Night_Trekker
Member
The bottom line is you can't take something people love for what it is, change it, and then expect no backlash.
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Silent Hill HD worse than imagined
- Thread starter alr1ght
- Start date
The bottom line is you can't take something people love for what it is, change it, and then expect no backlash.
Pay attention to the voiceover for Claudia Wolf... She gives hints to her future intentions in her voice. All removed in the re-done voices. All in the same tone... Worse it's not matching her facial expressions. IF someone did this crap on the Uncharted games, people would riot.
The confession scene comes off as completely phony...
Net_Wrecker
Member
Wow. I don't even play Silent Hill, but this is crazy. So many changes for the sake of changes and they do nothing but make the experience worse.
Their steadfast refusal to make an action focused game like the recent Resident Evils means no one buys Silent Hill games any more, so they don't have any money to fix the technical performance of their games.
Selling out has its advantages.
Typographenia
Member
What?
Great voice acting is just that. If it is interfering with the work in some way as you seem to be suggesting, I think that would be more the fault of the script or the direction. If anything, great voice acting should compliment the experience.
Also, I have to completely disagree that the town is the focus. Silent Hill games are and always have been character pieces. The town is a backdrop for these characters to externally explore their internal misgivings, struggles, and skeletons in closets. I could agree with the sentiment that the town is a character, but I could never agree that the town is the focus.
I was being facetious.
People tirelessly complained that the new voices didn't have the same unnatural and uneasy sound to them that the original versions did. I was simply poking fun at the fact someone was saying the opposite.
Mr. Enigma
Member
This video got me wondering: does anyone know where I can download the font used for SH2 and SH3's subtitles?
Cave Johnson
Member
Maybe I had you misunderstood. What I meant is that when the voices are overdone it put to much emphasis on the character, then we are forced to focus on him/her due to the fact the performance is clearly shining. In a video game, EVERYTHING matters, gameplay, atmosphere, controls, any particular aspect that makes the other elements feel mediocre may ruin what the game developers have build up to design. This isn't like watching a movie or a play where the character leads the audience through their script. In here, bugs, glitches and even unresponsive controls can be detrimental to the player's immersion and anything that STANDS out that is not the main focus would only make the other problems seem even worse.
That depends on how you view it. When I played Silent Hill the only thing that still sticks out the most was in fact, Silent Hill itself. You can tell because the atmosphere and music tries to embody something that inanimate to give the town some sort of life. When a character is introduced you have absolutely no idea which part of Silent Hill placed in the "real" world or the "otherworld" is true manifestation of it. This theme retains itself in all the original Silent Hill games I've played considering the stark difference in story.
Well it seem to me that these "people" are defending the voice-acting for the sake of originality (vice-versa to hates it). I very much let the character's acting to lead me revealing how Silent Hill reacts to their situation and it does so with consistency.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Huh, I thought the SH2: Restless Dreams on XBox was the best version? From what I've seen, it certainly looks better.
Mr. Enigma
Member
Xbox definitely has better graphics than the PS2 version, yes.
Jawmuncher
Member
The idea that people totally new to the series are being introduced to it for the first time via this train wreak on a disk....
Why do bad things happen to good games? Why? Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiii?!
I'm glad that I didn't pick it up.
Since it would have been the first time I played them
First game I played was Origins (Which I liked)
Played some of shattered memories (Never beat it)
Lastly was homecoming (It was ok)
Plan on playing downpour and book of memories.
But I want to jump in and play the games that made the series popular.
Will probably grab the PS2 versions or play them on PC.
D
Deleted member 102362
Unconfirmed Member
I've never played the SH series, but after watching these videos, I know which versions to avoid.
A shame the originals aren't on Steam.
A shame the originals aren't on Steam.
Jawmuncher
Member
Yeah I have no idea why konami hasn't put those along with MGS1 and MGS2 on the steam store.
RadioHeadAche
Member
I remember being so excited for the Silent Hill HD collection. I started with Silent Hill 3 and noticed they changed some of the sounds and scenes in the intro. I didn't like the changes, nor felt they were necessary, but I figured that it wasn't a big deal because it was Silent Hill in HD! Then I played through the game.
UNACCEPTABLE
UNACCEPTABLE
You are going to have to adjust that attitude sunshine, if you want to be a True Silent Hill Fan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fj81r4ifowI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLbI8H2fTQc
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
It's a shame but at least I can play the PS2 version with the widescreen hack. Only caveat I've run into is the FMVs being distorted but you just go into software mode (F9) for those and switch back when it's done.
Just took this screen:
Just took this screen:
fabricated backlash
Member
Aside from their personal bias, the videos really highlight how Konami fucked up here, but god damn they are really obnoxious with their snob like attitude. Especially the thing about the Voice Acting, cause that has allways been the worst part of SH2 and 3 (and 1). The original VA wasn't on a level with the rest of the design excellence, but once you're used to the voices it's hard to get used to changes. But to act like the original VA is somehow anywhere near "good" is just proposterous. The second video in particular is painfull to watch as they try to "prove" that the original VA was good, especially when first setting up how the original VA was cheaped out.
