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[Ulysses 31]

- what about the (quite plausible) theory that the "real world" was another layer in the Matrix? It was hinted and Neo had his powers in it, while unplugged.

I vaguely remember after Reloaded when people were speculating about a matrix within a matrix, the directors said that wasn't the case.

 

[PleaseDontBanMe]

so basically the original trilogy was within the simulation? zion included?

 

[PleaseDontBanMe]

The Wachowski brothers are both mentally ill these days so it doesn't surprise me how trash this sounds. The Matrix was an amazing film (ideas ripped off from other material but still a great film) but the Wachowski brothers are clearly 1 hit wonders. Because they are 1 hit wonders, they'll continue to bleed The Matrix well dry.

Banned for referring to Wachowki's as brothers (Permanent) ~ RegretEra

 

[Buggy Loop]

so basically the original trilogy was within the simulation? zion included?

I’m not surprised. The architect says there was many versions. At one point a Neo Jesus probably broke a simple version of the Matrix/Scion simulation and they decided “welp, let’s fucking layer this ala inception”

Neo seeing the Scion “real” world like he did in the Matrix at the end of the trilogy pretty much hints that it’s still simulated. Real world there’s no Jesus on LSD seeing code pearl down his eyes.

 

[Stuart360]

I could accept the orig trilogy were actually all happening in the Matrix without people realizing (and would actually be a cool way of explaiing how Neo could still use his powers out of the Matrix), but this bullshit about the orig trilogy being videogames that Anderson made, and didnt really happen, well thats just silly nonsense, and makes the orig trilogy worthless.

 

[ManaByte]

I could accept the orig trilogy were actually all happening in the Matrix without people realizing (and would actually be a cool way of explaiing how Neo could still use his powers out of the Matrix), but this bullshit about the orig trilogy being videogames that Anderson made, and didnt really happen, well thats just silly nonsense, and makes the orig trilogy worthless.

But Reloaded and Revolutions are worthless and the Wachowskis didn't even want to make them.

 

[INC]

Unless my mind is playing tricks on me, the architect said that in previous iterations Zion was destroyed and that the one had to choose people to rebuilt it. He also said that the machines got better at destroying it each time. There was no living on in Zion till Matrix Revolutions.

There must of been, since there's people with out jack point over their body, born and raised in zion

Tbh who cares, first matrix is the only 1 that matters

 

[Stuart360]

But Reloaded and Revolutions are worthless and the Wachowskis didn't even want to make them.

Of course they didnt want to make them, thats why they commited 6 or 7 years of their life to them.
Let me guess, they said this AFTER the lukewarm reception to the sequels?.

 

[FunkMiller]

Thanks for the funny replies. Glad you agree. The Wachowski brothers are 1 hit wonders.

Don’t be a cunt.

They went through the effort, time, money and pain to actually transition properly.

They ain’t like the RegretEra twats who just grow their hair, dye it purple and say they’re women now.

 

[ManaByte]

Of course they didnt want to make them, thats why they commited 6 or 7 years of their life to them.
Let me guess, they said this AFTER the lukewarm reception to the sequels?.

The first movie was meant to be standalone, just look at the ending. The first problem with the sequels was how Reloaded retconned the ending. Instead of Neo being confident he was the One and telling the Machines to go fuck themselves at the end of the first one, he mopes around for most of Reloaded not sure he's the One. WB wanted a franchise, not the Wachowskis.

 

[Ulysses 31]

There must of been, since there's people with out jack point over their body, born and raised in zion

Tbh who cares, first matrix is the only 1 that matters

We don't know how long a cycle is, probably decades or even centuries. Morpheus talked about people before his time who were freeing people from the matrix.

The architect says every Zion inhabitant is terminated. If there were survivors, then they would've told about Zion's prior destructions I'm sure.

If the Matrix 4 is continuation from 3 then it should address what happened to the people of 6th Zion.

 

[INC]

We don't know how long a cycle is, probably decades or even centuries. Morpheus talked about people before his time who were freeing people from the matrix.

The architect says every Zion inhabitant is terminated. If there were survivors, then they would've told about Zion's prior destructions I'm sure.

If the Matrix 4 is continuation from 3 then it should address what happened to the people of 6th Zion.

