me.

I really like your philosophy. What are some other games that you think satisfy your desire for games that are almost impossible to beat and don't assume the player deserves to win? I really like that idea. I absolutely love archaic, inaccessible games. I really want the games I play to seriously challenge me and require me to really give it my all.

So many games develop cool systems and ideas but they don't actually require you to learn the ins and outs of them and don't use those ideas to their full potential. With LM, if you *can* do something, you will have to at some point. NIGORO really wrings out every ounce of creativity in their ideas, and it's a masterclass in design.

Still waiting on 2... Hope is out by Deceased Crab's 10 th anniversary of the original.

Heck yes, DeceasedCrab is awesome. One of the first LPers I ever watched, and he's still probably my favorite. We have very similar tastes in games, it seems.

I have the WiiWare version, what's it missing?
(Maybe I'll finish it one day...)

As others have stated, you miss out on the super hard bonus dungeon. It's a pretty sizable amount of content to miss and it has an amazing reward for beating it, but it's too challenging for a lot of players. Most of LM's severe difficulty comes from the puzzles and learning the mechanics and less on pure platforming and the fights (which are still challenging, but less than the puzzles). The bonus dungeon does the opposite, and it has less puzzles and more agonizing platforming. It's a lot of fun but definitely a test of your endurance and platforming prowess. Definitely worth playing through, IMO.

I figure this is as good a place as any to mention that I was playing the remake of this not too long ago and got, like, hopelessly stumped at around the third or fourth area or so, where it feels like I can't proceed until I figure out some shit regarding the whole layout of the place...

Honestly the platforming is basic, the boss design (especially in the remake) seems both really simple and really unfair (as someone who tends to play games with minimal equipment most of the time, it took quite a bit of swallowing my pride to realize some bosses outright REQUIRE usage of subweapons if you want to take no damage. Good fucking luck beating
Sakit's second phase
with just the whip and no damage!), and the puzzles in this game feel like the worst kind of puzzle. i.e. the information to solving the puzzle is as difficult and obscure to uncover, if not more so, then actually solving it.

not to mention I feel like even when you DO have the information you need to make some ludicrous leaps of logic in order to interpret the info correctly

I have like two things in particular which bug me and I would gladly accept notifications from other people telling me how exactly the game hints at the 'solution'

-
Finding Iris's pendant feels like a fucking crapshoot. Oh ok it's in the Temple of the Sun. What's that? The room it's in is hidden by a completely nondescript ceiling that's not shown on your map at all and which you will probably end up abusing the hitbox of the whip to accidentally break? And where was this note to cracking the code again???
-
I feel like there's more to the "Jump into the Sun" riddle than I'm giving it credit for. I beat the boss in the temple but that just hardwires me to a dead fucking end. Also I thought I had to go through the magma caverns beforehand but that just seems silly upon reflection...

I don't think any of the bosses absolutely require subweapons, though they certainly help. I cannot agree with your assessment of the puzzles. They are certainly not "the worst kind of puzzles" simply because they're opaque. Lots of puzzles in games are about doing or about figuring out -- but not both. LM requires you to identify the puzzle location, identify how to interact with it, find the relevant hints, and figure out how exactly those hints relate to the puzzle. And then you have to put it all together. It's brilliant, and completely removes the hand-holding or elision of factors that play into so many other games' puzzles. The logical leaps aren't a sign of bad design -- the puzzles made me think, and they tested me in a way very few games do. They're brilliant logical exercises and I'll love the game forever because of them.

As for your spoilers, for the first one
there's a tablet above the sphinx statue IIRC on the right side of the Temple of the Sun that says Isis sits above all the other gods, or something like that. It lets you know that she's located higher than any other god's room, so you have to pay attention to your map and also know that certain weapons can hit floors and ceiling in order to break breakable blocks. As for myself, this was a puzzle I accidentally solved on my own while fighting the lion miniboss in the room before the Inferno Cavern.
As for your second spoiler,
Look for a big sun somewhere. There's one you've no doubt seen a few times. Be like Icarus, and fly close to the sun, but be careful when you do so...