Most of the video is Nerd Rage clad in an eloquent script, but as much as these guys disgust me, these videos really are needed as it shows how inept Konami is.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
That was entertaining. I actually watched the whole thing. I am amazed that Konami released the game in this state. Wow.
Downpour seems to have got a fairly positive reaction from people who don't have an axe to grind though. Technical issues aside.
So I am not entirely sure what their win condition is here.
Jawmuncher
Member
You are going to have to adjust that attitude sunshine, if you want to be a True Silent Hill Fan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fj81r4ifowI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLbI8H2fTQc
lol, I know I know.
That part nearly had me in tears from laughter.
You can say the same about the HD collection honestly. Their perspective will be interesting to hear, regardless. But if you enjoyed Downpour, you don't have to suddenly hate it just because they say so. I still would like to pick it up at some point when it's cheaper, regardless of what they say about it. But I can't wait for their breakdown of it.
kunonabi
Member
Even now Heather's original VA makes me tear up. The voices were fine and matched the characters much better than the new ones do. Look at the phone call from SH3, new Heather royally fucked it up.
fabricated backlash
Member
The new VA being bad doesn't retroactively make the old VA good. They are both shit for different reasons. The only redeeming quality of the original VA is that it is embedded in a complete package, while the new VA is thrown in an inconsistant package that is poor all around, making the horrible VA stand out even more.
With SH2 and 3 the bad VA was noticeable, but forgivable as the rest of the Soundtrack and direction was so superb that it was easy to just forget about it.
RadioHeadAche
Member
I think the stranger on the phone sounds worse, much worse. It's not creepy, just silly.
Honestly, I used to think that a bit. But the more you see the thought that went into the casting, the direction, and the intentions of the original team and cast; the more the quality starts to show.
Laura Bailey is probably my favorite voice actress ever. But in this video (part 2) there was really no denying that she sounded far worse than the original voice track. The same was true of Heather, Maria, and especially James. Honestly, once I saw what James' voice actor looked like in real life, it just clicked. And Troy Baker really was hamming it up pretty badly at times.
I thought James' original voice actor handled the comparison and analysis perfectly. The new breed of pro voice actors are all great, talented people. But they're almost like radio DJs sometimes, and really, really ham it up and overact at times. The constant gasps, exaggerated emotions, melodrama, etc. None of that was really in the original voice acting, and it was unique for that reason.
There are a lot of skilled voice actors out now, but they don't often understand subtlety. It's easy to overact when you can't portray anything with a look, or body language in any way and you're stuck in a sound booth. Also, I don't think they're always directed well, and aren't given enough guidance. Laura Bailey in NieR is like, one of the best performances ever (Kaine). But Laura Bailey in Silent Hill 3 sounds like she pulled her Dissidia Cloud of Darkness voice out and kind of phoned that one in with little direction.
I don't think anyone has a good word to say about the HD collection. They just are just... less gleeful about having something to hate on.
endresults
Member
New Heather sounds atrocious, like some Gurl-With-Attitude neighbor on a family sitcom. The people talking about the original VO not being perfect are wrong - it IS perfect. The only thing needed to prove that is a couple more attempts at re-casting original VO's and watching the shitstorm that ensues. You can cast whoever the fuck you want with an unlimited audio budget, and people who experienced the original will reject the changes every time. Upgraded visuals don't get that kind of visceral reaction because we're not invested emotionally in that rusted corrugated metal texture being replaced by a clean high-res corrugated metal texture (although they managed to screw that up to, as mentioned in the part 1 video), but if you change the original voice acting, you're changing a quality of someone you "know." Imagine cuddling up with your wife/husband/child for a movie, giving him/her a kiss, and hearing an "I love you" from them in the voice of someone you don't recognize. It's the audio version of the uncanny valley, and it's repelling.
But yeah, they didn't do a great job on the HD collection.
But yeah, they didn't do a great job on the HD collection.
Well, I mean, I don't play Silent Hill games on the grounds they are inherently less manly that Resident Evil, but if you have ever complained about the decline in Survival Horror titles, buy some bloody Silent Hill games! At least they are trying still. And who knows, if anyone bought the bloody games they might have enough money to hire some decent developers and make better games!
And Downpour is actually supposed to be pretty good, if you like that sort of thing.
kunonabi
Member
I mean the phone conversation in the mall.
