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The Mass Effect Community Thread

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Patryn

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Yeah, apparently they strongly recommended reviewers do their first playthrough without importing because the game was just so well done and oriented to series newcomers.

Still continuing my ME3 playthrough. Just got my first major Kai Leng scene, and I think I might honestly hate him more than I do the Star Kid. It really is amazing about how EVERYTHING about him just screams try hard. Bioware would be hard pressed to create a worse character.

On the other hand, I had forgotten just how much I liked Traynor. She's really great.
 

EatChildren

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I doubt anything integral to the trilogy's narrative arc is coming back in any capacity.
Except Cerberus.
 

Patryn

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How far does Reaper influence extend? Are they only interested in Milky Way and not Andromeda?
It has been confirmed multiple times that the Reapers are not in Andromeda. I would expect, at best, a token reference to them, with a high likelihood of no references whatsoever.

This does fit the series lore, where they seemingly only cared about the Milky Way.

I doubt anything integral to the trilogy's narrative arc is coming back in any capacity.
Except Cerberus.
Sadly, I fear your spoiler is correct. Terrible, but it's Mac Walter's baby.
 

DevilDog

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Oh I'm not expecting them either, but it wouldn't be impossible plotwise if they did want to go that direction.
Hey, its post 2009 Bioware, they are too powerful to be held back by trivial things such as plot consistency.

How far does Reaper influence extend? Are they only interested in Milky Way and not Andromeda?
Well they usually chill in Dark space between cycles, so maybe they could have taken a vacation on another galaxy? But it's never stated, they can go wherever they want tho.





Bitching aside, Mac Walters stated in the 101 questions that there will be no reapers in Andromeda.
 

EatChildren

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I think it's absolutely abundantly clear they're distancing themselves from the trilogy in order to give them the widest berth of creative freedom.

Sadly, I fear your spoiler is correct. Terrible, but it's Mac Walter's baby.
Can you imagine how cuntish you'd have to be to drag that, of all things, of all baggage, back from the trilogy for no good reason what so ever?
 

Big Nikus

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Cerberus/TIM could have been interesting in ME3.
Could have.
It really depends on who's writing. I like working for the wrong side in ME2, and I don't mind Cerberus in Karpyshyn's novels.

But I'm reading some of the comics by Walters and I'm facepalming so hard sometimes...
 

Sub_Level

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Speaking of which, I've always thought of what ME3 would be like if the player could choose to support Cerberus or the Alliance.

Perhaps it would default support to one side of the other based on their ME2 decisions, especially the collector base one. The first mission or 2 would be completely new and different, but those are just tutorials so not a big deal. One thing they maybe could have done was do a skin change for the cerberus soldiers. Just have them be the same but in alliance uniforms and boom you could reuse locations and enemies from the game we got. Then replace nemesis Kai Leng with Virmire survivor. (actually, replace Kai Leng regardless).

The whole subplot about Cerberus soldiers being retrofitted with Reaper tech could be ignored, and something players would only learn about on an Alliance playthrough lol

edit: Actually on second thought they would have to change quite a few things. It wouldn't be practical to merely change a few things like character skins. It'd need to be kind of a major revision especially in the writing department. The Citadel alone has so much Alliance-specific stuff.
 

Patryn

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Cerberus was fine as an evil organization in ME1. If they had just been the little side missions and doing evil stuff, it MIGHT have worked in ME2.

But as soon as they made it so that Cerberus was responsible for the Sole Survivor background, they fucked up. I could never make the leap that my Shepard would work with the organization that did that, so ME2 kind of lost me immediately. Somewhat helped to shade that entire first playthrough with a negative mindset.
 

DevilDog

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Everyone agrees Mac Walters can't write stories, but can he be a good director? I hope so, do your best Mac. Everyone is depending on you.

Cerberus was fine as an evil organization in ME1. If they had just been the little side missions and doing evil stuff, it MIGHT have worked in ME2.

