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[darkpaladinmfc]

then please put them into context for me so I understand your point about mobility.

oh and thanks, much appreciated. but I guess I failed way back when I didn't pick easy mode.

I don't understand what you're trying to say, so explain your Marine and Stalker stats and I'll tell you why you may be wrong.

Saying stuff like this at a low level is really stupid.

 

[Walshicus]

He co-wrote. Everything since then has been a mess.

I've got to be honest, I don't see any change in the quality of writing between SC1 and SC2. I think you're all both too harsh on the sequel and too easy on the original.

 

[mescalineeyes]

I don't understand what you're trying to say, so explain your Marine and Stalker stats and I'll tell you why you may be wrong.

Saying stuff like this at a low level is really stupid.

calling me low level is really stupid.
you haven't played in 3 months. I could probably eat you alive.

Protoss have bad mobility? When stalker is de facto one of the fastest ground units in the game, and Zealots have speed upgrade? Dude...

stop saying stupid shit at your low level dude. diamond doesn't mean crap. if you're not AT LEAST borderline-grandmasters on a 3 month hiatus you have nothing to say.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

Protoss have bad mobility? When stalker is de facto one of the fastest ground units in the game, and Zealots have speed upgrade? Dude...

Try splitting your army in half and see what a good Terran player will do to it, hint: it won't work out well for Protoss.

calling me low level is really stupid.
you haven't played in 3 months. I could probably eat you alive.

If you're borderline Masters (I'm totally ok with you saying borderline Masters if you're high diamond) then you won't, I have played a bit actually. I have friends who are also in the same sort of league you are in, and I consider them low level, sorry if that offends you, but it's definitely too low a level to talk make really bold claims about game design and balance (even at my level talking about balance is stupid).

 

[V_Arnold]

Try splitting your army in half and see what a good Terran player will do to it, hint: it won't work out well for Protoss.

Hint: if you split your army as terran against a Protoss, the Protoss will EAT YOU ALIVE.
That is your magical context?

Because it is quite weak.

stop saying stupid shit at your low level dude. diamond doesn't mean crap. if you're not AT LEAST borderline-grandmasters on a 3 month hiatus you have nothing to say.

Although I finished as Diamond, this stupid system placed me as Plat(!) and I did not have proper time to grind out a masters yet out of this Season. So I guess the black cars are on their way to my home now...

 

[Pandaman]

Mobility is about map control and map presence, things that Terran normally has in TvP when going Bio. Being able to split your army effectively is a very important part of map control and map presence (Terran can split their army easily, it's very dangerous for Protoss), the Phoenix provides this, but Phoenix builds are not very common in TvP (for a variety of reasons).

In the very early stages of the game Terran can easily obtain map control and presence with 1 Rax Reaper/Marauder expansions, and later on in the game Terran can obtain it via Medivacs.

you're much too respectful of t. :\ t cant just open reaper/marauder, expand and get medivacs and have enough stuff to split his army and be safe. it just doesnt happen. T also cant deny your scouting as a protoss without keeping those reapers and a sharp eye on the minimap. no race can tech, build units and expand all at the same time safely, if someones doing it to you you're being mindgamed.

marauders slow expansions. gas slows expansions. reaper/marauders/slow slows expansions and teching, there's a multitude of open windows you can exploit to roll a t in this situation off relatvely reliable scouting.

I don't understand what you're trying to say, so explain your Marine and Stalker stats and I'll tell you why you may be wrong.

Saying stuff like this at a low level is really stupid.

i think he's saying when your units are faster and have longer or equivalent range, the slow units cant really force you off the map for free.

or in short form: 1 marauder will never catch your stalker, so why send it home?

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

you're much too respectful of t. :\ t cant just open reaper/marauder, expand and get medivacs and have enough stuff to split his army and be safe. it just doesnt happen. T also cant deny your scouting as a protoss without keeping those reapers and a sharp eye on the minimap. no race can tech, build units and expand all at the same time safely, if someones doing it to you you're being mindgamed.

marauders slow expansions. gas slows expansions. reaper/marauders/slow slows expansions and teching, there's a multitude of open windows you can exploit to roll a t in this situation off relatvely reliable scouting.

You're not familiar with 1 Rax Tech Lab expansions? They're very popular and very good, the build my brother uses most often actually, and TvP is his best match-up. You get an expansion very quickly and can deny scouting and even pressure if you want.

i think he's saying when your units are faster and have longer or equivalent range, the slow units cant really force you off the map for free.

or in short form: 1 marauder will never catch your stalker, so why send it home?

The threat of a Marauder coming down and getting one concussive shot off is enough for you to not be as active with the Stalker as you would hope. Also, the very very early stages of the game are very very different to the later stages of the game.

