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[MegaManTrigger]

Why do people get caught up on console names?

The Mega Drive had no drive. The Xbox One is the third Xbox. The PSP Go did not play PSP retail games. The Game Boy micro could not play Game Boy games (only GBA).

In 2-3 years Nintendo Switch will just be a brand. The console family that plays Nintendo Switch games. The games you play on it an still be switched, pop them out of the Switch mini and into the Switch TV (presumably cloud saves will come to make that easier).

All those examples you just mentioned are irrelevant, and aren't good analogies to counter the argument that the Switch's name doesn't mean much. The Switch tells you what the concept is about, the names like Xbox One/Genesis-MegaDrive/Gameboy don't.

In fact, the better argument against your point is if Nintendo kept the 3DS and DS brand but decided to go with the one screen hardware instead of two as the name suggests. The Switch works the same way.

 

[Branduil]

Is the problem just the price or the portability?
If the problem is just the price, which it is imo, then they can just wait for normal production costs to go down naturally, and then release a basic SKU with just the tablet and the Joy-Cons beneath it with a USB-C Cable in a super small package to also reduce storage costs. That could probably manage to bring the price to $199 in a year or two, considering they are currently selling it at a profit. That's already 3DS XL (most popular 3DS) price point. And once costs go down even further, price cut it and introduce a 'Pro' version at a higher price to maximize profits again.

But if you think the Switch is too big... It gets trickier and to be honest I don't think (anymore) that it's worth the headache to make a vita-like design without the multiplayer out-of-the-box bonus and different accessories for TV play AND the need to market it clearly etc etc...

The problem is in 2 years the 3DS will be dead and they won't have an entry-level console for young children. That's why this will exist eventually.

 

[DavidDesu]

Don't understand people thinking they wouldn't bring out a Switch without joycons or the ability to dock to a TV (though I see no reason why a Switch mini would necessarily remove the dock functionality). Nintendo literally made the 3DS. It's big feature was the 3D, so important they put it in the name. Then they made the cheaper 2DS.

C'mon there's a good chance they'll make a portable focussed version of the Switch non detachable controllers perhaps as that would definitely reduce size and cost, plus also by then they may sell it as being cheap enough you don't need to share your controller, as all your friends will have their own Switch anyway!


I see it happening, I hope it happens, but I still think it will be able to dock to a TV. The mock ups look pretty great. The Switch as it stand definitely is quite heavy and hard to hold for kids I imagine. Even when I try and hold mine with one hand when I need to do something or touch the screen it feels like it could fall out of my hand. If they can get the tech smaller, more power efficient and put it into a slightly smaller package it would be great.

 

[Aleh]

The dock is pure profit if it's not included with the system. Seriously, for the price they're charging the components are not a concern, OP. It's easy to bundle and when they reduce the price of the system later they may sell it separately, unfortunately.

All the more reasons for them to have a SKU without the dock. If people later decide to buy it separately they'll make even more profits.

They might do joy-con minis, but I highly doubt they'll remove the rails that connect the joy-cons. Like I said, more likely they just do different sized joy-cons, it's more likely than a system that doesn't dock though.

The whole purpose of Joy-Cons is to use them as individual controllers, you really can't make them any smaller than they already are

 

[Jonneh3003]

How would Snipperclips work?

I know you listed joycons as compatible but it doesn't seen to make much sense.

 

[extralite]

They might do joy-con minis, but I highly doubt they'll remove the rails that connect the joy-cons.

The rails are very important indeed. As long as they keep those standardized, any variation of controller can connect to the same Switch and its future variants. The layout and size of the joycons could differ greatly, they just need to have the same size rail to connect to the main unit.

The Switch tells you what the concept is about, the names like Xbox One/Genesis-MegaDrive/Gameboy don't.

Actually, at the time Gameboy was generally understood to express the mobility, like Sony's Walkman which was a portable cassette player. There also was the Discman.

The Walkman was one of Sony's brightest hours in terms of innovation and influence on language usage.

 

[Ushay]

Honestly I'd rather have a Pro dock with significantly higher processing capabilities.