But as soon as they made it so that Cerberus was responsible for the Sole Survivor background, they fucked up. I could never make the leap that my Shepard would work with the organization that did that, so ME2 kind of lost me immediately. Somewhat helped to shade that entire first playthrough with a negative mindset.
I lost it when they revived me, then the doctor that invented revival tried to kill me because he was doing crunch time (we've all been there, trying to blow up the company that owns us with rogue robots, alone) , then when they gave me the exact same normandy, (only better that what the Turians and humans combined could make), then when the game insisted that I worked for them even tho the Illusive man was just an informant, then when Cerberus started "finding dead reapers" and when they weren't responsible for all the evil things in ME1, of course.
 

Patryn

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That reminds me: I was talking to Vega and he casually mentioned as part of his backstory that he was on a colony that was being hit by the Collectors, encountered a Cerberus agent that was working FOR the Collectors, and he managed to blow up a Collector ship.

Do I even need to explain the sheer number of things wrong with that scenario? Did Bioware really sign off on the movie that included all that?

Between that and the one book, do they do ANY quality control of ME spin-off products?
 

BrassDragon

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Well they usually chill in Dark space between cycles, so maybe they could have taken a vacation on another galaxy? But it's never stated, they can go wherever they want tho..
I can actually buy the Reapers staying within their designated play pen considering ME3 revealed them to be in a neverending loop created by an ancient AI who took its job too literal.

One thing I wonder about is what role the actual 'mass effect' is going to play in the new galaxy - that's the key piece of Reaper technology the series can't get away from since it's right there in the title.

My speculation is that the Kett and other Andromeda races
don't have technologies like biotics and mass effect fields and that it becomes a point of contention between the natives and the colonists. Maybe the Pathfinders have access to a special mass effect application that lets them 'respec' and develop their powers on the fly (BioWare said there's an lorefriendly reason we can do that.)

I'm also guessing that the Andromeda Initiative
grossly overestimated the number of golden worlds which is why fleet cohesion breaks down upon arrival (see the introduction of rogue Milky Way factions in the last trailer.) Perhaps much of the galaxy was stripped/depleted by another species before the fleet arrives (by the Remnant, using that black gravity-based technology they left everywhere?)

Both these points give us some clear conflict and stakes right away, without needing to build up intricate inter-species relationships.
 

DevilDog

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Both these points give us some clear conflict and stakes right away, without needing to build up intricate inter-species relationships.
Let us not forget that the mass effect isn't reaper related. It's caused from element zero and comes from a star going supernova.

I like your idea about the combining technologies, but I will be let down if they didn't build up intricate species relationships. That was one of the most amazing things about the original trilogy, it gave the world a sense of realism.
 

BrassDragon

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Let us not forget that the mass effect isn't reaper related. It's caused from element zero and comes from a star going supernova.
I know but I thought humanity only started iterating on its applications when they found the Charon relay, which is purposely put there to uplift civilizations along the Reapers desired path of development. Maybe I'm misremembering but I thought all the mass effect technology had Reaper / Leviathan origins.

I like your idea about the combining technologies, but I will be let down if they didn't build up intricate species relationships. That was one of the most amazing things about the original trilogy, it gave the world a sense of realism.
Oh, I have no worries here, I was just framing the premise in such a way the player can get involved right away without needing tons of exposition (vis a vis the first wander around the Citadel in ME1) I'm sure intricacies will build from there.
 

Ralemont

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Mac already squashed the Cerberus thing:

Jake @hypetrains101
@macwalterslives Could the Initiative's benefactors have ties to Cerberus?

Follow
Mac Walters @macwalterslives
@hypetrains101 Not likely. Cerberus was too busy rebuilding Shep or preparing for the imminent arrival of you-know-who... #Reapers

The implication of his reply is that Cerberus wasn't interested in Andromeda at all. I'd make an avatar bet on them not showing up in Andromeda whatsoever.
 

