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[Tenki]

Shin'en, who have worked with Wii U: "what do they know? lol"

Other developers who haven't touched the console: "they are right, they sure know and have done all they can"

 

[Busaiku]

Couldn't "current gen" also be talking about Wii?

 

[Kimawolf]

On that front:



Shin'en are tech gurus who could likely code circles around a lot of big name devs. Many people in here are revealing their ignorance.

It's more than ignorance, it's people believing whatever fits their narrative and reality they wish to be true. It is partly Nintendo's fault for not having something out to really push the system, but it's also people lacking any kind of reading comprehension or reading thread titles and not bothering to read the actual article before making their un-witty comments. Or perhaps even doing research on said people to know a small 5 man team like they have are very experienced and truly know their stuff. But again, because of what they said it will be laughed at because it doesn't fit a certain narrative.

 

[UncleSporky]

I'm pretty sure we already knew Wii U was several GPU generations ahead of PS360? Newer shader model version and all that.

 

[Captain Smoker]

I would like to invite everyone who shouts loud at Shin'en comments to visit this thread

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=59858645#post59858645

and prove themselves in serious technical discussions.


All those Dragon Ball - comparisons or oneliners which dismiss the technical knowledge of people who are in this business for more than 30 years aren't usefull at all.

 

[Mildudon]

An interview with Shin'en. I understand it as they are talking about GPU generations.

http://www.gamereactor.dk/grtv/?id=111311

 

[dallow_bg]

So far I've just seen bits of certain effects here and there that look a lot better than PS360.

Overall graphics, so far no.
Hopefully someone can make a showcase game but I don't care that much.

 

[SmokyDave]

Shin'en are fucking awesome, but I can't help but feel they're overselling things somewhat. It's obvious that the Wii-U is no powerhouse in comparison to the consoles it's going to go up against. Hell, it's struggling to top the last gen stuff and often falls behind.

It's very definitely the successor to the Wii in power terms.

 

[JerryThePredator]

If Shin'en tells me the Wii U is more powerful than most people give it credit for, but some EA/Frosbite Engine guy tells me it's not...

I'll believe the Shin'en guy.

 

[ivysaur12]

It's more than ignorance, it's people believing whatever fits their narrative and reality they wish to be true. It is partly Nintendo's fault for not having something out to really push the system, but it's also people lacking any kind of reading comprehension or reading thread titles and not bothering to read the actual article before making their un-witty comments. Or perhaps even doing research on said people to know a small 5 man team like they have are very experienced and truly know their stuff. But again, because of what they said it will be laughed at because it doesn't fit a certain narrative.

This is the best post in the thread.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I'm pretty sure we already knew Wii U was several GPU generations ahead of PS360? Newer shader model version and all that.

Hence my saying there's nothing fanciful or controversial about what they're saying.

 

[ASIS]

Did anyone here read anything more than the title? Anyone?

 

[Soi-Fong]

Still majority of GAF has the illusion that the Wii U GPGPU or CPU are weak. This guys code to the metal with there games on the Wii or Wii U. Middle ware engines are not tailored for exotic architecture that is the Wii U. Industry is working on middle ware engines that's why Wii U power is not visible at the moment.

Also according to this guys the middle ware engines need to be tailored for the Wii U that means more money on developing time that third parties are not willing at the moment to invest.

Wii U IS powerfull not Ps4 or Xbone level but close.

Can I have some of what you're smoking because I haven't seen anything remotely close to Infamous or Killzone on the WiiU.

 

[Grampasso]

OH come on!

They are still arguing the power of the WiiU hardware. Didn't we settle this debate?

We have new hardware coming to us this year and we are analyzing the Wii U hardware?

Because the new hardware has yet to come?

 

[The Boat]

GPU generations != console generations. It's a shame that most people just prefer to shoot their mouths without even thinking for a second, because "LOL" posts just make you seem so cool.

 

[Vermillion]

Could some real hardware expert tell me how many generations are this graphics ahead of current gen posibilities? I really can't count them just by looking at their latest WiiU game.

- GPU gen
- You picked the beginning of the bonus level
- They said they didn't push the Wii U

 

[Neo C.]

But why compromise if its so powerful?

Read the interview. He answered it.