Love this game. Are there any good lore videos for it? Always wanted to go back and try to figure out the story behind the ruins but never got the chance to do so.

Highwang has a LP of the La-Mulana remake on YouTube that focuses on the game's lore. It's rough but decent enough, and he puts in the effort to research the different cultural icons littered throughout LM and he makes sure to explain how the puzzles are supposed to be solved via explaining their relevant hints. It's a good series of videos.

Apart from the music, would you say the freeware version is better than the remake released on Steam? I am about to playthrough La Mulana and so I want to decide which version I play first.

I would honestly start with the remake. As stated, the remake adds some really nice QoL features and some of the puzzles are improved, plus the boss fights are a lot more engaging. I still haven't beaten the original, but I will at some point. IMO the original probably has a slightly better soundtrack, but they're both absolutely incredible. Check out the remake, and if you need more, go back to the MSX-styled original.

La-Mulana is really a unique awesome game, great thread! The way the ruins are put together is such a masterwork ( especially when one solves the 'final' puzzle).

This isn't a game that you marathon though! Keep a journal and write down notes, this will allow you to chip through the game's dense interior over time without resorting to outside walkthroughs.

I definitely agree that you need to take notes, but I don't think it's realistically a game you can leave and come back to over a long period of time. If I waited too long I really needed to restart, because I feel like you really need a complete mental map of the world in order to compliment your notes. You need to be able to read a hint and immediately recall one particular room in such and such an area and how to get there. Unless you have a great memory, you'll probably want to get through LM in a few months at most, IMO. But everyone's different, of course. Play LM however feels best to you!

Reminds me of "Rick Dangerous" that I used to play on the Spectrum, growing up. Loved that game.

After you posted this I watched a playthrough of the first Rick Dangerous. Looks like a fun game! I can kinda see the comparison, though I feel like RD reminds me more of Spelunker than La-Mulana. RD looks like it has some pretty devilish traps, particularly the spikes you can see until you're already mid-fall.

I'm glad that lots of people are excited for the sequel. I had some money set aside for a Switch but after beating LM I blew that money on the 256-tier La-Mulana 2 pledge on Playism. No ragrats.
 
I'm glad that lots of people are excited for the sequel. I had some money set aside for a Switch but after beating LM I blew that money on the 256-tier on Playism. No ragrats.

Same here, we're not a lot, but it's still great to talk about this game with other people! Also took the NI-GO-RO tier! I love the lore updates right now, lots new informations that show how much well thought the game is!

did you listened to the cover i posted?
 

1upsuper

Member
Same here, we're not a lot, but it's still great to talk about this game with other people! Also took the NI-GO-RO tier! I love the lore updates right now, lots new informations that show how much well thought the game is!

did you listened to the cover i posted?

*high-five* It's super cool to get those updates and get some new info. Naramura puts so much effort into LM. Also, I'm probably super late to the party on this, but the other day I had an epiphany and realized that La-Mulana is an anagram of Naramura's name, if you change the Ls to Rs in typical Japanese fashion, so La-Mulana becomes Ra-Murana = Naramura! Of course, Xelpud is Duplex backwards too. Is the name of the third member of Nigoro hidden in the game somehow?

I did check out that track - it's great! I'm not usually a fan of metal, but I think it suits the song surprisingly well. I found this medley, which is good too.

I spend a lot of time listening to VGM covers and chiptune music, so I really wish there were more covers of LM music.
 
*high-five*

I did check out that track - it's great! I'm not usually a fan of metal, but I think it suits the song surprisingly well. I found this medley, which is good too.

I spend a lot of time listening to VGM covers and chiptune music, so I really wish there were more covers of LM music.

wow thanks for the discovery, didn't knew this one! And yeah, for interstice of the dimension, this music was clearly metal even in the game!

