mitchman
Gold Member
B7 didn't have any burn-in mitigation features such as logo detection, afair. Newer TVs from B9 and up does have this.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Samsung S95B QD-OLED First Impressions (HDTVTest)
- Thread starter ParaSeoul
- Start date
Reallink
Member
Only thing the 7's lack is logo detection. It was the first year they added rigorous automatic panel compensation cycles (which is the big one for burn in), and of course also had the old Plasma era pixel shift (which continues to be worthless as any logo or HUD is FAR larger than you can reasonably shift an image) . The primary issue with any OLED is people driving them too bright. A C1 or C2 being ran full time at 300-400+ nits SDR are just as likely to experience burn in after several years if you display repeated static content.
Last edited:
Codiox
Member
See and that's the problem. Im all in for oled but why do I need to turn oled brightness way down just so I can use my TV more then a couple of years? If that's a problem then limit the setting for the end user.
OLED are already darker than LCDs.
Last edited:
Reallink
Member
They have limited the 42 and 48 C2 due to the threat of PC use, peak brightnesses are held back around 20% Vs the larger sizes and older 48"s. Not something they're trying to hide, they admitted this to press at the 2022 preview event. While a lot of places include free 4 year burn in warranties with purchase now, if you're planning to torch mode it with static content I would probably avoid OLED unless you upgrade often, don't use it often, or are wealthy enough to not care and replace it on a whim if need be.
Last edited:
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Amazing uniformity. Can't wait for this to mature a few years and to grab one once Dolby Vision and the colour accuracy and brightness is sorted.
Deaconstanjesusman
Banned
Having owned Samsungs. I want get one. They’re OS feels sluggish after a year and no Dolby vision support sucks. Plus like they’re phones they oversaturate everything. I’ll stick with my 77 c1 till it’s time to upgrade to micro led
Last edited:
cinnamonandgravy
Member
please join me in taking a moment to bow our heads for the poor souls who have LCDs.
daveonezero
Banned
Unless it is that double layer Hisense
Kazekage1981
Member
That extra pop vibrant saturated color look has always been a samsung thing...
is it me or does the 95B gives a CRT arcade monitor look?
is it me or does the 95B gives a CRT arcade monitor look?
MastAndo
Member
Despite the "controversy", I'm debating returning my 55" C1 for an S95B. I'm a sucker for a punchy image when gaming, and I'm just not getting that fix with the C1, despite my efforts. I'm trying to keep things accurate by using HGiG or Dolby Vision, but I'm just finding both to be just too dim at times for my tastes. Bright sunny days in Forza Horizon 5 or in MLB The Show 22 just look too dim to me for what they're supposed to be. DTM improves it, but just seems to fluctuate too much and I'm trying to avoid using such modes at the expense of accuracy. Just not sure it's worth $1000 more...decisions, decisions.
Mister Wolf
Member
Treat yourself. Buy the Samsung.
vpance
Member
If the brightness fluctuation is that annoying to you and it sounds like it is, then yeah I'd switch it up asap. That shit is annoying if you're sensitive to it, especially in games.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
Oh Samsung... as usual... making picture brighter than they should be... even on OLED. LoL.
Kazekage1981
Member
what about sony a95k? that has Dolby vision and its qd-oled
MastAndo
Member
I have 2 weeks to return my C1 for a refund, so I won't be able to do that before the a95k is released. Plus, it might be $1000 more than the S95B? That's quite a bit more than what I'm willing to spend.
vpance
Member
I wonder if anyone found a way to disable it on the QN sets, which also didn't track EOTF. So far it looks like that's the only negative of this TV.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
I for one would take a couple more inches over the benefits of oled, qled, whatever is hot now.
MastAndo
Member
Yeah, you're right. Order placed. Amazon makes TV returns pretty easy, so if I end up feeling like it's not worth it, no biggie.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
Good thing is that the tech behind this set just doesn't need this ki d of bs so they'll probably just release an update to correct this. And obviously say this was a 'mistake'.
MastAndo
Member
I like how recent events has him ending the video with the disclaimer that the TV isn't very accurate. It's like "This is the best TV I have ever seen...by the way, it isn't accurate."
