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[GrayChild]

Sorry guys, I just don't see this coming to PC......like any time soon.

Prepare to eat some crow then. For the sake of all PC gamers and especially GhostTrick's account.

 

[Abilidebob]

The concept of not buying a game you want to play because you feel underaprecciated and want to send a statement to a company as if it is a friend who betrayed you is such a weird concept to me.

Isn't it weirder to buy a game full priced at release to try and "help" a dev/publisher like they're your friend? If they want my money don't treat me like a second class citizen.

 

[7Th]

If first week sales matter that much they should perhaps give people a chance to buy the game in the first week.

Steam sales don't appear in NPD or Media Create/Famitsu so they don't count anyway.

 

[billythemule]

I feel almost sorry for any games that are being published by SE. They have ruined so many, most recently DX:MD, with their stupid practices. FFS.

So fucking silly. They are going to lose more sales because if this than they would by releasing it day and date without Denuvo. Such a terrible decision.

Why would you need receipts for what is common sense?

The game will sell less for being delayed and bringing a terrible DRM scheme that even affects legit users.
They will lose a lot more sales than they would by being piratable day one.

Wait, what? I though Denuvo was practically undetectable by a paying customer and only really a mild issue for people who perform multiple performance benchmarks per day. I played Doom and Deus Ex MD without even a thought about them having some sort of DRM. Am I wrong here? How does Denuvo affect your playing experience?

 

[Shari]

Sorry guys, I just don't see this coming to PC......like any time soon.

Oh well then with those arguments we better close this thread, it's all there, what are you going to do.

And up there a user saying Sony didn't moneyhat this but first week sales are very important, so SE is shooting itself on the foot by delaying one version out of two and giving absolute 0 marketing for it all in benefit of Sony, because, you know, they're great pals.

Like, seriously people.

 

[tuxfool]

Wait, what? I though Denuvo was practically undetectable by a paying customer and only really a mild issue for people who perform multiple performance benchmarks per day. I played Doom and Deus Ex MD without even a thought about them having some sort of DRM. Am I wrong here? How does Denuvo affect your playing experience?

Mods, for example. Ultimately I don't begrudge them shipping with at release, provided they do what others are doing, which is to remove it after some time.

 

[SilentRob]

Projecting an awful lot there buddy

What's actually weird though is how gamers always try to shame fellow consumers into buying products?

Nobody here's calling for a boycott or w/e, all people are saying is that the game went down a bunch in the priorities list. If Squeenix wants that Sony money so badly then they get less customer money. If you want me to commit to buying a product day one, for a higher price, you better put in some work.

But...that's exactly what I'm finding hard to understand. I don't see how I am projecting o0 When I buy video games I simply look for what brings me the most entertainment, what I want to play the most. Just the concept of not actually buying the product you want to play the most because you feel slighted, thus keeping you from actually doing what you'd like to be doing just out of principle, ultimately only taking away fun from yourself. That's what I mean

I guess for me it's just a video game. It sucks they couldn't get it ready at the same time as the PS4 version. They probably didn't do it to shit on people. Either way: It has no bearing on how much I want to play the game.

It's just my personal perspective. There are a lot of people in this thread with another. That's also fine

Isn't it weirder to buy a game full priced at release to try and "help" a dev/publisher like they're your friend? If they want my money don't treat me like a second class citizen.

But I'm not talking about buying anything to help someone. I'm talking about buying something because you want to play it

 

[Zia]

This went from a Day 1 to a Summer Sale purchase for me (assuming there isn't some contrived six month exclusivity window placed on it and it's actually out by then... ). Fucking sick of these marketing deals and artificial delays... Capcom aside, it's like these Japanese publishers have learned absolutely nothing from the PC market these past few years.

