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[Private Hoffman]

Well their profits were down 97% from last year which wasn't exactly stellar to start with.

At this rate the PS3 is going to start to really dig deep into PS1 profits over the next couple years.


Can Sony really contemplate the PS4? Can they come up with a new strategy so this doesn't happen again?

I guess they won't have to try and pull another media format over the line with it, but the PS4 will have a lot less momentum at launch than the PS3 did.

If the PS4 is priced reasonably, it'll have a lot more momentum at launch than the PS3 did.

The strategy is pretty simple, honestly. There's no need to force down a new format. By the time the PS4 rolls around Blu-Ray will be hitting its stride and likely overtaking DVD sales.

Make it more powerful, keep the blu-ray drive in the system, make it fully backwards compatible. Launch it at $400 instead of $600. Have a better software lineup for launch and they'll be fine.

 

[Karma]

How much has been shipped in total not just 2008

360 28.50 Million
PS3 21.27 Million

 

[Zombie James]

PS3 - 21.3M
360 - 28.5M

So PS3 passes Gamecube in a little over 2 years, and about 3 million shy of the original Xbox. The 360 is about 5 million away from passing the N64.

 

[Rocksteady33]

Make it more powerful, keep the blu-ray drive in the system, make it fully backwards compatible. Launch it at $400 instead of $600. Have a better software lineup for launch and they'll be fine.

Personally after seeing the trends and sales this generation, I still think that even a $400 system is going to hold you back, even with a $300 tard-pack. I really think price clearly has shown is an issue.

 

[Rocksteady33]

So PS3 passes Gamecube in a little over 2 years, and about 3 million shy of the original Xbox. The 360 is about 5 million away from passing the N64.

Are you sure? Are you comparing shipped vs. sold? Didn't GameCube sell ~22 million units?

 

[Private Hoffman]

Personally after seeing the trends and sales this generation, I still think that even a $400 system is going to hold you back, even with a $300 tard-pack. I really think price clearly has shown is an issue.

It's called inflation. The times of a $299 launch price are no more.

 

[Lightning]

If the PS4 is priced reasonably, it'll have a lot more momentum at launch than the PS3 did.

The strategy is pretty simple, honestly. There's no need to force down a new format. By the time the PS4 rolls around Blu-Ray will be hitting its stride and likely overtaking DVD sales.

Make it more powerful, keep the blu-ray drive in the system, make it fully backwards compatible. Launch it at $400 instead of $600. Have a better software lineup for launch and they'll be fine.

NO. $300 or bust.

Fuck this Sony policy of forcing technology that people don't want down their throats shit that Sony has. Sony need to get their prices down, not to $400, but launch with $300 maximum.

Also, I've always believed that Sony made a huge mistake making God of War 2 for the PS2, that title should have been a PS3 launch title or came out within the first 1yr of the PS3 cycle.

 

[Private Hoffman]

NO. $300 or bust.

Fuck this Sony policy of forcing technology that people don't want down their throats shit that Sony has. Sony need to get their prices down, not to $400, but launch with $300 maximum.

Also, I've always believed that Sony made a huge mistake making God of War 2 for the PS2, that title should have been a PS3 launch title or came out within the first 1yr of the PS3 cycle.

I - and many others - wanted Blu-Ray.

I don't see a need for a new media format for the PS4, however.

$399 is the new $299. Live with it. Otherwise we will get gimped upgrades in power. I do not want Sony going down the path of the Wii.

Sony's problems are that they launched at $600 for the PS3, not $400. So getting the costs down have taken years...it's still at $400.

A system launching at $400 will be down to $299 in no time and will have a much easier road.

 

[Zombie James]

Are you sure? Are you comparing shipped vs. sold? Didn't GameCube sell ~22 million units?

I'm not sure, actually. All i know is 21 million for Gamecube, 24 million for Xbox. Can anyone confirm?

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Make it more powerful, keep the blu-ray drive in the system, make it fully backwards compatible. Launch it at $400 instead of $600. Have a better software lineup for launch and they'll be fine.

Just like moving to optical media and being both more powerful and cheaper than a PS2 worked wonders for the Game Cube. There is no way that they just keep on the same track they are on now, make a few corrections and end up being "fine".

It's called inflation. The times of a $299 launch price are no more.

This is the tech world. By the time the PS4 launches $400 will buy you a decent laptop.

It's called deflation.

 

[Rocksteady33]

It's called inflation. The times of a $299 launch price are no more.

Inflation isn't an excuse. The fact is consumers look at it historically. A parent is going to say why am I paying $100 more for a system when I used to buy these things for my kids for $100 to $200 less. They don't say to themselves, "Well I suppose if I consider inflation, then this really is the same." It's consumer perception man.