 

[Vital Tundra]

A Switch mini doesn't make sense. 2 big functionalities of the Switch is the joycons seperating for wireless play and multiplayer, and "switching" from docked to handheld and such. A mini defeats these purposes. Yeah they ccould sell it without the dock but that starts adding confusion, and we all know what happened last time Nintendo didn't do something clear enough. There honestly doesn't need to be a mini console. It's small enough as is, and fulfills 2 important roles, no need to remove those roles

 

[Council Pop]

Honestly though, it's more likely we see a complete revision down the line.

There is only so much Nintendo can revise without completely changing the Joy Cons. Any Switch revision has to be compatible with all Switch Joy Cons- even Nintendo wouldn't be stupid enough to create two tiers of controllers for the same system which aren't cross compatible.

It would be like if, instead of the Wii Motion Plus add on, they had created a whole new Wii controller which wouldn't work with any previous Wiis.


Edit: I do think OPs idea of a Switch mini is very plausible though. Only issue is the docking.

How would Snipperclips work?

I know you listed joycons as compatible but it doesn't seen to make much sense.

Pretty simple- Joy Cons, purchased separately, can sync with the Switch mini. Snipperclips would only be playable in one player mode unless you synced other controllers, whether they're Joy Cons or the Pro.

 

[MegaManTrigger]

Actually, at the time Gameboy was generally understood to express the mobility, like Sony's Walkman which was a portable cassette player. There also was the Discman.

The Walkman was one of Sony's brightest hours in terms of innovation and influence on language usage.

Bad wording on my part as I was trying to pick apart at the Micro doesn't play GB games even though it came down to GB as branding and hardware constraints. Same goes for the two variants of gameboy players. They aren't a good example in terms of comparing with th Switch.

 

[Aleh]

The problem is in 2 years the 3DS will be dead and they won't have an entry-level console for young children. That's why this will exist eventually.

Yeah but I don't know how much cheaper than that a mini could be so soon, and keep in mind the 3DS didn't have a cheap entry-level option for a while either. I'm not ruling it out but I don't think losing the attractive features of the normal Switch would be the way to go. It would also require a different dock which doesn't sound like an elegant solution

 

[Eolz]

The problem is in 2 years the 3DS will be dead and they won't have an entry-level console for young children. That's why this will exist eventually.

And 2 years from now, either the Switch will be cheaper, or the 3DS will be replaced by something if the Switch somehow underperforms.
It's really nothing like asking for a 2DS to a 3DS, it's asking for a WiiU without a gamepad.

 

[jts]

And 2 years from now, either the Switch will be cheaper, or the 3DS will be replaced by something if the Switch somehow underperforms.
It's really nothing like asking for a 2DS to a 3DS, it's asking for a WiiU without a gamepad.

The Gamepad is required to use the Wii U and some of those games. Also, the Gamepad wasn't sold separately.

There is no game that requires the TV, and in fact some games don't support TV mode.

 

[extralite]

And 2 years from now, either the Switch will be cheaper, or the 3DS will be replaced by something if the Switch somehow underperforms.

Why would the Switch be cheaper in 2 years?

And why would the 3DS only get a successor if the Switch underperforms? That contradicts what Kimishima stated.

 

[Aleh]

Yeah they ccould sell it without the dock but that starts adding confusion, and we all know what happened last time Nintendo didn't do something clear enough. There honestly doesn't need to be a mini console. It's small enough as is, and fulfills 2 important roles, no need to remove those roles

I don't think removing the dock would be confusing because TV Mode and Tabletop Mode are basically the same thing, except playing on a smaller screen. Which means full compatibility with all games and features.

 

[Vital Tundra]

I don't think removing the dock would be confusing because TV Mode and Tabletop Mode are basically the same thing, except playing on a smaller screen. Which means full compatibility with all games and features.

The general public has shown time and time again that they don't "get it". It's as simple as that. Why risk it?

 

[Gitaroo]

Fully what I expected OT beside some size differences. Expect this thing to hit around next pokemon launch.

 

[RAWRferal]

I'd be more excited about a Switch XL tbh. Larger screen for better tabletop mode. Joycons would take some work to not look weird though.

 

[Branduil]

The general public has shown time and time again that they don't "get it". It's as simple as that. Why risk it?

The general public has shown that they didn't get the Wii U, or the 3DS at first. They get the Switch just fine, because it doesn't have the worst console name in history combined with the biggest botch job in marketing ever.