 

[ViviOggi]

But...that's exactly what I'm finding hard to understand. I don't see how I am projecting o0 When I buy video games I simply look for what brings me the most entertainment, what I want to play the most. Just the concept of not actually buying the product you want to play the most because you feel slighted, thus keeping you from actually doing what you'd like to be doing just out of principle, ultimately only taking away fun from yourself. That's what I mean

I guess for me it's just a video game. It sucks they couldn't get it ready at the same time as the PS4 version. They probably didn't do it to shit on people. Either way: It has no bearing on how much I want to play the game.

It's just my personal perspective. There are a lot of people in this thread with another. That's also fine



But I'm not talking about buying anything to help someone. I'm talking about buying something because you want to play it

Like it just comes down to voting with your wallet against practices you disagree with, and priorities. It has nothing to do with betrayal, or seeing companies as friends - in fact I'd argue that core PC gamers are generally highly critical of gaming companies. And we sure as hell don't lack games nowadays, so this one can simply wait and even get cheaper in the process.

 

[FlutterPuffs]

If first week sales matter that much they should perhaps give people a chance to buy the game in the first week.

First week sales for the PC.

I just want the game to do well. Would love for Yoko Taro to get his dues.

 

[Ascheroth]

But...that's exactly what I'm finding hard to understand. I don't see how I am projecting o0 When I buy video games I simply look for what brings me the most entertainment, what I want to play the most. Just the concept of not actually buying the product you want to play the most because you feel slighted, thus keeping you from actually doing what you'd like to be doing just out of principle, ultimately only taking away fun from yourself. That's what I mean

I guess for me it's just a video game. It sucks they couldn't get it ready at the same time as the PS4 version. They probably didn't do it to shit on people. Either way: It has no bearing on how much I want to play the game.

It's just my personal perspective. There are a lot of people in this thread with another. That's also fine



But I'm not talking about buying anything to help someone. I'm talking about buying something because you want to play it

The 'problem' here is that there are more good games coming out all the time than anyone could ever buy and then you also have sales of other good games everywhere, so you have to prioritize your purchasing decisions.
It's not like "I'm not going to buy Nier and I'm not going to play anything, that will show 'em for sure", more like "guess I'll just buy this other game I really want to play instead and wait until Nier is cheaper".

SEs silence also doesn't allow one to plan ahead.

First week sales for the PC.

I just want the game to do well. Would love for Yoko Taro to get his dues.

His point still stands. They're already hurting first week PC sales with their silence and delay anyway.

 

[MUnited83]

Wait, what? I though Denuvo was practically undetectable by a paying customer and only really a mild issue for people who perform multiple performance benchmarks per day. I played Doom and Deus Ex MD without even a thought about them having some sort of DRM. Am I wrong here? How does Denuvo affect your playing experience?

Let's see:

It limits the type of modding you can do (anything that uses the .exe is a no-go)
It can limit other types of modding if devs hide other files behind the denuvo encryption
It regularly prevents you from playing offline
It requires online server checks. The day the denuvo server goes down, so does the ability of playing your games.



Meanwhile, let's look at the list of advantages that it gives me as a paying consumer:
-
-
-
-
-
-

 

[Pacotez]

Pirates hurt their business, which in turn hurts actual paying customers.

See:

One day devs will realize that the vast majority of people that pirate wouldn't buy your game in the first place.

Welp, I can only hope that whenever this game arrives the port turns out to be solid.

 

[Pacotez]

Isn't RE7 being pirated despite Denuvo mostly because of the demo? So they cracked the protection on the demo and that same crack just worked on the full release? If they just threw Denuvo on the game wouldn't it still take pirates months to crack like other Denuvo releases?

Knowing there will be a PC version at some point just eats into the PS4 sales because I want the game but won't get it on PS4 if a PC port is coming but also now I'll wait to see if the port is any good (because I'm waiting months anyway) and then might as well wait for a sale because all the hype and newness around the game is gone because of the PS4 release.

I hate all this "waaaah PC piracy" bullshit. Isn't The Witcher 3 a huge success and didn't it have a DRM free version from GoG?

nope. The system changed just like it changes between games. CPY already understands denuvo and is cracking it no problem.
New is Denuvo is strengthening its protection tho.