Don't hesitate to share some other remix/covers of the game! Here's some i found :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT1D9BOSmWk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB9vWHDrFbY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZZ5BCWb2wM

also here's a game that might have inspired the style of la-mulana (to the title itself)

Arumana No Kiseki

(Arumana / Almana)
 
This thread inspired me to pick this up on the Vita today. Its on sale for $3.99, so why not!?

I don't mind a challenge, so here goes nothing.
 

llehuty

Member
I love this game, even if I've never beaten it. I think I have started it 3 times already.

It's odd that without finishing the game, I'm more that satisfied with all the entertainment this game has given me. Backed La Mulana 2 in a heartbeat becaus eI really trust Nigoro to bring it again.

Not sure if I'll go back to LM1 it at some point, but I kind of like having it there, available for maybe trying it again at some point.
 

mclem

Member
La Mulana is utterly, utterly brilliant. Can't wait for the sequel.

That said, I'm an avowed puzzle fan, and even *I* think the puzzles are a shade too obscure.

Edit: One of the problems with the puzzles in LM is that it's hard to associate hints with puzzles, given how widely scattered they are across the ruins. I note in the most recent update for LM2 that they talk about that - apparently the remake moved a number of hints to be closer to what they relate to? That's a promising start, and I like the iconography suggested for LM2 to make it easier to match hints to regions.
 

Boney

Banned
It's wonderful but it bucks the trends of junk gaming and automated consumption. You better drag a notebook in the first minute or you're just not going to climb over the difficulty curve.
 

1upsuper

Member
wow thanks for the discovery, didn't knew this one! And yeah, for interstice of the dimension, this music was clearly metal even in the game!

Don't hesitate to share some other remix/covers of the game! Here's some i found :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT1D9BOSmWk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB9vWHDrFbY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZZ5BCWb2wM

also here's a game that might have inspired the style of la-mulana (to the title itself)

Arumana No Kiseki

(Arumana / Almana)

Those are some dope tracks! I didn't think to check OCR since their indie game offerings are usually pretty...nonexistent, but that's a cool track for sure. Thanks for sharing these. Also, Arumana No Kiseki looks RIGHT up my alley, wow. I consider myself a Famicom aficionado but somehow I haven't heard of this one until now. I'll definitely have to play it now. The name thing is interesting too...

This thread inspired me to pick this up on the Vita today. Its on sale for $3.99, so why not!?

I don't mind a challenge, so here goes nothing.

Yes! I'm glad to have roped someone into trying LM. Please let us know what you think. If you need hints or any guidance I'd be happy to help. Or if you just want a place to jot down your thoughts, that's cool too.

I love this game, even if I've never beaten it. I think I have started it 3 times already.

It's odd that without finishing the game, I'm more that satisfied with all the entertainment this game has given me. Backed La Mulana 2 in a heartbeat becaus eI really trust Nigoro to bring it again.

Not sure if I'll go back to LM1 it at some point, but I kind of like having it there, available for maybe trying it again at some point.

That seems to be a common theme with LM fans. A lot of people don't actually finish LM, but it makes such an impression on them that they still love the game very much. It definitely provides a whole lot of entertainment. It's staggering how big this game is. You can really look back and marvel at what you've accomplished. In that sense it feels like an immense journey like no other game I've ever played.

La Mulana is utterly, utterly brilliant. Can't wait for the sequel.

That said, I'm an avowed puzzle fan, and even *I* think the puzzles are a shade too obscure.

Edit: One of the problems with the puzzles in LM is that it's hard to associate hints with puzzles, given how widely scattered they are across the ruins. I note in the most recent update for LM2 that they talk about that - apparently the remake moved a number of hints to be closer to what they relate to? That's a promising start, and I like the iconography suggested for LM2 to make it easier to match hints to regions.

