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STARCRAFT 2 ZERG Announcement Thread

Minsc

Minsc

Gold Member
Atilac said:
Whats the pop cap? and will there be hero units.
Click to expand...

Population caps are going to be the same as Starcraft 1, 200 per side and 8 player online, according to Blizzard's Q&As. No hero units, I hate them from WC3. Good riddance, they can rot in the lowest corners of hell.

And then rip them in half, and toss them in a shredder and incinerate them. Inside a large tank of poisonous gas with piranas.

Victrix said:
I'm kind of annoyed with Bliz's presentation of this. I mean, I'm sure HD vids will be up at some point, but wtf didn't they have this stuff ready to roll right out of the gate?

Instead, tons of tardly shaky cam footage up on youtube. Just seems strange, particularly from Bliz of all companies, lords of high production values and hype.
Click to expand...

I thought this too... but what's the point of going to the conference if they just have HD streams out within a day?
 
M

Mumei

Member
Atilac said:
They were a step forward. They added more strategy and altered mission structure. Not having them is a step back.
Click to expand...

They were a step forward in single-player, and a step backward in multiplayer as far as play-balancing goes.

Given that, I hope that we see unique units / unit models with unique abilities for some of the major characters (e.g. Kerrigan, Raynor, Zeratul, etc.) in StarCraft II's campaign mode, but none of those units appearing in multiplayer.
 
I

IzumiK

Banned
Victrix said:
I'm kind of annoyed with Bliz's presentation of this. I mean, I'm sure HD vids will be up at some point, but wtf didn't they have this stuff ready to roll right out of the gate?

Instead, tons of tardly shaky cam footage up on youtube. Just seems strange, particularly from Bliz of all companies, lords of high production values and hype.
Click to expand...
Blizzard never intended it to be shown at all until it goes up on Starcraft2.com. So what's your point?

They should break all cameras and strip search every Korean?
 
V

Victrix

*beard*
IzumiK said:
Blizzard never intended it to be shown at all until it goes up on Starcraft2.com. So what's your point?

They should break all cameras and strip search every Korean?
Click to expand...

How about realize it's going to be online within 2 seconds of the presentation and pre-empt it?
 
R

rezuth

Member
Atilac said:
really? Blizzard taking a step back?
Click to expand...
Even if its a step back, it still is a step in the right direction! That is all that matters.

IzumiK said:
Blizzard never intended it to be shown at all until it goes up on Starcraft2.com. So what's your point?

They should break all cameras and strip search every Korean?
Click to expand...
How about serving the community?
 
Minsc

Minsc

Gold Member
All I can find is the Hydralisk/Mutalisk. Pretty confusing website too, but I've never been very impressed with blizzard's sites.
 
I

IzumiK

Banned
Atilac said:
They were a step forward. They added more strategy and altered mission structure. Not having them is a step back.
Click to expand...
Didn't see this when replying this morning.

But it's not a step back or forwards or anything, it is simply a step in a different direction. But in the case of Starcraft, it will be a huge step back. If they based the gameplay around heroes, then Starcraft would just turn into another "kill the creep" race like Warcraft 3 and entirely based on micro management.

You should watch the Koreans play and how they macro and micro manage their game. If it was all about one unit with a low pop cap, they wouldn't need to build like 4 barracks or do fast expansions and scouting. It would just be an xp race to reach level 10. But Starcraft is about speed, economic management, sacrificing to gain momentum, and the little micromanagement tricks that help win the game.
 
Minsc

Minsc

Gold Member
The major problem with the WC3 heroes is they were really imbalanced. If I had to fight against someone with a fast one, and they got artifacts that made that hero even faster, I stood no chance. It was like their hero could simply run circles around everything.

I really found the whole imbalance between high level heroes and low level heroes annoying too. In general the heroes took away a lot of strategy I thought, because the game literally became solely about getting your hero to level faster than your opponents. As soon as there was a large enough gap between the heroes' levels, the game was over.

I guess it's just not my idea of how a RTS should be.

Edit: hero, heroes
 
H

hauton

Member
Minsc said:
Good riddance, they can rot in the lowest corners of hell.

And then rip them in half, and toss them in a shredder and incinerate them. Inside a large tank of poisonous gas with piranas.
Click to expand...
QFT.
 
I

IzumiK

Banned
Minsc said:
The major problem with the WC3 heros is they were really imbalanced. If I had to fight against someone with a fast one, and they got artifacts that made that hero even faster, I stood no chance. It was like their hero could simply run circles around everything.

I really found the whole imbalance between high level heroes and low level heroes annoying too. In general, the heroes took away a lot of strategy I thought, because the game literally became solely about getting your hero to level faster than your opponents. As soon as there was a large enough gap between the hero's levels, the game was over.

I guess it's just not my idea of how a RTS should be.
Click to expand...
In a way, it's like WoW. :lol

Epiced out 70s will win against not so epic 70s and definitely anything below 69. WC3 is just an XP race and making sure your hero survives and is involved in every battle.
 
F

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
Victrix said:
How about realize it's going to be online within 2 seconds of the presentation and pre-empt it?
Click to expand...

You are thinking the wrong way. Now we are discussing shaky cam footage for 3 days. Then comes the proper footage and we will discuss this again also. Twice the attention for the same stuff.

It's true. :D
 
T

Tr4nce

Member
Awesome stuff. Although I rarely played Zerg, it's a very interesting race with it's own cool units and myths. Can't wait to play this sucker.
 
