Support NeoGAF

[Heigic]

Isn't the simple solution to just upgrade the OS before you go on a boat. It's not like you will be buying new games while on a boat, so all the games you do own will have the correct version of the OS.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

All good friend. If your console was always connected to the net, it's likely you wouldn't know as it would never happen.

It turns out that I was getting firmware updates mixed up for bluray titles.

I remember back sometime after the bluray/HD-DVD format war many people were complaining about the constant firmware updates and I remember a rep was asked why companies didn't include firmware updates on the movie discs themselves and they mentioned that there were major liability issues in doing that. Its obviously a different scenario since there were many different types of bluray players and it would be hard to provide for them all, among other issues they could face.
I assumed (incorrectly) that the same thing was true for gaming consoles.

And yes, all my consoles were always connected online and I pretty much always had the necessary updates.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Isn't the simple solution to just upgrade the OS before you go on a boat. It's not like you will be buying new games while on a boat, so all the games you do own will have the correct version of the OS.

It sounds simple, but I would imagine many of them are getting the games right before they get on the boat!

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Nm.

 

[Nafai1123]

Any game that requires a OS update should contain it on the disc. There's really no excuse.

 

[SMattera]

There's a reason the FCC wants to regulate the Internet under Title II.

At this point, the Internet is almost on the level of electricity.

It's not cool for a company to mislead customers or lie, but I just don't understand the backlash towards connected consoles. Video games, by definition, are a high-tech past-time, requiring quality electronics (TV, stereos, etc.) to really enjoy.

I don't think it's unfair that I can't play my consoles when I go to my cabin, for example.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

I know it's not ideal OP, but can you not get one of those 3/4G mifi routers and just use it to update on these occasions? I guess it totally depends on where you are and if there is coverage, but you can either preload them or go contract for more data if it's an option.

Several years ago I used to do this with a 3G mobile router, and it allowed me to game online with my PS3 and no actual landline connection. I had 15Gb a month and that was very much adequate for updates and online play, just had to watch how many games I downloaded each month.

 

[Jomjom]

I dont understand why they require you to be online for something like pins, which is essential to use that horrid UI.

 

[Fess]

So if you buy a game at GameStop or whatever you might not be able to play the game if you don't have internet? And it doesn't say "internet connection required" on the game case?
This is terrible. Always online still exist, kind of.

 

[soundscream]

That's not true.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_system_software#History_of_updates

So 3-4 my mistake.

Aside from sunset overdrive has this been an issue for any other games?

 

[Swhalen]

Yes, you can take screenshots of every game at anytime, and copy them to an USB drive, or upload them via Twitter and Facebook (unless the game forbids you, to stop you from posting heavy spoilers, for example). Hell it even save videos of your gameplay automatically, and it's very easy to deal with this stuff, copy, upload it, edit it, etc.

And what I mean "paying for it" it's because some games on the Xbox 360 have a photomode, in which you can take pictures of the game (Forza, for example). But the problem is: you can't upload them if you don't pay for a Xbox Live subscription. And you can't even copy them to an USB drive to see those pics on you PC. F*ck, you can't even have a Netflix subscription on the Xbox without having to pay for a Xbox Live Gold account. It really sux having basically everything behind a paywall.

I use Netflix on my 360 all the time and j do not have a gold sub. But sure if that's new or what?

 

[Gamezone]

Isn't the simple solution to just upgrade the OS before you go on a boat. It's not like you will be buying new games while on a boat, so all the games you do own will have the correct version of the OS.

Why should it be my problem? Make the console function like the Xbox 360.

 

[R_thanatos]

I could be wrong but from my experience PS4 doesn't require you to update to play a game long as you don't want to go online. Any online functionality will require it though (annoying everytime I want to play Netflix and there is an update I keep pushing off). In fact, I think I may remember playing GTA online before updating but that one I could totally be remembering wrong so take that with a very light grain of salt.

Some games on PS4 does require a specific update to run , but usually that update in on the disc if that is the case.

For example at launch , if you had a 1.00 PS4 and wanted to play killzone but didn't have internet .. you had the 1.06 update on the disc to install ( that happenned to me ).

Pretty sure it's the case for many games

 

[BigDug13]

There's a reason the FCC wants to regulate the Internet under Title II.

At this point, the Internet is almost on the level of electricity.

It's not cool for a company to mislead customers or lie, but I just don't understand the backlash towards connected consoles. Video games, by definition, are a high-tech past-time, requiring quality electronics (TV, stereos, etc.) to really enjoy.

I don't think it's unfair that I can't play my consoles when I go to my cabin, for example.

