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Suicide is Selfish
- Thread starter Devolution
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As someone who had an ex who dealt with depression and always talked about taking her own life I never said it was a selfish thing to do but, that there is a better way of going about it. Also as someone who thought of offing myself at a point in my life because of the issues in my own life I understand the stress of depression and the toll it has on a person. I could call it selfish because you're effecting many people who are close to you in your life but, how fair is it to keep yourself in a place that feels like torture everyday of your life too keep a few people happy? This is why It's hard for me to say it's selfish. People who do usually won't understand because they are happy in there life or just don't care to think about what that other person is going through in there life.
I can think of very few instances where suicide is not selfish and cowardly. Unless you can find a case where the suicide affects no one else then I cannot fathom how suicide cannot be selfish and/or cowardly.
I've posted a thread here in the past when someone who I knew committed suicide here.
^^^
In the case above...the mother and child are living with grandparents now...who are kind of supporting her and the child. Having spoken to her a couple of times now you can visibly see she's not in a good place even though she's had counselling and support.
I've posted a thread here in the past when someone who I knew committed suicide here.
^^^
In the case above...the mother and child are living with grandparents now...who are kind of supporting her and the child. Having spoken to her a couple of times now you can visibly see she's not in a good place even though she's had counselling and support.
Your perspective is based purely on personal anecdote and is wildly incomplete. I can just as easily characterize your chronic physical pain as laughable compared to severe emotional pain. Your physical pain is a joke. For babies. Take some pills and deal with it, pussy. Why are you even bringing it up? Sympathy plea? Fucking coward.
You wouldn't care much for being told those things, right? Because presumably you've gone through a lot and you're still here. Well then.
GrandHarrier
Member
The only thought I have on suicide is one phrase: "Suicide is a permanent solution to all of your temporary problems."
When I was 12 years old my Dad commited suicide.. I fucking hated him for it. I thought he was a selfish person, not thinking about his kids and only thought of himself.
Now 26 years later I have kids myself, and a family of my own. I wish I could show him my beautiful family and see him together with them.. but you know what..? it´s me who is selfish here, not him.. He did what he thought was the right thing for him at the time. He had suffered enough, life wasn´t easy for him anymore. He did what he found right and what he thought was the only way he could end his suffering.
I hate myself for ever thinking like I did, but I was a kid.. life goes on, and I´m proud to be his son.
Now 26 years later I have kids myself, and a family of my own. I wish I could show him my beautiful family and see him together with them.. but you know what..? it´s me who is selfish here, not him.. He did what he thought was the right thing for him at the time. He had suffered enough, life wasn´t easy for him anymore. He did what he found right and what he thought was the only way he could end his suffering.
I hate myself for ever thinking like I did, but I was a kid.. life goes on, and I´m proud to be his son.
N
NinjaFridge
Unconfirmed Member
way more
Member
I always thought that was a silly thing to say. A permanent solution to your problems sounds fantastic. "I don't need to shovel the snow ever again! What a lovely idea!"
They need to come up with a better phrase.
What's the point of living at all? If someone had an awesome life great friends career family etc so be it let them live. If someone has a crappy life when everything goes wrong no friends dead end job and evey choice is wrong what's the point to continue this existence. Things do not get better for everyone so there is no guarantee that it will get better. Personally I'd rather not have been born. There isn't anything in this life for me. Who wants to be a loser for the rest of your life?
At least it's a solution that works.
At least it's a solution that works.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
If there are no losers in society, how will the winners know that they are winning?
Makes you wonder if there could ever be a truly egalitarian society.
If not inequality when it comes to material wealth, I'm certain there'll be inequality when it comes to social status.
GrandHarrier
Member
Probably is. I don't actually say or use it in practice. But it's how I feel.
I have a roomate who has, and on occasion does, struggle with suicidal thoughts due to a essentially permanent disability that causes pain, coupled with the psychological distress of having been (honorably) discharged from the Navy over it. They are in an OK place now, but it feels like a constant struggle to keep him positive. He goes to therapy for both aspects, but I struggle to relate and understand. I do try though and he has on occasion remarked that our steadfast friendship helps.
Like the hat?
Banned
I don't think it's selfish, I think it's just sad. Sad that people reach a point where they feel like it's their only option.
I'd be lying if I said I haven't though about it many times. In all honesty if I didn't have my wife and kids, I wouldn't be around right now.