 

[gngf123]

edit: somehow posted in the wrong thread

 

[michaelius]

Prepare to eat some crow then. For the sake of all PC gamers and especially GhostTrick's account.

Most of Japanise side of SE stuff comes to pc with solid delay. To be honest I got no idea why anyone expected differently in this case.

 

[JaseC]

Most of Japanise side of SE stuff comes to pc with solid delay. To be honest I got no idea why anyone expected differently in this case.

I think this case is unique in that the PC version was announced before release. And again, Squeenix hasn't said that the game isn't coming next month; in fact, it hasn't said anything, which is why people suspect a marketing/temporary exclusivity deal.

 

[Ascheroth]

I think this case is unique in that the PC version was announced before release. And again, Squeenix hasn't said that the game isn't coming next month. It hasn't said anything, which is why people suspect a marketing/temporary exclusivity deal.

I am Setsuna was also announced before release.
And it was a simultaneous release

 

[JaseC]

I am Setsuna was also announced before release.
And it was a simultaneous release

Ah. "Rather unique", then.

 

[fvng]

If it made more sense, every publishers would do so:
They don't.
Why ? Because piracy hurting sales on PC is a long gone myth.
You actually lose more sales by delaying it, considering you're losing launch hype.

You do know that picture really isn't proving anythign you said, a DRM got cracked, so what? It really doesn't mean that piracy is rampant at all.

This has nothing to do with DRM. Niche games can perform well on PC, and have done so for for quite some time, in spite of piracy.

Literally nothing in this post indicates that RE7 didn't sell on PC due to piracy.

lets see


Day One release on both PS4 and PC = More sales and more money. This is a irrefutable fact.
Delayed PC release= Less sales, less money.


The impact is minimal either way. But you actively lose sales by delaying it.

The double dip thing caught me a couple times, but now they are probably losing more money on me with that than gaining. For anything with even the most remote possibility of getting a PC version, I wait to pick it up on consoles once it's dirt cheap. And even if they do release a late port, I'll often end up waiting for a sale, whereas if they had just done a day and date release I'd have possibly picked it up on day one.

It has decreased to the point it isn't an issue. Why is SE releasing a physical copy of the game? They are going to "lose" a lot more money on used copies than they will on pirated copies. I mean, hell, PSP piracy was worse than PC piracy is now, and they released a shit load of games for that.

According to an interview with Yosuke Saito(game producer) (can't find english interview) Main reason behind the delay is making sure "game is secured against piracy"(read: Denuvo) another part of the statement is that "it won't be released on the same day as PS4 but it shouldn't take much longer"

there you have it, piracy is the reason, as I stated earlier in this thread. just because it's an irrational response doesnt mean it's not a totally expected response from a paranoid publisher

 

[Spirited]

there you have it, piracy is the reason, as I stated earlier in this thread. just because it's an irrational response doesnt mean it's not a totally expected response from a paranoid publisher

if i was a game publisher i would stall out on a pc release too, since pc piracy is so rampant.

they'll make most of their money on ps4, and then release on pc because the impact of piracy would probably be negligible at that point.. but since they announced a pc release so early, it's going to create some sour grapes that we're already seeing in this thread

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/01/resident-evil-7s-denuvo-protections-cracked-in-under-a-week/

yeah ok guys i'm totally nuts, pc game piracy totally isn't a thing. whether or not the trend that pc piracy is decreasing is irrelevent, it's not something they'd want to deal with and I don't blame any publisher for waiting on a proper PC release.

You seriously trying to shame us by quoting our responses when the context is that you posted shit like this?