Spoiler

They achieved their goals for the first game and didn't bother to go further for a launch game. Their next games will dig much deeper.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

What a well-thought-out argument! Wonderful evidence.

Thank you.

 

[Zero148]

And here's another shin'en interview where they try to defend their only/main source of money...

Who knows why they are the only one who talks about good thing about the wii u hardware huh?

Criterion did also. Surprisinglyt their NFS port is actually not only performing better than the PS360 versions, but also has superior visuals.

Maybe most developers (every EA employeer outside of criterion) just don't understand or don't want to understand the hardware?

 

[baggagelizard]

better technology =/= raw power

 

[Interceptor]

This will at least create 50pages full of angry people who won't stop teaching you that the Wii U its abysmal bad. It has to be!

 

[bobbychalkers]

GPU generations go by fairly quick and the PS3 and 360 are 7 and 8 years old. Just speaking chronologically that shouldn't be a controversial statement at all. With that said, I can't wait to see their next game.

 

[KingSnake]

People not seeing any difference between GPU generations and console generation, proven. This thread is delivering.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

Shinen is slowly (well maybe not so slowly) becoming a running gag.

I could say the same about you.

 

[Serenity]

- GPU gen
- You picked the beginning of the bonus level
- They said they didn't push the Wii U

So why no 1080p for their game then?

 

[mugurumakensei]

The Wii U GPU has a later shader model, has dedicated compute functionality, and the newest pre-DX11 tesselator vs the PS3 and 360 GPUs. None of Shin-en's statements are controversial.

 

[AmFreak]

The "“The Wii U GPU is several generations ahead of the current gen." is true, cause they are obviously talking about gpu generations.
By saying this they also prevent the need to say anything (real) about the power of the gpu.

Everything else they said is just ..... obvious.

 

[The_Lump]

So developers must adapt to the system's custom specifications to get a decent performance?

It's cool that the console it's not as bad (graphically) as thought but from a dev perspective, what is the incentive to spend money on a dedicated Wii U team who can learn the custom architecture when the game is going to sell 10 or 20 thousand copies?

In this case, Sony did a brilliant choice ditching the japanese obsession to customize everything to THEIR needs.

This is an important point. Nintendo took a risk by going down this route and it hasn't paid off yet as its evidently put off quite screw third parties. They only way up is for sales to increase enough to tempt them back.

 

[ULTROS!]

I'm surprised they're still 3rd party developers when they've only developed for Nintendo consoles ever since. Might as well be bought by Nintendo.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

 

[Cosmozone]

Oh, GPU generations? That wasn't very clear from the interview but makes much more sense. Still, this is the perfect flamebait as proven by this thread.

 

[gemoran4]

I think people are misunderstanding the definition of 'generation' in this context. Hell it could have 2008 GPU architecture and be considered multiple generations ahead of the 360 and ps3 gpus.

 

[Jocchan]

Maybe most developers (every EA employeer outside of criterion) just don't understand or don't want to understand the hardware?

Neither, they just don't care. Very few are going to try and push the system.

 

[Drencrom]

Then go ahead with your knowledge and educate the people with facts. Serious discussion.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=59858645#post59858645

Edit: I revert my previous comments because i thought they were talking console generations, not GPU generations.

 

[Mutanthands]

It's more than ignorance, it's people believing whatever fits their narrative and reality they wish to be true. It is partly Nintendo's fault for not having something out to really push the system, but it's also people lacking any kind of reading comprehension or reading thread titles and not bothering to read the actual article before making their un-witty comments. Or perhaps even doing research on said people to know a small 5 man team like they have are very experienced and truly know their stuff. But again, because of what they said it will be laughed at because it doesn't fit a certain narrative.

Amen. The change of generation creeping stupid is getting to be a bit much. GAF is not as pleasant a place these days.

 

[Marche90]

I don't believe that they meant "several generations" with Console Generation in mind. At least, that's what I get from reading that interview.

Also, it should be pretty obvious that once the tools and engines are optimized for it, it will get better performance.

Fake Edit: Beaten in that regard.

 

[Glass Rebel]

GPU generations go by fairly quick and the PS3 and 360 are 7 and 8 years old. Just speaking chronologically that shouldn't be a controversial statement at all. With that said, I can't wait to see their next game.