 

[Deadly]

Wow so this totally derailed into balance talk :lol
In some new features talk, I noticed in the gameplay video the lings kinda jump from a small distance now, looked pretty much like charge but from a shorter distance. Plausible new multiplayer ability?

 

[pieatorium]

You're not familiar with 1 Rax Tech Lab expansions? They're very popular and very good, the build my brother uses most often actually, and TvP is his best match-up. You get an expansion very quickly and can deny scouting and even pressure if you want.

These auto die to any voidray play, pretty much any toss 1 base all in actually unless you have a ton of bunkers.

 

[V_Arnold]

Wow so this totally derailed into balance talk :lol
In some new features talk, I noticed in the gameplay video the lings kinda jump from a small distance now, looked pretty much like charge but from a shorter distance. Plausible new multiplayer ability?

That is the Raptor morph upgrade for them. With cliff jumping. Something I pretty much DEMANDED from them since day 1

 

[Pandaman]

You're not familiar with 1 Rax Tech Lab expansions? They're very popular and very good, the build my brother uses most often actually, and TvP is his best match-up. You get an expansion very quickly and can deny scouting and even pressure if you want.

no, i am familiar with it and i just told you how to beat it when he transitions into big drop play.

you're welcome.

maybe i should be talking to your brother instead, since you seem to bring him up alot.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

These auto die to any voidray play, pretty much any toss 1 base all in actually unless you have a ton of bunkers.

They don't.

no, i am familiar with it and i just told you how to beat it when he transitions into big drop play.

your welcome.

maybe i should be talking to your brother instead, since you seem to bring him up alot.

You don't rush to Medivac unless you feel safe to do so, you don't need Medivacs to be more mobile than Protoss. Obviously I'm going to bring my brother up when you talk about Terran builds as he knows more about them then I do. What league are you in?

 

[mescalineeyes]

They don't.

it's these sort of replies that made the tone in this thread turn as sour as it is.

the correct way to go about it is: "I am of the belief that Terran 1 rax Tech-Lab fast expands don't die to silly herp derp Protoss one-base allins because ____________" (this is where you put why you don't think they do and then our more experienced players can tell you why you are -- again -- blatantly wrong.)

What league are you in?

and these.

 

[pieatorium]

They don't.

Go watch Nada vs Inca from last seasons gsl and you will see one of the most consistantly high placing Terrans get rolled buy a guy who's only good matchup is pvp because he techlab expands vs 1 basing. There are other pro games I've seen recently go down the same, Cruncher vs somone If I think of a few more I'll let you know.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

it's these sort of replies that made the tone in this thread turn as sour as it is.

Saying they 'auto-die' to any Stargate or all-ins is just straight up wrong, it'd be a very rare build if that was the case.

Go watch Nada vs Inca from last seasons gsl and you will see one of the most consistantly high placing Terrans get rolled buy a guy who's only good matchup is pvp because he techlab expands vs 1 basing. There are other pro games I've seen recently go down the same, Cruncher vs somone If I think of a few more I'll let you know.

Nada straight up plays bad, you can't use one series as an example, I can just 'counter' with most of ThorZain's games in the TSL where he uses 1 Rax Tech Lab expand a lot and his opponents see it and do not all-in or go Stargate (because it's not an auto-win).

 

[Pandaman]

You don't rush to Medivac unless you feel safe to do so

right!

you don't need Medivacs to be more mobile than Protoss.

wrong!

Obviously I'm going to bring my brother up when you talk about Terran builds as he knows more about them then I do.

mentioning siblings doesnt grant you access to their knowledge, so unless you're actively discussing this with him [in which case he'd be better suited to speak himself], bringing him up doesn't actually do anything.

What league are you in?

masters, ofcourse.

 

[mescalineeyes]

not everyone is eloquent enough to say things like "has trouble dealing with" or "is susceptible to".
it is a forum on the internet after all.

 

[ultron87]

Man, those jumping zerglings in the expansion pack that this thread is actually about sure look cool.

 

[SillyEskimo]

I'm pretty excited for this. I'm going to go back and play through the WoL game.

Getting this expansion and Diablo 3 in the same year would be pretty awesome.

 

[webrunner]

Spec Ops and Corruption, ok..

the other two look like a palm and claws, so i assumethey're something psionic ("Ghost"?) and something to do with clawy smashy bladey ("Blade Queen"?)

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

wrong!

You don't need to rush to Medivacs to get Medivacs, if that makes sense (it does in my head, hard to articulate what I mean). Even then with stim Terran can split their army up safely and dart in and out of locations.

mentioning siblings dont grant you access to their knowledge, so unless you're actively discussing this with him [in which case he'd be better suited to speak himself], bringing him up doesn't actually do anything.

I have asked him and he agrees with what I say, and I'll continue to ask him about his TvP builds if I need to.

masters, ofcourse.

Good, that means you may not suck .

