• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

The EU Plans to Force Apple to Include USB-C Ports on Phones

Cyberpunkd

Member
Dec 16, 2020
1,975
2,800
455
I am a citizen of the EU and I am in support of the EU enforcing standards in technology to defend consumer rights. EU has asked these companies before and nothing happened. Now Apple are getting banhammered into submission which they rightfully deserve.
Agreed, and I have 2 MacBooks, an iPhone, a HomePod, and an Apple TV. It’s obvious companies want to introduce their all proprietary rubbish connectors for no other reason than to tie people to their ecosystem.

Same thing should be done with e.g. electric razor chargers. WTF my Panasonic needs some crazy 2 pin, square connector that does not exist anywhere else ?
 

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
Dec 26, 2008
12,641
7,721
1,560
Spain
Don’t forget to mention that part where majority of Western Europe has quality of life superior to the US.

Cheap mobile plans and fast speed Internet? Check
Free healthcare? Check
Free higher education? Check
Social net so homeless do not line up next to Market Strret in SF? Check

But hey, you can keep your commercial reality - I will be over there enjoying my fast Internet for $20.

Or one of my personal favorites, the ability to force marketers to remove you from their databases. Two emails and poof… these days I don’t get robocalls nor sales calls anymore.
 

hullostranger

Member
Jun 23, 2011
355
12
760
Serendip
I'd love to charge my iPhone, iPad and Mac using one charger and cable (especially while travelling)
Qi support is good but USB-C would be great.
 

Atrus

Gold Member
Jul 16, 2007
4,722
958
1,485
Oh yeah, TOTALLY, that's what Apple were going to do, they were going to introduce the BESTEST connector, the year after NEXT, but now because of the EVIL EU, they TOTALLY aren't now. /s

Come on, what a joke, they've had multiple years to switch to USB C, but because they like to keep their customers tied to their eco system, they keep the lightning connector.

It is a question about whether regulations stipulating uniformity will stifle the adoption of better technology. Micro-USB was a dogshit connector, would everyone have preferred that we used that as a standard and prevented the lightning cable or should companies be free to develop alternatives?
 

Mr Hyde

Member
Jun 1, 2018
4,577
9,500
645
I can't imagine how cumbersome it would be if USB-C wasn't standard. I charge all my devices with one charger. My Switch, my phone, my headphones. What the fuck is Apple using? Glad I never bought into their shit.
 

Trogdor1123

Member
Mar 2, 2012
10,081
3,418
965
This seems like something a company would want. Having government force them to change ports, then force them to sell the new chargers to everyone, none if is their fault and they make more money
 

Azurro

Member
Jun 11, 2018
2,586
4,705
485
It is a question about whether regulations stipulating uniformity will stifle the adoption of better technology. Micro-USB was a dogshit connector, would everyone have preferred that we used that as a standard and prevented the lightning cable or should companies be free to develop alternatives?

This is a better question. However, USB C is just the form factor, you can upgrade the internals, no issue. Nobody is setting in stone the transfer speeds we have now, it's more about removing the ability to arbitrarily create connectors for no good reason other than to ring fence your walled garden.
 

dorkimoe

Member
Aug 19, 2007
11,206
4,218
1,640
Right so the solution is you as an individual make the choice to buy USBC. It is a big factor in things for me. I won't buy devices anymore unless it has C or lightning.

Then I have a few things that still need adapters but working on getting that all squared away so one day I'll be all usb c. Like the EU but no one forced me.
Thats fine, but dont you think these governments should step in for the slave labor they use? The suicide nets and all that other stuff before worrying about a cable?
 
  • LOL
  • Like
Reactions: Nester99 and rofif

Fbh

Member
Dec 6, 2013
17,219
14,615
1,150
I feel split on this.
On the one hand having a unified port on all phones is obviously going to be really convenient for charging, transferring data and accessories.
On the other hand I'm not a fan of government/state control on non essential products. Iphones are not an essential product, they are a premium phone and there's tons of alternatives on the market with USB-C ports.

I am a citizen of the EU and I am in support of the EU enforcing standards in technology to defend consumer rights.

What right do you feel Apple is violating by having their own type of port/cable?
Them having their own proprietary cable/port is well known so you don't need to buy and Iphone if you don't like it, there's a lot of Phone alternatives with USB-C ports on the market.