As someone who is very much a novice with these things, I'm not quite sure what any of this S95B drama even means to me. Am I supposed to care that much? Owning the C1 has made me realize I will very much sacrifice some accuracy for a brighter picture with more pop though (i.e. using DTM looks "better" to my eyes than HGiG more often than not). I'm not looking for a ruined overly bright/washed out picture to sear my eyeballs though or completely oversaturate things, like some store display. That said, I'm hoping/thinking the S95B should suit me.
I like how recent events has him ending the video with the disclaimer that the TV isn't very accurate. It's like "This is the best TV I have ever seen...by the way, it isn't accurate."
As someone who is very much a novice with these things, I'm not quite sure what any of this S95B drama even means to me. Am I supposed to care that much? Owning the C1 has made me realize I will very much sacrifice some accuracy for a brighter picture with more pop though (i.e. using DTM looks "better" to my eyes than HGiG more often than not). I'm not looking for a ruined overly bright/washed out picture to sear my eyeballs though or completely oversaturate things, like some store display. That said, I'm hoping/thinking the S95B should suit me.
The "pop" mode would actually be a decent feature if you could just turn it off. Everybody would win, including Samsung.
MastAndo
Member
The S95B threads on a particular AV forum are a dumpster fire. You've got people hanging out in threads for TV's they don't have any interest in, just to push back against anyone saying they're enjoying the set. One dude is laughing at anyone with positive impressions, page after page...or if you're not a calibrator your opinion doesn't hold any weight. It's quite remarkable how much Vincent's video changed the narrative on this. It went from the holy grail to a laughing stock because it doesn't track the EOTF precisely out of the box, and some people have made the mistake of still liking it.
I'm hoping I'll just love the TV when I get it tomorrow, so I can abandon altogether the temptation to spend time on sites like that.
I'm hoping I'll just love the TV when I get it tomorrow, so I can abandon altogether the temptation to spend time on sites like that.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
While I’m firmly in the camp that says burn in concerns are greatly exaggerated, I’d be very hesitant to recommend an OLED for every day PC use. I do have my 48 inch C1 hooked up to my PC, but I only use it for gaming.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I’m not mad at Vincent but he pointed out an issue that literally no one would notice if not pointed out.
Lack of Dolby Vision continues to keep Samsung off my buy list. At least for movies. I could see using it for gaming only.
MastAndo
Member
Yeah, that's understandable. When I started shopping for a TV a couple month back, I dismissed Samsungs entirely for lack of Dolby Vision. Having owned a C1 for a few weeks now though, I'm finding the overall presentation of DV to be too dark for my tastes. I've been turning it off on the XSX and largely prefer DTM over HGiG for HDR...so yeah, I'm clearly not a purist, but I can see how it's a dealbreaker for some.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
That godly uniformity makes this TV amazing for gaming imo.
The problem is not that it's not 100% accurate, cause people like and enjoy different things, so they may like not accurate, overvibrate picture, preference over reference.
The problem is that Samsung is simply cheating, actively detecting testing patterns and making them show accurate colors just like Vincent have shown in his video. So they want to have reviewers praising them for the picture being reference-like AND customers being delighted for "popping colors" at the same time. It's just wrong, it's the same practice as smartphones detecting benchmark softwares and running faster or VW dieselgate where they were running other software during emission tests.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I’m talking about movies. DV does make a difference and I find it to be more natural. In gaming I couldn’t careless.
mitchman
Gold Member
You can change the brightness for DV only, it's stored separately.
thatJohann
Member
I saw the S95B at Best Buy. Granted they have them on Vivid mode as stores do but I was surprised at how bright they got although white text kind of glowed a bit. Maybe cause of vivid mode.
Does anyone know if game mode on the S95B dims the screen like most displays do?
Does anyone know if game mode on the S95B dims the screen like most displays do?
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Samsung is known for going notoriously bright. Samsung goes for bright abs poppy while Sony and LG go for more natural looks. At least to my eyes.
MastAndo
Member
My 55" S95B arrived earlier today and after a few hours, some initial impressions/comparisons to the C1 - it's basically everything I hoped it would be (i.e. an OLED and LED hybrid). Due to limitations in the OLED tech, gaming on the C1 often left me underwhelmed. I don't like a blown out image, but I do want bright, sunny days to look well, bright and sunny. The C1 gave me the impression I was looking through tinted glass particularly in some games. The S95B has no such perceivable limitations. It's not eye-searingly bright like an LCD, but it's most definitely bright enough to more accurately depict a well-lit environment. Even in Elden Ring, walking through Limgrave during sunrise, the sun through the trees shining on to the grass shows a great contrast between shadow and light, as it should. Things like that are just visually pleasing to me when gaming. Highlights and specular details are practically glowing. The "wow" factor is most definitely there. It feels like HDR with DTM on on the C1 (my preferred HDR setting), except more vibrant and without the fluctuations and blown out mids.
