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Sony Faces Heat From Game Publishers to Cut PS3 Price

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J-Rzez said:
17 May, 2005

A lot has changed on that stance post $599,999.99 price tag. Especially post launch. There's still a very heavy bias in the media today for the 360 even.

This is when the free ride Sony was getting started to end but no one can deny that pre-price announcement that everyone just assumed that the PS3 was going to be the new PS2 and "dreamcast" the 360 and run circles all around that silly Gamecube with a weird controller.

Shit, just do a GAF search for terms "FFXIII/DMC4" "360" and "Never" around that time and see all the goodness that pops up. Only after the price was announced did people step back a bit and look at the situation with a sharper eye.

Vinci said:
It seems unnecessary to me to offer the same thing when a PC is, you know, practically a requirement in the average home and a console isn't.

My household gets along just fine without a PC since we are a family of Macs. Consoles allow us to play HD games without the hassle of running Windows.
 

Vinci

Danish
Dunlop said:
Valid personal opinion, you are missing out on a great system though.

I actually owned a 360 for six months. Four of those months were spent getting it repaired, trying to locate it after the repair center lost it, having it returned to me unfixed, sending it back, etc. and so on. It was a damned nightmare. Seriously, I started to hate Microsoft due to the ridiculous shit I had to go through over that system. So yeah, they lost me as a customer - for at least this gen.

I can still play it at my friend's house though, so not a huge loss.

I can relate however, I missed out on the PS2 due to my biases against Sony and EA for curb stomping my beloved DreamCast :D

The DC dying was one of the most horrible things ever, I swear. People who have played nothing but Sony systems their entire gaming lives have no clue how fantastic that system was and how on fire SEGA was before the fall. I was one of those rare SEGA / Nintendo fans. I honestly didn't care which won, so long as they were producing stuff I loved - and they both were back then.

I just noticed last night that I somehow switched over to using my PS3 exclusively as my media hub in the last month and that I haven't played a game on the 360 since KZ2 came out. Meanwhile my Wii has not been used in over 3 months : (

My wife or I play the Wii daily. Most of the time, we play it together - but I'll go home from work on her day off and see that she's logged 11 total hours on the thing split between six or seven games. :lol And to think, she had no interest in gaming before the thing beyond Tetris.

The hardware issue while deplorable, was a great strategic move (the early launch, not the shitty testing) as there is no way we would be having this discussion if PS3 and 360 launched at the same time.

Oh, I'm aware of why MS did it. I'm also aware of why Sony's system was such a massive shift from the PS2. I get both these strategic decisions - but neither of them makes me appreciate the decisions any more. Yes, MS is beating Sony: I don't care. It doesn't change the fact that I felt fucked over by them for months on account of this. Sony is losing: They priced a $600 system in order to win a damn format war that I couldn't give a shit about, so yeah, all I want is for them to not die. My animosity over the latter, however, was far less than the former - mostly due to how the RROD fiasco affected me personally.
 
domokunrox said:
They could cry moar?

There is plenty of great exclusives that completely redeem it, and they keep coming year after year.

Anyone who doesn't purchase one this cycle is really missing out.


Unless you have a 360.
 

Vinci

Danish
polyh3dron said:
ohhhhh snap
funny because it's true

Am I considered a Wii-only gamer if I own a PC, Wii, and DS, seeing as the Wii is the only console I have? I'm actually curious.
 

J-Rzez

Member
herod said:
It's not really bias though, is it? Sony over-promised and under-delivered, and made a lot of optimistic infectiously enthusiastic journalists look stupid along the way. If you release target renders and then take 3.5 years to fulfil them then it can't really come as a huge shock, surely?

Sony did make some rather grand promises, but they did end up cashing in on most of them, regardless of how long it took at least they did it. Also, "target renders" were close to met with even the first Motorstorm which didn't come out "3.5 years" later. It's interesting how people have taken this approach to the fact that Killzone delivered. "Yeah right, we'll never see a game like it this gen lol" to "yeah, well took ya long enough sheesh".

The only segment where Sony has "under delivered" to this day is the online still needs some fleshing out, and that's because I think Sony needs to crack the whip harder on the devs for that one. For example, how bleeding hard is it to put in a fucking party system? Especially when a day 1 title had it implemented... Seriously, they need to crack down on these devs with certain features like that.

If you're talking about on day 1 under delivery, of course, but I don't think anyone expected them to fully deliver everything the first day it hit the shelves as far as the games go. Everyone knows it takes development time on games.