Why does Steam work so great with even better game performance when I'm deployed for six months offline then? You make it sound like an inevitability that we must keep game consoles connected, but on PC while playing Steam games offline, I can do it just fine at a cabin, on deployment, wherever. still works just fine.

Gaming shouldn't become an "only while connected" experience for every single game. not every genre needs that shit and it definitely doesn't need to be forced at the system level like MS was going to do.

Kinda surprised a military person still went with XBO after that trash Mattrick was talking about "we have a product for you, the Xbox 360."

 

[Gamezone]

There's a reason the FCC wants to regulate the Internet under Title II.

At this point, the Internet is almost on the level of electricity.

It's not cool for a company to mislead customers or lie, but I just don't understand the backlash towards connected consoles. Video games, by definition, are a high-tech past-time, requiring quality electronics (TV, stereos, etc.) to really enjoy.

I don't think it's unfair that I can't play my consoles when I go to my cabin, for example.

Steam offline mode let me enjoy my games for months without any issue at all. Online requirement is no excuse.

 

[ReBurn]

I use my Vita in airplane mode all the time to save battery and only turn WiFi on to download games. I don't encounter any problems.

You mean aside from all of those "cannot connect to network" prompts when games reach out to PSN, right? That drives me nuts.

 

[Souldestroyer Reborn]

Sorry to slightly high-jack the thread OP, but if I can get an answer here it would save me from making a new thread

I'm in the same sort of situation as the OP being that I also work away from home too.

I've recently been thinking of buying a second PS4 to take to my work where I will at no point have access to an Internet connection/4G/3G any kind of G.

My plan is to buy the console, do the day zero update, download my games that I've bought and then use it at my work.

Would this be possible or would I need all disc games ontop of this?

Thanks for any advice btw!

 

[ReBurn]

Sorry to slightly high-jack the thread OP, but if I can get an answer here it would save me from making a new thread

I'm in the same sort of situation as the OP being that I also work away from home too.

I've recently been thinking of buying a second PS4 to take to my work where I will at no point have access to an Internet connection/4G/3G any kind of G.

My plan is to buy the console, do the day zero update, download my games that I've bought and then use it at my work.

Would this be possible or would I need all disc games ontop of this?

Thanks for any advice btw!

If your games are digital make sure you set it as the primary PS4 for your account. Otherwise it's going to want an Internet connection to verify that you own the games.

 

[Gamezone]

Sorry to slightly high-jack the thread OP, but if I can get an answer here it would save me from making a new thread

I'm in the same sort of situation as the OP being that I also work away from home too.

I've recently been thinking of buying a second PS4 to take to my work where I will at no point have access to an Internet connection/4G/3G any kind of G.

My plan is to buy the console, do the day zero update, download my games that I've bought and then use it at my work.

Would this be possible or would I need all disc games ontop of this?

Thanks for any advice btw!

I don't think that should be any problem.

 

[HTupolev]

There's a reason the FCC wants to regulate the Internet under Title II.

At this point, the Internet is almost on the level of electricity.

It's not cool for a company to mislead customers or lie, but I just don't understand the backlash towards connected consoles. Video games, by definition, are a high-tech past-time, requiring quality electronics (TV, stereos, etc.) to really enjoy.

I don't think it's unfair that I can't play my consoles when I go to my cabin, for example.

Rocket ships are high tech!
Washing machines are high tech!

Why should anyone expect their washing machine to work when it's not mounted on a rocket ship? They're just complaining to complain!

 

[Souldestroyer Reborn]

I don't think that should be any problem.

If your games are digital make sure you set it as the primary PS4 for your account. Otherwise it's going to want an Internet connection to verify that you own the games.

Awesome! Thanks guys!

Have an internets cookie on me

 

[ocean]

And such a future for the industry, is a future without me as a customer.

If enough follow, then it shall be the end of the industry.

Yet the industry shall blame us.

So be it.

Fuck them.

It really sucks and they should be held accountable for being misleading. Most games should easily fit an OS update it absolutely requires in order to run, I don't see why platform holders can't make that a requirement for publishers.

As for taking the industry down? Easy now. This, while being terrible, is an extreme edge case. Most people have their consoles connected to the Internet, or are able to connect it easily if required. There are a few cases where this wouldn't work - farms or boats - but I think we can all agree that doesn't represent anywhere near a large portion of the player base.

 

[ocean]

Sorry to slightly high-jack the thread OP, but if I can get an answer here it would save me from making a new thread

I'm in the same sort of situation as the OP being that I also work away from home too.

I've recently been thinking of buying a second PS4 to take to my work where I will at no point have access to an Internet connection/4G/3G any kind of G.