 

[MegaManTrigger]

The general public has shown that they didn't get the Wii U, or the 3DS at first. They get the Switch just fine, because it doesn't have the worst console name in history combined with the biggest botch job in marketing ever.

And you don't think adding nonsense like introducing handheld only form factor and still calling it the Switch, won't confuse more potential customers? Just because the Switch's marketing is on point right now, doesn't mean you can't fuck that up down the road.

 

[Branduil]

And you don't think adding nonsense like introducing handheld only form factor and still calling it the Switch, won't confuse more potential customers? Just because the Switch's marketing is on point right now, doesn't mean you can't fuck that up down the road.

No, I don't think after 2 years of knowing what the Switch is, introducing a mini portable-only version will brainwipe people and throw them into a state of unfixable confusion about what the system is, any more than the 2DS destroyed the 3DS.

 

[LewieP]

I am amazed that some people don't seem to think this is inevitable. The exact implementation is still up for discussion, but of course they will have a more child friendly handheld variant of the Switch.

I think they will go for a device much like the mockup in the OP. No docking functionality. 540p screen (and reduced GPU requirement. Better battery life. More durable hardware. Child friendly design. Cheap price.

Paired with a Vita TV style TV only version of Switch, ideally with a spec boost to have more 1080p games (or even 4k support).

The concept of the Switch is retained if you can switch between a variety of playstyles and devices with the same games.

 

[Eolz]

Why would the Switch be cheaper in 2 years?

And why would the 3DS only get a successor if the Switch underperforms? That contradicts what Kimishima stated.

Because consoles usually get pricecuts after a while when they're not overshipped (like the WiiU) or get constant stock issues (like the Wii).
For the second comment, you should look up what Nintendo was saying when they introduced the DS.

The Gamepad is required to use the Wii U and some of those games. Also, the Gamepad wasn't sold separately.

There is no game that requires the TV, and in fact some games don't support TV mode.

No, but the whole marketing and main features for the Switch is that it's an Hybrid that you can dock, and where you can remove the joycons.
You could use the same architecture but call it something else if you wanted just some handheld. You can use the Switch just as an handheld if you want, but that's not how it's sold and marketed. Attaching the joycons to it also removes the whole point of where Nintendo is going with (sharing fun with other people with one console).

 

[rbanke]

I think it could be a good idea for those who want portable systems. Maybe they can shave some decent costs by building the controllers into it and omitting some of the peripherals

It seems like I'm in the minority but I'd much prefer a vita tv style version that was home only and came with a pro controller. And to add even more unlikeliness to that equation, have it be a tad more powerful to avoid some of the docked/1080p slowdown issues.

I'm currently planning on waiting until around E3 2018 to see if we get such an announcement (lol) or whatever the eventual revision will be before buying the system as I just have no use for playing a portable.

 

[Yawnny]

The "Switch-U". Guys? ..Guys?

 

[Chezzymann]

I think the switch could have avoided this problem if they ditched the joycons and made the bezel way smaller (seriously its ridiculous). The joycons dont add much as they are bad controllers when only using one and the motion controller stuff is just more gimmicky fluff.

Basically that switch mini should have been the switch but with less bezel and still a 6 inch screen. Could still be compatible with the dock too.

 

[Aleh]

I think the switch could have avoided this problem if they ditched the joycons and made the bezel way smaller (seriously its ridiculous). The joycons dont add much as they are bad controllers when only using one and the motion controller stuff is just more gimmicky fluff.

Basically that switch mini should have been the switch but with less bezel and still a 6 inch screen. Could still be compatible with the dock too.

You conveniently forgot the multiplayer out-of-the-box part though
Plus releasing different colors of Joy-Cons is gonna make them a ton of money.

 

[Chezzymann]

You conveniently forgot the multiplayer out-of-the-box part though
Plus releasing different colors of Joy-Cons is gonna make them a ton of money.

No i mentioned that as its bad since using one joycon (expecially the right one) is not a good experience. Id take a dpad and smaller form factor any day over that.

 

[shadow2810]

I can see Nintendo releases a smaller dumbed down version in 4-5 years, like the 2DS, Wii mini and GB micro

 

[extralite]

Because consoles usually get pricecuts after a while when they're not overshipped (like the WiiU) or get constant stock issues (like the Wii).

Nintendo has their stance on price cuts which I already detailed in this thread (betrayal of early adopters, creating bad expectations). They generally don't like to price cut.