There's also a ton of off brand Iphone cables and accessories so it's not like Apple is forcing you to buy directly from them.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: rofif and NahaNago

RCU005

Member
Nov 9, 2016
718
1,349
590
To everyone saying: "Well, apple will just remove ports and have all phones charged wirelessly"

You do know wireless charging is mostly useless right?

Apple removing ports is not even a joke, they are likely considering that stupidity. Wireless charging is useful in a car for example, where you just put the phone in place and drive, no need for cables. Most of the time, however, many people use the phone while it is charging! If you have wireless charging, then you won't be able to do that!

I guess a solution would be to have a cable with a magnet to get it in place on the back with magsafe, so that instead of the port you just put the thing there but you'd still have a cable to be able to use it, but knowing Apple they wouldn't do that.

I don't understand why people don't realize that wireless charing removes the ability to use the phone while it's charging, at least in the current method of having charging matts.
 

Mista K

Member
Oct 5, 2010
4,444
4,663
1,350
U.S.
There's also a ton of off brand Iphone cables and accessories so it's not like Apple is forcing you to buy directly from them.
Actually, apple did try to clamp down on unauthorized charging cables with….ios 10? Lots of people were getting “this accessory is not supported” with older cables until manufacturers made workarounds. I had to replace mine, so who is to say they won’t do it again.

I understand the concerns about government overreach, but what are the pros of apple having a different cable than every other company that already adopted usb c? It’s thinner, sure, but that’s about it. I think it’s really dumb not to have one cable that can do just about everything and it not be the standard
 

Fbh

Member
Dec 6, 2013
17,219
14,615
1,150
Actually, apple did try to clamp down on unauthorized charging cables with….ios 10? Lots of people were getting “this accessory is not supported” with older cables until manufacturers made workarounds. I had to replace mine, so who is to say they won’t do it again.

I understand the concerns about government overreach, but what are the pros of apple having a different cable than every other company that already adopted usb c? It’s thinner, sure, but that’s about it. I think it’s really dumb not to have one cable that can do just about everything and it not be the standard

Don't take me wrong, I don't think the port has any advantages. Their reliance on proprietary stuff like this as well as stunts like the ones you describe with the iOS update are some of the reasons I don't own any Apple devices.
But I don't like the idea of the government getting involved in things like this. Being Ok with it because I don't like lightning but then being against it when they force a change I don't like would be hypocritical, that's like saying "I support free speech....as long as everyone is saying things I like".
 

Mista K

Member
Oct 5, 2010
4,444
4,663
1,350
U.S.
Don't take me wrong, I don't think the port has any advantages. Their reliance on proprietary stuff like this as well as stunts like the ones you describe with the iOS update are some of the reasons I don't own any Apple devices.
But I don't like the idea of the government getting involved in things like this. Being Ok with it because I don't like lightning but then being against it when they force a change I don't like would be hypocritical, that's like saying "I support free speech....as long as everyone is saying things I like".
You’re right, and I feel the same way. I honestly wouldn’t own anything apple either if they didn’t have me by the balls with apps and my itunes library. After my current phone wears out, I’ll make a concentrated effort to switch
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Fbh

Bluntman

Member
May 8, 2017
245
465
430
Doesn’t seem like the EU’s business. They should have more pressing matters to worry about.

This is exactly what the EU should be doing instead of things like pushing LMBTQ propaganda and making "legal migrant ways" for half of Afghanistan.
 

IDKFA

Member
Jan 15, 2017
2,484
3,269
540
Although this will be good for reducing E-waste, the EU really have bigger things to worry about at the moment. I would also question if they should have this type of authority.

Also, slightly off topic, but I'm confused by a few recent threads. Does this mean political discussions are back on?
 

UnNamed

18+ Member, acts like 12 year old console warrior
Dec 21, 2006
2,489
4,444
1,560
Somewhere in Bananaland
Apple says this put a brake on innovation an tech, but so far they didn't push this supposed innovation, they only use lightning for charging, not for other fancy uses. Lightning doesn't have more reliability, fast charge is slower and data transfer is much slower than usbc. Apple is simply lying.

There is no real difference between lightning and usbc. So use that fucking usbc!
 

Mithos

Member
Apr 26, 2006
6,266
719
1,565
Sweden
The second point is what I look forward too...
Every damn phone having its own "proprietary" fast charging.

Use the charger that comes with my phone and it charges with 30w. Use another charger and it only charges using 18-20w.
And use that "other charger" to charge the phone it comes with and it charges with 30w again...
 