My plan is to buy the console, do the day zero update, download my games that I've bought and then use it at my work.

Would this be possible or would I need all disc games ontop of this?

Thanks for any advice btw!

You can have two consoles associated with your digital purchase library. The primary PS4 always has access to these. Your secondary PS4 needs an an Internet connection to verify your access privilege.

Set your home console, which will remain connected to the Internet, as the secondary PS4 and it should be fine. One detail: on this secondary PS4 you leave at home, games will only be accessible to people playing under your PSN profile. So if someone at home wants to play a game from your library they'll have to do so under your account.

 

[Gamezone]

I dont understand why they require you to be online for something like pins, which is essential to use that horrid UI.

I don`t know. Will pins work without Xbox Gold?

 

[Withnail]

It really sucks and they should be held accountable for being misleading. Most games should easily fit an OS update it absolutely requires in order to run, I don't see why platform holders can't make that a requirement for publishers.

As for taking the industry down? Easy now. This, while being terrible, is an extreme edge case. Most people have their consoles connected to the Internet, or are able to connect it easily if required. There are a few cases where this wouldn't work - farms or boats - but I think we can all agree that doesn't represent anywhere near a large portion of the player base.

All discs are made by Microsoft (even third party games) so it's not even a requirement on publishers. MS just needs to make sure there is a firmware update on every disc appropriate for the SDK used to build the game. This is how it works for other consoles, MS not doing it is baffling tbh. I can only assume it's a weird hangover from the original always-online plan.

 

[Gamezone]

All discs are made by Microsoft (even third party games) so it's not even a requirement on publishers. MS just needs to make sure there is a firmware update on every disc appropriate for the SDK used to build the game. This is how it works for other consoles, MS not doing it is baffling tbh. I can only assume it's a weird hangover from the original always-online plan.

It`s probably a weird hangover from their original plan. That`s why I hope they will build Windows 10 OS from scratch, and release the OS as it should have been released to begin with.

 

[The Faceless Master]

If Xbox 360 OS required any update, the update was always on the game disc. If I try to run a new game on Xbox One, I usually get this message:

"You need to update your console"

If this happens, there`s usually one solution. Wait months so I can update the OS.

oh snap!

i'm sitting here right now updating an Xbox One for a family friend who had the console (and 2K15) since his wife got it for his birthday on Friday but couldn't play it.

guess this means he'll be back in a few months... not that i mind, i really don't, but still...

 

[Persona7]

This will NEVER happen. EVER.

What makes you think Sega wants to be liable if you brick your console for an update shipped on their game disc? That is absolutely one mess no publisher wants to deal with.

It will NEVER happen.

If you buy a new Wii U Nintendo includes a slip of paper telling you to update your wii with the game that is included with the bundle because it is much faster than downloading it.

 

[Souldestroyer Reborn]

You can have two consoles associated with your digital purchase library. The primary PS4 always has access to these. Your secondary PS4 needs an an Internet connection to verify your access privilege.

Set your home console, which will remain connected to the Internet, as the secondary PS4 and it should be fine. One detail: on this secondary PS4 you leave at home, games will only be accessible to people playing under your PSN profile. So if someone at home wants to play a game from your library they'll have to do so under your account.

That sounds golden to me! thabks for the insight

You guys have persuaded me to get a second PS4 now >.<

 

[The Faceless Master]

I use Netflix on my 360 all the time and j do not have a gold sub. But sure if that's new or what?

happened last June.

 

[Gamezone]

oh snap!

i'm sitting here right now updating an Xbox One for a family friend who had the console (and 2K15) since his wife got it for his birthday on Friday but couldn't play it.

guess this means he'll be back in a few months... not that i mind, i really don't, but still...

If he doesn`t connect the console, he will probably come back in the future when a new game requires a new OS version, yes. It sucks.

 

[bishoptl]

I don't think it's unfair that I can't play my consoles when I go to my cabin, for example.

Sorry, but that's unacceptable. I can play my PS4, WiiU, PS3 and X360 out on my family farm. Same with my Genesis and N64. Offline Steam and GOG. No internet, no problem - and that's the way it should be.

 

[SMOK3Y]

This is very true.

I've purchased movies via Xbox Video and nothing physically downloads...so if you aren't connected to live, you can't watch your purchased movies, tv shows, etc.

Really dumb in my opinion.

Sony does this now sadly too on the PS3 you used to d/l them on PS4 it's stream....

 

[Gamezone]

Sorry, but that's unacceptable. I can play my PS4, WiiU, PS3 and X360 out on my family farm. Same with my Genesis and N64. Offline Steam and GOG. No internet, no problem - and that's the way it should be.