With most streaming content, it seems pretty similar so far. I'd actually give the edge to the C1 in certain content like Batman on HBO Max for example, thanks to Dolby Vision. I have said I found Dolby Vision to be generally too dark for my liking, but I can still see the appeal and it's definitely a bummer that Samsung sets don't have it. With videos that push HDR hard, like certain showcase videos on YouTube, it's a night and day difference. The S95B just dominates when given certain content and can be downright stunning. SDR content seems similarly great on both, just generally brighter on the Samsung.
Out of the box, it does have that Samsung oversaturated color thing going (grass was looking radioactive), but I changed the Color Space to Auto for all sources (SDR and HDR) and it reeled things in. I have seen some reviewers/content creators leaving it on normal, and that looks like an eyesore to me. So yeah, it looks pretty great on that front to me right now.
I've been going back and forth between streaming via the built-in apps, brief gaming on the XSX/PS5 and using it as a PC monitor. No major issues to report so far. I'm not noticing any disruptive ABL or ABSL or anything. The screen does gradually dim after a while on static images (like writing this post, for example), but that was the case on the C1 as well and doesn't bother me. Large swaths of white still do appear grayish but not as much as the C1, not surprisingly.
Motion seems slightly better on the S95B, but it's same ballpark. I'm not one too use motion interpolation and even with it, streaming content and sports are generally smooth to my eyes. The panel is clean (though so was my C1), and I'm not seeing any bending like others reported.
My biggest issues with the TV right now are basically the remote and Tizen - they both kinda stink. The LG remote allows for instantaneous switching between inputs, but this doesn't have that nor a dedicated settings button. You have to go to the Home screen, then choose the input there. I know you can purchase the older remote that has more dedicated buttons, so I might have to do that. Also, Tizen is pretty underwhelming, with about the same level of sluggishness as WebOS 6 on the C1 perhaps even worse when it comes to responding to button presses. Apps and menus load a bit faster though. They generally seem similar in that regard, and they're both basically a cluttered mess of icons.
I'm going to be messing with settings and different content in the upcoming days to fine tune things to my liking. If anyone wants me to check anything on it for them, just let me know.
With most streaming content, it seems pretty similar so far. I'd actually give the edge to the C1 in certain content like Batman on HBO Max for example, thanks to Dolby Vision. I have said I found Dolby Vision to be generally too dark for my liking, but I can still see the appeal and it's definitely a bummer that Samsung sets don't have it. With videos that push HDR hard, like certain showcase videos on YouTube, it's a night and day difference. The S95B just dominates when given certain content and can be downright stunning. SDR content seems similarly great on both, just generally brighter on the Samsung.
Out of the box, it does have that Samsung oversaturated color thing going (grass was looking radioactive), but I changed the Color Space to Auto for all sources (SDR and HDR) and it reeled things in. I have seen some reviewers/content creators leaving it on normal, and that looks like an eyesore to me. So yeah, it looks pretty great on that front to me right now.
I've been going back and forth between streaming via the built-in apps, brief gaming on the XSX/PS5 and using it as a PC monitor. No major issues to report so far. I'm not noticing any disruptive ABL or ABSL or anything. The screen does gradually dim after a while on static images (like writing this post, for example), but that was the case on the C1 as well and doesn't bother me. Large swaths of white still do appear grayish but not as much as the C1, not surprisingly.
Motion seems slightly better on the S95B, but it's same ballpark. I'm not one too use motion interpolation and even with it, streaming content and sports are generally smooth to my eyes. The panel is clean (though so was my C1), and I'm not seeing any bending like others reported.
My biggest issues with the TV right now are basically the remote and Tizen - they both kinda stink. The LG remote allows for instantaneous switching between inputs, but this doesn't have that nor a dedicated settings button. You have to go to the Home screen, then choose the input there. I know you can purchase the older remote that has more dedicated buttons, so I might have to do that. Also, Tizen is pretty underwhelming, with about the same level of sluggishness as WebOS 6 on the C1 perhaps even worse when it comes to responding to button presses. Apps and menus load a bit faster though. They generally seem similar in that regard, and they're both basically a cluttered mess of icons.