I'd be lying if I said I haven't though about it many times. In all honesty if I didn't have my wife and kids, I wouldn't be around right now.
I've been on both sides of this. I became suicidal after someone took his life. It was a complicated situation to say the least. I had abusive and passive parents so depression was my middle name for the better part of 30 years. That unimaginable pain when he committed that act was my breaking point and I couldn't handle anything in my life anymore. My worthless parents made things worse. I bought tons and tons of books to learn what was wrong and how I could fix it. I am the most nonviolent person out there. I wouldn't hurt a fly. The situation however was so bad, also with this economy that I started to have homicidal thoughts too. This one thing prevented me from professional help because I didn't want to be put in a cuckoo bin. So I had to isolate myself further, and take more abuse from my family. Books and forums were all I had in every sense od the word.
The only reason I'm alive today is because I'm stubborn as a mule. That's literally it. While you could easily argue mine was shit to beginwith, that destroyed three families. At some point you have to make decisions, and I'm still unhappy about his. Six years lost, and I didn't have a good deck to beginwith.
It is a shitty perspective, but to those who are feeling the brunt of it, its impossible not to, and takes ungodly amounts of either time or therapy to fix. So sorry, but not really, if I've burst anyones bubble here.
At some point I'm sure I'll both feel bad and sorry, but some of us are literally not equipped for that level of pain because the deck is stacked against us.
The only reason I'm alive today is because I'm stubborn as a mule. That's literally it. While you could easily argue mine was shit to beginwith, that destroyed three families. At some point you have to make decisions, and I'm still unhappy about his. Six years lost, and I didn't have a good deck to beginwith.
It is a shitty perspective, but to those who are feeling the brunt of it, its impossible not to, and takes ungodly amounts of either time or therapy to fix. So sorry, but not really, if I've burst anyones bubble here.
At some point I'm sure I'll both feel bad and sorry, but some of us are literally not equipped for that level of pain because the deck is stacked against us.
I rather not play this game of life. I don't care who wins or loses I want out of it.
And I hope there is no afterlife I don't want that either.
Tesseract
Banned
that's fair enough, guess we'll agree to disagree what constitutes torment, how it's set, scaled and so forth. i'm touch and go re: mental anguish, shouldn't have called it babyish. i'd never call it laughable or anything nasty, apologies if that's how i came across. i deserve a good licking for my arrogance.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Cheer up, there are other moves to make than participating or quitting. I'm partial to just doing my own thing, makes everything so much more enjoyable.
Depends on how you view your life and who it belongs to. I definitely think that you don't own your life completely to yourself and thence have a responsibility to the people who love you, friends, family.
Person A is part of a family of 5. Person A supports the family. The family consists of Person A and his/her four kids. They have no other family.
Person B lives by him-/herself. He/she has a mother and father, but they are old. No friends or personal relations other than the parents.
They are the same age, the same person, in different situations, suffer from the same anxiety and depression. It has to be recognized here that Person A has a greater responsibility to people around him, both emotionally and financially. Of course Person B might also have a emotional responsibility to his/her parents, one could argue it's not as great as the responsibility that lies upon Person A.
When one has concluded that these responsibilities exist, and must also draw the conclusion that this responsibility lies upon every person out there, but in differing degrees. I guess also to what degree the person is suffering should be counted in. When discussing if the person can have justification to commit suicide. I strongly stand by the the thought that a concious being does not own him-/herself fully.
Person A is part of a family of 5. Person A supports the family. The family consists of Person A and his/her four kids. They have no other family.
Person B lives by him-/herself. He/she has a mother and father, but they are old. No friends or personal relations other than the parents.
They are the same age, the same person, in different situations, suffer from the same anxiety and depression. It has to be recognized here that Person A has a greater responsibility to people around him, both emotionally and financially. Of course Person B might also have a emotional responsibility to his/her parents, one could argue it's not as great as the responsibility that lies upon Person A.
When one has concluded that these responsibilities exist, and must also draw the conclusion that this responsibility lies upon every person out there, but in differing degrees. I guess also to what degree the person is suffering should be counted in. When discussing if the person can have justification to commit suicide. I strongly stand by the the thought that a concious being does not own him-/herself fully.
