• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Square Enix's silence about the PC version of Nier Automata

Zomba13

Member
Isn't RE7 being pirated despite Denuvo mostly because of the demo? So they cracked the protection on the demo and that same crack just worked on the full release? If they just threw Denuvo on the game wouldn't it still take pirates months to crack like other Denuvo releases?

Knowing there will be a PC version at some point just eats into the PS4 sales because I want the game but won't get it on PS4 if a PC port is coming but also now I'll wait to see if the port is any good (because I'm waiting months anyway) and then might as well wait for a sale because all the hype and newness around the game is gone because of the PS4 release.

I hate all this "waaaah PC piracy" bullshit. Isn't The Witcher 3 a huge success and didn't it have a DRM free version from GoG?
 

MUnited83

For you.
Isn't RE7 being pirated despite Denuvo mostly because of the demo? So they cracked the protection on the demo and that same crack just worked on the full release? If they just threw Denuvo on the game wouldn't it still take pirates months to crack like other Denuvo releases?

Knowing there will be a PC version at some point just eats into the PS4 sales because I want the game but won't get it on PS4 if a PC port is coming but also now I'll wait to see if the port is any good (because I'm waiting months anyway) and then might as well wait for a sale because all the hype and newness around the game is gone because of the PS4 release.

I hate all this "waaaah PC piracy" bullshit. Isn't The Witcher 3 a huge success and didn't it have a DRM free version from GoG?

It's a really shitty excuse. They either have no idea how Denuvo works and are scared it will be cracked as quickly as RE7, or they are just making up excuses for the delay.
 

Sajko

Member
Well. Now I am totally expecting stealth release 2 months later without DRM or if Denuvo comes up with something new. Just worried it might be too late and end up like DQH steam release and bomb.

They'll never learn this way... God damnit Square.
 

Ascheroth

Member
I don't buy the piracy excuse, especially since RE7 still had excellent sales despite getting broken. More likely it's "Steam version? Oh fuck, that's right... uh... we have no idea how to do that."

Japanese devs are terrified of the PC, they have no idea how to approach it. It took petitions, sales estimations and years of waiting for publishers like Capcom, From Software and Square Enix to feel comfortable dipping their toes into the market.

Considering 90% of this game's hype is in Japan, 99% of Western gamers have no idea what "Nier" is, and the PC is pretty irrelevant in their home market... I think their focus is on domestic sales first. We'll be lucky to see a PC release before 2018.

I'm warming up to playing big RPGs on my PS4 though. Nioh taught me that, while still not ideal, the platform is at least convenient.

I would maybe agree if it weren't Platinum doing the PC version themselves. They absolutely have experience on that front and they've also said that their workflow is creating a PC version first and then scaling it down to PS4.
I mean I could understand if they need some more time to polish the PC version and iron out some kinks that don't affect the PS4 version, but I think it very unlikely that some major problems cropped up or that they're completely clueless.

This really feels like SE meddling, because unlike Platinum they've shown that their Japanese side has no clue at all when it comes to PC, treating it as an afterthought at best.
Nier's previous PC announcement was exciting because it could have announced a change in that behaviour, but as all this fuckery shows they're still clueless.

Thankfully basically every other japanese publisher that isn't SE or SEGA isn't run by monkeys.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Saito Producer just mentioned steam version on the Dengeki stream.

He said they are working on it, but they have to do something about the pirating issue, and because of recent certain game being broken (I assume he is mentioning RE7 issue but I am not 100% sure) they have to do something about it. He said it won't take long so please wait for it.

Horizon and Zelda both hit before this. I have been waiting for PC news on the game and now this? Nah, I will wait. SE wants you to double dip but fuck em. Too many games, not enough time. The game will get slashed in price super hard in time anyway so I can pick it up later when there is a lull. If there ever is a lull this year.

So silly.
 

GrayChild

Member
Saito Producer just mentioned steam version on the Dengeki stream.

He said they are working on it, but they have to do something about the pirating issue, and because of recent certain game being broken (I assume he is mentioning RE7 issue but I am not 100% sure) they have to do something about it. He said it won't take long so please wait for it.

That didn't stop them to release pretty much any FF PC port for the last few years.

I call bullshit on this one. I still believe that either:

1. Sony has moneyhatted some temporary exclusivity deal.
2. Square naively thinks that a delayed PC version will bring more money thanks to the double-dippers.
 