Oh yeah, there's no doubt that at least a few of the puzzles are bullshit, haha. So I'm a bit conflicted with LM2. Being a bit more thoughtful in placing hints and providing clues for what puzzles they relate to could make it a "better" experience technically, but part of what I love so much about LM is how unabashed it is about being cruel. It's completely antithetical to most modern gaming philosophies and it jives so perfectly with me. I like the insanity of it. The one puzzle that might push things a bit too far is
the number puzzle in the Endless Corridor, mainly because you can completely miss out on Mulbruk's hint, AFAIK, at which point it becomes impossible to know for certain two of the four numbers you're looking for. Thankfully you can brute force the puzzle, and I assume that was by design.
 

Ilvocare

Member
I don't think any of the bosses absolutely require subweapons, though they certainly help. I cannot agree with your assessment of the puzzles. They are certainly not "the worst kind of puzzles" simply because they're opaque. Lots of puzzles in games are about doing or about figuring out -- but not both. LM requires you to identify the puzzle location, identify how to interact with it, find the relevant hints, and figure out how exactly those hints relate to the puzzle. And then you have to put it all together. It's brilliant, and completely removes the hand-holding or elision of factors that play into so many other games' puzzles. The logical leaps aren't a sign of bad design -- the puzzles made me think, and they tested me in a way very few games do. They're brilliant logical exercises and I'll love the game forever because of them.

As for your spoilers, for the first one
there's a tablet above the sphinx statue IIRC on the right side of the Temple of the Sun that says Isis sits above all the other gods, or something like that. It lets you know that she's located higher than any other god's room, so you have to pay attention to your map and also know that certain weapons can hit floors and ceiling in order to break breakable blocks. As for myself, this was a puzzle I accidentally solved on my own while fighting the lion miniboss in the room before the Inferno Cavern.
As for your second spoiler,
Look for a big sun somewhere. There's one you've no doubt seen a few times. Be like Icarus, and fly close to the sun, but be careful when you do so...

Honestly if you end up solving a puzzle by accident or through dumb luck... that demotivates me HARD. I want to feel like I was able to follow the leyline of thought, not just... trip over everything. Granted, LM seems intent on making that the exception, but still...

I appreciate the feedback! Even though I'm a lot colder on this game than most other people I WANT to like it. For what it's worth your thread did make me decide to boot the game back up, just to see if I could do anything new... and I did!

-Went into the Inferno Cavern, got the Sacred Orb, died a bunch to breakable platforms
-Got the Flare Gun rather entirely by accident. Once again it honestly feels like the hints for its location are too obscure for their own good. Next to the Pit of Flames... but it's not above or to the right of it, which just leaves two other places to check. The floor is unbreakable. Thankfully, the alcove to the left is distinct enough that I WAS encouraged to hit it, but like... I feel that telegraphing is already starting to get phased out of the game...
-Got Additional Text Memory, the Space Gun game software, and the Ice Cloak! However, diving through all the lava areas revealed absolutely nothing of worth to find outside of a breakable wall holding a money chest.
-Went back to the Spring in the Sky, decided to take on the sub-boss again. I originally thought he was just completely invulnerable but it turns out that he IS vulnerable... just he has a really picky hitbox and an annoying attack. Getting the Origin Seal would have been a MASSIVE step forward for me... if I hadn't ended up dying a while later. To a trap I've triggered multiple times inside of the Gate of Guidance, no less...

Also trawled through the Twin Labyrinths by coming up from the Inferno Caverns entrance and got mad tilted!
The flying subboss
in particular seems like he straight-up cheats and he might ACTUALLY be impossible for me to kill unless
I can counter his time stop...

however thank you VERY much for the highwang video recommendation, that seems right up my alley!

EDIT: spoiler 2 response:
I'm pretty sure I know what the 'sun' is, but like...jumping into it from below does nothing. Am I missing something else???