Yeul

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I could see the most concentrated area of call-backs to the original trilogy organizations/happenings in the cultural exchange archives that we saw in that Initiative video (granted, it would only be things up until the end of ME2).The rest might be in passing conversation, like how we saw in TGA's trailer. When Ryder, Vetra, and Drack step foot on that outpost and ask about Sloane Kelly, Sam says,"Before joining the Initiative, as head of Nexus Security, Miss Kelly served in the Alliance, with a nearly spotless record." I would guess that things of that nature happen more often as opposed to a big exposé.
 

DevilDog

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I know but I thought humanity only started iterating on its applications when they found the Charon relay, which is purposely put there to uplift civilizations along the Reapers desired path of development. Maybe I'm misremembering but I thought all the mass effect technology had Reaper / Leviathan origins.
What I mean is that other species could have discovered the mass effect on their own.
 

Ghazi

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Are the ME3 Galaxy At War servers down or is there something up with my network? I can boot ME3 just fine and load MP, but it says that I can't connect to Galaxy At War.
 

Maledict

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I always wondered how the reapers chose the location of the relays and why. If a species evolves in a system that doesn't have a relay, they arent going to discover the mass effect in all liklkehood and therefore won't ever develop as intended through the relay system. Similarly, once a species has been harvested, there's no point leaving a relay in their dead system (in fact, it's probably a direct downside as some remnants of the harvested species could be found which may tip off the next wave).

Along with the timing of the cycles (i.e. 50,000 years is way too often a cycle on the timescales that the reapers outline, given how long evolution takes to occur), it was something I expected them to address in the final game. I sort of expected a dramatic moment when the relays all started to move or something from owner system to another...
 

Heckler456

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Yay. Let us hope those dates stick.

Also, if the book still releases before the game, then maybe we have our first hint as to where their mind is at in terms of releasing the actual game. Sounds like an end of April - beginning of May date to me.
 

Patryn

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It feels very strange that they're announcing all these dates for the ancillary products but still refuse to give a date for the game.

At the very least, seems like a decent chance that if the game does slip to May or November there will be a TON of spoilers out there.
 

Ralemont

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Mar 26, 2014
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No Cerberus in this game.
Thanks for the confirmation, lol.

I had a question that I think you'd be able to answer since it's just a clarification on what Mac said in the latest Gamespot interview: he said there's a handful of handcrafted worlds with stories and characters and history, etc; does he mean that every planet has that type of feel and that there's a handful of them, or that there's a handful of optional planets that are story-centric and others that are more pure gameplay?
 

shinobi602

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Thanks for the confirmation, lol.

I had a question that I think you'd be able to answer since it's just a clarification on what Mac said in the latest Gamespot interview: he said there's a handful of handcrafted worlds with stories and characters and history, etc; does he mean that every planet has that type of feel and that there's a handful of them, or that there's a handful of optional planets that are story-centric and others that are more pure gameplay?
There are a certain number of very large planets that have any number of activities on them. Enemy bases, main plot missions, and other things. These are sort of the "open world" areas you'll freely explore. Some will be more story centric than others. There's also a lot of side areas too that could be smaller planets, outposts, derelict space stations, etc.
 
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There are a certain number of very large planets that have any number of activities on them. Enemy bases, main plot missions, and other things. These are sort of the "open world" areas you'll freely explore. Some will be more story centric than others. There's also a lot of side areas too that could be smaller planets, outposts, derelict space stations, etc.
Hmm, interesting. I guess we truly won't know just how large or small the scope of the game is until launch day.
 

Sou Da

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The "Love Interests for males are objectively ugly and it was done on purpose" for DAI is one of the sentiments I truly hope never makes it to GAF.
 

Yeul

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The "Love Interests for males are objectively ugly and it was done on purpose" for DAI is one of the sentiments I truly hope never makes it to GAF.
I've already seen them on GAF before, with regards to Cassandra in particular. Those comments just make me want to go to sleep for eternity.
 
