bitbydeath
Member
60CU’s lines up with the RX 3090. (Navi20)
The same one I mentioned is the only confirmed hardware to support Ray Tracing.
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Rumor: PS5 devkits ~ 13 TFLOPS
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60CU’s lines up with the RX 3090. (Navi20)
The same one I mentioned is the only confirmed hardware to support Ray Tracing.
Insane Metal
Member
I feel like this sounds closer and closer to the true thing.
SonGoku
Member
Actually 3080 (4 disabled)
bitbydeath
Member
60 in total though with 4 disabled.
SonGoku
Member
So the 3080 is a 56CU part? I assumed it was 60CU with 4 disabled
edit: My bad the disabled CUs its just a console thing it seems
Im with you in that i predict a 60CU GPU with 4 disabled.
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Airbus Jr
Banned
You seems to have a very good understanding on how these thing works
Do you work at IT tech company or something?
Have any recomended youtube channel for PS5 tech rumours?
bitbydeath
Member
The CU’s still exist though and Sony locked and unlocked CU’s via software on the Pro for non-pro games to run so I’d imagine that means the total number is what is recorded as the 4 locked can be unlocked if Sony had wanted.
I also heard that the CU’s are disabled to be reactive to faults. So if one faulted it’d disable and another locked will become enabled.
Saying all that I could be wrong though.
Having more CUs would be more like the PS3 SPEs than having a FPGA .
SonGoku
Member
Not at all lol, just read a bunch of forum posts and articles on people more knowledgeable, its just acquired internet knowledge.
I don't really like watching videos that talk about tech, since they tend to drawn out and it gets hard for me to maintain concentration (ADHD). I rather read tech articles. But AdoredTv seems to be all the rage these days, people keep referencing that channel.
Devs are familiar with CUs and all the tools are ready to take advantage of them out of the box.
wow first time i read that, all i know is CUs tend to be disabled/lasered to improved yields
The PS4Pro backwards compatibility mode its not really the same
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Game devs wouldn't be programming the FPGA that would be done by Sony & middleware companies
SonGoku
Member
Ah that's interesting, so what kind of fixed functions do you have in mind?
demigod
Member
I have 750gb ssd in mine, got a new nvme for my PC so i’m going to put 1tb ssd in it. Even then its not enough for me. Thats why putting 1tb ssd isn’t good for next gen and i’m hoping Sony does go with some new tech with 2tb hdd.
SonGoku
Member
Maybe nvme + hdd combo?
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demigod
Member
I’d rather not have to move one game to the other drive to utilize the fast loading.
SonGoku
Member
I meant thats what PS5 might end up doing as cost saving measure
Something like 256GB NVMe + 1TB HDD
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LordOfChaos
Member
"When you add DDR4 bandwidth the range is 11.whatever Tflops"
"XTflops is the rumor if you only count HBM bandwidth"
GPU Flop calcs don't touch on bandwidth at all, that's the rambling of someone with not quite enough information to be dangerous...
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SonGoku
Member
They are referencing the reddit "leak" that talked about hitting X GB/s per TF"When you add DDR4 bandwidth the range is 11.whatever Tflops"
"XTflops is the rumor if you only count HBM bandwidth"
GPU Flop calcs don't touch on bandwidth at all, that's the rambling of someone with not quite enough information to be dangerous...
Its a bs leak, im just putting the reasoning behind it out there.
Jayjayhd34
Member
No different than ps4 using 7850. That was two years old by time ps4 came out.
Relax with optimization the things achieved on such hardware will be incredible.
SonGoku
Member
woulnt RT hw be better suited for that?
LordOfChaos
Member
While you can do practically anything on an FPGA (including running an entire turing complete CPU on them), lighting is a generalized enough problem that I'm fairly sure the GPUs we have already would already be better at this, at least without spending even more die size on the FPGA than the GPU would take which would be counterproductive. Where they're great is as hardware accelerators for very narrow, predictable patters (like mining dogecoin, all repeats of the same hash algorithm)
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wordslaughter
Banned
Where are you hearing that the 3090 is the only one "confirmed" to support ray tracing? You seem to have heard that somehwhere and are mixing that with Cerny's ray tracing comment and concluding that the PS5 GPU "must" be the 3090. Extremely thin reasoning.
