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Shin'en makes reponse to rumor of downgrade for final devkits

R

Ryuuga

Banned
filler said:
I think I'll take Shin'en's word for it. Since they're actually a competent developer on the wii u, I think they have a better handle on what the hardware situation is than most.
Click to expand...

What do all those other developers on the Wii U have to say regarding this?
 
H

Hoo-doo

Banned
TheGreatMightyPoo said:
You sure make the rounds on all things that don't matter to you.

Interesting approach.
Click to expand...

We could keep snarkily replying to eachother for a while. This thread might actually hit two whole pages!

I'm kidding. Please don't take every word so damn seriously around here.
 
H

Hiltz

Member
Shin'en does what Nintendo doesn't because it knows Nintendo isn't obviously going to bother answering that kind of question. The minute they do ,then people will naturally expect Nintendo to be more open to discussing the guts of the Wii U, and asking why it is underpowered and how that has impacted its current-gen and next-gen third party support from a technical perspective. Quite frankly, Nintendo has enough problems to face as it is, this one doesn't need to be something add to their plate of shit. Look at how overblown the PS4 and Xbox resolution and frame rate war has become. Nintendo doesn't want to get involved in that kind of stuff even if Wii U were more closer in hardware power to them. Nintendo likes to talk about other things like what people think of its games and how its coming up with new ways to play games.
 
prag16

prag16

Banned
SmokyDave said:
There was a ton of scepticism expressed regarding the downgrade rumour and the clock speed increases were explicitly mentioned. If it didn't receive enough focus that's perhaps because the thread was busy discussing whether or not such a small form factor was worth it.


Yeah, it's because this is a blatant and desperate attempt to create an echo-chamber to make the nasty thread go away.
Click to expand...

Right. Of all threads on this forum, THIS IS THE ONE that deserves to be called out for being intended as an echo chamber (TC's identity notwithstanding).

NONE of the sony circlejerk threads are echo chambers. NONE OF THEM.

(this is not thread whining; just justification for this thread being just as valid as any other... new news new thread and all)
 
Q

QaaQer

Member
Hiltz said:
Shin'en does what Nintendo doesn't because it knows Nintendo isn't obviously going to bother answering that kind of question. The minute they do ,then people will naturally expect Nintendo to be more open to discussing the guts of the Wii U, and asking why it is underpowered and how that means they fucked themselves over with ports that look and run unimpressively identical to 360 and PS3 games , not to mention how Wii U isn't going to be strong enough on a technical perspective to support next-gen engines . Quite frankly, Nintendo has enough problems to face as it is, this one doesn't need to be something add to their plate of shit. Look at how overblown the PS4 and Xbox resolution and frame rate war has become. Nintendo doesn't want to get involved in that kind of stuff even if Wii U were more closer in hardware power to them. Nintendo likes to talk about other things like what people think of its games and how its coming up with new ways to play games.
Click to expand...

broadly agree, except I'd replace 'play games' with 'sell consoles' in the last sentance because thats how they pay the bills in part.
 
P

Projectjustice

Banned
Hiltz said:
Shin'en does what Nintendo doesn't because it knows Nintendo isn't obviously going to bother answering that kind of question. The minute they do ,then people will naturally expect Nintendo to be more open to discussing the guts of the Wii U, and asking why it is underpowered and how that has impacted its current-gen and next-gen third party support from a technical perspective. Quite frankly, Nintendo has enough problems to face as it is, this one doesn't need to be something add to their plate of shit. Look at how overblown the PS4 and Xbox resolution and frame rate war has become. Nintendo doesn't want to get involved in that kind of stuff even if Wii U were more closer in hardware power to them. Nintendo likes to talk about other things like what people think of its games and how its coming up with new ways to play games.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
Personally in Shin'en I trust.
 
N

NBtoaster

Member
This doesn't invalidate the rumor, we already knew the devkits received a clock bump later, this doesn't mean the specs weren't initially downgraded (like before they got one).
 
M

mantidor

Member
NBtoaster said:
This doesn't invalidate the rumor, we already knew the devkits received a clock bump later, this doesn't mean the specs weren't initially downgraded (like before they got one).
Click to expand...

I would think Shin'en was one of the first devs to recieve dev kits, and they are answering a twitter question about the rumor itself, I'd say yeah of course it's debunked.

I mean unless they are lying of course.
 
F

filler

Banned
Ryuuga said:
I meant no ill intent I was just genuinely curious what other developers have been saying.
Click to expand...

I didn't think you did, breh. My feeling is just this, until I see another developer(that can do what Shin'en can on wii u) say differently. Then I'm going to take their word for it. Why should I assume they're lying about anything?
 
C

Conor 419

Banned
Shin'en seem like the kind of company that will infrequently produce great games to the point that fans are demanding they reboot every single Nintendo IP, much like Retro Studios now.
 