I NEED SCISSORS
Banned
I agree that it's wrong to call it selfish. However, I feel that this other attitude of "they can do what they want because it's their life" is equally harmful. While technically correct, it stands directly at odds with the notion of helping those who need our help. I've also been reading a lot of replies correctly identifying that it's an often irrational decision, and the danger with that "it's their life" nugget is that I fear it could give some inkling of rationality to the whole act and spur it on more. I just think there is a huge contradiction in both respecting it yet at the same time trying to prevent it...
way more
Member
Not all suicides are selfish but many are.
Let me tell you a story from my own life.
My uncle and his wife had two kids when they were young, a boy and a girl. The wife died of cancer when the kids were 9 and 10 years old. So all relatives rallied around this family to help out with EVERYTHING. Money, cleaning, washing, cooking, you name it.
He never said anything about him feeling bad or beeing depressed, even when asked directly about it.
His brother took a year of from work _and_ moved across the country to be there.
On the day the girl turned 11 she and two of her friends came home from school and found him hanging from the closet door in a noose made out of ties.
He left a note saying "I have gone to be with your mother, dont be mad. And Fredrik (Uncle), it feels good to leave them in such capable hands, i know you will raise them better than i would"
The letter was much longer but thats the gist of it.
Lets fast forward to 2 years ago.
The daughter is 25 years old and is studying on a university. We knew she had been depressed but she assured us that it was over and she was looking forward. Then one day she doesn´t show up for a cup of coffe her and her best friend had every thursday. Friend had a key to the apartment, and you can guess the rest.
Her letter said loads of stuff but it ended with the awesome : "If father can, so can I!"
MAN FUCK THAT!
Now the littlebrother is the sweetest guy and a rock mentally so im not worried about him. He and i talked last week and he said something that resonated with me :
"I would have preffered if they died from cancer, or in a car accident, hell i would have prefferd if they were murdered. Because then it wouldnt have been a choice. Now they chose to leave me here alone"
There is not a person in the world that can tell me that this is not selfish with a straight face.
If you bring kids to this world, it is your damn responsibility to see it through. The only time that a suicide can be defended in this case is if it stands between hurting the kid or ending your own life.
Now i do make a diffrence in people telling all their relatives and friends that "I do not want to live anymore" and then ending their life on some clinic in switzerland, and the people that "SURPRISE!! IM DEAD!". Fuck that shit
Let me tell you a story from my own life.
My uncle and his wife had two kids when they were young, a boy and a girl. The wife died of cancer when the kids were 9 and 10 years old. So all relatives rallied around this family to help out with EVERYTHING. Money, cleaning, washing, cooking, you name it.
He never said anything about him feeling bad or beeing depressed, even when asked directly about it.
His brother took a year of from work _and_ moved across the country to be there.
On the day the girl turned 11 she and two of her friends came home from school and found him hanging from the closet door in a noose made out of ties.
He left a note saying "I have gone to be with your mother, dont be mad. And Fredrik (Uncle), it feels good to leave them in such capable hands, i know you will raise them better than i would"
The letter was much longer but thats the gist of it.
Lets fast forward to 2 years ago.
The daughter is 25 years old and is studying on a university. We knew she had been depressed but she assured us that it was over and she was looking forward. Then one day she doesn´t show up for a cup of coffe her and her best friend had every thursday. Friend had a key to the apartment, and you can guess the rest.
Her letter said loads of stuff but it ended with the awesome : "If father can, so can I!"
MAN FUCK THAT!
Now the littlebrother is the sweetest guy and a rock mentally so im not worried about him. He and i talked last week and he said something that resonated with me :
"I would have preffered if they died from cancer, or in a car accident, hell i would have prefferd if they were murdered. Because then it wouldnt have been a choice. Now they chose to leave me here alone"
There is not a person in the world that can tell me that this is not selfish with a straight face.
If you bring kids to this world, it is your damn responsibility to see it through. The only time that a suicide can be defended in this case is if it stands between hurting the kid or ending your own life.
Now i do make a diffrence in people telling all their relatives and friends that "I do not want to live anymore" and then ending their life on some clinic in switzerland, and the people that "SURPRISE!! IM DEAD!". Fuck that shit
No worries. It's just important to stress that we haven't lived each other's lives, and probably shouldn't be too quick to judge how we each cope with our burdens. I wasn't seriously suggesting the harsh words directed your way, just putting you on the receiving end of some of the sentiments you were projecting toward others to make a point.