Didn't he also say they left survivors tho, to rebuild? Been so long since I've cared about the cannon lol

 

[Ulysses 31]

Didn't he also say they left survivors tho, to rebuild? Been so long since I've cared about the cannon lol

Nope, the architect says Neo has to choose 23 people from the matrix to rebuilt Zion.

But yeah, the first movie is still the best one and 4 seems to be somewhat a retread if the rumours are true.

Only interesting story to tell IMO is how the machines rose to power and conquered earth, the 2nd renaissance shorts could be expanded upon so much.

 

[sol_bad]

I don't really care how this new Matrix exists, we know other Matrixs have existed in the past so its plausable it'll happen again. Just gimme amazing martial arts and highway chases.

 

[Ulysses 31]

I don't really care how this new Matrix exists, we know other Matrixs have existed in the past so its plausable it'll happen again. Just gimme amazing martial arts and highway chases.

Tell me at least you care that new entries in a franchise remain consistent with what was established before.

 

[INC]

Nope, the architect says Neo has to choose 23 people from the matrix to rebuilt Zion.

But yeah, the first movie is still the best one and 4 seems to be somewhat a retread if the rumours are true.

Only interesting story to tell IMO is how the machines rose to power and conquered earth, the 2nd renaissance shorts could be expanded upon so much.

Like terminator, the only interesting thing was war, after T2

And older version of the matrix would of been a cool concept, super trippy, since its not perfected yet

 

[Ulysses 31]

Like terminator, the only interesting thing was war, after T2

And older version of the matrix would of been a cool concept, super trippy, since its not perfected yet

Have you seen the 2nd Renaissance? It brings up lots of ideas/concepts of AI and human/machine relationships. Also implies that it was the humans who were the intolerant ones and the aggressors.

With Terminator I would've liked to see how "storming the wire of the camps" ultimately led to the machines losing to humans though since you can see the machines packing a lot of heat and having air superiority in the future flashbacks

 

[TheInfamousKira]

Unless I'm completely misunderstanding you, you just described exactly what The One already is: a program created and used by the Machines as part of their system of managing the human need for rebellion. It's exactly what the Architect's speech reveals to Neo (that he's not breaking the system, simply another part of it controlled by the Machines).

But The One is still a human, giving him or her a small chance of going against the intended purpose of the function, like Neo did. I was saying maybe they just decided to cut out the human element and confine the function of The One to an AI that uses Neo as a blueprint for behavior.

 

[Tokio Blues]

Nope, the architect says Neo has to choose 23 people from the matrix to rebuilt Zion.

But yeah, the first movie is still the best one and 4 seems to be somewhat a retread if the rumours are true.

Only interesting story to tell IMO is how the machines rose to power and conquered earth, the 2nd renaissance shorts could be expanded upon so much.

Wait what? yes, but in the end he chosed to save Trinity. That's why we was different from the others "Ones". Am I missing something?

 

[Ulysses 31]

Wait what? yes, but in the end he chosed to save Trinity. That's why we was different from the others "Ones". Am I missing something?

You missed that I was talking to INC if there were survivors each time Zion got destroyed to which I pointed that the movies don't corroborate that(no one in Zion knew and the architect says they're all killed).

Neo is different that he chooses to safe Trinity instead of rebuilding Zion like his predecessors as you said.

 

[Gp1]

But V For Vendetta, man.

And Cloud Atlas??? and Jupiter Ascending????

Spoiler

 

[Dr_Salt]

So when is the trailer droping? This is getting ridiculous now.

 

[SirKicksalot]

So when is the trailer droping? This is getting ridiculous now.

October because WB has a short marketing window this year.

 

[lame gag1990]

Don’t be a cunt.

They went through the effort, time, money and pain to actually transition properly.

They ain’t like the RegretEra twats who just grow their hair, dye it purple and say they’re women now.

Pardon? I believe in nature and biology (mad, isn't it) so I'm referring to their biologic makeup. The Wachowski brothers are male. I don't care how much they pay to mutilate the body. They will always be male. You're the cunt enabling that kind of attention seeking behaviour. How about you stop enabling.

 

[Star-Lord]

You're the cunt enabling that kind of attention seeking behaviour. How about you stop enabling.

Stop, seriously, before you say something you regret.