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
Dec 26, 2008
12,641
7,721
1,560
Spain
Although this will be good for reducing E-waste, the EU really have bigger things to worry about at the moment. I would also question if they should have this type of authority.

Also, slightly off topic, but I'm confused by a few recent threads. Does this mean political discussions are back on?

They're also forcing electronic manufacturers to release repair manuals and sell parts for at least 10 years to any repairer who asks at a fair price. They're starting with washing machines, dishwashers, fridges and televisions.

Oh no muh freedom to build and sell unrepairable shit :messenger_tears_of_joy:

 
Last edited:

daveonezero

Member
Nov 19, 2018
1,782
1,488
455
So, Apple's plan to "comply" with the regulation is to do what they wanted to do all along? There's a reason they are pushing that all of those accessories to connect to the back of your phone. They want to keep the lightning port to keep existing customers in the ecosystem, while pushing the new "wireless" charging attachment until they have migrated enough people to do so they can drop the Lightning connector altogether.


As a note, in topics like these, you can easily tell when Americans are posting here: Knee jerking about government regulations while being completely ignorant about the tons of existing regulations all around them, starting from the building they live in, the utensils they use to eat, the microwaves, washing machines, etc.

You can even picture them with their tiny american flag going "but muh freedom!!!" while invoking the USSR.
I’m not sure what Apples plan is. It is a hypothesis.

for the record I oppose the existing regulations on business in the USSA as well.

you are trying to claim I’m inconsistent without knowing my opinion. That isn’t a valid argument because it isn’t my opinion. It is your view and stereo type.
 

daveonezero

Member
Nov 19, 2018
1,782
1,488
455
They're also forcing electronic manufacturers to release repair manuals and sell parts for at least 10 years to any repairer who asks at a fair price. They're starting with washing machines, dishwashers, fridges and televisions.

Oh no muh freedom to build and sell unrepairable shit :messenger_tears_of_joy:

Right to repair is a separate issue and also doesn’t require government involvement.

in the US the FCC has denied approval of devices that have been submitted that we’re trying to break up the big tech monopolies on phones and tablets. Things like hardware switches for phones will stop the item from being approved.
 

DaleinCalgary

Member
Feb 9, 2014
2,666
3,369
705
inb4 Apple goes B R A V E and ditches physical ports to go all in on wireless charging.
There goes everyone that likes Apple CarPlay

edit: yes there is bluetooth connection but only a small percentage of cars have it, and it doesnt work well most of the time.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: daveonezero

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
Dec 26, 2008
12,641
7,721
1,560
Spain
Right to repair is a separate issue and also doesn’t require government involvement.

Because it’s working sooo well… and in fact the government had to step in as in the case of the John Deere tractors.

I swear Americans think “the market” is a XVIII century farmers market where the sweetest and cheapest fruit always wins. Hint: market efficiency is highly distorted and either the government steps in or the issues won’t be fixed.
 

Azurro

Member
Jun 11, 2018
2,586
4,705
485
I’m not sure what Apples plan is. It is a hypothesis.

for the record I oppose the existing regulations on business in the USSA as well.


you are trying to claim I’m inconsistent without knowing my opinion. That isn’t a valid argument because it isn’t my opinion. It is your view and stereo type.

Again, people that say that usually come from a place of ignorance. I'm sure that you enjoy building codes that ensure the house/apartment you live in isn't an earthquake/asbestos/structural failure trap, as well as those paved roads and the food you eat each day does contain the ingredients that they say it contains. All of that comes from regulation.

I think my little flag and "muh freedomz!" stereotype is still correct. ;)
 

DaleinCalgary

Member
Feb 9, 2014
2,666
3,369
705
Maybe Apple will get them in iPhones next year. If they wait for 2 years for this to go in force you will not be able to buy anything but a iPhone 15 at an apple store. No older cheaper models.
 

rofif

Member
Sep 13, 2019
7,893
11,186
670
I still can't get over the fact that they removed plastic straws for the paper ones.... Like wtf. There are so many places to save waste... Even lids or packaging but no. They make or lives more miserable. Same with forced trash segregation. I have to keep 4 bins and segregate... And pay more for this at the same time...
But why? It should not be my responsibility. It should be on the producer to add less packaging... And plastic is not recyclable really. They still lie about that.

Eu is really weird. And what does it change to replace lighting end of cable for USB c? It's the same amount of material or less
 

rofif

Member
Sep 13, 2019
7,893
11,186
670
Why though? Their notebooks have them.