There is a distinct bias though, it's not hard to see. This all stems from the acceptable bias "my friends own x console so I wanna play with them" to the non-acceptable lower than should've attention brought to the RRoD issue. MS should've taken drastically more heat for that, especially considering they had to know the hardware was drastically flawed but they rushed it out the door at consumers grief just to "have a shot" this gen (not knowing Sony was shooting themselves in the foot). Even to this day you still see too many stories of people's machines dying on them, or hearing a friend complain again. Everyone has their "bias", I have mine and wear it on my sleeve, and that's normal which nearly everyone I know is like. You like what you like. But "journalists" are supposed to be impartial.

This is when the free ride Sony was getting started to end but no one can deny that pre-price announcement that everyone just assumed that the PS3 was going to be the new PS2 and "dreamcast" the 360 and run circles all around that silly Gamecube with a weird controller.

Of course pre-shooting themselves in the foot thought that, you're talking about coming off of the most successful console of all time, which surpassed the 2nd most successful that your company made just before it. My point overall is that any bias should be removed from journalism. Clear-hard facts is fine, and that's what should be conveyed to the reader/consumer, there is absolutely no need for bias though. I don't even think it belongs in other publication matters as well, like Automotive for example, even the blokes from my favorite TV show are guilty of it at many times on Top Gear.
 

Rad Agast

Member
The most likely scenario is that Sony will drop the price by 50 USD in April (I don't know how they'll manage that but they'll have to do it).

At 350 USD, it's still at a high price point for the mass market. I don't think that it will be enough to turn the tide. They're better off going for profitability for the rest of this generation (even if it means losing 3rd party support this gen) and start over in a couple of years with PS4 (PS 3.5 or whatever you want to call it).
 

WaltJay

Member
I think Sony is focused on making a profit than appeasing game publishers wishes. It's not like $50 pricedrop will open the floodgates, and the PS3 sales will double overnight. It will help with sales, no doubt, but how much? It probably won't even get them past the 360's install base, considering MS could play tit-for-tat with pricedrops (you drop $50, we drop $50).

Maybe $100 could do it, but that's the part of the problem. No one really knows if $299 is the magic pricepoint where PS2 owners start buying PS3s like crackcakes, or if that's even a likely scenario anymore. Is it already too late? All of those PS2 owners might have already moved onto the Wii, 360, or are content with just having the PS2.
 

Karma

Banned
J-Rzez said:
Sony did make some rather grand promises, but they did end up cashing in on most of them, regardless of how long it took at least they did it. Also, "target renders" were close to met with even the first Motorstorm which didn't come out "3.5 years" later. It's interesting how people have taken this approach to the fact that Killzone delivered. "Yeah right, we'll never see a game like it this gen lol" to "yeah, well took ya long enough sheesh".

:lol Motorstorm was not even close to the target render. Sony over promised. Sad thing is they will do it again with the PS4 and most of the Sony Fans will believe them again.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15401.html?type=mov
 

billy.sea

Banned
While the media that put out articles on PS3 is dooming - are based on facts and charts, the other side of media that put out articles saying the PS3 will dominate someday - are based on pure love and faith that comes out of nowhere.
 

methane47

Member
Doesn't EVeryone Overpromise and underdeliver though?

I mean.. Everyone cuts corners in the end... isn't this just a part of marketting or a better term... "hype"

hype
1. to create interest in by flamboyant or dramatic methods; promote or publicize showily: a promoter who knows how to hype a prizefight.
2.. to intensify (advertising, promotion, or publicity) by ingenious or questionable claims, methods, etc. (usually fol. by up).
4. to trick; gull.

billy.sea said:
While the media that put out articles on PS3 is dooming - are based on facts and charts, the other side of media that put out articles saying the PS3 will dominate someday - are based on pure love and faith that comes out of nowhere.

hmm yeah but the facts that the dooming articles cite.. dont really support.. DOOM..

PS3 is selling slower than Xbox and Wii.. yes true...

but thats like saying.. OMG!! Mercedes is Going out of business soon because they aren't selling as many cars as Toyota and Honda....

The "Facts" can be used by spin doctors to show anything
 

herod

Member
methane47 said:
PS3 is selling slower than Xbox and Wii.. yes true...

but thats like saying.. OMG!! Mercedes is Going out of business soon because they aren't selling as many cars as Toyota and Honda....

No, it really isn't.
 

Karma

Banned
Lion Heart said:
Man do you ever NOT talk about system wars shit, aka how bad PS3 is doing? It's like you are obsessed. Do you actually care about games?