You are also putting a lot of faith in that Wired article with Cerny. Literally the only thing he said was "will support ray tracing" and then went on to an example of using ray tracing for SOUND and not graphics. It's going to be far FAR less computationally expensive to bounce a couple rays around "“If you wanted to run tests to see if the player can hear certain audio sources or if the enemies can hear the players’ footsteps, ray tracing is useful for that,”
That's nice but that's nothing compared to using ray tracing for actual lighting, shadows and reflections. Cerny doesn't talk at all about using ray tracing for global illumination or anything like that. And what he's not saying is just as important as what he is.
Also in that article they talk about the PS5 "supports 8k" but you're not expecting much from that I assume.
"Supports ray tracing" may not mean ANYTHING at this point. If you wanna take that very small comment from Cerny to mean that the PS5 will be a ray tracing beast, go for it. But you can ray trace on Pascal GPU's now and they have no RT cores but they absolutely do "support ray tracing." They're just not very good at it. My point is that you don't need anything special hardware wise to claim "ray tracing support."
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bitbydeath
Member
wordslaughter
Banned
bitbydeath
. Thanks for the video. I'll take a look. He has a very strange voice.recklesscognition
Member
Is it going to be larger than the pro?
CyberPanda
Banned
Most likely.
CrustyBritches
Gold Member
Assuming we're going by adoredtv's "RX 30xx" nomenclature, RX 3080 is 52CUs and 175W+.
The big Navi's, RX 3090XT and RX 3090, are Navi 20 and 64CU and 60CU, respectively. Parts with disable CUs are not new for AMD, and definitely not restricted to consoles. R9 390x was a 44CU part, while R9 390 was a 40CU part. In many cases you could flash the bios and enable the full 44CU "R9 390x" using the cheaper R9 390(mine didn't work). 6950 to 6970 unlock was one that goes even further back, and the practice has been around even longer.
All that said, RX 3080 in adoredtv's updated chart does in fact look like a decent candidate for 52CUs with 4 more disabled in the retail unit making 48CUs. imo. Consoles go for GPU in the 150-160W PC tier.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
The fan fiction is getting good. Will read again.
I still call FUD on that YouTube channel only source Navi joint.
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Imtjnotu
Member
Based on that video tho there are tweaks to the cu's in Navi 10 and 20. I'm praying Sony goes with the Navi 20 variant
Kenpachii
Member
Some hillbilly logic.
The PS4 GPU was a 3 year old nvidia gpu basically the 580 would beat it.
PS5 GPU being a 1080 ti performance wise for 2020 release makes sense and 1080 for 2019 release, both 3 year old.
PS5 11-12 tflops confirmed.
8 tflop xbox also makes sense as it's going to release most likely this year then aka 1080 performance.
The PS4 GPU was a 3 year old nvidia gpu basically the 580 would beat it.
PS5 GPU being a 1080 ti performance wise for 2020 release makes sense and 1080 for 2019 release, both 3 year old.
PS5 11-12 tflops confirmed.
8 tflop xbox also makes sense as it's going to release most likely this year then aka 1080 performance.
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CrustyBritches
Gold Member
Pretty much all rumors for PS5 are an amalgam of either Gonzalo(Apisak and Komachi) or adoredtv. The Gonzalo leak is identified as "Navi 10 Lite" and looks to have a GPU core clock that gone from 1GHz to 1.8GHz.
Digital Foundry even sought out his advice(click to read the whole discussion)...
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bitbydeath
Member
The 13F8 part is said to mean 13.8TF.
Can Navi 10 reach that figure?
That sounds more like Navi 20 to me.
xool
Member
"Will support ray tracing" has been a thing literally every generation - I seem to recall Kutaragi saying PS2 "can ray trace" and definitely recall him saying that PS3 "was capable of" .. this gen will be just the same - minor applications, but not full ray traced scenes
Ray tracing for audio is this-gen too https://www.platinumgames.com/official-blog/article/10021
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CrustyBritches
Gold Member
That portion is the PCI id and doesn't correspond to any compute metric. The DF article has the updated product code with 2 new PCI id and it looks like it might now correspond to "Ariel". What that means for whether it's still Navi 10 Lite or Navi 10 is up to you.
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bitbydeath
Member
The old code suggested Navi 10, but then it changed.