ViviOggi

Member
Whether they're serving disingenuous PR speech, draconian DRM or think they can pull a Rockstar - I certainly won't be there day one anymore.
 

UrbanRats

Member
Horizon and Zelda both hit before this. I have been waiting for PC news on the game and now this? Nah, I will wait. SE wants you to double dip but fuck em. Too many games, not enough time. The game will get slashed in price super hard in time anyway so I can pick it up later when there is a lull. If there ever is a lull this year.

So silly.
Yeah i stopped buying games on d1 to save money and im all the better for it.
Im about to play hitman, then ill get to re7, then gravity rush 2, horizon, zelda... before i get around to nier, not only it'll be out on pc, but it'll have gone way down in price.
 

MUnited83

For you.
Whether they're serving disingenuous PR speech, draconian DRM or think they can pull a Rockstar - I certainly won't be there day one anymore.
This. I would have bought this day one if it released at the same time. Now i'll be waiting for a good sale.
 
That didn't stop them to release pretty much any FF PC port for the last few years.

I call bullshit on this one. I still believe that either:

1. Sony has moneyhatted some temporary exclusivity deal.
2. Square naively thinks that a delayed PC version will bring more money thanks to the double-dippers.
Nah, most Japanese developers are still 50-50 about making a simultaneous PC and console release. You have to remember that they still lag behind in that sense compared to western devs.

Why would Sony moneyhat Nier Automata, of all games. It's not a popular series.
 

Hektor

Member
Why would Sony moneyhat Nier Automata, of all games. It's not a popular series.

I feel like thats a bit of a disengenious sentiment that has been expressed in this thread quite often now.

If sony moneyhatted Nier, they wouldn't have moneyhatted a sequel to a niche game 5 people in the west played.

They'd be moneyhatting that hot, new Platinum Game.

The last three big P* games have been funded by console manufacturers (even if one of them has been cancelled now), is it that hard to believe that Sony would have interest in a (timed) exclusive P* game of their own?
 
I feel like thats a bit of a disengenious sentiment that has been expressed in this thread quite often now.

If sony moneyhatted Nier, they wouldn't have moneyhatted a sequel to a niche game 5 people in the west played.

They'd be moneyhatting that hot, new Platinum Game.

The last three big P* games have been funded by console manufacturers (even if one of them has been cancelled now), is it that hard to believe that Sony would have interest in a (timed) exclusive P* game of their own?



The mistake here is to think it'd cost the same or even that it'd cost them money.
Marketing spot is a way to strike a deal for exemple.
 

Vanille

Member
I feel like thats a bit of a disengenious sentiment that has been expressed in this thread quite often now.

If sony moneyhatted Nier, they wouldn't have moneyhatted a sequel to a niche game 5 people in the west played.

They'd be moneyhatting that hot, new Platinum Game.

The last three big P* games have been funded by console manufacturers (even if one of them has been cancelled now), is it that hard to believe that Sony would have interest in a (timed) exclusive P* game of their own?

Yeah, I'm sure Sony is desperate for a piece of the pie after seeing those Wonderful 101 sales.
 

patapuf

Member
I feel like thats a bit of a disengenious sentiment that has been expressed in this thread quite often now.

If sony moneyhatted Nier, they wouldn't have moneyhatted a sequel to a niche game 5 people in the west played.

They'd be moneyhatting that hot, new Platinum Game.

The last three big P* games have been funded by console manufacturers (even if one of them has been cancelled now), is it that hard to believe that Sony would have interest in a (timed) exclusive P* game of their own?

The future will tell us how likely this is. If the port comes out in one year? Sure, Sony most likely had a hand in that. If it comes out in a month or two? That would border on self-harm from Square. Though i guess Square isn't a stranger to bad exclusivity deals.

I can't imagine Sony footing the marketing bill for a short delay.
 

jmga

Member
Why would Sony moneyhat Nier Automata, of all games. It's not a popular series.

The same reason they moneyhatted the announce of Ni no Kuni 2 or Ace Combat VII for other platforms for more than a year, who knows how many third party PS4 "exclusive" games out there are truly exclusive and how many of them are releasing on other platforms in the near future.

They just want people to think that PS4 has a larger number of exclusive than it truly has.
 

GrayChild

Member
Yeah, I'm sure Sony is desperate for a piece of the pie after seeing those Wonderful 101 sales.

A large part of the Platinum fanbase is still PS/Xbox based. Don't forget that Vanquish, MGR and Bayonetta are still the most well-sold titles they developed.
 