R

rpmurphy

Member
SmokyDave said:
There was a ton of scepticism expressed regarding the downgrade rumour and the clock speed increases were explicitly mentioned. If it didn't receive enough focus that's perhaps because the thread was busy discussing whether or not such a small form factor was worth it.


Yeah, it's because this is a blatant and desperate attempt to create an echo-chamber to make the nasty thread go away.
Click to expand...
Then the OP and title in the other thread should be updated with new information, like with most other threads when new revelations come to light?
 
M

megabytecr

Member
jay said:
These guys want to be bought so badly they do more PR than NoA.
Click to expand...

Actually they don´t. If you pay attention to them, which is obvious is not case, they have clearly stated that they are a small and independent team with creative freedom and they want to stay that way, even if Nintendo themselves gave them an IP to work with.

So No.

JoeFu said:
incoming 1 page thread since it paints wii u in positive light
Click to expand...

lol, spot on. This thread 2 pages vs 9 pages in the other thread.
 
K

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
Shin'en had a game at launch. So they must have had the devkits quite early. And they answered directly to this :

twitter said:
today i read rumors that the wiiu was downgraded in final specs due to heating, can you comment on that, any opinions
Click to expand...

The earlier rumour from bgassassin is based on two things.

The first,

bgassassin said:
I will say that around the time right before I stopped posting last year someone told me something along the lines of Nintendo reducing their original plans after the overheating issue.
Click to expand...

is clearly contradicted by the tweet from Shin'en, as he stopped posting in Fall (I think it was November) 2012.
 
M

meppi

Member
Heyt said:
Breaking news, developers that define themselves as Nintendo Fanboys adress WiiU rumors with the most positive statement about the company and the console.
Click to expand...

Indeed. The only developers I trust are the ones who have not worked on a system they are bashing to hell and back.
 
O

OryoN

Member
JoeFu said:
incoming 1 page thread since it paints wii u in positive light
Click to expand...

One page later, at about a rate of something like 10 posts/hr(my estimate), buried on page 4(till I dug it out), I came to say that you were wrong sir. Dead wrong! Good Wii U news does hold 2-page potential. So now are you ashamed for your flat out wrong prediction? Yeah you should be, Joe... you should be.


Dear God, please bestow a blessing on everyone's 'S-detectors' today.
 
F

foxuzamaki

Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
I just came into this thread purely on the name drop of shin'nen, now im leaving after reading the comments
 
T

Thunder Monkey

Banned
filler said:
How many people work at Shin'en?
Click to expand...

Very few. They were PC demo guys forever. Now they are a small very tech oriented team. Usually less in the "These big specs are awesome!" more "What can we squeeze out of this lemon?"

I must say they haven't visually disappointed me yet. They achieved very impressive tech on the Wii and squeezed it into 40MB.

And guys seriously, stop shitting on Dave. He bought a WiiU, he's admitted to enjoying it much more than he expected. But that doesn't mean he can't make jokes about it being weak. The truth is as a next generation console it is weak.

"Weak" just meaning vastly different things now than it did even a generation before.
 
S

Starfish Hero

Member
Thunder Monkey said:
Very few. They were PC demo guys forever. Now they are a small very tech oriented team. Usually less in the "These big specs are awesome!" more "What can we squeeze out of this lemon?"

I must say they haven't visually disappointed me yet. They achieved very impressive tech on the Wii and squeezed it into 40MB.

And guys seriously, stop shitting on Dave. He bought a WiiU, he's admitted to enjoying it much more than he expected. But that doesn't mean he can't make jokes about it being weak. The truth is as a next generation console it is weak.

"Weak" just meaning vastly different things now than it did even a generation before.
Click to expand...

I find it baffling that you are telling people not to shit on Dave, because he frequently shits on something Nintendo fans find valuable. I have nothing against Dave or his posts, but come on now: what do you expect?
 
Laughing Banana

Laughing Banana

Weeping Pickle
SmokyDave said:
Yeah, it's because this is a blatant and desperate attempt to create an echo-chamber to make the nasty thread go away.
Click to expand...

You honestly think that the OP posted this thread as a measure of desperation...? I don't get that vibe at all... what makes you think so ill towards the intention of the OP....?

Or maybe I was reading your post the wrong way.
 
T

Thunder Monkey

Banned
Starfish Hero said:
I find it baffling that you are telling people not to shit on Dave, because he frequently shits on something Nintendo fans find valuable. I have nothing against Dave or his posts, but come on now: what do you expect?
Click to expand...
I like most here in spite of what they post.

And to a degree I agree with him. The intent of this thread is to combat the other thread. To create a safe haven if you will for those that believe the opposite of bg's thread. Forgetting that bg was firmly in the 640SPU arena until last year when we got the die shots. Which turned to 320 and now down to 160.