New codename for AMD's rumored custom console APU Gonzalo throws up new conundrums
An engineering sample processor has turned up on Twitter with the codename “ZG16702AE8JB2_32/10/18_13F8”. Fortunately, a little bit of light has been shed on what this mystery processor could be, and it is claimed that it is actually AMD’s custom chip Gonzalo, which is expected to appear in the...
www.notebookcheck.net
CrustyBritches
Gold Member
He's referencing a random comment on Reeee-.The old code suggested Navi 10, but then it changed.
New codename for AMD's rumored custom console APU Gonzalo throws up new conundrums
An engineering sample processor has turned up on Twitter with the codename “ZG16702AE8JB2_32/10/18_13F8”. Fortunately, a little bit of light has been shed on what this mystery processor could be, and it is claimed that it is actually AMD’s custom chip Gonzalo, which is expected to appear in the...
I read their speculation thread occasionally and it's like a mix of GAF and SW.
That is the PCI id. You wouldn't go from 13.9TF on a 1GHz core to 13.8TF on a 1.8GHz core. This chip is a gaming APU that's nearing completion. It's most likely PS5 based on the clocks.
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PocoJoe
Banned
Your expectations arent realistic if you wait 399-499€ console to have latest high end performance of PCs.
Imo 2017 highish end performance sounds really good.
Tech have its limitations, cant force 20Tflops into small case with limited power envelope.
And look what they can do with "~2011 level of pc" aka ps4, i would not worry about it unless they go nintendo and cheap out in everything, which isnt likely
Von Hugh
Member
There are plenty of people here expecting and almost demanding at least 13 TFLOPS out of a system that uses an AMD APU enclosed in the small case with particular power requirements. And that APU is still GCN. And it should cost under 499 dollars while even Radeon VII is, what, over 700 dollars?
bitbydeath
Member
To be fair most rumours we’ve had have indicated that PS5 will be between 12-15TF.
bhunachicken
Member
But that's buying a single graphics cards from a retailer. There's so many points in that chain where entities are taking a cut and thereby elevating the price.
How much would those Radeon VIIs cost if you bought 20 million (or more) of them, directly from AMD, and paid for them upfront? I can tell you right now it's going to be a lot less than $700. Probably even less if there's no sale-or-return clause in the contract.
Just to illustrate, a tear down of the iPhone XS Max (~$1250) revealed that the components cost ~$450. What's the cost if you bought a few million of those components in bulk? You could maybe halve the total bill if you include things like tax deductions for businesses.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Yeah these ppl coming with msrp numbers to back up why Sony wouldn't get this chip or that doesn't make sense. Sony will obviously be buying whole sale and would have a deal in place and will not be paying msrp. Add to tht that most of these companies take a loss on hardware and eat tht loss because they know software and plus subscriptions more than make up for it. They just aren't in the business of taking Ps3 level hardware losses anymore (those losses were in the hundreds per console back then).
We don't know specifics yet but what we do know is tht both companies are analyzing each other and both want to one up the other. It means Jack shit if Microsoft says "they will have most powerful console" Sony will not be resting on their laurels and will also push to have a powerful console, at right price point. All tht is up in the air.
SonGoku
Member
I was thinking about the 3080XT which is listed at 56CU
Anyways Sony will have its own custom designed GPU like the PS4. I think they will go with a 60CU GPU (4 CUs disabled) so 56CU usable.
We don't know if Gonzalo is PS5, could be Stadia for all we know
It could also be a lower CU part place holder hence the 1.8Ghz clock.
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TeamGhobad
Banned
Splitting the RAM pool is a good cost saving measure, these specs sound amazing. 13tflops hbm2 3.2ghz 8core zen 2 its pretty high end stuff.
SonGoku
Member
Not really, hbm2 is more expensive than its worth, the leak slow bandwidth is too low to make up for ddr4 slack
TeamGhobad
Banned
prices are going down apparently. but isn't hbm2 superfast bandwidth, superlow energy AND super low latency? using gddr6 for cpu is a waste?
SonGoku
Member
The rumor which talks about hbm2 mentions salvaged parts reaching a anemic 400GB/s
I wouldn't put any weight to this leak
TeamGhobad
Banned
that not fast enough?
SonGoku
Member
Not enough to pick up the slack of ddr4 also consider GCN hugely benefits from bandwidth and consider the X already has 320GB/s for 6TFs
With GDDR6 they can reach 670GB/s to 800GB/s on a 24/22GB pool
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