Just for you.


methane47 said:
Doesn't EVeryone Overpromise and underdeliver though?

I mean.. Everyone cuts corners in the end... isn't this just a part of marketting or a better term... "hype"

hype
1. to create interest in by flamboyant or dramatic methods; promote or publicize showily: a promoter who knows how to hype a prizefight.
2.. to intensify (advertising, promotion, or publicity) by ingenious or questionable claims, methods, etc. (usually fol. by up).
4. to trick; gull.



hmm yeah but the facts that the dooming articles cite.. dont really support.. DOOM..

PS3 is selling slower than Xbox and Wii.. yes true...

but thats like saying.. OMG!! Mercedes is Going out of business soon because they aren't selling as many cars as Toyota and Honda....

The "Facts" can be used by spin doctors to show anything

That is the one Sony likes.

2 x HDMI
6 x USB
3 x Ethernet can be used as a Hub
Dual HD output at 1080p each
Spring 2006 launch
Autumn 2006 launch for Europe

Also, what happen to the demo of PSN they were showing that had video chat and was said to be a LIVE killer. I can`t find the video of the demo. Will look and post later.
 
methane47 said:
but thats like saying.. OMG!! Mercedes is Going out of business soon because they aren't selling as many cars as Toyota and Honda....
Mercedes don't rely on having a ton of cars out there so that they can make money on the custom fuel they sell for each car. (yeah... I know. :lol)
 

jmdajr

Member
Karma said:
Just for you.




That is the one Sony likes.

2 x HDMI
6 x USB
3 x Ethernet can be used as a Hub
Dual HD output at 1080p each
Spring 2006 launch
Autumn 2006 launch for Europe

Also, what happen to the demo of PSN they were showing that had video chat and was said to be a LIVE killer. I can`t find the video of the demo. Will look and post later.

Good memories of 2005 make believe.
It's going to be so awesome when we get fed more come the next generation of consoles.
 

JudgeN

Member
Karma said:
Just for you.




That is the one Sony likes.

2 x HDMI
6 x USB
3 x Ethernet can be used as a Hub
Dual HD output at 1080p each
Spring 2006 launch
Autumn 2006 launch for Europe

Also, what happen to the demo of PSN they were showing that had video chat and was said to be a LIVE killer. I can`t find the video of the demo. Will look and post later.


Ahh remember when Microsoft said every game will be full 720p with 4x AA? But yea Sony the only company that lies and uses bullshots.
 

Andrew2

Banned
We're in a recession and as result corporations like Sony are bleeding money badly becaue price cuts. If anything Sony should just give these publishers the middle finger because dropping the price would a form of economic suicide for them given the losses the company is taking across the board.
 

jmdajr

Member
JudgeN said:
Ahh remember when Microsoft said every game will be full 720p with 4x AA? But yea Sony the only company that lies and uses bullshots.

no, but its pretty damn good at it! WOOT!
 

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
I remember when I used to go full throttle in these kind of threads. All I can say is that we know Sony needs to drop the price. Most people just don't think that they can afford it. We will see the full extent of the damage to the Playstation brand next generation though. I love my PS3 and I bought it at launch. I'm a gamer though. It's crazy though, for years, Sony always competed with each other and the PS3 was one of the first things that consisted of what made Sony as a company great. The culmination of things. However, they had too much faith in their brand that they felt that people would buy it at whatever price. I did, but I'm not a part of the general population that would frown at 49.99, forget about 59.99 game prices
 

squatingyeti

non-sanctioned troll
stuburns said:
Well you didn't even provide a single example. All I ever hear is that's it's roughly the same attachment rate.

You're saying it's 2 to 3 times more, with the higher install base you'd expect games to sell four times more on 360. They don't.

How many times must it be repeated? Sales of X game do NOT scale linearly with install base of Y console!!!!

If they did, Madden would have sold ~25M on the PS2 alone at about the 5-6 year mark. This flawed logic is constantly repeated and needs to be put to bed.
 
Vinci said:
Depends: Does Mercedes lose money for every sale?

Also: Does Mercedes need to have the greatest market share in the 'luxury car' industry? Or a certain amount of market share in the car industry, period?

If the answer is "no" to all of these, it really isn't the same situation at all.
 
Karma said:
:lol Motorstorm was not even close to the target render. Sony over promised. Sad thing is they will do it again with the PS4 and most of the Sony Fans will believe them again.

The Motorstorm guys said recently that they not only had no clue what the final specs of the PS3 were when they made that render but they also had no clue they were even going to show it at E3 in the first place.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3171196
 
mentalfloss said:
Also: Does Mercedes need to have the greatest market share in the 'luxury car' industry? Or a certain amount of market share in the car industry, period?