I mean yes, the man has always been snarkier than I would be, but I don't see anything wrong with his post. Just calling it as he sees it. And I guess I shouldn't say much considering others are just doing the same back at him.

Overall I don't see the issue on either end. WiiU is weak. Weak today means "Outputting beautiful visuals." Just without the technical flourishes of the new sexy. Even the hacked attempts at GI on PS4/One aren't achievable on WiiU. And neither is our closest to accurate implementation of SVOGI possible on PS4.

All three consoles are weak compared to what they could be.
 
P

Poimandres

Member
filler said:
I think I'll take Shin'en's word for it. Since they're actually a competent developer on the wii u, I think they have a better handle on what the hardware situation is than most.
Click to expand...

Shin'en are great developers no doubt, especially when it comes to technical matters. But they are pretty upfront about their pro-Nintendo slant. Have they ever said anything negative about Nintendo?

That kind of means that I think they know what they are talking about, but I won't take their word as a balanced representation of most issues.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
Poimandres said:
Shin'en are great developers no doubt, especially when it comes to technical matters. But they are pretty upfront about their pro-Nintendo slant. Have they ever said anything negative about Nintendo?

That kind of means that I think they know what they are talking about, but I won't take their word as a balanced representation of most issues.
Click to expand...
They're certainly biased, but unless they actually straight out lied, that doesn't matter in this case. "Was there a hardware downgrade?" - "Nope." That's pretty clear and there's little room for fanboy bias here.
 
S

Starfish Hero

Member
Thunder Monkey said:
I like most here in spite of what they post.

And to a degree I agree with him. The intent of this thread is to combat the other thread. To create a safe haven if you will for those that believe the opposite of bg's thread. Forgetting that bg was firmly in the 640SPU arena until last year when we got the die shots. Which turned to 320 and now down to 160.

I mean yes, the man has always been snarkier than I would be, but I don't see anything wrong with his post. Just calling it as he sees it. And I guess I shouldn't say much considering others are just doing the same back at him.

Overall I don't see the issue on either end. WiiU is weak. Weak today means "Outputting beautiful visuals." Just without the technical flourishes of the new sexy. Even the hacked attempts at GI on PS4/One aren't achievable on WiiU. And neither is our closest to accurate implementation of SVOGI possible on PS4.

All three consoles are weak compared to what they could be.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying you shouldn't agree with him. But obviously not everyone will, and obviously people aren't going to like his snark either. Along with his history in Nintendo threads (ie: not notably positive), I'm not too surprised people are a bit hostile toward him.
 
U

USC-fan

Banned
I think the big downgrade came when they move from wiiu alpha kits that had 4850 or whatever in them to the beta kits with real wiiu parts. Then they were "upgraded" with the clock speed bump.
 
M

Mentallyerect

Neo Member
Starfish Hero said:
.


Anyway, the clock speed bump to the GPU and CPU was known. The "downgrade" refers to a decrease to the number of shaders I think.

Rough guess, but, if the downgrade rumor is true, it went something like this:

1. Original devkit
2. 320/x/x to 160/8/8
3. 400 Mhz to 550 Mhz GPU, 1 Ghz to 1.25 Ghz CPU

The rumor says 2 happened. Just because 3 happened doesn't mean 2 didn't, depending on when Shin'en got their dev kit.
Click to expand...

I was flipping through the rumor thread but, correct me if I'm wrong, I don't believe the rumor said it was 320/x/x to begin with. All I got from the rumor was that it was downgraded. What it originally was, who knows. As far as I remember, the 320/x/x derived from the die shot analysis threads where the going debate was whether or not it was 320 or 160 with supporters on each side.
 
P

Poimandres

Member
wsippel said:
They're certainly biased, but unless they actually straight out lied, that doesn't matter in this case. "Was there a hardware downgrade?" - "Nope." That's pretty clear and there's little room for fanboy bias here.
Click to expand...

Yeah, seems pretty cut and dry.
 
Schnozberry

Schnozberry

Member
Poimandres said:
Yeah, seems pretty cut and dry.
Click to expand...

I wish we could get them to answer the core config question, but they are probably nailed to the floor via NDA. Not that it matters to them. They could probably get a pretty decent looking game running on an arm based web connected refrigerator.
 
F

fernoca

Member
Thunder Monkey said:
And guys seriously, stop shitting on Dave. He bought a WiiU, he's admitted to enjoying it much more than he expected. But that doesn't mean he can't make jokes about it being weak. The truth is as a next generation console it is weak.
Click to expand...
Didn't he sold it? Remember him talking about it.
I think shinobi was another one that sold the Wii U (though now says he will buy one again for Super Mario 3D World).


****

On-topic (kinda)...I just want them to show their game. They said that the picture of the car was in-engine and looked quite clean and smooth.
 
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