I feel like thats a bit of a disengenious sentiment that has been expressed in this thread quite often now.

If sony moneyhatted Nier, they wouldn't have moneyhatted a sequel to a niche game 5 people in the west played.

They'd be moneyhatting that hot, new Platinum Game.

The last three big P* games have been funded by console manufacturers (even if one of them has been cancelled now), is it that hard to believe that Sony would have interest in a (timed) exclusive P* game of their own?
Platinum Games is a fantastic developer.

Their games arent really big sellers though. Not to mention Nier is a niche series.
 

orochi91

Member
I'd be extremely disappointed in Sony if they had a hand in any potential delay of the PC port.

They missed their chance at making this a PS4 exclusive, so trying to retroactively buy timed exclusivity would be so petty and blatantly anti-consumer behaviour.
 
I mean, I get moneyhatting Resident Evil 7's VR. Wint be surprised if they try to get Ace Combat VR to be timed exclusive too.

Still... Nier? I can buy them being concerned with PC piracy, especially with a niche game like Nier that needs all the help it can get.

It's always niche and indie games that suffer due to piracy issues.
 

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
From my perspective, it's Squeenix's silence that is most damning vis-a-vis the potential (and I'd argue probable) Sony connection. The two comments on the PC version since the release date confusion almost three months ago have both come from Platinum and one of those was a "We have nothing to share" -- Squeenix itself hasn't said anything. Not a single branch of the company has reassured those interested in the PC version that it's still in active development and on track for an "Early 2017" release; this being voluntarily seems decidedly unlikely to me. There isn't even a Steam Store page.
 

jmga

Member
I mean, I get moneyhatting Resident Evil 7's VR. Wint be surprised if they try to get Ace Combat VR to be timed exclusive too.

Still... Nier? I can buy them being concerned with PC piracy, especially with a niche game like Nier that needs all the help it can get.

It's always niche and indie games that suffer due to piracy issues.

The concern with piracy could explain a delay, but not the fact that they are only promoting the PS4 version in trailers, website, advertisements, press releases, etc.

Anyone who would look for the game on the internet right now would think the game is PS4 exclusive.
 
The silence is probably that the PC release is considered not as important to them than the PS4 for obvious reasons.

The marketing for the PC release is most likely an afterthought. We have seen precedence for this numerous times from Japanese devs.

The concern with piracy could explain a delay, but not the fact that they are only promoting the PS4 version in trailers, website, advertisements, press releases, etc.

Anyone who would look for the game on the internet right now would think the game is PS4 exclusive.


Yeah, not denying that they are. But I dont think moneyhatting is the case. Just that it's SE's marketing focus regarding Nier.
 

jmga

Member
The silence is probably that the PC release is considered not as important to them than the PS4 for obvious reasons.

The marketing for the PC release is most likely an afterthought. We have seen precedence for this numerous times from Japanese devs.

So you announce a PC version and then remove the PC/Steam logo from all promo material because the PS4 version is more important?

That doesn't make sense.
 
So you announce a PC version and then remove the PC/Steam logo from all promo material because the PS4 version is more important?

That doesn't make sense.

If Sony is moneyhatting it the devs cant even talk about a PC release. The PC download for the SE store wont even be there.
 
Reading these post and some ppl are suggesting Sony has a exclusivity deal but shouldn't that be a bad thing if so. Guess we all home it's just a square mistake but if not and it is a exclusivity deal then it's pretty bad for the industry

Only way it seems it would be fine is if the game wouldn't of been made unless Sony helped.
 
Well, we knew that Rise of the Tomb Raider would release to other platforms, even after the initial MS moneyhat.

Yeah, due to communication fuckups.

We can know if Nier is being moneyhatted if Sony/SE announces it as a timed exclusive, which to my knowledge isnt. Why bother giving the cash if you cant flaunt it even a bit in PR?

Let's wait if they do, or dont.
 

jmga

Member
As I have already said, all promo material and trailers have only showd the PS4 version. The official website only shows the PS4 version.

A lot of people think it is a PS4 exclusive game, and that only benefits Sony.
 

MUnited83

For you.
Yeah, I'm sure Sony is desperate for a piece of the pie after seeing those Wonderful 101 sales.

Not all moneyhatting is supposed to be just about sales. Moneyhatting is also in effect on trying to build your platform as the place where to play x title or y genre.
 
Actually, I also remembered that a large chunk of the devs were working on Scalebound instead. Maybe the Nier PC port is not that up to par yet too, and they arent working on both simultaneously.