 

[lame gag1990]

Stop, seriously, before you say something you regret.

It's my beliefs, I'm entitled to it. He attacked me. I simply replied to him. Now you're at it. Quit it.

 

[Star-Lord]

It's my beliefs, I'm entitled to it. He attacked me. I simply replied to him. Now you're at it. Quit it.

And you just attacked my beliefs, hence why I'm now involved. Calling someone an attention whore because they are who they are is a huge step in the wrong direction. I really advise you stop.

 

[lame gag1990]

And you just attacked my beliefs, hence why I'm now involved. Calling someone an attention whore because they are who they are is a huge step in the wrong direction. I really advise you stop.

Not once did I call someone an "attention whore". Stop trying to put words in my mouth. He attacked me, I defended my views. Then you chimed in. I'll stop now before you say something you regret. See ya.

 

[Star-Lord]

Not once did I call someone an "attention whore". Stop trying to put words in my mouth. He attacked me, I defended my views. Then you chimed in. I'll stop now before you say something you regret. See ya.

I paraphrased slightly, I'll admit, but you weren't far off calling them that. Either way, regardless of whether you used the slur or not, what you said is extremely offensive to me and to many others. But you do you.

 

[VAL0R]

Don’t be a cunt.

They went through the effort, time, money and pain to actually transition properly.

They ain’t like the RegretEra twats who just grow their hair, dye it purple and say they’re women now.

Transition "properly"? What does this mean? So if you take more time, spend more money and exert more effort you can then (and only then?) literally change from being a man to a woman? But not if you take merely some effort? It's not enough to, for example, grow your hair long and appear more feminine and identify yourself as a woman? What then? How much time is required? How much money? How much effort? What is the scientific standard we are using here? It's all completely arbitrary nonsense.

Aren't you an atheist that takes pride in science? What then, is the mechanism which causes a man to become a woman? What shall we observe and measure here? Sheer force of will? Is our nature determined by our will? If so, we could will ourselves to become anything and everything at any time.

Isn't what you are saying something like, "because they are trying really, really hard to be something they're obviously not (women) and could never actually be in reality, I will reward their deluded efforts by naming them after the object of their impossible desire"? It's a little like telling a three year old who is obsessed with dinosaurs and wishes he was a prehistoric predator, "yes Timmy, you're a T-rex."

People who love truth don't speak or think this way. Before you call him a "cunt", realize how completely ridiculous your train of thought is here and how divorced from reality.

Are you calling him a cunt only because he said they were "brothers" (a scientifically verifiable fact) and not "sisters" (make believe nonsense). Why should he be expected to lie albout the nature of these men as men? Because they put great effort into appearing as women? They have failed to do the impossible and remain men (brothers).

If you are willing to lie about their nature as a reward for their hard fought delusional efforts, that's a defect in your logic and in opposition to reality and the truth. Don't judge someone for not joining you in this absurd charade.

 

[Thaedolus]

Transition "properly"? What does this mean? So if you take more time, spend more money and exert more effort you can then (and only then?) literally change from being a man to a woman? But not if you take merely some effort? It's not enough to, for example, grow your hair long and appear more feminine and identify yourself as a woman? What then? How much time is required? How much money? How much effort? What is the scientific standard we are using here? It's all completely arbitrary nonsense.

Aren't you an atheist that takes pride in science? What then, is the mechanism which causes a man to become a woman? What shall we observe and measure here? Sheer force of will? Is our nature determined by our will? If so, we could will ourselves to become anything and everything at any time.

Isn't what you are saying something like, "because they are trying really, really hard to be something they're obviously not (women) and could never actually be in reality, I will reward their deluded efforts by naming them after the object of their impossible desire"? It's a little like telling a three year old who is obsessed with dinosaurs and wishes he was a prehistoric predator, "yes Timmy, you're a T-rex."

People who love truth don't speak or think this way. Before you call him a "cunt", realize how completely ridiculous your train of thought is here and how divorced from reality.

Are you calling him a cunt only because he said they were "brothers" (a scientifically verifiable fact) and not "sisters" (make believe nonsense). Why should he be expected to lie albout the nature of these men as men? Because they put great effort into appearing as women? They have failed to do the impossible and remain men (brothers).