I totally agree. I paid for my device because Microsoft promised that I wouldn`t have to connect it after the mandatory update. If I knew that this would become an issue, I would never have bought it.

 

[SMattera]

Sorry, but that's unacceptable. I can play my PS4, WiiU, PS3 and X360 out on my family farm. Same with my Genesis and N64. Offline Steam and GOG. No internet, no problem - and that's the way it should be.

I don't have electricity at my cabin, or a TV. So I can't play any console (except handhelds). Is that unreasonable?

Put another way, why is it reasonable to demand that you have electricity and a TV, but unreasonable to demand a reliable Internet connection? What is the difference between the two things? At this point, broadband Internet is almost as ubiquitous as electricity. Indeed, I can get Internet at my cabin by tethering my smartphone (but can't get electricity, because the utility company won't run lines that far into the woods).

Did you know more American households have broadband Internet than HDTVs? The Xbox One requires an HDTV, yet I rarely -- if ever -- see anyone complain about that. Why is that?

Basically, I just don't understand why requiring an Internet connection draws such hostility at this point in time. It isn't 1999.

 

[serversurfer]

You can have two consoles associated with your digital purchase library. The primary PS4 always has access to these. Your secondary PS4 needs an an Internet connection to verify your access privilege.

Set your home console, which will remain connected to the Internet, as the secondary PS4 and it should be fine. One detail: on this secondary PS4 you leave at home, games will only be accessible to people playing under your PSN profile. So if someone at home wants to play a game from your library they'll have to do so under your account.

To clarify, the "secondary console" is like a floating activation. You can sign in to any PS4 in the world and access your games on it, or you can play on your semi-static, primary console without signing in.

Sorry, but that's unacceptable. I can play my PS4, WiiU, PS3 and X360 out on my family farm. Same with my Genesis and N64. Offline Steam and GOG. No internet, no problem - and that's the way it should be.

I think they meant they don't have electricity at the cabin.

Not a very good analogy, but yeah.

Edit: Guess I was right. lol

 

[The Faceless Master]

I don't have electricity at my cabin, or a TV. So I can't play any console (except handhelds). Is that unreasonable?

Put another way, why is it reasonable to demand that you have electricity and a TV, but unreasonable to demand a reliable Internet connection? What is the difference between the two things? At this point, broadband Internet is almost as ubiquitous as electricity. Indeed, I can get Internet at my cabin by tethering my smartphone (but can't get electricity, because the utility company won't run lines that far into the woods).

Did you know more American households have broadband Internet than HDTVs? The Xbox One requires an HDTV, yet I rarely -- if ever -- see anyone complain about that. Why is that?

Basically, I just don't understand why requiring an Internet connection draws such hostility at this point in time. It isn't 1999.

that's not true. not since they updated what qualifies as broadband.

 

[SMattera]

that's not true. not since they updated what qualifies as broadband.

Numbers from last year put the rate of HDTV ownership at around 77%.

At the very least, it's close.

 

[TheYanger]

Sorry, but that's unacceptable. I can play my PS4, WiiU, PS3 and X360 out on my family farm. Same with my Genesis and N64. Offline Steam and GOG. No internet, no problem - and that's the way it should be.

But you can still do that with an Xbone. If a title literally won't run without the system update it probably SHOULD be on the disc, but if there's some reason it's not (file size or even a security reason on MS' end, who knows) the other option is not to utilize what that update brings. That's far more unreasonable to me.

Especially since, as noted, you've got the game from somewhere, presumably you were in civilzation at that point and could update it before you left if it's that big of a concern. Should you have to? Maybe not? it's an inconvenience for sure, but it's also necessary. So given that the other choice is the games don't work that way, I don't see the issue.


To take it a step further, you mention GoG and Steam - how the hell did you download the games in the first place? This is literally ONLY a problem if you basically don't even attempt to install your games prior to leaving. Why is that ok when you're talking about Steam but not ok when you're talking about Xbox? you're holding the platforms to different standards.

I'm super happy that they've been able to make firmware/OS level improvements to the Xbox that are substantial enough that a game can actually WORK where it wouldn't before (like, improved performance enough for a game to be possible with the specs it has), and yes that adds a bit of extra requirement to playing them at times, but given the alternative would be us being stuck with the launch specs, I choose the former.

 

[joecanada]

i had to check the date of your post OP because there was a similar thread in about september...
its pretty bad, but did you do research before? Just curious why you bothered with xbox at all given your situation....

edit - ^ how does this help him when he stated he is out for 4-5 months? how does this preclude xbox offering an update via disc? all of what you posted is basically "too bad for you, get internet"

hey doesn't bother me, it's not my business (literally business as in this is not the way you run one) .