The reasons you give for why Wii U and Wii didn't get price cuts seem random and not really plausible?

For the second comment, you should look up what Nintendo was saying when they introduced the DS.

This is not really a third pillar situation. Switch is the Wii U successor, taking over one of the pillars. If 3DS really wouldn't get its own successor, they'd be left with one pillar. Unifying the hardware architecture serves to have more effective software development, not to give up on having various models covering different pricepoints.

Very different situation. Kimishima referred specifically to target audience and pricepoint as reasons why the 3DS should have a successor.

 

[brain_stew]

A Switch mini doesn't make sense. 2 big functionalities of the Switch is the joycons seperating for wireless play and multiplayer, and "switching" from docked to handheld and such. A mini defeats these purposes. Yeah they ccould sell it without the dock but that starts adding confusion, and we all know what happened last time Nintendo didn't do something clear enough. There honestly doesn't need to be a mini console. It's small enough as is, and fulfills 2 important roles, no need to remove those roles

This is less about a "mini" console and more about a cost reduced Switch to target the same market the 3DS and 2DS will be vacating.

A 5" 720p screen makes sense because it is a commodity part used in budget smartphones. Removing the detachable controllers makes sense as it can cut the costs associated with motion controls and 2 additional batteries. Removing the dock as standard makes sense as it reduces material and shipping/packaging costs.

Think of this as the 2DS to the 3DS and it makes a lot more sense. It won't launch anytime in the next 18 months.

What's the alternative? The current iteration of the Switch is too expensive to manufacture to service the low end $100-$200 market the 2DS and 3DS currently occupy.

Should Nintendo throw away that lucrative monopoly market altogether or come up with an entirely new platform and split development resources? No, they should capitalise on the software library and development platform that the Switch has already established.

 

[darkazcura]

I think the lack of ability to switch is being a bit overthought. Nintendo will be able to advertise the Switch as a family of systems and an ecosystem that allows you to switch between multiple devices while maintaining the same game library and saves. Having a Switch mini can still fit this description since it is more figurative than literal, I suppose. The only issue is that the Switch logo literally has the joycons heh which kind of goes against my point, but Nintendo could make it work.

Basically the concept of switching doesn't have to apply to a singular system itself. The concept can expand to include switching between different systems in the same family. Nintendo would have to get cloud saving up and running for this to really work seamlessly, though.

 

[brawly]

If they make it compatible with a dock then this would be an awesome idea, since I only plan to play with the Pro Controller.

 

[brain_stew]

I think the lack of ability to switch is being a bit overthought. Nintendo will be able to advertise the Switch as a family of systems and an ecosystem that allows you to switch between multiple devices while maintaining the same game library and saves. Having a Switch mini can still fit this description since it is more figurative than literal, I suppose. The only issue is that the Switch logo literally has the joycons heh which kind of goes against my point, but Nintendo could make it work.

Basically the concept of switching doesn't have to apply to a singular system itself. The concept can expand to include switching between different systems in the same family. Nintendo would have to get cloud saving up and running for this to really work seamlessly, though.

It could still support the "Switch" feature but simply not include the dock in the retail package. If parents just want a cheap portable system that plays the latest Pokemon, why force them to pay the extra for the dock?

Sell that system for $200 with the next generation Pokémon packed in and I can guarantee it finds a market.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

I wish the buttons were wider.

 

[FrozenCell]

Huh.....Here I am excited for a switch xl.

making the original Switch bezeless in a future revision would suffice

 

[LizardKing]

Like many have said the biggest problem is eliminating the joy cons. You can't really do that. It would fragment things too much and cause too much confusion. And buying them separate isn't a solution. A $200 Switch mini would be $280 so what's the point?

 

[Jonneh3003]

Pretty simple- Joy Cons, purchased separately, can sync with the Switch mini. Snipperclips would only be playable in one player mode unless you synced other controllers, whether they're Joy Cons or the Pro.

That doesn't sound simple to me, it seems to go against the point of the console.

Also Snipperclips doesn't support Pro controllers.

 

[ZeoVGM]

I don't see this happening unless Switch sales tank. It would be admitting defeat.

Simply a smaller Switch unit that still works with the dock would be kind of pointless. And releasing it without the dock would be the equivalent of Microsoft dropping the Kinect. It would be a sign that the idea didn't work.