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The "Love Interests for males are objectively ugly and it was done on purpose" for DAI is one of the sentiments I truly hope never makes it to GAF.
A particularly strange sentiment by them given that a lot of those same people who play Mass Effect probably fawn over Tali who you'll never see outside the suit.

I'm getting horrible flashbacks of the old BioWare boards already.
 

EatChildren

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From what shinobi is saying it sounds like Andromeda is kinda like Inquisition combined with saaaay Mass Effect 2. Wherein you have a small handful of open zone planets, like Mass Effect 1 and Inquisition, which have an assortment of missions, activities, etc. You can spend a lot of time straight on one of these, visiting settlements, chasing big bads, taking over outposts, discovering stuff, going on missions, etc. And return to them. But there may also be smaller hand crafted specific zones either on space stations or other planets.

So it'd be like...land on one planet and it's kind of like Mass Effect's variation of Hinterlands (only hopefully more interesting!). And then you might also be able to land on another planet during a quest arc that take you to a specific outpost or facility, like the Cerberus base during Jack's loyalty mission.
 

Patryn

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From what shinobi is saying it sounds like Andromeda is kinda like Inquisition combined with saaaay Mass Effect 2. Wherein you have a small handful of open zone planets, like Mass Effect 1 and Inquisition, which have an assortment of missions, activities, etc. You can spend a lot of time straight on one of these, visiting settlements, chasing big bads, taking over outposts, discovering stuff, going on missions, etc. And return to them. But there may also be smaller hand crafted specific zones either on space stations or other planets.

So it'd be like...land on one planet and it's kind of like Mass Effect's variation of Hinterlands (only hopefully more interesting!). And then you might also be able to land on another planet during a quest arc that take you to a specific outpost or facility, like the Cerberus base during Jack's loyalty mission.
That's kind of what I've been expecting since I heard there were loyalty missions.

Frankly, I think we all need to brace ourselves for the inevitable wave of people saying "IT'S JUST LIKE INQUISITION" if ME has anything that even smells like an open-world area.

It's unfortunate that Inquisition started with one of the more disjointed and MMOish open areas in the game in the Hinterlands. If it started in something like Exalted Plains or Crestwood, where there was a clear narrative hook for the entire area things would have gone a lot smoother.

Then again the one lesson that Bioware really, really needed to learn is that they should expect players to want to fully complete an area before moving on unless they're absolutely forced to do so. Having a few minor and limp reminders to move on is not enough to compel a player to leave an area, especially if you can easily conquer it by sheer bullheadedness.

If you want people to leave an area and come back later you either need to make the difficulty in the section you're supposed to return to be such a large jump that it's nigh impossible to brute force or actively lock it off until the player accomplishes certain tasks.

However I do think Bioware has learned some of its lessons, because I found the new area in Jaws of Hakkon, the Frostback Basin, to be one of the best areas in the game.

Returning to Mass Effect, I had really forgotten just how much I hated the fetch sidequests in ME3. You know, the ones you get from ambient dialogue and have no real interaction? I can't tell you the number of times I've been running around the Citadel and suddenly had a quest pop up and I realized I'd missed all the setup dialogue. Now, sure that stuff isn't Shakespeare, but it's world building I'd like to have.

At the same time, I'm really enjoying some the ambient stories that don't have quests associated with them. If you don't know what I'm talking about, there are a handful of throwaway stories that occur through ambient dialogue between characters on the Citadel that have multiple beats requiring you to return to the area multiple times to get the full fleshed out story. The most famous of these is the one in the hospital where the Asari relates the story of Joker's sister's death and her fears of the consequences.

I had noticed a few in my earlier playthroughs, but I'm trying to be more patient and noticing even more. Like the Human soldier going off to the front who is married to an Asari and trying to get her daughter back to Thessia but being blocked by red tape, or the little girl whose parents sent her off to the Citadel promising to meet her there. They're nice little bits of world building.