If you are willing to lie about their nature as a reward for their hard fought delusional efforts, that's a defect in your logic and in opposition to reality and the truth. Don't judge someone for not joining you in this absurd charade.

You can’t be so dense as to not realize there are trans women born biologically male and women born biologically female. Woman being a gender identity and male/female being the biological sex.

You might not approve of people transitioning and some extremist might want to pretend biological sex isn’t a real thing, but all you’re really being asked to do is have some common courtesy with regard to how someone is telling you they are.

 

[VAL0R]

You can’t be so dense as to not realize there are trans women born biologically male and women born biologically female. Woman being a gender identity and male/female being the biological sex.

You might not approve of people transitioning and some extremist might want to pretend biological sex isn’t a real thing, but all you’re really being asked to do is have some common courtesy with regard to how someone is telling you they are.

A "trans woman" is merely an actual man pretending to be a woman. You can veil the nakedly obvious with semantics and call me dense all you like.

 

[Thaedolus]

A "trans woman" is merely an actual man pretending to be a woman. You can veil the nakedly obvious with semantics and call me dense all you like.

Again, you’re free to feel that way and believe what you believe, the only real request is just don’t be a chode and if someone says they’re a woman, just be nice and call them that.

 

[VAL0R]

Again, you’re free to feel that way and believe what you believe, the only real request is just don’t be a chode and if someone says they’re a woman, just be nice and call them that.

No, thats not kindness. I know someone who is mentally ill and believes himself at times to be other persons. I tell him something like, "No, you're my buddy [Bob], remember?" It wouldn't be kind to reinforce his delusion.

I believe in two genders as a matter of verifiable scientific fact, but also religious (Catholic/Christian) doctrine. God made them, male and female and the man shall be united to his wife in marriage and the two shall become one flesh, by God's design.

I'm not going to betray my sincerely and deeply held religious principles to protect someone's feelings by supporting their gender delusions. I am too comiitted to the truth and my faith. Frankly, it's unkind to ask me to do so. Generally speaking, it's unethical to ask someone to betray their conscience, if it can be avoided reasonably.

I would not go seeking ways to call a "trans woman" a man. Why needlessly offend? I would just avoid using pronouns when possible, but I won't hide from my views and am unashamed to speak the truth.

Edit:

I'll add that if I interacted with a trans individual, I would be kind to them. I love them (will their good). I would pray for them and try to befriend them. I'm sure they would see my views as deeply offensive, but I would try to find some common ground with them. "Speak the truth in love." I think, if they were fair, they would see I am coming from a sincere place and not a hateful one. Honestly I would pity them. I know many trans people suffer terribly with their sexual identity. I can imagine what a nightmare it would be for me to try to look feminine. It must be brutal, to hate what you see in the mirror and deeply longing, obsessing even, to be someone else. I can empathize with that very real pain, if not the gender swapping philosophy.

 

[sol_bad]

So how about that trailer hey fellas.

 

[VAL0R]

So how about that trailer hey fellas.

Yeah, fair enough. Back on topic.

 

[Thaedolus]

No, thats not kindness. I know someone who is mentally ill and believes himself at times to be other persons. I tell him something like, "No, you're my buddy [Bob], remember?" It wouldn't be kind to reinforce his delusion.

I believe in two genders as a matter of verifiable scientific fact, but also religious (Catholic/Christian) doctrine. God made them, male and female and the man shall be united to his wife in marriage and the two shall become one flesh, by God's design.

I'm not going to betray my sincerely and deeply held religious principles to protect someone's feelings by supporting their gender delusions. I am too comiitted to the truth and my faith. Frankly, it's unkind to ask me to do so. Generally speaking, it's unethical to ask someone to betray their conscience, if it can be avoided reasonably.

I would not go seeking ways to call a "trans woman" a man. Why needlessly offend? I would just avoid using pronouns when possible, but I won't hide from my views and am unashamed to speak the truth.

Edit:

I'll add that if I interacted with a trans individual, I would be kind to them. I love them (will their good). I would pray for them and try to befriend them. I'm sure they would see my views as deeply offensive, but I would try to find some common ground with them. "Speak the truth in love." I think, if they were fair, they would see I am coming from a sincere place and not a hateful one. Honestly I would pity them. I know many trans people suffer terribly with their sexual identity. I can imagine what a nightmare it would be for me to try to look feminine. It must be brutal, to hate what you see in the mirror and deeply longing, obsessing even, to be someone else. I can empathize with that very real pain, if not the gender swapping philosophy.