Z

Zzoram

Member
Atilac said:
They were a step forward. They added more strategy and altered mission structure. Not having them is a step back.
Click to expand...

Heroes were a huge step back in competitive multiplayer. It was too hard to balance all the heroes properly, and they've still never quite fixed things.

Starcraft 2's engine will feature leveling heroes like Warcraft 3, but not in competitive multiplayer. They will be available for custom map creation, and potentially in the campaign, but not in normal melee matches. Don't worry, DOTAII will happen.
 
A

aznpxdd

Member
Proelite said:
Damn it, how are they going to make Dota II without hero mechanics in the game! :(
Click to expand...

Blizzard already said anything that's possible in the War3's campaign editor is possible in SC2's, so don't worry. Actually, a lot of people specifically asked if Dota is possible in SC2, and they said yes plus more.
 
X

Xeke

Banned
Atilac said:
They were a step forward. They added more strategy and altered mission structure. Not having them is a step back.
Click to expand...

I don't want XP and inventories in my RTS games. Sorry.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
aznpxdd said:
Blizzard already said anything that's possible in the War3's campaign editor is possible in SC2's, so don't worry. Actually, a lot of people specifically asked if Dota is possible in SC2, and they said yes plus more.
Click to expand...

Awesome.
 
Z

Zzoram

Member
TurtleSnatcher said:
Wow.. its like the game is done in some of that video.

Hawt!

DO WANT
Click to expand...

The game is essentially done. Right now they are just tweaking the unit/building graphics (note how the zerglings seem to have lost their long white wings), and balancing the gameplay. The campaign is a work in progress as well, mainly because the unit balancing hasn't been finished yet, but they know what they're doing with the story.
 
O

Opiate

Member
Zzoram said:
Heroes were a huge step back in competitive multiplayer. It was too hard to balance all the heroes properly, and they've still never quite fixed things.

Starcraft 2's engine will feature leveling heroes like Warcraft 3, but not in competitive multiplayer. They will be available for custom map creation, and potentially in the campaign, but not in normal melee matches. Don't worry, DOTAII will happen.
Click to expand...

Heroes were also an important distinguishing feature between Warcraft and Starcraft, and it was a conscious choice.

In earlier years (pre WC III), Warcraft and Starcraft essentially played the same, but one was in space and one had wizards. I specifically remember hearing a Blizzard guy say they went for a smaller, single unit focused game with WC III, and that they will go for larger scale battles with multiple units in SC II, in order to give each franchise a specific feel that differentiates it.
 
I

IzumiK

Banned
aznpxdd said:
Blizzard already said anything that's possible in the War3's campaign editor is possible in SC2's, so don't worry. Actually, a lot of people specifically asked if Dota is possible in SC2, and they said yes plus more.
Click to expand...
It's possible that they might let you create your own abilities but using the graphics of unit abilities. But SC2 Dota might be a bit hard since WC3 had a lot of hero abilities. I don't think SC2 will have that much.

SexConker said:
Not liking the art style of the zerg.
Too Warcraft-like.
(See zerglings & fel hounds)
Click to expand...
You mean the other way around right? Because Starcraft was here before Warcraft 3, felhounds debut. The zergling always looked like that so I don't know what you're thinking really.
 
Z

Zzoram

Member
IzumiK said:
It's possible that they might let you create your own abilities but using the graphics of unit abilities. But SC2 Dota might be a bit hard since WC3 had a lot of hero abilities. I don't think SC2 will have that much.


You mean the other way around right? Because Starcraft was here before Warcraft 3, felhounds debut. The zergling always looked like that so I don't know what you're thinking really.
Click to expand...

You're assuming they don't just build in all the hero spells/items from WC3 for the SC2 map editor database.
 
Proelite

Proelite

Member
SexConker said:
Not liking the art style of the zerg.
Too Warcraft-like.
(See zerglings & fel hounds)
Click to expand...

I concur. Blizzard needs to replace some of the art staff since a lot of the units look they were designed by an amature. I.E. Seige tanks, lurkers, and the new infestors.

Case in point. The god awful Mecha concept art.
ss47-hires.jpg
 
A

aznpxdd

Member
Just a concept art, not like the Thor looks anything close to that in-game. But yeah, some of zerg's new units look pretty meh...but I suppose zerg is still pretty early in development (as far as units and designs go). Blizzard is constantly tweaking and changing the units, I mean, they aren't even done with terran and toss yet. Plus, If there's enough bitching online about a particular unit, Blizzard will change it (like the did with the tank).
 
E

Ether_Snake

安安安安安安安安安安安安安安安
Hey will you be able to move around in a room like they showed the Terran character do, even if you chose Zergs?
 
P

proposition

Banned
IzumiK said:
It's possible that they might let you create your own abilities but using the graphics of unit abilities. But SC2 Dota might be a bit hard since WC3 had a lot of hero abilities. I don't think SC2 will have that much.
Click to expand...
Couldn't mappers just script it? Aren't most of those maps already running lots of custom scripts anyway?
 
A

aznpxdd

Member
Ether_Snake said:
Hey will you be able to move around in a room like they showed the Terran character do, even if you chose Zergs?
Click to expand...

I doubt it, they said the adventure style gameplay between missions is only for the Terran (since it obviously wouldn't make sense for Z & P). They said Zerg and Protoss's campaign will be completely different from Terran, can't wait to see what they have instore for the SP.
 
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