LanceVance
Member
I don't really have a problem with people committing suicide if they feel it's their only option. However I hate when people commit suicide in a public place. For example jumping off a bridge into oncoming traffic, running in front of a train etc. It causes a lot of trauma for those that have to see it. I have a friend who's dad used to be a train driver, then someone ran in front of his train and killed themselves and he's had a lot of psychological problems, couldn't drive a train again and had to quit his job that he loved to do.
Not me. No, i don't say that.
I understand what makes one want oblivion.
Saying that it is "selfish" is just dismissing the issue behind it.
If it is so "selfish", then perhaps the one saying that could start thinking whether not-wondering-if-someone-has-problems-nor-doing-anything-to-help-attitude is selfish.
(Example: my mother. Her reaction to me being depressed, to a quite dangerous point: "go to therapy", and then forgetting all about this. I really don't like her.)
Do you not see how the father was afraid that he would hurt his own children?
Edit: I am in no way condoning his actions but it looks like his depression made him fear that he would take his children down with him if he continued.
daninthemix
Member
Well, sure, I doubt there are many cases where it wouldn't negatively affect someone else, thereby making it selfish.
But do you not think that if a person is in the position to give up everything and the possibility of everything, that affecting a few other people (on a scale of inconveniencing them to causing deep, ongoing pain) is going to make someone change their mind?
Consider this: should someone suffer pain/anguish indefinitely just to avoid hurting/inconveniencing others?
And what about situations where someone considers themself a burden upon the one/ones that love them in life? They consider that the temporary pain of losing them will be outweighed by what would be a burden that never ends.
And of course, whether someone is/isn't a burden, and to what degree their death will/won't affect others is entirely different from case to case, and will be perceived differently from one person to another.
There really is no blanket answer here, as one person's suffering and perception of their outcome is entirely unique to them.
But do you not think that if a person is in the position to give up everything and the possibility of everything, that affecting a few other people (on a scale of inconveniencing them to causing deep, ongoing pain) is going to make someone change their mind?
Consider this: should someone suffer pain/anguish indefinitely just to avoid hurting/inconveniencing others?
And what about situations where someone considers themself a burden upon the one/ones that love them in life? They consider that the temporary pain of losing them will be outweighed by what would be a burden that never ends.
And of course, whether someone is/isn't a burden, and to what degree their death will/won't affect others is entirely different from case to case, and will be perceived differently from one person to another.
There really is no blanket answer here, as one person's suffering and perception of their outcome is entirely unique to them.
gutter_trash
Banned
mental illness is a real health concern which is usually a taboo subject matter and society doesn't know how to deal with the problem.
It is way too easy to say '' you selfish '', lots of people suffer from various mental illness and these people need help and treatment.
It is way too easy to say '' you selfish '', lots of people suffer from various mental illness and these people need help and treatment.
AlimNassor
Banned
People considering suicide are not mentally sound. They don't need to be told they're horrible people, they need help.
First thing that came to mind when I saw thread title.
I've been trought depression too, and had suicidal thoughts as well, as did many of my closest friends. Yes, suicide's selfishness depends a lot on the situation (see also: euthanasia). And yes, there's a growing number of people on the Internet whose only intent is to feel morally superior to others based on no-effort type of lyfestyles, as if "not having suicidal thoughts" or "I drive an hybrid" would be some kind of paragon of moral upstanding and life accomplishement.
But that being said: Society do not need to be more tolerant to suicide. Period. There's something that you really do NOT need when you are depressed: validation for your own depressed or suicidal thoughts. The whole "everyone should be accepted as they are, noone's sensible ego should ever be harmed" type of post modern relativist thinking is far more harmful than people realize, even if it is done with a "feel good" intention.
Love and empathy are not the same as acceptance and siding, not even remotely close. Think of depression as obesity, so to speak: feeling "content with yourself" on these situations is not acceptable, and you are not actually making any kind of favour to people by telling them that they "have the right", so to speak.
Keep in mind that while one person does not obviously just "snap out" of depression and that they don't need any help to feel worse, in order to get out of it and start to recieve treatment, you need to at the very least:
1 - Understand that you have, indeed a problem. Listening "The problem are just your circumstances" or "it is a normal thing" is not going to help you.
2- Understand that you need to be willing to change. Listening "You are perfectly right as you are" or "normality is just a convention, this is your new normal" is not going to help you either.
Some people are more afraid of change that death itself, and I am not being my hyperbolic self here. Depression does have a lot do with that type of personal paralysis. As many people have said that here before, the whole "killing yourself is selfish" is just another way of saying "fucking please do not kill yourself, since you add a lot to this world, it is not alright", albeit stated in a horribly misguided manner. Making people realize of these things without coming off like a patronizing asshole is a marvellous skill which I wish I could possess, but it has nothing to do with being more tolerant towards suicide.