 

[fvng]

You seriously trying to shame us by quoting our responses when the context is that you posted shit like this?

the context of the quote is piracy concerns and I used that screenshot as an example of something that would put publishers in a panic. since you needed a reminder of the context, i'm happy to oblige

 

[Kintaro]

But I'm not talking about buying anything to help someone. I'm talking about buying something because you want to play it

They announced it for PC. I want to play it on PC. They went to delay me playing it, after announcing it day and date (then taking it back) because of a piracy excuse. Thus, treating me as a legit customer worse than other customers.

I want to play it. I don't need to play it. The difference between the sale and no sale is how I am treated. Really that simple. It's not like it will vanish. I can buy it years and years later when mother fucking Horizon and Zelda aren't looming over a niche RPG. =P

 

[Battlechili]

there you have it, piracy is the reason, as I stated earlier in this thread. just because it's an irrational response doesnt mean it's not a totally expected response from a paranoid publisher

There's no evidence that piracy is the reason
There is no source on that alleged interview where Saito says its piracy.
Just some reddit thread from a random poster.

 

[ezodagrom]

It regularly prevents you from playing offline
It requires online server checks

As far as I know, online re-activations with Denuvo are required on new installations of a game, when there's major hardware changes (limited to 4 a day), and when there's updates to a game.

So, Denuvo only prevents people from playing offline only if they haven't launched the game while online at least once after:
- the game was installed;
- the user did a major change to PC's hardware;
- the game got updated.

As an example, just launched Tales of Berseria with Steam in offline mode without any issue, and it's a Denuvo protected game.

 

[Spirited]

the context of the quote is piracy concerns and I used that screenshot as an example of something that would put publishers in a panic. since you needed a reminder of the context, i'm happy to oblige

if i was a game publisher i would stall out on a pc release too, since pc piracy is so rampant.

just because it's an irrational response doesnt mean it's not a totally expected response from a paranoid publisher

First you say you would do the same because the PC piracy is rampant and then you say that it is an expected irrational response from a paranoid publisher, I think you're actually happy about these news but try to play it off as you aggreing with us about how SE is out of touch. Going back and quoting eveyrone that responded to you earlier shows how smug you are about this.

 

[MUnited83]

the context of the quote is piracy concerns and I used that screenshot as an example of something that would put publishers in a panic. since you needed a reminder of the context, i'm happy to oblige

Panic? There wasn't any panic when 99.999999% of all other ports came without Denuvo and sold well, why there would be a panic now?

Mind you that even if it was true, it makes no sense either. Denuvo's version is no longer the same version used in RE7, and it won't be cracked in a week any ways.

As far as I know, online re-activations with Denuvo are required on new installations of a game, when there's major hardware changes (limited to 4 a day), and when there's updates to a game.

So, Denuvo only prevents people from playing offline only if they haven't launched the game while online at least once after:
- the game was installed;
- the user did a major change to PC's hardware;
- the game got updated.

As an example, just launched Tales of Berseria with Steam in offline mode without any issue, and it's a Denuvo protected game.

Try to spend some time in offline mode and you'll see that Denuvo will eventually prevent you from playing the game. It has periodic re-activations.

 

[NeoRaider]

I want this nightmare to finally end and please SE just say something!!

 

[Battlechili]

There's no evidence that piracy is the reason
There is no source on that alleged interview where Saito says its piracy.
Just some reddit thread from a random poster.

I must now correct myself
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/nier-automata-may-be-slightly-delayed-on-the-pc/

 

[UrbanRats]

"If we release it on PC, a portion of the audience may pirate it, instead of buying it, what can we do?"
"I got it! Let's not release it at all!"

Genius solution, unless they're on the cusp of discovering a magical uncrackable system that doesn't exist yet, of course.

 

[ezodagrom]

Try to spend some time in offline mode and you'll see that Denuvo will eventually prevent you from playing the game. It has periodic re-activations.

Isn't that caused by Steamworks' DRM?
Trying to search around, there's a 2 weeks limit for offline mode with Steamworks DRM apparently. Denuvo's main purpose is to make it so the underlying DRM (usually Steamworks on Steam games) can't be tampered with, after all.