Apples has always been a trash company, so this isn't surprising.

Hopefully we can get global right to repair soon.
Right to repair is a slippery slope without forcing them to change designs.
I am all for making parts available and having back cover that opens.
But at the same time if there are building rules, it will be in the way of progress and innovation
 

rofif

Member
Sep 13, 2019
7,893
11,186
670
To everyone saying: "Well, apple will just remove ports and have all phones charged wirelessly"

You do know wireless charging is mostly useless right?

Apple removing ports is not even a joke, they are likely considering that stupidity. Wireless charging is useful in a car for example, where you just put the phone in place and drive, no need for cables. Most of the time, however, many people use the phone while it is charging! If you have wireless charging, then you won't be able to do that!

I guess a solution would be to have a cable with a magnet to get it in place on the back with magsafe, so that instead of the port you just put the thing there but you'd still have a cable to be able to use it, but knowing Apple they wouldn't do that.

I don't understand why people don't realize that wireless charing removes the ability to use the phone while it's charging, at least in the current method of having charging matts.
You've seen apple magsafe right? You can charge wirelessly and use the phone
 

RCU005

Member
Nov 9, 2016
718
1,349
590
You've seen apple magsafe right? You can charge wirelessly and use the phone
How? with the battery pack? you can use the phone with any battery pack, but you'd have to have one which is an extra expense. You can't use a phone with charging matts.

The advantage of the MagSafe is that they could do a charging cable that attaches to the back so you can plug in to the wall, but don't know if apple would do that.

Also, wireless-only charging would mean that you can forget to charge on an airport or public space unless you bring your charging Matt everywhere.

The fact is, not having ports would suck and hopefully apple doesn't do it, because you know everyone will follow them and will suck!
 

DaleinCalgary

Member
Feb 9, 2014
2,666
3,369
705
How? with the battery pack? you can use the phone with any battery pack, but you'd have to have one which is an extra expense. You can't use a phone with charging matts.

The advantage of the MagSafe is that they could do a charging cable that attaches to the back so you can plug in to the wall, but don't know if apple would do that.

Also, wireless-only charging would mean that you can forget to charge on an airport or public space unless you bring your charging Matt everywhere.

The fact is, not having ports would suck and hopefully apple doesn't do it, because you know everyone will follow them and will suck!
You can charge an iPhone on any qi charger, Yes Apple has already made a MagSafe charger that attaches to the back of the phone and you can plug it into the wall.
 

Blade2.0

Member
Dec 3, 2018
1,875
2,031
505
Although this will be good for reducing E-waste, the EU really have bigger things to worry about at the moment. I would also question if they should have this type of authority.

Also, slightly off topic, but I'm confused by a few recent threads. Does this mean political discussions are back on?
Apple can just not sell their products in the EU. It isn’t a right to sell your products in the world. You either adhere to the regulations or don’t do it.
 

rofif

Member
Sep 13, 2019
7,893
11,186
670
How? with the battery pack? you can use the phone with any battery pack, but you'd have to have one which is an extra expense. You can't use a phone with charging matts.

The advantage of the MagSafe is that they could do a charging cable that attaches to the back so you can plug in to the wall, but don't know if apple would do that.

Also, wireless-only charging would mean that you can forget to charge on an airport or public space unless you bring your charging Matt everywhere.

The fact is, not having ports would suck and hopefully apple doesn't do it, because you know everyone will follow them and will suck!
They sell wireless battery pack and also their wired wireless charger uses magnets to hold back to the back of the phone. So You can charge "wirelessly" while still being tethered and continue charging. It will not fall off
 
  • Like
Reactions: Futurematic

nemiroff

Gold Member
Feb 19, 2018
2,161
2,936
595
Even when I was an Apple fanboy their obvious exploitation of proprietary stuff (Sony did it as well, albeit not with chargers) was a pet peeve of mine. This is a good move by the EU.
 

rofif

Member
Sep 13, 2019
7,893
11,186
670
Even when I was an Apple fanboy their obvious exploitation of proprietary stuff (Sony did it as well, albeit not with chargers) was a pet peeve of mine. This is a good move by the EU.
This would be a good move 15 years ago. Now it's not needed at all.
Only Apple have lightning on their last legs... and it's essentially usb c. They will change it sooner or later I bet
 