And still people are struggling with it.

I'm surprised they're still 3rd party developers when they've only developed for Nintendo consoles ever since. Might as well be bought by Nintendo.

Maybe they could finally get some decent art.

 

[tipoo]

I guess this invalidates that VGleaks report that the eDRAM was not programmable and was automatically managed.

 

[Raist]

They made this:

That game (Jet Rocket) is only (!) 40 MB in size! I think they know what they are talking about.

I'm not quite sure that using a screen for a Wii game that doesn't look any better than your average PS2 game is gonna help, no matter how big the file is, because that's completely irrelevant to their statement that the WiiU's GPU is a lot more advanced than current gen's.
So unless they put out something that looks much more advanced, they'd better not make statements about GPU capabilities. Even if their game fits on an N64 cartridge.

 

[ivysaur12]

I never said Wii U's GPU wasn't powerful or anything, I'm just saying that the statement about it being 'several gens' ahead is downright inane. It's simply not, it won't even be as powerful as it's competitors.

No, it's not. Re-read the thread.

 

[Teknoman]

Shin'en does amazing technological achievements with what they are given and what looks like small file sizes. I think i'm gonna listen to them.

I'm not quite sure that using a screen for a Wii game that doesn't look any better than your average PS2 game is gonna help, no matter how big the file is, because that's completely irrelevant to their statement that the WiiU's GPU is a lot more advanced than current gen's.
So unless they put out something that looks much more advanced, they'd better not make statements about GPU capabilities. Even if their game fits on an N64 cartridge.

You should see the game and its effects in action.

 

[Heyt]

- GPU gen

Better hardware doen't show better results? So upgrading a PC is kind of pointless right? oh...

- You picked the beginning of the bonus level

I chose like the second screen that showed up in my google search because gaf yould asterisk out the URL of the first one. If you think the pic is not representative of the game, post one of your choice.

- They said they didn't push the Wii U

But they are tech wizards! How can this be?

 

[equippedwithtowel]

So why no 1080p for their game then?

Why don't you ask them?

 

[Pie and Beans]

With Cerny coming out at the PS4 unveil and detailing how the PS3 was a mistake due to its exotic nature and the Sony of then suggesting devs get themselves up for the challenge, hearing about this sorta stuff in 2013 is why I consider Nintendo to be 6-7 years behind where their competitors are with regard to tech.

Other devs don't have the luxury of Shin'en in reinventing the wheel exclusively for just one console really. Its also pretty hard to put too much stock into what Shin'en says when nothing they produce is going to on the same scale as something like a God of War, Uncharted, Halo, Crysis or something like The Witcher 2.

 

[gngf123]

And here's another shin'en interview where they try to defend their only/main source of money...

Who knows why they are the only one who talks about good thing about the wii u hardware huh?

To be fair, they are far from the only ones who have had positive things to say about the hardware. Frozenbyte, Two Tribes B.V, some indie developers, and even Crytek have all been fairly positive.

Of course, those who are positive all have vested interests, but so do a number of the developers who are most negative.

 

[daxgame]

daaamn

look at all that Salt in this thread!

Gotta love Shin'en's magic

 

[Spongebob]

It's a newer GPU so this is to be expected.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

I'm not quite sure that using a screen for a Wii game that doesn't look any better than your average PS2 game is gonna help, no matter how big the file is, because that's completely irrelevant to their statement that the WiiU's GPU is a lot more advanced than current gen's.
So unless they put out something that looks much more advanced, they'd better not make statements about GPU capabilities. Even if their game fits on an N64 cartridge.

Im sorry but average ps2 games dont look like that man

 

[Vermillion]

So why no 1080p for their game then?

Last bullet. They didn't feel the need to squeeze out any more for a launch game and they said that maybe their next game would be in 1080p... read the interview.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

I'm not quite sure that using a screen for a Wii game that doesn't look any better than your average PS2 game is gonna help, no matter how big the file is, because that's completely irrelevant to their statement that the WiiU's GPU is a lot more advanced than current gen's.
So unless they put out something that looks much more advanced, they'd better not make statements about GPU capabilities. Even if their game fits on an N64 cartridge.

hmmm?
Are you sure about that?