Anyway, the SEA and JP release for Nier is next week on the 23rd. We can probably know for sure if Sony are moneyhatting it because like Nioh, they'll mention it in the PR.
 

gngf123

Member
Whether they're serving disingenuous PR speech, draconian DRM or think they can pull a Rockstar - I certainly won't be there day one anymore.

That's essentially where I am too. From instant day 1 purchase to probably in a steam sale.

I can support other releases instead.
 
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.
 

Spirited

Mine is pretty and pink
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

If we're an afterthought then the game will be an afterthought for me too, I got other stuff to play.
 

Ascheroth

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

Well, Square Enix is doing their best to hurt first week sales on PC on their own.
 

MaLDo

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

What?

I can pay 49€ for the game on steam day 1.

If the game is not on steam day 1 (I mean, same day 1 as PS4), I will pay max 15€ in a key seller sale.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

elyetis

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.
That's always the problem when trying to send a message with your wallet, you know you do send a message but you have no idea if they will know what was that message. Maybe buying the game on steam and asking for a refund while stating why you were unhappy ( not simultaneous release, drm, bad port or whatever depending of the situation ) can help, but I'm not even sure they do take time to check that.
 

Paragon

Member
Saito Producer just mentioned steam version on the Dengeki stream.
He said they are working on it, but they have to do something about the pirating issue, and because of recent certain game being broken (I assume he is mentioning RE7 issue but I am not 100% sure) they have to do something about it. He said it won't take long so please wait for it.
I was already hesitant about buying this at launch due to the poor quality of previous Platinum ports, but delaying the release to add even more restrictive DRM is incentive for people to avoid buying the game entirely - or at least wait for it to be cheap in a sale.
I'm really torn over this, as it was one of the games that I actually planned on buying at full price from Steam instead of waiting or shopping around, to show my support and hopefully encourage SE to bring the previous game and more over to PC.
Denuvo in its current state is bad enough, having to constantly re-activate or being locked out of playing games offline.

If someone is going to pirate the game, they weren't going to buy it anyway.
Having a simultaneous release and more positive word of mouth about the game - even if some of that comes from pirates - is going to do far more for sales than delaying the game and paying another company to implement restrictive DRM.

And let's imagine for a moment that we lived in a world where everything was online-only and DRM was perfect.
Think how much of an impact that would have on the preservation of games.
  • Any time you're without internet access (which is frequent for some of us) or if the servers are busy or down temporarily, you wouldn't be able to play games at all.
  • Anything more than a few years old would be rendered unplayable once they shut down the servers.
  • If sales for licensed games are bad, they might pull the game from sale to save money on renewing the license.
  • Even if the sales are good, things are not licensed indefinitely and once they expire the games disappear from sale and can never be purchased again - or may even be rendered unplayable.
  • The game you're trying to play is more than a few years old an has issues running on newer hardware? Tough luck. The developer/publisher isn't going to pay to update it, and there's no way to fix it yourself any more if you can't modify the executable or inject DLLs.
  • Would emulation even exist? Lots of companies don't seem to care about their back catalog of games, and you have to wonder if companies would have deemed it worth the cost of developing an emulator just to sell old games, if the concept had not already been proven by the emulation community.
Just look at how many games/DLC items have been removed from Steam for various reasons - including Platinum's previous game: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3071895
And there are many more PC games which never even made it onto digital storefronts due to licensing deals, trying to find the rightsholders, lack of publisher interest etc.
Unless a physical version of these games exists - which is often no longer the case for new releases - they could potentially be lost forever due to DRM or other online requirements.
Even with physical releases, anything using SafeDisc or SecuROM is no longer playable on updated versions of Windows without cracking the game. If that DRM was uncrackable, those games would have been lost.
Some companies are even selling cracked versions of their games now, because they no longer have a clean copy of the game to distribute any more.

I don't believe that DRM-free releases hurt sales, and I personally care far more about the preservation of games than any "potential sales" lost to piracy.
Of course that's easy for me to say when I'm not trying to sell a game myself - though I think if there is any potential harm, it's more likely to impact small indie developers than games from big companies like SE.
With the convenience of services like Steam/GOG, I can't imagine that there are many people who would pirate a game instead of buying it just because a pirated version exists.
People who pirate games never intended to buy it. If piracy wasn't an option, they simply wouldn't be playing the game. They're not going to suddenly hand over $60.