I'm going to be messing with settings and different content in the upcoming days to fine tune things to my liking. If anyone wants me to check anything on it for them, just let me know.
NeonGhost
uses 'M$' - What year is it? Not 2002.
That’s a big post just to say you don’t care about accuracy
MastAndo
Member
I would imagine there are some other heathens checking this thread who might want to hear from someone who actually owns it.
Kazekage1981
Member
How does VRR look between LG and Samsung?
MastAndo
Member
Seems to be equally smooth on both. I haven't played any PC games yet though, and the only console game I played that benefits much from VRR is Elden Ring on XSX. Both do a great job of smoothing that game out.
StateofMajora
Banned
Seems quite a few customers are getting units with bent screens.
Which i'm not surprised, these things are WAY too thin, same for lg oled.
Sony oled is about twice as thick and I still think it's too thin lol
Which i'm not surprised, these things are WAY too thin, same for lg oled.
Sony oled is about twice as thick and I still think it's too thin lol
I have the Samsung q9fn and don't really feel like I'm missing out on anything other than I guess the ultra oled blacks. That's a perfectly fine sacrifice for me in order to not worry about having to baby the panel to avoid menus getting burned into the tv
Corporal.Hicks
Member
Despite the controversy this guy (FOMO, 14m20s) say S95 is still more accurate than LG and Sony OLEDs.
FOMO also shows heat map to prove his point
Last edited:
Stooky
Member
I think Fomo is an enthusiast vs Vincent a former professional video calibrator.
vpance
Member
Saw that earlier. I get his point as WOLED is inaccurate in other ways too, especially OOtB uncalibrated, but I believe they can be made to match reference (at least for the A90J?) for any content under 700 nits, while the S95B will still be boosting in the entire range.
Samsung could have literally hit a home run but they drop in the undefeatable boosting. That said, if I was in the market for a new TV I don't think this would stop me from getting an S95, lol.
Last edited:
Kazekage1981
Member
when is HDTVTest\Vincent gonna release a comprehensive review of S95?
Corporal.Hicks
Member
WOLED's can display accurate colors up to 350-400 nits range (above that colors start turning into white because of white subpixel), so even 600/700 nits picture will look more accurate on S95 in that regard. FOMO has used 600 nits demo in his comparison, and S95 was clearly showing much more bright colors on the heat map. With 2000 / 4000 nits content LG WOLED was simply destroyed as you can see in his video.
Because of Vincent people think S95 bright picture is just a gimmick (boosted settings), but here's interesting comparison between Sony X95K, and S95. As anyone can see picture on X95K is still a little bit brighter, but there's not a huge difference like it was with WOLED's (and even LG G2 looks extremely dim next to MINI LEDs). No amount of tweaking will help LG G2 reach mini led level of brightness, therefore suggesting S95 brightness is a gimmick is just ridiculous.
People view Vincent as a guru when it comes to display technology and trust him. Personally I cant trust him after his "your OLED is not bright enough for HDR" video. For many years he was recommending OLED's for HDR, and later on he addmited WOLED wasnt bright enough LOL.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
It's almost like people's minds can change. Vincent is the best we have. He's not perfect but he has more credentials than any other. Remember display quality is a measurable science. He could be like Quantum and like his tv's on full blast color with motion smoothing and troll other youtubers who know what they're talking about.
Last edited:
Corporal.Hicks
Member
Yes, display quality is measurable, but lets not forget there are many picture quality aspects to measure, while Vincent picks just one that shows LG G2 in good light. Also I want to know if Vincent has calibrated his S95 himself (that's the only way to do it correctly), or just used settings from the internet (even the same display will be a little bit different, therefore you cant use the same settings), because he suggest using "keep it classy tech" picture settings in his video.
Last edited:
vpance
Member
Have to remember FOMO was just showing a comparison for out of the box uncalibrated sets. His argument is what's more accurate for the average consumer, who won't get their TVs calibrated? I would tend to agree with him on that point.
Well I always remembered Vincent talking about how important peak brightness is to minimize tone mapping and more accurate colors for bright pictures. He wasn't talking about it in every video but he did bring it up from time to time. But yeah that OLED not bright enough video confused a lot of his loyal viewers who didn't realize that fact.