“My way is god’s way and actually anything I do is a kindness because it’s right and true” certainly never backfired in the course of history

 

[VAL0R]

“My way is god’s way and actually anything I do is a kindness because it’s right and true” certainly never backfired in the course of history

That's not what I said, but I won't derail further.

 

[eyesabitdull]

Thread went off track real fast hitting the third page.

 

[xandaca]

But The One is still a human, giving him or her a small chance of going against the intended purpose of the function, like Neo did. I was saying maybe they just decided to cut out the human element and confine the function of The One to an AI that uses Neo as a blueprint for behavior.

Gotcha, thanks for clarifying.

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Did they ever explain why Neo had powers in zion?

It makes zero sense. He could see matrix lines in the real world? And blow up a trillion bombs thrown at him?

I'm still going with the matrix in a matrix theory.

 

[Mexen]

In the 4th movie, Neo has forgotten he is the one and Trinity has forgotten that she's dead.

Not only will this movie suck, it will be full of easter eggs from the trilogy.

 

[xandaca]

Did they ever explain why Neo had powers in zion?

It makes zero sense. He could see matrix lines in the real world? And blow up a trillion bombs thrown at him?

I'm still going with the matrix in a matrix theory.

Yes. It's in the scene between the Oracle and Neo in Revolutions.




"The power of the One extends beyond this world. It reaches from here all the way back to where it came from. [...] The Source. That's what you felt when you touched those sentinels, but you weren't ready for it. You should be dead, but apparently you weren't ready for that either."

More specifically: in the scene with the Architect at the end of Reloaded, Neo learns that his power is a program given to him, and his predecessors, by the Machines. Because of this, and presumably because the Machines need to be able to transfer the program from one 'One' to the next upon completion of their task, the One program has a connection to the Source, which can in a sense be considered the motherboard of all machine activity: the sentinels, the Matrix, everything is linked through it. Therefore, Neo's connection to the Source via his powers means he is also indirectly linked to all machine 'life', including the sentinels. That connection lay dormant until the Architect made him aware of it, although Neo was still unaware of how far that connection went: he had become aware of its existence, but didn't know he could use it. With every previous One having acceded to the Architect, it can be assumed that no 'One' prior to Neo had ever had the chance to test that connection in the real world: all Neo's precedents would have re-entered the Matrix, freed the required number of survivors to rebuild Zion, before giving himself up for the Machines to disseminate the One program to allow it to eventually be passed onto his successor. When Neo returns to the real world, his awareness of his connection to the machines, via his power's link to the Source, allows him to detect the sentinels and use that connection to disable them, even if he doesn't (yet) know exactly how he's doing it. He's not doing anything to the sentinels physically, but subconsciously (wirelessly, if you like) sending a command from his powers, through the Source, and into them. Him tapping into a part of himself he didn't previously know existed and does not yet understand how he can control, the part of him which spans both the real and the Machine worlds, is what sends him into a coma.

I don't know if that explanation helps clarify things, and there's a bit of interpretation and a few gaps involved, but contrary to popular belief there is an explanation given. Like a lot of the sequels, it just requires quite a bit of work to piece it together and the dialogue is written and delivered so mechanically (sometimes intentionally, but it still doesn't help) that it's easy to gloss over.

 

[ManaByte]

I don't know if that explanation helps clarify things, and there's a bit of interpretation and a few gaps involved, but contrary to popular belief there is an explanation given. Like a lot of the sequels, it just requires quite a bit of work to piece it together and the dialogue is written and delivered so mechanically (sometimes intentionally, but it still doesn't help) that it's easy to gloss over.

 

[Rat Rage]

Did they ever explain why Neo had powers in zion?

It makes zero sense. He could see matrix lines in the real world? And blow up a trillion bombs thrown at him?

I'm still going with the matrix in a matrix theory.

I present you the best Matrix Interpretation I have found ages ago somewhere on the interwebs. Read it. It's amazing.

