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[Shin]

The Federal Court has ordered Sony Interactive Entertainment Network Europe Limited (Sony Europe) to pay $3.5 million in penalties for making false and misleading representations on its website and in dealings with Australian consumers about their Australian Consumer Law (ACL) rights.

Sony Europe made misleading representations to four consumers who believed they had purchased faulty PlayStation games. This occurred when Sony’s customer service representatives told them over the phone Sony Europe was not required to refund the game once it had been downloaded, or if 14 days had passed since it was purchased.

“Consumer guarantee rights do not expire after a digital product has been downloaded and certainly do not disappear after 14 days or any other arbitrary date claimed by a game store or developer,” ACCC Chair Rod Sims said.

The Court also declared Sony Europe breached the ACL by telling one of the four consumers it did not have to provide a refund unless the game developer authorised it, and by telling a fifth consumer that Sony Europe could provide a refund using virtual PlayStation currency instead of money.

Original case was from last year: https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/allegations-sony-breached-consumer-law-for-playstation-games
The ruling and where the above quote is taken from: https://www.accc.gov.au/media-relea...or-misrepresenting-playstation-gamers’-rights

I don't care about for the news myself, but remembered a few being vocal around here about PlayStation refund policy and it's a bit different than the rehash of several topics that has been extensively covered.

 

[Degree]

Good. And deserved.
It’s absolutely PATHETIC that you can’t CANCEL digital preorders

WTF IS THIS

 

[Nikana]

Buddy of mine bought fallen order 6 hour before it went on sale for half the price and he's SOL. Total BS and things like that need to change

 

[Entroyp]

Good.

 

[Mr Hyde]

One of the reasons I never preorder or rarely buy digital. Most of your consumer rights is tossed out of the window and you can´t do anything about it. Hopefully this case changes things but there is still a long way to go before I embrace a fully digital future. I might never go down that road at all.

 

[hyperbertha]

As long as this doesn't impact their SSD speeds I'm fine with it.

 

[Shin]

Good. And deserved.
It’s absolutely PATHETIC that you can’t CANCEL digital preorders

WTF IS THIS

About that since it's Sony Europe it falls under EU policy as well I reckon as well as local (Australia).
Wasn't there a ruling last year about consumers being able to get a refund or return on digital items within 14 days without needing to give a reason?
Which then forced some platform holders to change policy, Valve included or am I remembering things wrongly and/or mixing them up?

One of the reasons I never preorder or rarely buy digital.

I get what you're saying, it takes a couple of seconds to pay something but some companies need 60 days to issue a refund.
The Dutch system we have doesn't protect you from jackshit, which is why I love PayPal, if issues arise I just open a case and let PP deal with it - which is a positive experience as buyer.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Fuck you Papa

 

[Shin]

Fuck you Papa

When Sony issues my refund I'll get you and him a room.

 

[Nankatsu]

Well, someone in Sony is about to get fired.

 

[Knitted Knight]

We should see more of this across the board.

 

[Fbh]

Nice.

But I'm guessing their shitty stance on refunds makes them way more than 3.5 million

 

[Shin]

Well, someone in Sony is about to get fired.

This can only be sarcasm.
It's a drop in the bucket as is the case for most companies that's why they keep living on the edge or break the law, because they away with a lot more than the refines they receive.
Sony won't be losing sleep over this shit, at least those 4 took action and stood up for their themselves.

 

[Starlight Lotice]

Watchdog had them over about this in the UK but I think they just ignored it despite it being publicised on British Television.

Hopefully getting fined helps them realise they can't have terrible Customer Service and ban accounts who challenge that.

 

[Vawn]

Good. And deserved.
It’s absolutely PATHETIC that you can’t CANCEL digital preorders

WTF IS THIS

Not as pathetic as people dumb enough to pre-order a digital game.

 

[Knitted Knight]

Not as pathetic as people dumb enough to pre-order a digital game.

When the need is great, becoming dumb is the only solution. @TLOU2

 

[Saber]

Lol after reading, totally deserved.

What a bitch move.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Digital costumer rights still have a looong way to go, I remember Valve also being involved in a similar case to this one.
Then there's also the whole matter with intrusive DRMs, exploitative monetization, bricking games with forced updates that can't be reverted...

I think right now GOG is the one leading digital game stores in terms of costumers rights. I hope other stores, both on PC and consoles, begin following suit. That or, more realistically, be forced to.

 

[Dargor]

Great, hope this leads to a complete overhaul of sony's consumer services, cuz they are the worst.

 

[PSYGN]

Sony is really stupid sometimes.

 

[Zog]

Not as pathetic as people dumb enough to pre-order a digital game.

...but they might run out of digital copies!

 

[Xplainin]

And most likely the 3.5 million went to the Government and not the effected parties.

 

[SoloKingRobert]

One of the reasons I never preorder or rarely buy digital. Most of your consumer rights is tossed out of the window and you can´t do anything about it. Hopefully this case changes things but there is still a long way to go before I embrace a fully digital future. I might never go down that road at all.

One of the reasons I'll never buy digital games on a Sony console is, you can't change regions even you move to a different country. Please don't tell me you can just create a new account and change regions, I prefer all my games on one account, not on multiple account I wont use or lose.

 

[phil_t98]

...but they might run out of digital copies!

it’s preloading what is the good side of preordering

 

[Mr Hyde]

One of the reasons I'll never buy digital games on a Sony console is, you can't change regions even you move to different country. Please don't tell me you can just create a new account and change regions, I prefer all my games on one account, not on multiple account I wont use or lose.

Do you often move to different countries?

 

[Texas Pride]

Good. Sony should get with the times on their refund policy. Especially not cancelling digital preorders. That's beyond shitty. But let's be honest. 3.5 million ain't shit to Sony in the grand scheme.