 

[JaseC]

Isn't that caused by Steamworks' DRM?

That's just a common misunderstanding born from the erroneous belief Denuvo (the company) has cultivated that Denuvo (the software) isn't itself DRM but rather just piggybacks off the DRM native to the platform with which the game interacts. Steam has no DRM mechanism beyond tethering an executable to the client, which is entirely optional.

Trying to search around, there's a 2 weeks limit for offline mode with Steam's DRM apparently. Denuvo's main purpose is to make it so the underlying DRM (usually Steamworks on Steam games) can't be tampered with, after all.

That was a bug.

 

[MUnited83]

Isn't that caused by Steamworks' DRM?
Trying to search around, there's a 2 weeks limit for offline mode with Steamworks DRM apparently. Denuvo's main purpose is to make it so the underlying DRM (usually Steamworks on Steam games) can't be tampered with, after all.

Not at all. The only thing Steamworks DRM does is requiring the steam client to start, which is able to do even when offline. There wasn't ever a limit for offline mode with Steamworks. There was a bug, but that was fixed.

 

[ezodagrom]

That's just a common misunderstanding. Steam has no DRM mechanism beyond tethering an executable to the client, and even that is entirely optional.

That was a bug.

Oh, thank you for the correction.
Too much misinformation about Denuvo (both from those who defend it and those who are against), so kinda hard to know what is true. <-<;

 

[KimonoNoNo]

Sorry I just don't buy that excuse.

Square went quiet on the release date long before RE7 got cracked.

 

[SarusGray]

I was interested in this game but the disrespect towards PC gamers and not giving any information is silly. If Sony did put some money to make you silent about the PC version, maybe don't say anything about the PC version from the start. Now you just have a bunch of confused gamers who wanted to buy your game but now are hesitant. Jeez.

 

[Paragon]

As far as I know, online re-activations with Denuvo are required on new installations of a game, when there's major hardware changes (limited to 4 a day), and when there's updates to a game.

New releases using Denuvo tend to push out small <100KB updates three or four times a week for at least the first month to force reactivation.
The updates are small enough that they basically happen instantly, but that forces reactivation the next time you try to launch the game.
Games like DOOM were forcing reactivation every time you switched between OpenGL and Vulkan modes.
Actually, I believe Vulkan mode required reactivation on every launch in the initial patch.

I have zero interest in pirating games, but I've been caught out by Denuvo activation at least a dozen times. It even happened with the RE7 demo.
I've often run into situations where my internet was down and I decided to load up a game to pass the time - only to find that I couldn't because of Denuvo.

What happens a few years from now if Denuvo are no longer in business, the servers are unavailable, and games remain uncracked?
Additionally, older games often need you to modify the executable; e.g. modding in widescreen/ultrawide support, which Denuvo can prevent.

 

[fvng]

There's no evidence that piracy is the reason
There is no source on that alleged interview where Saito says its piracy.
Just some reddit thread from a random poster.

Seems legit to me

https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/comme...ium=user&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage

 

[ezodagrom]

New releases using Denuvo tend to push out small <100KB updates three or four times a week for at least the first month to force reactivation.
The updates are small enough that they basically happen instantly, but that forces reactivation the next time you try to launch the game.
Games like DOOM were forcing reactivation every time you switched between OpenGL and Vulkan modes.
Actually, I believe Vulkan mode required reactivation on every launch in the initial patch.

I have zero interest in pirating games, but I've been caught out by Denuvo activation at least a dozen times. It even happened with the RE7 demo.
I've often run into situations where my internet was down and I decided to load up a game to pass the time - only to find that I couldn't because of Denuvo.

What happens a few years from now if Denuvo are no longer in business, the servers are unavailable, and games remain uncracked?
Additionally, older games often need you to modify the executable; e.g. modding in widescreen/ultrawide support, which Denuvo can prevent.