Neo is a machine, kinda. He is a human with enhanced genetics, enhanced implants, and a machine programmed mind (probably based on a "The One" template program). That's why, at the end of Revolutions, when his body is being taken away, he is shown as an orange glow. The orange glow is how the machines see each other, and therefore how they see Neo. It is also how Neo sees Smith inside Bane... he is seeing the machine program of Smith inside Bane's mind, and therefore it is an orange glow in the shape of the Smith.

But the orange glow isn't the only reason to believe Neo is a machine. Throughout the trilogy other hints are given, such as: "His neural kinetics are way above normal.", "He's a machine.", "Your five predecessors were by design based on a similar predication...", etc.

So if Neo is a machine, why was he created (as all machines must have a purpose)? He was created by the Oracle and the Architect to be The One. As the Architect explains to him: "Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the Matrix... Your five predecessors were by design based on a similar predication, a contingent affirmation that was meant to create a profound attachment to the rest of your species, facilitating the function of The One... The function of The One is now to return to the Source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program."

Translated, the Architect is explaining that Neo was designed to be a religious figure to the freed humans, thus causing them to put their faith (hope) in Neo and to rally around him ("...sum of a remainder..."). This helps to ensure that the freed humans are focused on Neo instead of war, and to keep them all together in one place, Zion (which was built by the machines for this purpose also). Neo is a form of control in the real world.

And just to make sure that Neo carries out his part of their plan, the machines programmed him with "... a contingent affirmation that was meant to create a profound attachment to the [humans]." This, along with his enhanced abilities and the "guidance" of the Oracle, keeps him on the intended course.

The Architect also states that "The function of The One is now to return to the Source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program." This simply means that The One program in Neo's mind is the most important (prime) program in the Matrix, and that now that his mission (purpose) is complete, he must return to the source for deletion (all machines must have a purpose). The phrase "... temporary dissemination..." means that the The One program will be used again in the next version of the Matrix. This is also why Neo's choice of the left door will destroy the Matrix, as there can be only one The One in the Matrix at any time. By staying in the Matrix Neo is preventing it from being reloaded, as a reload will do nothing without another The One for the next version. (In programming terms he is the highest priority task, and he will not release the Matrix program's main semaphore.)

OK, so The One is a human with enhanced genetics, enhanced implants, and a machine programmed mind, and was created by the Oracle and the Architect to carry out a specific purpose (form of control in and out of the Matrix) in each iteration of the Matrix. Now let's see how The One fits in with the entire story of the trilogy.

As is explained, the Matrix was created by the Architect, at the end of the war with the humans, as a way to control the humans and use them as a power source (I know, hard to believe...). The first Matrix was "... quite naturally perfect, it was a work of art, flawless, sublime.", while the second Matrix was redesigned "... to more accurately reflect the varying grotesqueries of your nature." Basically Heaven and then Hell. In both cases, however, no conscious choice was given to the humans as to whether or not they wanted to believe in the reality of the Matrix. This caused the majority of humans to reject the Matrix and die ("... whole crops were lost.").

To solve this problem the Oracle was created, and realized correctly that the humans needed to be given a choice: "Thus, the answer was stumbled upon by another, an intuitive program, initially created to investigate certain aspects of the human psyche... she stumbled upon a solution whereby nearly 99.9% of all test subjects accepted the program, as long as they were given a choice, even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level." So by giving humans a choice, even at an unconscious level that only 0.1% are ever aware of, they accepted the Matrix.

Unfortunately for the machines, however, a majority of the 0.1% who were aware of the choice usually chose the real world over the Matrix. "While this answer functioned, it was obviously fundamentally flawed, thus creating the otherwise contradictory systemic anomaly, that if left unchecked might threaten the system itself. Ergo, those that refused the program, while a minority, if unchecked, would constitute an escalating probability of disaster." The machines therefore also needed a way to control the 0.1% of the humans who chose the real world over the Matrix, thus Zion and The One were created.

As was explained earlier, Zion was built by the machines to ensure that the freed humans would all gather in one place, and The One was created to be their religious figure, helping to distract them from renewed war with the machines. Both forms of control.