Other things that are annoying me: Once again, I'm reminded just how terrible the journal is. I'd love to know the story behind that one, because it was fine in ME1 and ME2 and suddenly we stepped back to practically Baldur's Gate 2 in terms of usability. Hopefully we have a functional journal in Andromeda.

I'd also love to know why they changed the menu to give one of the two largest and most prominent areas to the control scheme, while moving the journal off to the side and combining it with the codex. It still baffles me how they could break the menu that bad.

That being said, still really enjoying the game. Just caught up with Samara and Jacob and I think I'm about to do Omega before meeting up with the Quarians.
 

Renekton

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I'm trying to understand why Hinterlands failed (or is maligned for), given so many popular RPGs are open-world anyways. Is it POI density? # of sidequests? World building?

The "Love Interests for males are objectively ugly and it was done on purpose" for DAI is one of the sentiments I truly hope never makes it to GAF.
I think the biggest riot happens if Vetra is not into dude Ryder.
 

Maledict

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I'm trying to understand why Hinterlands failed (or is maligned for), given so many popular RPGs are open-world anyways. Is it POI density? # of sidequests? World building?


I think the biggest riot happens if Vetra is not into dude Ryder.
It's far, far too large. If you do what most people do and try to finish it before going elsewhere, you will be massively overlevelled for the set of the game.

At the same time, a lot of the content is really trivial, dumb stuff that doesn't belong in an end of world style adventure. Kill bears, fetch horses ETC - low level MMO quests aren't what I play single player RPGs for.

It's one of the most 'MMO-ish' zones in the game, and that's not a compliment. Particular as it resembles an MMO from 5+ years ago, and not what a modern game looks like (look at Legions levelling content in WoW, it blows Hinterlands out of the water'.

That's still my biggest worry with the new ME. It's not that it's MMO like, it's that it's 2010 MMO-like.
 

Renekton

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It's far, far too large. If you do what most people do and try to finish it before going elsewhere, you will be massively overlevelled for the set of the game.

At the same time, a lot of the content is really trivial, dumb stuff that doesn't belong in an end of world style adventure. Kill bears, fetch horses ETC - low level MMO quests aren't what I play single player RPGs for.

It's one of the most 'MMO-ish' zones in the game, and that's not a compliment. Particular as it resembles an MMO from 5+ years ago, and not what a modern game looks like (look at Legions levelling content in WoW, it blows Hinterlands out of the water'.
Hm so basically the area should be properly paced, game should incentivize the player to move on, and quests need to have better story context.

Having levelled three characters through WoW Legion... I feel what Legion shares with Witcher 3 is both put a ton of VA and backstory into quests and make sure they either a) world-build or b) tie to main story. Otherwise MMORPG quests and single-player RPG quests don't seem fundamentally different in gameplay.
 

Patryn

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It's far, far too large. If you do what most people do and try to finish it before going elsewhere, you will be massively overlevelled for the set of the game.

At the same time, a lot of the content is really trivial, dumb stuff that doesn't belong in an end of world style adventure. Kill bears, fetch horses ETC - low level MMO quests aren't what I play single player RPGs for.

It's one of the most 'MMO-ish' zones in the game, and that's not a compliment. Particular as it resembles an MMO from 5+ years ago, and not what a modern game looks like (look at Legions levelling content in WoW, it blows Hinterlands out of the water'.

That's still my biggest worry with the new ME. It's not that it's MMO like, it's that it's 2010 MMO-like.
A lot of this. It also pretty much lacks a cohesive narrative drawing you through the area. It often feels like they stitched a bunch of smaller areas together that had little to do with one another and called it an open-world area.

Compare, for instance, with Crestwood, an area that has a cohesive plot that naturally pushes you to explore most of the region naturally following a story that is contained for that one area.

Which also reminds me that progression and leveling was kind of broken in Inquisition. It was far too easy to hit the level cap early if you were a completionist. Even if you didn't hit the level cap, it was far, far, FAR too easy to massively over-level yourself out of any challenge. After the very beginning, I don't think I did a single story mission without being about 5 levels higher than the top of the recommended range. At this point I can't play that game without the Take it Slow trial, which halves experience gain.