But that being said: Society do not need to be more tolerant to suicide. Period. There's something that you really do NOT need when you are depressed: validation for your own depressed or suicidal thoughts. The whole "everyone should be accepted as they are, noone's sensible ego should ever be harmed" type of post modern relativist thinking is far more harmful than people realize, even if it is done with a "feel good" intention.
Love and empathy are not the same as acceptance and siding, not even remotely close. Think of depression as obesity, so to speak: feeling "content with yourself" on these situations is not acceptable, and you are not actually making any kind of favour to people by telling them that they "have the right", so to speak.
Keep in mind that while one person does not obviously just "snap out" of depression and that they don't need any help to feel worse, in order to get out of it and start to recieve treatment, you need to at the very least:
1 - Understand that you have, indeed a problem. Listening "The problem are just your circumstances" or "it is a normal thing" is not going to help you.
2- Understand that you need to be willing to change. Listening "You are perfectly right as you are" or "normality is just a convention, this is your new normal" is not going to help you either.
Some people are more afraid of change that death itself, and I am not being my hyperbolic self here. Depression does have a lot do with that type of personal paralysis. As many people have said that here before, the whole "killing yourself is selfish" is just another way of saying "fucking please do not kill yourself, since you add a lot to this world, it is not alright", albeit stated in a horribly misguided manner. Making people realize of these things without coming off like a patronizing asshole is a marvellous skill which I wish I could possess, but it has nothing to do with being more tolerant towards suicide.
It is selfish. If you have a family, friends and loved ones the only thing suicide brings is sadness and pain to the ones who loved you while you take the easy way out.
But of course this is hypothetic because I see no reason why anybody would even consider suicidewhen they would have any of those.
But of course this is hypothetic because I see no reason why anybody would even consider suicidewhen they would have any of those.
One of the most idiotic ideas associated with suicide. All it does is serve to trivialize the pain someone is going through (just like the usual comparisons to physical pain, to "real" pain, and the references to suicide being "cowardly"). It's pretty obvious what this is going for on paper, and it's a good idea (on paper), but terrible and insulting in execution.
Red Liquorice
Member
It is possibly selfish, since it can leave a lot of unanswered questions and the friends and family grieving obviously. So it's selfish in some ways, so what - a lot of decisions in life are made selfishly, we are selfish beings.
But as for it being the cowards way out, I would say certainly not - it takes a lot of balls to put a final full stop on life not knowing what if anything happens next. Not leaving it up to fate, age or disease but making a decision yourself to stop. That's a hugely difficult decision to make, so all this "permanent solution to a temp problem" crap is the platitude that I find most eyeroll-worthy.
But as for it being the cowards way out, I would say certainly not - it takes a lot of balls to put a final full stop on life not knowing what if anything happens next. Not leaving it up to fate, age or disease but making a decision yourself to stop. That's a hugely difficult decision to make, so all this "permanent solution to a temp problem" crap is the platitude that I find most eyeroll-worthy.
Their reaction would be pretty selfish too.
dinazimmerman
Incurious Bastard
I think equating depression (technically, major depressive disorder) with heart disease or other serious physiological conditions is fallacious. They are both serious illnesses, but they are incredibly different in many aspects. For example, heart disease does not go away if one learns to think differently. On other hand, depression, and other mental disorders, can in fact go away if one acquires new mental "tools" (depending of course on the severity and type of depression). This is what cognitive behavioral therapy, the effectiveness of which has been proved by many statistical studies, is all about. It's about learning to identify, examine, and correct negative thoughts. With the help of a therapist, some people can overcome depression themselves without taking medication. The same clearly cannot be said about heart disease.
Moreover, it's hard for most people, who are not trained psychiatrists or abnormal psychologists, to know when someone is suffering from major depressive disorder and not just suffering from some temporary melancholy owing to his or her current circumstance. That explains some popular misconceptions about depression and suicidal thoughts. I do agree, however, that labeling suicidal people as "selfish" is not helpful. At the same time, I do not think it helps to treat a suicidal friend or family member as you would treat a friend or family member with cancer or heart disease. Friends and family should instead consider following this advice:
That said, I don't think it's wrong or unhealthy to be angry at a loved one for killing themselves. It's a normal reaction, I'd say.