EDIT2: One of the biggest issues I had with this game (and this also applies to the remake!) is that one of, if not THE most important functions in the game is completely hidden from you. Knowing that the F1 key is your hard-pause button, your map, AND your warping tool is kinda fucking essential! But it's the only key in the game that's not rebindable, that's NOT mentioned at all in the remake's controls menu... that's just straight-up not talked about at all! It assumes the player uses the F1 key on a regular basis for gaming and that's just... straight wrong...
 

Tain

Member
Probably gonna dig into the original version of this at some point. I started it a few weeks ago and got extremely sidetracked.

The aesthetics of the 2011 version don't seem as consistent to me.
 

TacoBurgos

Neo Member
I remember trying it a few years ago, but it was almost impossible, without a guide I have given up from the beggining.
 
Best Metroid-type game.
Seriously fantastic because it is actually challenging compared to every other metroidvania.

I'm a bit afraid of sequel's quality though, since they've often stated kickstarter funds were drying up and other stuff from their monthly blog.
 
I remember getting somewhat far. I love the game but its hard as hell, and I would probably have to start over to figure anything out.
 
The only OG track that is noticably better than the remake's is muhfuggin' Curse of muhfuggin' IRON PIPE.

That thing should not work.

Honestly if you end up solving a puzzle by accident or through dumb luck... that demotivates me HARD. I want to feel like I was able to follow the leyline of thought, not just... trip over everything. Granted, LM seems intent on making that the exception, but still...

I appreciate the feedback! Even though I'm a lot colder on this game than most other people I WANT to like it. For what it's worth your thread did make me decide to boot the game back up, just to see if I could do anything new... and I did!

-Went into the Inferno Cavern, got the Sacred Orb, died a bunch to breakable platforms
-Got the Flare Gun rather entirely by accident. Once again it honestly feels like the hints for its location are too obscure for their own good. Next to the Pit of Flames... but it's not above or to the right of it, which just leaves two other places to check. The floor is unbreakable. Thankfully, the alcove to the left is distinct enough that I WAS encouraged to hit it, but like... I feel that telegraphing is already starting to get phased out of the game...
-Got Additional Text Memory, the Space Gun game software, and the Ice Cloak! However, diving through all the lava areas revealed absolutely nothing of worth to find outside of a breakable wall holding a money chest.
-Went back to the Spring in the Sky, decided to take on the sub-boss again. I originally thought he was just completely invulnerable but it turns out that he IS vulnerable... just he has a really picky hitbox and an annoying attack. Getting the Origin Seal would have been a MASSIVE step forward for me... if I hadn't ended up dying a while later. To a trap I've triggered multiple times inside of the Gate of Guidance, no less...

Also trawled through the Twin Labyrinths by coming up from the Inferno Caverns entrance and got mad tilted!
The flying subboss
in particular seems like he straight-up cheats and he might ACTUALLY be impossible for me to kill unless
I can counter his time stop...

however thank you VERY much for the highwang video recommendation, that seems right up my alley!

EDIT: spoiler 2 response:
I'm pretty sure I know what the 'sun' is, but like...jumping into it from below does nothing. Am I missing something else???

EDIT2: One of the biggest issues I had with this game (and this also applies to the remake!) is that one of, if not THE most important functions in the game is completely hidden from you. Knowing that the F1 key is your hard-pause button, your map, AND your warping tool is kinda fucking essential! But it's the only key in the game that's not rebindable, that's NOT mentioned at all in the remake's controls menu... that's just straight-up not talked about at all! It assumes the player uses the F1 key on a regular basis for gaming and that's just... straight wrong...

Fun fact about that sub-boss in the Twin Labs...
you can totally kill him without ZA WARUDO...cuz I did it and got a Steam cheevo for it.
:D
 
This is one of my favorite games of all time. I love that it really feels like you're an archaeologist in that you piece together the language and obscure riddles scattered throughout. I quit when I got to the end boss because the bosses are my least favorite part. I just enjoyed the puzzling and exploration. I hope LM2 is at least somewhat satisfying after the brilliance of this game.
 
Top Bottom