But even with Zion and The One, the unpredictability of choice ("systemic anomoly") still forced the machines to occasionally "reload" the Matrix. This always occurs when The One reaches the Source, which he can only do after attaining the level of power necessary for him to defeat the Merovingian, obtain the Keymaker, etc. The One program is then temporarily reinserted into the Source (machine mainframe), in preparation for the next iteration of the Matrix. In the process the machines gain the knowledge and experiences of The One, allowing them to better predict the future behavior of the humans, and thus reduce the systemic anomolies.

So that is the situation at the start of the sixth iteration of the choice-Matrix. Luckily for the humans, however, the Oracle does not want them to be enslaved in the Matrix any longer, or for the freed humans to be killed. She therefore decides to take a risk and use Neo to bring about a "revolution".

In M1 (The Matrix) she meets with The One, Neo, as she has done in the five previous iterations of the Matrix. Normally she simply helps guide The One to his meeting with the Architect. Except this time the Oracle gives Neo a special cookie, which he eats. The cookie isn't actually a cookie, though, it's an upgrade to Neo's program. Since the Oracle created the The One program, she can predict exactly what Neo will do in the future, specifically how he will destroy Smith (from the inside, with some copying from Neo to Smith occuring). She therefore includes in the program upgrade code that will give Smith the ability to replicate himself, and for Neo and Smith to see the future as she does.

In M2 (The Matrix Reloaded) Neo plays out his role as The One, meeting with the Architect. However, due to his love for Trinity he chooses the left door, preventing the Matrix from reloading. This was seen in advance by the Oracle, as she has the ability to predict Neo's behavior (as explained above) as well as human behavior in general (due to the nature of her program). She therefore told Trinity that she would fall in love with Neo (in M1), all the while knowing it would eventually cause Neo to choose the left door.

In M3 (The Matrix Revolutions) the Oracle's plan comes to fruition. While the machines begin their assualt on Zion (for the sixth time), Smith continues to replicate himself throughout the Matrix. Neo, on the otherhand, is stuck in the train station. Apparently, fulfilling his mission to meet with the Architect unlocks some section of his program that allows Neo to use his enhanced implants to once again become part of the machine collective (perhaps because of the Oracle's upgrade?). He is therefore able to sense and control other machines wirelessly. The first example of this is when he stops the sentinels at the end of M2. Since he is not quite ready to use his new abilities, however, his program gets stuck at the security checkpoint of the Matrix, the train station.

continued..

In the train station Neo meets with Rama Kandra, his wife, and their daughter Sati. Rama and his wife are both machines from the real world who can jack into the Matrix, like all other machines, and live human lives. Sati is a program created by these two machines out of love, which Rama explains to Neo is not out of the grasp of the machines. They are on their way back into the Matrix to leave Sati with the Oracle for safe keeping, as any program without a purpose is deleted.

After being rescued from the train station by Trinity, Morpheus, and Seraph, Neo is helped out of the Matrix using the standard jack. While aboard the Hammer he has another vision of the future, this time of the three power lines leading from the Matrix power station to 01, the machine city (he is able to see the power lines due to his newfound connection to the machine collective). He therefore takes the Logos, along with Trinity, and leaves for 01. Along the way he confronts the stowaway Bane (who has the Smith program inside of him), and is blinded by him. Although blind, Neo is still able to see other machines (orange glow), including the Smith program inside Bane, which he uses to defeat Bane. He also uses his power to control other machines to detonate the bombs fired at the Logos by the 01 defenses.

Meanwhile Smith is replicating out of control in the Matrix, and eventually confronts the Oracle after taking over Seraph and Sati. They have a brief conversation in which he calls her "Mom", referring to the fact that she helped to create him (along with the Architect) as well as Neo (part of his program now). The Oracle then tells Smith to "Do what you came here to do.", so he takes over her as well. The newly formed Smith then stands up and laughs hysterically, foreshadowing the events at the end of the movie.

Eventually the Logos crashes in 01, but not before Neo gets a top-down view of the orange glowing city with his newfound machine-vision (notice the fractal patterns). Unfortunately Trinity is killed in the crash, and explains to Neo that both of them have been living on borrowed time. Neo since he was ressurected by Trinity, and Trinity since she was ressurected by Neo. Both are meant to die and Trinity is simply happy for the oportunity this time to tell Neo how she feels about him. (But shame on the brothers for killing off Trinity in such a lame way. Couldn't she have at least died trying to save the ship, not just letting it crash!)