 

[Burai]

It's called inflation. The times of a $299 launch price are no more.

Inflation had nothing to do with it.

Microsoft and Sony both launched their consoles earlier than planned, thus the inflated launch prices (and hardware issues for Microsoft).

You stick untested, bleeding edge tech in a consumer device, you're asking for a world of hurt whether that be $600 price tags or $1bn repair programs.

 

[Karma]

Have not seen Hoffman for a few weeks. Where have you been?

 

[Grampa Simpson]

Have not seen Hoffman for a few weeks. Where have you been?

I don't think that's Hoffman anymore. God-damned Cylon infiltrators!

 

[Lightning]

I - and many others - wanted Blu-Ray.

I don't see a need for a new media format for the PS4, however.

$399 is the new $299. Live with it. Otherwise we will get gimped upgrades in power. I do not want Sony going down the path of the Wii.

Sony's problems are that they launched at $600 for the PS3, not $400. So getting the costs down have taken years...it's still at $400.

A system launching at $400 will be down to $299 in no time and will have a much easier road.

So basically you want a Ferrari but only want to pay for a Ford? That's not the way it works.

This is gaming, we want to play games. Sony should never have forced BluRay down their gamer fans throat, no matter how many people like you wanted it. Sony doing that has resulted in them losing and it cost Ken Kutaragi his job.

Sony have become so financially strained that they can no longer even hold down their 3rd party exclusives to push their damn overpriced system. Sony dug themselves this hole and if they launch expensive they will dig themselves another one. No way are Sony making back the billions that the PS3 has cost them.

And above all else with future products. Sell the fucking hardware for a profit DAY ONE. Nintendo have given Sony a business lesson and I hope Sony take heed or they are in for a very hard future because their products are too damn expensive.

 

[Private Hoffman]

Inflation isn't an excuse. The fact is consumers look at it historically. A parent is going to say why am I paying $100 more for a system when I used to buy these things for my kids for $100 to $200 less. They don't say to themselves, "Well I suppose if I consider inflation, then this really is the same." It's consumer perception man.

Nope.

Perception really doesn't have much to do with it. Consumers will accept increases over time. PS3 overshot that threshold for price increase, but overall you do see a trend of rising hardware prices. It's just an inevitability.

NES -> SNES -> PS1 -> PS2

NES launched at 200

SNES launched at 200

PSX launched at 300

PS2 launched at 300

PS3 may have overstepped the increase bounds a bit by being to cutting edge with Blu-Ray, but I would expect Microsoft's $400 introduction price to be standard for next-gen Microsoft/Sony systems.

So basically you want a Ferrari but only want to pay for a Ford? That's not the way it works.

This is gaming, we want to play games. Sony should never have forced BluRay down their gamer fans throat, no matter how many people like you wanted it. Sony doing that has resulted in them losing and it cost Ken Kutaragi his job.

Sony have become so financially strained that they can no longer even hold down their 3rd party exclusives to push their damn overpriced system. Sony dug themselves this hole and if they launch expensive they will dig themselves another one. No way are Sony making back the billions that the PS3 has cost them.

And above all else with future products. Sell the fucking hardware for a profit DAY ONE. Nintendo have given Sony a business lesson and I hope Sony take heed or they are in for a very hard future because their products are too damn expensive.

Luckily I like entertainment in general, so I'm not really closed minded about what a videogame system should entail. It's not just games. It's evolving into an entire media device for both Microsoft and Sony. I'm glad that it's not just about games. There's a lot more added value - for both machines - in terms of their media capabilities, whether it be blu-ray, movie downloads, or NetFlix.

Frankly, as a consumer, I would prefer Sony continue to take a loss early on in a cycle and make it up later on. I don't want Sony or Microsoft taking the nintendo route, hardware wise. When I buy a console, I expect the hardware to be quite a bit more powerful than its predecessor. So, in order to be able to achieve this and still remain profitable, I expect Sony and Microsoft to elongate their hardware frequency cycles rather substantially.

 

[bttb]

.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

.

 

[Neo C.]

For everyday's stuff, food especially, people tolerate inflation, because they absolutely need it.
Electronic entertainment isn't as important. When you don't have the money, you just don't buy it.

 

[Nocebo]

I - and many others - wanted Blu-Ray.

Source?
Also, did you really want it that badly over a year ago or could you have waited a couple of months to a year?

 

[Private Hoffman]

Source?

This should hopefully help.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Frankly, as a consumer, I would prefer Sony continue to take a loss early on in a cycle and make it up later on.

Must...resist...cynical joke!