DaleinCalgary

Member
Feb 9, 2014
2,666
3,369
705
This would be a good move 15 years ago. Now it's not needed at all.
Only Apple have lightning on their last legs... and it's essentially usb c. They will change it sooner or later I bet
I agree, usb is coming soonish but I do not want a portless iPhone. I really don't care either way as I don't understand the hate for the lightning connector. I plug my phone in to a charger and my car. It works just fine.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rofif

Torrent of Pork

Gold Member
Aug 29, 2018
4,674
9,972
635
36
Bartow, Florida, USA
Bureaucracy-choked conglomerate of nations with a culture of monarchial autocracy vs. snowflake techbros who cry when told they can't sell solutions to bullshit barriers they created.

recap bachelorette GIF
 

daveonezero

Member
Nov 19, 2018
1,782
1,488
455
Because it’s working sooo well… and in fact the government had to step in as in the case of the John Deere tractors.

I swear Americans think “the market” is a XVIII century farmers market where the sweetest and cheapest fruit always wins. Hint: market efficiency is highly distorted and either the government steps in or the issues won’t be fixed.
Big ag is heavily subsidized by the government and destroying farmland. Removing all the small farmers. So it really isn’t the bastion of a free market.

also farmers were flashing firmware and fixing their own shit.
 

daveonezero

Member
Nov 19, 2018
1,782
1,488
455
Again, people that say that usually come from a place of ignorance. I'm sure that you enjoy building codes that ensure the house/apartment you live in isn't an earthquake/asbestos/structural failure trap, as well as those paved roads and the food you eat each day does contain the ingredients that they say it contains. All of that comes from regulation.

I think my little flag and "muh freedomz!" stereotype is still correct. ;)
No I actually think building codes make very expensive and fragile buildings.

there are constructs that aren’t allowed and they are way better than 2x4s and dry wall

Ever heard of earth ships or hemp Crete?

they are much more energy efficient and green yet most regulations have not allowed them into the market.
 

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
Dec 26, 2008
12,641
7,721
1,560
Spain
also farmers were flashing firmware and fixing their own shit.

Which is a crime under american laws.

Gee things go so well, no need for government intervention - I mean farmers are forced to commit crimes and violating copyright laws to repair their own tractors but it's all well because it's what the free market provides!

Big ag is heavily subsidized by the government and destroying farmland. Removing all the small farmers. So it really isn’t the bastion of a free market.

Woosh.
 

RCU005

Member
Nov 9, 2016
718
1,349
590
They sell wireless battery pack and also their wired wireless charger uses magnets to hold back to the back of the phone. So You can charge "wirelessly" while still being tethered and continue charging. It will not fall off

Oh that's great! That's exactly what I was talking about. IMO, this is the way to do it. You can keep using your phone.

If there's ever an iPhone without ports, this is exactly the kind of setup I would have.
 
  • Empathy
Reactions: Bluntman

daveonezero

Member
Nov 19, 2018
1,782
1,488
455
Which is a crime under american laws.

Gee things go so well, no need for government intervention - I mean farmers are forced to commit crimes and violating copyright laws to repair their own tractors but it's all well because it's what the free market provides!



Woosh.
Who made flashing it a crime?

so you are saying government is a savior to fix the problem they created?

if you can’t understand basic government and corporate overlap none of this will make sense.
 

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
Dec 26, 2008
12,641
7,721
1,560
Spain
Who made flashing it a crime?

so you are saying government is a savior to fix the problem they created?

if you can’t understand basic government and corporate overlap none of this will make sense.

You cannot understand that modern markets that are not commodified are highly distorted and the only fix for those distortions is for thee government to step in.
 

Futurematic

Member
Jan 28, 2014
852
172
565
Why though? Their notebooks have them.
And the iPads for that matter. The difference is that Apple sells hundreds of millions of phones and tens of millions of computers/iPads.

Skipping USB-C entirely to offer slow Qi charging or MagSafe Max a super-fast wireless charging which they license just like existing Lightning port makes way more sense for them.
 
Aug 8, 2019
380
654
345
seriously? how many of those does someone have in use. That is like made for a professional that may encounter those but in the last 10 years most of those have been phased out to better connectors. Most of those are just power. No data.

There are all sorts of adapters you can buy for old serial ports. The government didn't get rid of them and force people to use USB.

Back in the 00's those things were very useful.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Blade2.0

poppabk

Member
Jan 21, 2008
13,201
2,139
1,470
USA
Although this will be good for reducing E-waste, the EU really have bigger things to worry about at the moment.
Why do people keep saying this. It's not like they shutdown all other Government work until they could get the apple port situation sorted out.