 

[Zog]

it’s preloading what is the good side of preordering

Just have to be playing the game at 12:01 AM on launch day. That sounds a little obsessive.

 

[thanosg]

Sony has some of the worst customer services and anti-consumer practices in the world, and they need to pay back to us not some other organizations.

 

[MoreJRPG]

Nintendo is the same BS it’s a complete joke. You’d think they would take a page from Steam and Microsoft but nope. Anti-consumer in the highest regard. How can they not return money for something that hasn’t released and is DIGITAL?

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

only 3.5 .... not good enough

 

[SoloKingRobert]

Do you often move to different countries?

Yeah, I don't stay In one country all the time.

 

[Aion002]

Excellent! I hope other countries follow this.

 

[sainraja]

Digital costumer rights still have a looong way to go, I remember Valve also being involved in a similar case to this one.
Then there's also the whole matter with intrusive DRMs, exploitative monetization, bricking games with forced updates that can't be reverted...

I think right now GOG is the one leading digital game stores in terms of costumers rights. I hope other stores, both on PC and consoles, begin following suit. That or, more realistically, be forced to.

GOG has the best policy when it comes to digital games.

 

[nikolino840]

Where goes those money?

 

[MagnesG]

Nintendo is the same BS it’s a complete joke. You’d think they would take a page from Steam and Microsoft but nope. Anti-consumer in the highest regard. How can they not return money for something that hasn’t released and is DIGITAL?

That's why they named it "Pre-purchase".
To avoid this kind of thing.

 

[MoreJRPG]

That's why they named it "Pre-purchase".
To avoid this kind of thing.

Yeah and it’s the most anti-consumer nonsense in existence.

 

[MagnesG]

Yeah and it’s the most anti-consumer nonsense in existence.

Yeah, the law sure had to protect these illiterate people. A "Pre-purchase" what a vague term right...

IMO it's not anti-consumer if they had stated the case from the start, unlike pre orders where we know there are tons of things to consider and some other loopholes to, well unless it's digital.

There's nothing anti-consumer in honesty.

 

[Potato Chip PRO]

But...... Why Pre-order digital content in the first place?

 

[njean777]

Doesn't matter if you pre-order anything digital, you should always be offered a refund (physical I can kind of see why refunds are not offered). Now I agree that beating a game and asking for a refund is shitty, but I think the 2 hour rule that steam has is a great alternative. Most people will know after 30min if they like a game. Xbox has been great with refunds with me (rarely used but nice to be able to), but Sony has basically told me to fuck off, which is one huge reason I don't really play on PS4 much unless I know for sure I want the game on that platform.

 

[phil_t98]

Just have to be playing the game at 12:01 AM on launch day. That sounds a little obsessive.

Not everybody has access to super fast internet remember.

 

[down 2 orth]

The same thing happened to me, but with the US store. Not sure how that would work out with a different state's laws.

Still... SONY HAS SHIT CUSTOMER SERVICE AND DESERVES TO GET SUED OUT THE ASSHOLE.

 

[Nickolaidas]

But...... Why Pre-order digital content in the first place?

Exclusive skins, DLC content, support for their favorite devs/publisher, etc.

 

[Frederic]

The same thing happened to me, but with the US store. Not sure how that would work out with a different state's laws.

Still... SONY HAS SHIT CUSTOMER SERVICE AND DESERVES TO GET SUED OUT THE ASSHOLE.

I agree. Sony is so damn anti-customer these days, and this is another one of their anti-customer moves

 

[Hostile_18]

Wow that first brought up some memories.

Sony took an unauthorized amount from my bank last month and gave it back to me in my wallet only as a "goodwill gesture".

Also on the one occasion I had software that was unplayable they also told me I needed to get authorization and a written statement from a game developer.

Frankly put they are awful for refunds and no doubt break consumer laws in the UK too.

 

[cireza]

I would have liked to know how the digital games were faulty. They don't launch or they freeze is my guess ?

 

[Inviusx]

Australian consumer rights are some of the strongest in the world. The ACCC don't fuck around.

 

[Xorbus]

Oh I can't wait the day when people won't wipe their arses anymore and they will sue the arse wiping machine's maker, because it was harsh and accidentally went all in.

 

[M1chl]

SONY HAS SHIT CUSTOMER SERVICE AND DESERVES TO GET SUED OUT THE ASSHOLE.

MS too. No only, through official channels, they do NOT provide any refund policy. It's only through official support, they told you exactly what to do to get refund. BUT they still refund you game with 21% less of value it has been purchased, because that's taxes in my country. I am not sure if this is how it's done, but I doubt it, because if you refund anywhere else (in different company) , which does not have financial HQ in Luxembourg (you know, the place, where is zero VAT), you get full amount. Fucking taxes evading assholes.

 

[Shin]

But...... Why Pre-order digital content in the first place?

I've seen this stance at least twice now in this thread, publishers push it onto consumers with various editions of their product.
Promotions run wild, sometimes locking players in/out if they don't get Y or Z edition in the process - in a way it is feeding off of people.
Now that all is fine and dandy as it's supply and demand, but if a consumer so wishes so to cancel for whatever reason it is their right and a company should not try and get in their way, intentionally or otherwise.

 

[Zog]

I've seen this stance at least twice now in this thread, publishers push it onto consumers with various editions of their product.
Promotions run wild, sometimes locking players in/out if they don't get Y or Z edition in the process - in a way it is feeding off of people.
Now that all is fine and dandy as it's supply and demand, but if a consumer so wishes so to cancel for whatever reason it is their right and a company should not try and get in their way, intentionally or otherwise.

People should just say 'No' to pre-ordering.