In addition, the game never communicated which areas corresponded to which level ranges, which meant that in my first playthrough of the game, when I was given a choice of several areas to explore I just happened to pick a higher-level area because it sounded interesting. I completed that area and ended up massively overleveled for the area I should have gone to instead. I hope that Andromeda will either balance for the player being able to go to one of several areas, or clearly communicate what the recommended level for the area is.
 

Bisnic

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A lot of this. It also pretty much lacks a cohesive narrative drawing you through the area. It often feels like they stitched a bunch of smaller areas together that had little to do with one another and called it an open-world area.

Compare, for instance, with Crestwood, an area that has a cohesive plot that naturally pushes you to explore most of the region naturally following a story that is contained for that one area.

Which also reminds me that progression and leveling was kind of broken in Inquisition. It was far too easy to hit the level cap early if you were a completionist. Even if you didn't hit the level cap, it was far, far, FAR too easy to massively over-level yourself out of any challenge. After the very beginning, I don't think I did a single story mission without being about 5 levels higher than the top of the recommended range. At this point I can't play that game without the Take it Slow trial, which halves experience gain.

In addition, the game never communicated which areas corresponded to which level ranges, which meant that in my first playthrough of the game, when I was given a choice of several areas to explore I just happened to pick a higher-level area because it sounded interesting. I completed that area and ended up massively overleveled for the area I should have gone to instead. I hope that Andromeda will either balance for the player being able to go to one of several areas, or clearly communicate what the recommended level for the area is.
I haven't played Inquisition, but they could also just make it so no matter what zone or planet you are on, the enemies will be balanced around your current lvl. No crap such as "Oh this planet is for lvl 30s only, so your Ryder lvl 15 should stick to this lvl 15 planet instead." You want to explore that cool dark purple planet rather than the desert one? Go ahead, nothing gonna stop you. That's the kind of stuff they should do, just like previous Mass Effect games where the "side" planets could be played in any order.
 

Patryn

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I haven't played Inquisition, but they could also just make it so no matter what zone or planet you are on, the enemies will be balanced around your current lvl. No crap such as "Oh this planet is for lvl 30s only, so your Ryder lvl 15 should stick to this lvl 15 planet instead." You want to explore that cool dark purple planet rather than the desert one? Go ahead, nothing gonna stop you. That's the kind of stuff they should do, just like previous Mass Effect games where the "side" planets could be played in any order.
The problem with that approach is that you can easily end up with an Oblivion situation where leveling begins to feel pointless because everything is scaled to you.

I'd argue there's value in having a high level area when you're low level because it gives you something to aspire to visit once you're strong enough.
 

DevilDog

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The "Love Interests for males are objectively ugly and it was done on purpose" for DAI is one of the sentiments I truly hope never makes it to GAF.
Like, I can see a few people not liking Cassandra, even though I thought she was beautiful, but Viviene and Dorian? How can anyone call them ugly?
 

Patryn

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Like, I can see a few people not liking Cassandra, even though I thought she was beautiful, but Viviene and Dorian? How can anyone call them ugly?
I suspect you can't include Dorian in that, because I wouldn't be shocked if what they really meant was "love interests for straight males are objectively ugly, blah blah blah"

Which I completely disagree with. Cassandra looked really nice if you ask me.
 

Ridesh

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I'm quite curious about Liam and Cora looks.
Previous leaks didn't say that Cora is a hottie? But looking at FemRyder face... yeah.
 

DevilDog

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Cassandra was cute af. So tsundere.
Yes, yes she is.

I suspect you can't include Dorian in that, because I wouldn't be shocked if what they really meant was "love interests for straight males are objectively ugly, blah blah blah"

Which I completely disagree with. Cassandra looked really nice if you ask me.
Cassandra looks great.

But I'm curious as to why they said that BioWare did this deliberately.



We're getting off topic here, I hope it's okay.
 
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