The new voices have nothing to do with my opinion of the old voices. Heather's voice work got tons of praise when the game was released. It matched what the Team Silent wanted to do instead of just doing generic anime dub #343433423. The new voicework doesn't match the characters, their motivations, or dynamics and that is a much bigger issue than not having professional VA for the sake of having professional VA. Hell Hulett admits to casting the same actress for Angela and Claudia for a reason not pertaining to the characters at all. Mary Elizabeth is great but are you seriously arguing that her performance was better and did the game justice more so than the original? The original letter reading is leagues ahead of the new one.
CheesecakeRecipe
Stormy Grey
I never thought the old voices were even bad - I identified with some of them because they did sound like normal people who were fucked up. Guy's voice was perfect for the role of James, and Mary/Maria's voice actress was incredibly talented and threw in all sorts of subtleties as displayed by the scene where she's trapped behind bars and uses both voices to confuse James, and the player, through the entire thing. And listening to the emotion she put behind the letter written to James at the end, makes me tear up without fail every single time.
There's something indescribably real about it all, even if it isn't what you expect "Characters" to sound like. Troy tries too hard to sound masculine and loses all of the helplessness that Guy put into his performance. You don't hear a man whose life has been shattered by loss, instead you hear a bored VA getting paid to stand in a booth and totally forget who he was portraying. Mary's new VA has pretty much one tone - 40 year old woman who has been smoking all of her life and probably had a pack on the way into the booth. It's flat, lifeless, unconvincing and insulting.
And the mixing, dear lord the mixing. It's like they weren't even trying.
Tom I hope you're still lurking, man. Because you guys fucked up.
Azure Dream
Member
2 hours of video later, but damn. I had no idea how extensive some of the changes and mistakes were. Maybe they were a bit too hard on some of the voice actors (but not Mary E, that video from the convention was very telling, the way she was badmouthing her predecessors), but some were clearly missing the mark.
The thing that struck me the hardest (besides the graphical glitches I already knew about) were the soundtrack changes. In a game with such heavily-scripted cutscenes, the music needs to match. Playing the wrong music at the wrong times really changes a scene.
The thing that struck me the hardest (besides the graphical glitches I already knew about) were the soundtrack changes. In a game with such heavily-scripted cutscenes, the music needs to match. Playing the wrong music at the wrong times really changes a scene.
I got them besides Downpour. I'm probably getting Book of Memories at launch to have something to play on Vita.
WrenchNinja
Member
They were way too hard on the voice replacements, some of the criticism was definitely reaching like the Vincent one. And while I prefer Heather Morris' infinitely more, Amanda Winn Lee did pretty well from what I saw. Same with Liam Obriens Eddie.
But they were definitely right about Mary/Maria, James and Angela.
But they were definitely right about Mary/Maria, James and Angela.
You'd better do something about that cough
jaydogg691
Member
I just saw these two videos back to back and it's a shame of what has happened to this re-release. I'm going through the original SH on my Vita and got it's got me interested in the series, but there is no way I'm going to touch this collection.
They're nitpicking quite a bit in a few parts here and there. For some things, there'd be little to complain about without reference to the original.
The overriding theme was buried in their video: that an HD remake should at the very least do the game justice and at best, enhance it subtly. The SH collection comes off as a sloppy port. There's simply no excusing bugs, mistakes, glitches, unnecessary replacements etc. 10 years after the fact.
Backfoggen
Banned
Wow, these HD versions are actually more fucked up than I thought. Straight up broken in parts.
Krappadizzle
Member
Just got done watching both videos. I didn't realize how bad the audio was. Like it was shipped pretty terribly and the producer of the hd version totally just doesn't get what we as the fans loved about the games.
Jawmuncher
Member
I still feel sad for the Devs who had to work on the port though.
Since if what they said was true and they had to work with uncomplete code, I can see why the port ended up being so fucked up.
Plus it's not like they could have stopped working on it even after seeing how bad it was, since they were probably contractally obligated to get it shipped "done or not"
Obviously this is just me thinking about it, but I still blame Konami more so than the devs.
Since if the incomplete code thing is true, who knows how much better this could have turned out.
Since if what they said was true and they had to work with uncomplete code, I can see why the port ended up being so fucked up.
Plus it's not like they could have stopped working on it even after seeing how bad it was, since they were probably contractally obligated to get it shipped "done or not"
Obviously this is just me thinking about it, but I still blame Konami more so than the devs.
Since if the incomplete code thing is true, who knows how much better this could have turned out.
Magicpaint
Member
How do you mess up a port job so badly? RIP Silent Hill.
Backfoggen
Banned
There's no excuse for some of the shit they did in these ports. Some of the mistakes could have easily been prevented by just having the PS2 version running alongside their dev build and comparing them. That's the least you could expect from a HD version developer, actually looking at the source material.
Night_Trekker
Member
Maybe the most depressing gaming-relate thing I've read in recent memory.
They didn't just make the series popular. They established the series (made the IP worth all of Konami's fumbling attempts since) and set a very high standard none of the subsequent sequels have met.
I mean, Origins is alright, but... please, play the original games. Yes, even 4.