 

[Chumly]

Nintendo
http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/news/index.html
http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2009/090129.pdf

Worldwide Shipments as of December 2008
GBA HW = 81.44M
NDS HW = 96.22M
Wii HW = 44.96M

GBA SW = 377.24M
NDS SW = 533.38M
Wii SW = 312.22M

Do they have english files up?

 

[Rocksteady33]

Nope.

Perception really doesn't have much to do with it. Consumers will accept increases over time. PS3 overshot that threshold for price increase, but overall you do see a trend of rising hardware prices. It's just an inevitability.

NES -> SNES -> PS1 -> PS2

NES launched at 200

SNES launched at 200

PSX launched at 300

PS2 launched at 300

PS3 may have overstepped the increase bounds a bit by being to cutting edge with Blu-Ray, but I would expect Microsoft's $400 introduction price to be standard for next-gen Microsoft/Sony systems.

Which is why I said $100 to $200, as I was comparing the $400 360 to the PS2/GameCube prices, I suppose that didn't seem very clear though. And while, yes, system price did move up $100 from the transition of Nintendo to Sony, that doesn't necessarily mean it should keep going up. Yes the value you get for the price of entry with the 360 and PS3 are definitly appropriate, however it's clear that the average consumer does not see that value or care for that value. There's no point in moving towards a higher price if consumers don't value it at that price. Maybe they aren't informed properly of everything each system can really do, but the fact remains that low entry price ($200-$300) historically shows that the system is likely to do well.

 

[bttb]

.

 

[Gaborn]

This should hopefully help.

1.7 million on Blu-Ray, 11.8 million on DVD. Yeah... that's... not that impressive :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[IceIpor]

Which is why I said $100 to $200, as I was comparing the $400 360 to the PS2/GameCube prices, I suppose that didn't seem very clear though. And while, yes, system price did move up $100 from the transition of Nintendo to Sony, that doesn't necessarily mean it should keep going up. Yes the value you get for the price of entry with the 360 and PS3 are definitly appropriate, however it's clear that the average consumer does not see that value or care for that value. There's no point in moving towards a higher price if consumers don't value it at that price. Maybe they aren't informed properly of everything each system can really do, but the fact remains that low entry price ($200-$300) historically shows that the system is likely to do well.

I agree with this statement. Besides, as an entertainment medium gets more popular, it should become cheaper even as technology advances because there is a larger audience to sell to.

A few noteworthy examples would be: TVs, DVDs, PCs, and more recently, Laptops.

 

[bttb]

.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Frankly, as a consumer, I would prefer Sony continue to take a loss early on in a cycle and make it up later on. I don't want Sony or Microsoft taking the nintendo route, hardware wise. When I buy a console, I expect the hardware to be quite a bit more powerful than its predecessor. So, in order to be able to achieve this and still remain profitable, I expect Sony and Microsoft to elongate their hardware frequency cycles rather substantially.

I just don't understand how you think the jump from whatever the PS3 can do now to your desired PS4 specs could possibly matter. I mean the jump from SD to HD did not do much for consumers. Is Sony planing to sell their next console mainly to pixel counters?

Anyway back to the topic at hand: if I did my math right then Nintendo made $757M in Q3.

 

[mr_bishiuk]

This should hopefully help.

Blu ray sales are front loaded unlike DVD, Blu ray is still single digit % sales overall

Plus that was a special film, people with a PS3 were bound to get it for Christmas, its in average titles where the gap is horrendous.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Blu ray sales are front loaded unlike DVD, Blu ray is still single digit % sales overall

So B-RayVD:S3 games:Wii games?

 

[DDayton]

Perception really doesn't have much to do with it. Consumers will accept increases over time. PS3 overshot that threshold for price increase, but overall you do see a trend of rising hardware prices. It's just an inevitability.

NES -> SNES -> PS1 -> PS2

NES launched at 200

SNES launched at 200

PSX launched at 300

PS2 launched at 300

Er... something isn't quite right there.

Nintendo's hardware has traditionally sold for the same price -- $200.
NES -> SNES -> N64 -> GameCube. (I'm assuming you're right about the NES and SNES)

Sony's successful hardware traditionally sold for a $100 premium over Nintendo's hardware.

The Wii is the first price increase we've seen from Nintendo, but it's only an increase of 25%. Sony, on the other hand...

 

[Fuzzy]

Nintendo
Wii HW = 44.96M

Just over 4 million more to pass the SNES.

 

[w3stfa11]

Just over 4 million more to pass the SNES.

Probably will pass it by the end of FY Q4.

 

[bttb]

.

 

[titiklabingapat]

Nope.

Perception really doesn't have much to do with it. Consumers will accept increases over time. PS3 overshot that threshold for price increase, but overall you do see a trend of rising hardware prices. It's just an inevitability.