 

[FZW]

When PSN went down last Christmas, the only console I couldnt play was the PS4. Downloadable games require the internet to call home on that system after a period of time offline.

If you ask me, This is not just an Xbox issue.

 

[The Faceless Master]

But you can still do that with an Xbone. If a title literally won't run without the system update it probably SHOULD be on the disc, but if there's some reason it's not (file size or even a security reason on MS' end, who knows) the other option is not to utilize what that update brings. That's far more unreasonable to me.

Especially since, as noted, you've got the game from somewhere, presumably you were in civilzation at that point and could update it before you left if it's that big of a concern. Should you have to? Maybe not? it's an inconvenience for sure, but it's also necessary. So given that the other choice is the games don't work that way, I don't see the issue.

To take it a step further, you mention GoG and Steam - how the hell did you download the games in the first place? This is literally ONLY a problem if you basically don't even attempt to install your games prior to leaving. Why is that ok when you're talking about Steam but not ok when you're talking about Xbox? you're holding the platforms to different standards.

I'm super happy that they've been able to make firmware/OS level improvements to the Xbox that are substantial enough that a game can actually WORK where it wouldn't before (like, improved performance enough for a game to be possible with the specs it has), and yes that adds a bit of extra requirement to playing them at times, but given the alternative would be us being stuck with the launch specs, I choose the former.

how is it even possible to get a game disk but not get internet!?

 

[TheYanger]

i had to check the date of your post OP because there was a similar thread in about september...
its pretty bad, but did you do research before? Just curious why you bothered with xbox at all given your situation....

edit - ^ how does this help him when he stated he is out for 4-5 months? how does this preclude xbox offering an update via disc? all of what you posted is basically "too bad for you, get internet"

hey doesn't bother me, it's not my business (literally business as in this is not the way you run one) .

That's not what I said at all. I said it's virtually impossible to be in that situation without having been able to connect prior to leaving, and yes it probably should be on the disc (I said as much) but if there's a reason it can't be (security or size or whatever) then so be it. It only even happens with MAJOR updates that the game requires to run. It's not like if you buy any random game and try to play it a month from now it won't work, but if something needs like the kinect disabling API then yeah, you need that version of firmware or newer for sure. I would expect similar with some stuff that uses DX12 or whatever. That's life, the other choice is for the games not to take advantage of the improved features.

how is it even possible to get a game disk but not get internet!?

I get that your'e being snarky, but it's basically the truth. He already said getting shipments mailed was basically not an option because he's out at sea or what have you. Anywhere else you'd get mail? You PROBABLY have access to the internet.

 

[joecanada]

how is it even possible to get a game disk but not get internet!?

you've never heard of mail,?

 

[Gamezone]

i had to check the date of your post OP because there was a similar thread in about september...
its pretty bad, but did you do research before? Just curious why you bothered with xbox at all given your situation....

edit - ^ how does this help him when he stated he is out for 4-5 months? how does this preclude xbox offering an update via disc? all of what you posted is basically "too bad for you, get internet"

hey doesn't bother me, it's not my business (literally business as in this is not the way you run one) .

Don Matrick said that I didn't have to connect my console ever again. Shouldn't that be research enough?

 

[joecanada]

Don Matrick said that I didn't have to connect my console ever again. Shouldn't that be research enough?

Im not blaming you I was just curious... I agree that it was outright lying but I refused to buy an xbox in the first place because of their constant bullshit, just wondered how you ended up with one.

for the record I will get one at my valuation of the console - 199$

 

[serversurfer]

Im not blaming you I was just curious... I agree that it was outright lying but I refused to buy an xbox in the first place because of their constant bullshit, just wondered how you ended up with one.

for the record I will get one at my valuation of the console - 199$

Why would you buy one ever, given their constant bullshit?

 

[Wereroku]

Numbers from last year put the rate of HDTV ownership at around 77%.

At the very least, it's close.

Broadband now requires a 20 meg connection. I bet the US rate is under 50% with that classification change.

 

[Wereroku]

When PSN went down last Christmas, the only console I couldnt play was the PS4. Downloadable games require the internet to call home on that system after a period of time offline.

If you ask me, This is not just an Xbox issue.

No that's your fault.

 

[Gamezone]

Im not blaming you I was just curious... I agree that it was outright lying but I refused to buy an xbox in the first place because of their constant bullshit, just wondered how you ended up with one.

for the record I will get one at my valuation of the console - 199$

I ended up with one because they "reversed" the DRM. I also enjoyed my Xbox 360. After reading trough this thread, it looks like I might go for the PS4 instead.