If the answer is "no" to all of these, it really isn't the same situation at all.

They stopped building 3rd party roads for my M-Class about halfway through its lifecycle.
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Karma said:
That is the one Sony likes.

2 x HDMI
6 x USB
3 x Ethernet can be used as a Hub
Dual HD output at 1080p each

The pettiness is unbelievable :lol You guys still can't let go of a few ports, eh?

The only meaningful changes in the machine spec after E3 05 was 1) the unpublished underclocking of RSX by 50hz, 2) the addition of a standard hard disk and 3) the addition of waggle.

The machine we got, by virtue of the later inclusion of HDDs as standard, was better than the machine presented at E3 05 IMHO.

God though..I really can't believe we're still arguing over shit like this. The lingering bitterness isn't as entertaining as it used to be.
 

jmdajr

Member
gofreak said:
The pettiness is unbelievable :lol You guys still can't let go of a few ports, eh?

The only meaningful changes in the machine spec after E3 05 was 1) the unpublished underclocking of RSX by 50hz, 2) the addition of a standard hard disk and 3) the addition of waggle.

The machine we got, by virtue of the later inclusion of HDDs as standard, was better than the machine presented at E3 05 IMHO.

God though..I really can't believe we're still arguing over shit like this. The lingering bitterness isn't as entertaining as it used to be.

Whatever the case, Sony dug their own hole. Let them figure out how to get out.
 
i bet all this commotion about the price will give sony even more reason to go the cheap route for PS4.....meaning a minimal upgrade in power from ps3 and very likely a casual-oriented control setup like using EyeToy motion (which will likely be included in every PS4)......its going to be sad for hardcore Playstation fans, but thats the route that sony and most other game companies are taking now, especially in a prolonged recession.
 
frAntic_Frog said:
i bet all this commotion about the price will give sony even more reason to go the cheap route for PS4.....meaning a minimal upgrade in power from ps3 and very likely a casual-oriented control setup like using EyeToy motion (which will likely be included in every PS4)......its going to be sad for hardcore Playstation fans, but thats the route that sony and most other game companies are taking now, especially in a prolonged recession.

There's also the minor issue that, in all likelihood, the current industry model simply can't profitably support more than a handful of games that are a true generational leap beyond what current HD consoles can do... even without the recession.
 

thaOwner

Member
jmdajr said:
no, but its pretty damn good at it! WOOT!

Well, they really did say that and it's never too late to catch up on history:

Microsoft’s targets for the Xbox 360 are far more down to earth, with 720p and 4X AA being the requirements for all 360 titles. With a 720p target for all games, you can expect all Xbox 360 titles to render (internally) at 1280 x 720. We’ve already discussed that the 360’s GPU architecture will effectively give free 4X AA at this resolution, so there’s no reason not to have 4X AA enabled as well.

....I love google search btw. It's also funny how PC didn't promise anything but yet, its the only system that has been excelling in that field.
 

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
Sadist said:
We have EA and Capcom to prove it.

... ... ... ...

14rw3d.jpg
 

Johann

Member
jmdajr said:
no, but its pretty damn good at it! WOOT!

A lot of early 360 games, such as Prey, had great difficulty maintaining a decent framerate with 4x AA, so Microsoft suspended that requirement.

Edit: Wait, how come we're talking about early 360 development problems...
 

Zoe

Member
Vinci said:
It seems unnecessary to me to offer the same thing when a PC is, you know, practically a requirement in the average home and a console isn't.

My main PC is almost 3 years old and can't play most games coming out these days. I have no intention of replacing it any time soon.

If I were inclined to play PC-style games, a console would still be a cheaper investment than buying a gaming PC.
 
Zoe said:
My main PC is almost 3 years old and can't play most games coming out these days. I have no intention of replacing it any time soon.

If I were inclined to play PC-style games, a console would still be a cheaper investment than buying a gaming PC.

Yeah people confuse this issue about gaming and PC's.
A Mac/PC is a requirement in the modern home... but a gaming pc is NOT a requirement whatsoever.

Frankly, for home accounting, web surfing, documents, and spreadsheets even a 10 year old rig is sufficient.
 

Synless

Member
JudgeN said:
Ahh remember when Microsoft said every game will be full 720p with 4x AA? But yea Sony the only company that lies and uses bullshots.
Arean't Warhawk and RE5 the only two games to actually hit that goal on either system?
 
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