NES -> SNES -> PS1 -> PS2

NES launched at 200

SNES launched at 200

PSX launched at 300

PS2 launched at 300

PS3 may have overstepped the increase bounds a bit by being to cutting edge with Blu-Ray, but I would expect Microsoft's $400 introduction price to be standard for next-gen Microsoft/Sony systems.




Luckily I like entertainment in general, so I'm not really closed minded about what a videogame system should entail. It's not just games. It's evolving into an entire media device for both Microsoft and Sony. I'm glad that it's not just about games. There's a lot more added value - for both machines - in terms of their media capabilities, whether it be blu-ray, movie downloads, or NetFlix.

Frankly, as a consumer, I would prefer Sony continue to take a loss early on in a cycle and make it up later on. I don't want Sony or Microsoft taking the nintendo route, hardware wise. When I buy a console, I expect the hardware to be quite a bit more powerful than its predecessor. So, in order to be able to achieve this and still remain profitable, I expect Sony and Microsoft to elongate their hardware frequency cycles rather substantially.

You're better off playing on the PC if you're really that worried. It can even do word processing.

 

[w3stfa11]

Are you sure? Are you comparing shipped vs. sold? Didn't GameCube sell ~22 million units?

As of June 30, 2008, Nintendo has shipped 21.74 GameCube systems.
http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/library/historical_data/pdf/consolidated_sales_e0806.pdf

edit: beaten by bttb

 

[Fuzzy]

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/library/historical_data/pdf/consolidated_sales_e0812.pdf

Nintendo LTD Shipments as of December 2008

		Hardware		Software
GB		118.69M		501.11M
GBA		 81.44M		377.24M
NDS		 96.22M		533.38M

FC/NES		 61.91M		500.01M
SFC/SNES		 49.10M		379.06M
N64		 32.92M		224.97M
GCN		 21.74M		208.56M
Wii		 44.96M		312.22M

I wish Nintendo gave separate GB and GBC numbers.

 

[ThatObviousUser]

WTF at Wii numbers. Last time I checked (which wasn't that long ago) it was at like 30 million. Holy cheese.

Edit- Double WTF on DS software passing GB software on a smaller base. Triple WTF at Wii software getting close to SNES software.

WTTFFFFFFFFreakout

 

[Psychotext]

New version in post 651.

 

[Randy Lanzarote]

$2.7 billion....and that's with a strong yen impacting them as well. :s

printsmoney.gif

 

[Bust Nak]

Luckily I like entertainment in general, so I'm not really closed minded about what a videogame system should entail. It's not just games. It's evolving into an entire media device for both Microsoft and Sony. I'm glad that it's not just about games. There's a lot more added value - for both machines - in terms of their media capabilities, whether it be blu-ray, movie downloads, or NetFlix.

It's not added value if I have to shell out extra cash for it. I'd rather pay less and have a machine that plays games and nothing else. The PS3 and 360 dupilcate a lot of "added value" functionality that I have to pay for twice. That's not even taking into account of my PC and other kits.

 

[Throwaway123456789]

 

[Psychotext]

Anyone know the missing figures? Should be the total shipments for 2008.

PS2: 136.32m (???)
NDS: 96.22m (31.43m)
PSP: 49.58m (???)
WII: 44.96m (24.83m)
360: 28.50m (10.80m)
PS3: 21.30m (10.78m)

 

[AyuFanatic86]

I - and many others - wanted Blu-Ray.

Yeah, because Sony told you to want it. Seriously, you - did not want - BluRay. Not within the PS3, at least.

 

[Frankfurter]

$2.7 billion....and that's with a strong yen impacting them as well. :s

printsmoney.gif

I'm confused. How can Nintendo make a profit of 2.7 billion in only one quarter (+ another ~2.5 in the two quarters before) when the whole year (the three quarters + the current quarter) is expected to see a profit of ~2.6 billion?

 

[Psychotext]

I'm confused. How can Nintendo make a profit of 2.7 billion in only one quarter (+ another ~2.5 in the two quarters before) when the whole year (the three quarters + the current quarter) is expected to see a profit of ~2.6 billion?

That's not their profit. It's their operating income.

 

[Bending_Unit_22]

Nintendo 1998-2008 income: $20,302,764,330

Huh, that's a lot of money.

 

[DarkMehm]

Anyone know the missing figures? Should be the total shipments for 2008.

PS2: 136.32m (6.53m)
NDS: 96.22m (31.43m)
PSP: 49.58m (11.98m)
WII: 44.96m (24.83m)
360: 28.50m (10.80m)
PS3: 21.30m (10.78m)

I filled the numbers in.

 

[Psychotext]

Thank you.