 

[raphier]

Spec Ops and Corruption, ok..

the other two look like a palm and claws, so i assumethey're something psionic ("Ghost"?) and something to do with clawy smashy bladey ("Blade Queen"?)

I think Ghost powers fall under Spec Ops category. The claws seems to be something else, maybe Offensive upgrades.

 

[V_Arnold]

Jesus christ, you are a bit too ranking-focused. Anyone can 2-rax/4gate his way into masters, but that does not mean he is actually any good.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

I'm pretty excited for this. I'm going to go back and play through the WoL game.

Getting this expansion and Diablo 3 in the same year would be pretty awesome.

No way HotS is coming out this year.

Spoiler

I'm staying (perhaps overly) optimistic for Diablo 3

 

[hamchan]

darkpaladinmfc needs to post a link to his bnet profile or sc2ranks link.

 

[Pandaman]

people who are bad:
diamonds. Nada.

people who might not be bad:
me.


awwwww yeah baby.

 

[Ark]

Day one.

Maybe this will get me back in SC2..

 

[Deadly]

darkpaladinmfc needs to post a link to his bnet profile or sc2ranks link.

This. It would help alot already :lol

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

darkpaladinmfc needs to post a link to his bnet profile or sc2ranks link.

Like I said I haven't laddered for a long time, but broad game knowledge does not diminish (my knowledge of intricacies and exact builds admittely has), here is my brothers, who I recently could go toe-to-toe with.

people who are bad:
diamonds. Nada.

people who might not be bad:
me.


awwwww yeah baby.

Haha, playing one bad series (relative to the level which you have to perform at, which is ridiculously high for Nada) doesn't make you a bad player, you're just taking my posts out of context... And also, you can be Masters and be bad, so obviously I can't say you're good based on just that.

 

[Tacitus_]

I think Ghost powers fall under Spec Ops category. The claws seems to be something else, maybe Offensive upgrades.

From an AMA over at reddit:

It was essentaily that you pick her skill loadout before a mission at the Battle Focus menu, either Spec Ops or Corruption (there are two more but they were locked and no text'd). Spec Ops is essentially the super-ghost mode, corruption is essentially super-infestor mode.

 

[Pandaman]

dark, you might aswell just post it. nobody will care if you're a 80s masters because you havent played since season start.

ever get that feeling battle.net is trolling you?

 

[Yoshichan]

What was the name of that SC2-GAF-troll with the giraffe avatar? I seriously think he's the same person as darkpaladinmfc. I don't think I've ever seen such rank-whoring in quite some time (since beta actually! "Wow, you're only platinum?! I'M HIGH DIAMOND! EAT YOUR HEART OUT, N00B!")

edit: And the fact that he keeps mentioning his HOLY-SHIT-MY-BROTHER-SHOULD-BE-IN-GSL-SINCE-HE-OBVIOUSLY-BEAT-IDRA sickens me to death.

My thread ;_; What happened to it.

 

[pieatorium]

What was the name of that SC2-GAF-troll with the giraffe avatar? I seriously think he's the same person as darkpaladinmfc. I don't think I've ever seen such rank-whoring in quite some time (since beta actually! "Wow, you're only platinum?! I'M HIGH DIAMOND! EAT YOUR HEART OUT, N00B!")

chronicle x?

 

[webrunner]

I think Ghost powers fall under Spec Ops category. The claws seems to be something else, maybe Offensive upgrades.

What I'm assuming is that Spec-Ops is "ghost as an elite sniper soldier", and hand is "Ghost as a super-psionic protoss-lite"

That'd give two "terran" and two "zerg" trees.

 

[erpg]

Brotherly love.

 

[BigAT]

Like I said I haven't laddered for a long time, but broad game knowledge does not diminish (my knowledge of intricacies and exact builds admittely has), here is my brothers, who I recently could go toe-to-toe with.

Is this not the internet equivalent of "SHUT UP OR I'LL GET MY BIG BROTHER TO BEAT YOU UP!"?

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

What was the name of that SC2-GAF-troll with the giraffe avatar? I seriously think he's the same person as darkpaladinmfc. I don't think I've ever seen such rank-whoring in quite some time (since beta actually! "Wow, you're only platinum?! I'M HIGH DIAMOND! EAT YOUR HEART OUT, N00B!")

Except I'm actually making logical argument? All I'm saying is it's hard to make bold statements about game design and balance in a low league, someone seems a bit salty. And to think this all started because one person said that Forcefields and warping-in went against the fundamentals of RTSs (oh and didn't you say they should be removed for HotS?).

dark, you might aswell just post it. nobody will care if you're a 80s masters because you havent played since season start.

If you insist. I had to play a PvT for one day, so I just 4gated most of the PvZs (with low success) and PvPs (decent success, I didn't have time to learn 'new' PvP) and played properly in PvT (did well). I was playing like 1200 Masters which I believe is mid-high?

edit: And the fact that he keeps mentioning his HOLY-SHIT-MY-BROTHER-SHOULD-BE-IN-GSL-SINCE-HE-OBVIOUSLY-BEAT-IDRA sickens me to death.