 

[WordAssassin]

The Gamepad is required to use the Wii U and some of those games. Also, the Gamepad wasn't sold separately.

There is no game that requires the TV, and in fact some games don't support TV mode.

What games don't support TV mode?? O:

I know there's at least one (1, 2, Switch!) that doesn't support Handheld Mode but I didn't know there were any that didn't support Docked Mode.

 

[jwk94]

What games don't support TV mode?? O:

I know there's at least one (1, 2, Switch!) that doesn't support Handheld Mode but I didn't know there were any that didn't support Docked Mode.

VOEZ is a touchscreen only game.

 

[Soapbox Killer]

But Switch is already a Wii U mini, won't that cause an issue with soccor moms?


Real Answer: the next DS may still be coming so who knows.

 

[marmoka]

I don't see a Switch Mini incoming in 2019. It's more probable in my opinion to release a Nintendo Switch phone, same Switch with a cell phone option, and apps like WhatsApp, Instagram or Facebook.

At least i would buy it.

 

[FStubbs]

It could still support the "Switch" feature but simply not include the dock in the retail package. If parents just want a cheap portable system that plays the latest Pokemon, why force them to pay the extra for the dock?

Sell that system for $200 with the next generation Pokémon packed in and I can guarantee it finds a market.

The dock can't cost but so much. Switch mini could still come with one.

 

[atbigelow]

My guess:

Nintendo is going to come out with both a smaller handheld for the 2DS market and a screenless "puck" for TV-only. Smaller handheld has fused Joycons and is more geared for solo play; Puck comes with two Joycons + charging adapter.

Brand issues won't be a problem: just call the library "Nintendo games" and neither of the devices need to have the name "Switch" in them.

One hint that this could be the reality: as stated in the Zelda GDC talk, the SDK for the Switch is not called the "Switch SDK". It's Nintendo SDK. They are going to be reusing this thing for more than just the Switch itself.

 

[Nostremitus]

Seriously? Gyro isn't motion control? Gyro was in Wii Motion Plus. It's a motion sensor, like accelerometers and magnetometers.

Not in context of the conversation.

Since you didn't read the conversation that I thought had already been resolved, let me ask you this...

Do you think the Sixaxis gyro tilt control is the same as the PlayStation Move, Wii Remote, or Joycon motion control?

You can use gyros for basic tilt or full on motion controls. They are separate uses for the same basic technology.

You wouldn't call the 3DS OoT or MM remakes motion controlled games in the same catagory as Skyward Sword just because they have gyro aiming.

They gotta fit onto the system.

People are talking about a mini with built-in controls that do not detach. It wouldn't have or need rails for any other joycons to attach to.

 

[Alchemy]

I'm really confused why people are so much more worried about keeping the removable joycons, motion controls, and docking feature of the Switch instead of focusing on Nintendo having to find a way to reach a significantly reduced price point to expand the Switchs market to the same audience that goes after cheaper tablets or the 2DS for portable gaming. It won't happen anytime in the next few years because that audience isn't the same that buys electronics day one, but is important for the long term success of the Switch. Its the same reason we see so many slim/mini console revisions with stuff like the PS1/2/3, 360, 2DS, etc. A hardware revision is inevitable and it will likely involve cutting costs anywhere possible.

Creating a 3DS successor to fill that space does significantly more harm to Nintendo by splitting their software development across multiple platforms than focusing on one ecosystem with multiple hardware SKUs. Nintendo just has to make sure it plays a majority of Switch games and its cheap for it to be compelling, not that every SKU has the same hardware features.

 

[Goodacre0081]

they should go the other way with it. home/tv only version packed with a pro controller

 

[hououinkyouma00]

See I want the exact opposite of this. I just want a set top box and a controller. I don't give a shit about the portable part or HD rumble for that matter. I don't care if it doesn't have the pro controller I'm okay with the joycon grip.

Just give me a cheap tv only console.

 

[axisofweevils]

Why risk confusing the issue? The minute you have "this is a switch mini but this doesnt work with it but that does", you suddenly have to add labels to all the old games and market chaos ensues. Also, a smaller screen would make much of the in game text hard to read. For the first time in years, Nintendo has a product that everybody gets. Why change it?