I am far less opposed to the idea of DRM schemes like Denuvo if companies actually committed to its removal 3-6 months after release like DOOM and Inside did though.
Assuming that the game wasn't cracked, at that point you have protected the game during the initial sales period (if you believe that it actually does this) and secured the majority of your sales.
Past that point, its inclusion seems far less important, and you may get a second-wind of sales from its removal - perhaps by launching it on other storefronts like GOG now that it's DRM-free.
Having a DRM-free version of the game in existence secures its preservation even if it is later removed from sale. Platinum's TMNT game didn't even last 9 months.

I'd be extremely disappointed in Sony if they had a hand in any potential delay of the PC port.
They missed their chance at making this a PS4 exclusive, so trying to retroactively buy timed exclusivity would be so petty and blatantly anti-consumer behaviour.
The entire concept of exclusives is anti-consumer, whether they're timed or not.
I'd much rather have a late port than none at all - but companies shouldn't be surprised when the sales are low if they do this.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

When gamers try to make other gamers feel guilty for how they want to spend their money.

Platinum will survive. Yoko Taro is a SE employee. He is not going nowhere. He's heading up a cell phone too. No one is losing their jobs. They all got paid. SE will just lose PC sales. No one is out to hurt the developers, but customers shouldn't let themselves be walked on either. If SE doesn't want to learn, I shouldn't feel guilty for taking my money elsewhere or feeling their product lost value.

Stop with this. There have been 3 Drakengards and 2 Niers now. They are all niche as fuck. If they want to make more, they will.
 
I'd be extremely disappointed in Sony if they had a hand in any potential delay of the PC port.

They missed their chance at making this a PS4 exclusive, so trying to retroactively buy timed exclusivity would be so petty and blatantly anti-consumer behaviour.

It's a niche game and it's cheaper than buying full exclusivity for something they feel won't sell. Besides, buying up a game from a 3p is really more anti consumer than just delaying for marketing.

Valve could always join in and make the game come to their platform same day by moneyhatting most likely. If they don't that's on them. Phil seems to put effort on getting certain game on their platforms like FFXV which we all know has a minuscule fanbase on xbox. Dunno why some people get so touchy about it because both microsoft and sony do it. In the end business is business so they can do what they want.
 
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

Boo fucking hoo.

Why should I not just wait longer if I'm going to have to wait anyways.

If we're an afterthought then the game will be an afterthought for me too, I got other stuff to play.

Well said.
 

Durante

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.
If first week sales matter that much they should perhaps give people a chance to buy the game in the first week.
 

gngf123

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

For me at least it's not a protest vote. It's nowhere near that.

Simply, the more Square Enix fuck around with it the less of a priority it is to spend my limited money on it when there are many other games I can buy that I'm looking forward to. They will come first and will get my money first, especially if they show that they are actually taking PC seriously.

This is especially the case if they decide to weigh it down with Denuvo or some kind of other extra DRM/anti-tamper after the RE7 situation. I have held off buying many other games because of that and will do so again.

Why should I not just wait longer if I'm going to have to wait anyways.

If first week sales matter that much they should perhaps give people a chance to buy the game in the first week.

This too
 

UrbanRats

Member
On buying Nier Automata on sales as a protest well...

For me, you are mostly hurting Platinum and Yoko Taro with it. They need all the help they can get regarding Nier.

It's fine if you want to tell Square Enix to fuck themselves. Protesting helps, but hoping it wont lead them to think that the Nier Universe shouldnt be given a chance again.

First week sales matter very very much.

I'm not even trying to send a message, i just don't buy on D1 to save money, since i rarely have time to play on d1 anyway.
Them being ass to pc players makes it a little bit easier though.
 

SilentRob

Member
The concept of not buying a game you want to play because you feel underaprecciated and want to send a statement to a company as if it is a friend who betrayed you is such a weird concept to me.
 

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Sorry guys, I just don't see this coming to PC......like any time soon.
 

ViviOggi

Member
The concept of not buying a game you want to play because you feel underaprecciated and want to send a statement to a company as if it is a friend who betrayed you is such a weird concept to me.

Projecting an awful lot there buddy

What's actually weird though is how gamers always try to shame fellow consumers into buying products?

Nobody here's calling for a boycott or w/e, all people are saying is that the game went down a bunch in the priorities list. If Squeenix wants that Sony money so badly then they get less customer money. If you want me to commit to buying a product day one, for a higher price, you better put in some work.
 
Top Bottom