My thread ;_; What happened to it.

Wow you're an IDIOT. I said he was good, not that he should be in GSL or that he is anywhere near as good as Idra, sounds like you're just mad that I said Diamond league is low level (no shame in that, I have tons of friends in Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Diamond, Masters, etc and most of them are in Diamond).

Is this not the internet equivalent of "SHUT UP OR I'LL GET MY BIG BROTHER TO BEAT YOU UP!"?

Read my other posts and you'll see how its relevant, as we were talking about Terran builds and I asked my brother about some stuff.

 

[Yoshichan]

Except I'm actually making logical argument? All I'm saying is it's hard to make bold statements about game design and balance in a low league, someone seems a bit salty. And to think this all started because one person said that Forcefields and warping-in went against the fundamentals of RTSs.

No, you're not making any logical argument. You're most likely one of those people that got to GM by doing shit strategies that work in league matches (4gate, 3rax). And by getting into GM, you can clearly sit back, relax and start talking about balancing because you and especially your brother is so amazing.

An example of how to actually contribute and make logical arguments: Look at Pandas posts. An example of how to NOT do it: Look at your own.

Wow you're an IDIOT.

someone seems a bit salty

 

[Pandaman]

If you insist. I had to play a PvT for one day, so I just 4gated most of the PvZs (with low success) and PvPs (decent success, I didn't have time to learn 'new' PvP) and played properly in PvT (did well). I was playing like 1200 Masters which I believe is mid-high?

i dunno, i just see more fuel for the 'stop complaining about shattered being zerg favoured' fire.

 

[farnham]

if raptors can do cliff jumping that would be completely awesome

finally a cliff jumping zerg unit!

 

[mescalineeyes]

Won 22, lost 33 (40.00% wins)

demotion to low-level incoming.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

No, you're not making any logical argument. You're most likely one of those people that got to GM by doing shit strategies that work in league matches (4gate, 3rax). And by getting into GM, you can clearly sit back, relax and start talking about balancing because you and especially your brother is so amazing.

An example of how to actually contribute and make logical arguments: Look at Pandas posts. An example of how to NOT do it: Look at your own.

Saying I 'probably 4gated my way to where I am' just makes you look like a complete idiot. I'm actually doing the OPPOSITE of talking about balance, you said you want forcefields and warp-in REMOVED, and I'm saying they're a fundamental part of the Protoss race and should stay. I'm not even going to propose any balance changes because the balance is so fickle and only a select few people have any right to seriously talk about balance to this level, and you and I are not any of those people.

 

[Yoshichan]

Won 22, lost 33 (40.00% wins)

demotion to low-level incoming.

Playing in Masters automatically gives you the opportunity to talk balance. Didn't you know that?

Spoiler

lol, I know someone who's played like 8 ladder games or something and is high Master...

to this level, and you and I are not any of those people.

Look people, he's starting to get it!

you said you want forcefields and warp-in REMOVED

You got zero out of two points for this one. Sentries needs to be taken out and warp-in needs to be changed.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

i dunno, i just see more fuel for the 'stop complaining about shattered being zerg favoured' fire.

Sorry? I'm not saying anything about maps, or balance.

Won 22, lost 33 (40.00% wins)

demotion to low-level incoming.

Read my post ^_^. In a few weeks after my exams are over I'm going to be playing full-time again, downloading a set of Naniwa/whoever's replays from MLG and studying the builds that I've missed on is going to be the first thing I do (completely not used to warpgate timing change).

 

[ultron87]

The horrible thing is that we really aren't even talking balance in this thread, we're just having a semantic argument about which race is more "mobile".

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

The horrible thing is that we really aren't even talking balance in this thread, we're just having a semantic argument about which race is more "mobile".

I think it's just turned into flaming me, actually ;(, talking about balance is stupid any ways .

 

[Biff]

Hai guize I'm a Gold Terran I think Ter-

*gets stabbed*

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

Hai guize I'm a Gold Terran I think Ter-

*gets stabbed*

Certainly not by me, I'd help you actually, as long as you don't say forcefields and warp-in should be removed and then call me an idiot!

You got zero out of two points for this one. Sentries needs to be taken out and warp-in needs to be changed.

Just re-read that and think about how ridiculous it sounds coming from anyone in any league.

 

[farnham]

Hai guize I'm a Gold Terran I think Ter-

*gets stabbed*

yeah reading this thread makes me feel like you have to play at the gsl to get at least to be able to post here.

im sure the grandmasters here will even laugh at ogsmc or nestea looking how skilled they seem to be

 

[Technosteve]

Your multiplayer diamond league opinions don't mean shit to me.