Moreover, it's hard for most people, who are not trained psychiatrists or abnormal psychologists, to know when someone is suffering from major depressive disorder and not just suffering from some temporary melancholy owing to his or her current circumstance. That explains some popular misconceptions about depression and suicidal thoughts. I do agree, however, that labeling suicidal people as "selfish" is not helpful. At the same time, I do not think it helps to treat a suicidal friend or family member as you would treat a friend or family member with cancer or heart disease. Friends and family should instead consider following this advice:
http://noahpinionblog.blogspot.com/2013/01/a-few-thoughts-on-depression.html
That said, I don't think it's wrong or unhealthy to be angry at a loved one for killing themselves. It's a normal reaction, I'd say.
People who say this don't really understand depression or mental illness.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Which I think is silly too. My family (parents and grandparents alike) were extremely supportive and raised me well but my late-teenage self still managed to be suicidal and extremely depressed. If I had gone through with it I would not have wanted people to think that I wasn't loved enough or cared for in the right way or that my parents had failed.
N
NinjaFridge
Unconfirmed Member
SolidusDave
Member
People can choose whatever they want. Personally I see suicide as the final solution, so it's more something liberating in my mind.
I can't really relate to someone having depression though. I can neither stand the "think positive!!111 yaaay" people nor the "I have it so hard buhuhu" people (in first world countries). Sorry, I don't want to offend someone, especially as I know it's often due to how their brain chemistry works. It just makes it so hard to relate to, I wish I could show people to give less of a fuck / enjoy the small things while being realistic.
But I think I can comment on the actual suicide acts (and also not the fake I-want-attention ones). Because a lot of them ARE very selfish. I'm not even talking about family etc.
Like, fuck all the people jumping in front of trains. Train drivers can get a fucking trauma from that, plus tons of people will be late to wherever they were going.
In general, it's not very considerate to all the people who have to look at your corpse and scrape your remains from the street. So many people are also simply involved (and use their working hours) in this "event", from police to the mortician who has to literally pull your head out of your ass because you landed feet first.
Or do you prefer to be an undiscovered rotten corpse to annoy your neighbors? Some apartments need to be renovated anyway I guess.
So, plan properly. Like the guy in Gataca.
I can't really relate to someone having depression though. I can neither stand the "think positive!!111 yaaay" people nor the "I have it so hard buhuhu" people (in first world countries). Sorry, I don't want to offend someone, especially as I know it's often due to how their brain chemistry works. It just makes it so hard to relate to, I wish I could show people to give less of a fuck / enjoy the small things while being realistic.
But I think I can comment on the actual suicide acts (and also not the fake I-want-attention ones). Because a lot of them ARE very selfish. I'm not even talking about family etc.
Like, fuck all the people jumping in front of trains. Train drivers can get a fucking trauma from that, plus tons of people will be late to wherever they were going.
In general, it's not very considerate to all the people who have to look at your corpse and scrape your remains from the street. So many people are also simply involved (and use their working hours) in this "event", from police to the mortician who has to literally pull your head out of your ass because you landed feet first.
Or do you prefer to be an undiscovered rotten corpse to annoy your neighbors? Some apartments need to be renovated anyway I guess.
So, plan properly. Like the guy in Gataca.
Chainsawkitten
Member
People who think other people need to take their feelings into account when it comes to basic decisions regarding one's own life and whether one wants to live it or not are selfish jerks.
ElectricBlue187
Member
I think this is only really a factor of you are the sole parent of a child that depends on you completely for everything. In that situation I think you owe them a solid upbringing no matter what problems you have. If its just your mom and dad will be sad or whatever then that's not super convincing to me in terms of selfishness.
Omegasquash
Member
Oh, the selfish argument. That never gets old, but it's been tired for a long time. I was sort of ashamed when MA voted it down this past cycle TBH.
Inherently it is a selfish thing to do because it's one person making a decision about their life. The factors in making that decision are what matter more, and it's not for us to judge them. it's for us to offer help to those that ask it, and encourage those with opportunity to continue living, but respect the decisions that people make. Because it's their life. Not mine.
Inherently it is a selfish thing to do because it's one person making a decision about their life. The factors in making that decision are what matter more, and it's not for us to judge them. it's for us to offer help to those that ask it, and encourage those with opportunity to continue living, but respect the decisions that people make. Because it's their life. Not mine.
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