Yeah, that's the main worry about Denuvo, what'll happen if Denuvo's servers ever end up being unavailable.
Wish publishers would remove Denuvo from their games like 6 to 12 months after release, kinda like DOOM.

I guess at least it's not as bad as securom and such? <-<;

Modding wise, Denuvo hasn't prevented Kaldaien from modding Tales of Berseria at least, which includes framepacing improvements, increasing shadows and post processing resolution, performance improvements and a bunch of other stuff.

 

[Mifec]

New releases using Denuvo tend to push out small <100KB updates three or four times a week for at least the first month to force reactivation.
The updates are small enough that they basically happen instantly, but that forces reactivation the next time you try to launch the game.
Games like DOOM were forcing reactivation every time you switched between OpenGL and Vulkan modes.
Actually, I believe Vulkan mode required reactivation on every launch in the initial patch.

I have zero interest in pirating games, but I've been caught out by Denuvo activation at least a dozen times. It even happened with the RE7 demo.
I've often run into situations where my internet was down and I decided to load up a game to pass the time - only to find that I couldn't because of Denuvo.

What happens a few years from now if Denuvo are no longer in business, the servers are unavailable, and games remain uncracked?
Additionally, older games often need you to modify the executable; e.g. modding in widescreen/ultrawide support, which Denuvo can prevent.

Happened to me too when I tried playing MGS5 offline.

 

[spannicus]

Will release in 6 months to a year after ps4 sales have died down a bit.

 

[lukeskymac]

It's probably cancelled.

If it was, you'd think they would confirm it before the PS4 release. If I hold out from buying the PS4 version because I'm waiting for the PC one and they admit it's not gonna happen when the game's already discounted, they'll have lost money from me.

 

[Mifec]

Will release in 6 months to a year after ps4 sales have died down a bit.

Releasing at $30 then.

 

[MUnited83]

Modding wise, Denuvo hasn't prevented Kaldaien from modding Tales of Berseria at least, which includes framepacing improvements, increasing shadows and post processing resolution, performance improvements and a bunch of other stuff.

That's more on luck than Denuvo. As an example, Kaldaien stopped trying to make a 60fps mod for Symphonia because of a DRM that operates similarly to Denuvo.

 

[iavi]

Squeenix is so trash with their handling of PC ports. Unless it's ol Eidos, we don't usually hear about the PC releases until a SteamDB leak, and even then the dates are always floating.

 

[TGO]

Prepare to eat some crow then. For the sake of all PC gamers and especially GhostTrick's account.

Well never say never, I just don't see it coming until atleast holidays 2017 maybe later.

 

[Izuna]

Wait, are you telling me that this might not happen?

:S

 

[Clear]

Releasing at $30 then.

Making less revenue per unit sold likely isn't a great incentive for publishers to support the PC platform in future.

Units shifted makes for nice PR, but revenue generated is what counts. Most importantly you can't rely on a volume sales model when the product itself has a somewhat niche appeal in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Sakujou]

It's really baffling how a publisher can announce a version for a game and then go completly silent about it. And it doesn't seems to be related to developpement troubles considering the game is developped with that platform in mind first according to the game producer and developpement is going smoothly according to Platinum Games' employee.

Can't Square-Enix adress this once and for all ? Cause I got 60 bucks to use on pre-order

Spoiler

and also to appease the wrath of a certain mod, who seeks to appease him/herself with a sacrifice if the game is delayed :")

More serious question, when's the next event in West Square Enix may potentially talk about the game before release ?

you pre-ordered something with no release date, what is your problem?
sony has the exclusive rights, square never promised anything except that the game will come to pc. they never said when. so i dont see a problem. its a japanese game, and the first will hit consoles before any other platforms.

 

[MUnited83]

you pre-ordered something with no release date, what is your problem?
sony has the exclusive rights, square never promised anything except that the game will come to pc. they never said when. so i dont see a problem. its a japanese game, and the first will hit consoles before any other platforms.

Actually, they did say when.