Neo then leaves the Logos and enters the machine building into which it crashed (the building is seen in the same orange glowing machine-vision). He is then confronted by the Deus Ex Machina, who knows that Neo is the only one who can stop Smith from destroying the Matrix, but still shows hatred toward Neo (due to the fact that he is mostly human). After a show of force, the Deus Ex Machina agrees to peace with the humans in exchange for Neo's promise to destroy Smith. This causes the sentinels to halt their attack on the Zion temple, the last holdout of the remaining humans (the dock and city have already been destroyed).

The machines then jack Neo into the Matrix, since he has not yet masterred the ability to do so wirelessly (this theme of Neo having to learn to use his new abilities runs throughout the trilogy). Neo then confronts Smith, who says he has seen the future, and that he (the one particular Smith) is the one that defeats Neo. The other Smiths (all of the other people in the Matrix have now been taken over by him) therefore only watch as the fight begins.

After a brutal battle Neo is near defeat, but continues to fight. When asked why he does so, Neo responds "Because I choose to.", echoing the theme in M2 that "Everything begins with choice." (the only way humans achieve true freedom). But even though he delivers a stunning punch to Smith which sends him through the ground, Neo is eventually defeated. Before Smith takes him over he pauses, however, realizing that he has seen this very moment in his visions, and he already knows what he is going to say. "Everything that has a beginning has an end..." he mutters confusedly. This causes Neo to realize that the Oracle still exists somewhere inside of Smith, and that she is partially able to control his thoughts. Taking his cue from the Oracle, Neo freely gives himself to Smith.

Thus Neo is defeated, and Smith's original purpose, to defeat The One (which he is never really expected to achieve, which leads to his bad temperment) is accomplished. Smith therefore no longer has a purpose and must be deleted. But since programs marked for deletion must return to the source, how is Smith to be deleted? Simple, the machines send the command through Neo, into Smith, using a burst of energy. This causes all of the Smith clones, and the original Smith, to be deleted, leaving the original inhabitants of the bodies he has taken over (this is a basic function of the agent programs, that they leave their hosts as they found them, with death being the only exception).

This then completes another revolution in the Matrix cycle, as The One has reached the Source and has reinserted the prime program (Neo's program, his knowledge and experiences). The Matrix is then reloaded back to it's initial state, the late 20th century.

The Oracle then meets with Sati, Seraph, and the Architect in a park outside the city as the sun rises over it. The Architect tells her that she was playing a "very risky game", and she asks him if he will honor the promise of peace. He says that he will, since he is not human (meaning humans do not keep their promises, an insult). This means that those people who unconsciously become aware of the Matrix and choose to leave will be freed, and those living in Zion will not be killed. The war between man and machine is over, or at least suspended.

Looking upon the sunrise the Oracle asks Sati if that was her doing, and the girl responds that she did it for Neo (made the sun rise). Apparently Neo's experience with love, which was uploaded from him to the Source, caused the machines to show pity on Sati and give her a purpose instead of deleting her. She is now in control of the sun. Sati also asks the Oracle if they will ever see Neo again, and the Oracle replies that they might, indicating that the The One program will be used again in the future, as it had been for the previous six iterations of the Matrix. M3 therefore ends where M1 began, except that now the humans who become aware of the Matrix will be freed (a decent compromise if you ask me).

 

[Azelover]

Yes. It's in the scene between the Oracle and Neo in Revolutions.




"The power of the One extends beyond this world. It reaches from here all the way back to where it came from. [...] The Source. That's what you felt when you touched those sentinels, but you weren't ready for it. You should be dead, but apparently you weren't ready for that either."

More specifically: in the scene with the Architect at the end of Reloaded, Neo learns that his power is a program given to him, and his predecessors, by the Machines. Because of this, and presumably because the Machines need to be able to transfer the program from one 'One' to the next upon completion of their task, the One program has a connection to the Source, which can in a sense be considered the motherboard of all machine activity: the sentinels, the Matrix, everything is linked through it. Therefore, Neo's connection to the Source via his powers means he is also indirectly linked to all machine 'life', including the sentinels. That connection lay dormant until the Architect made him aware of it, although Neo was still unaware of how far that connection went: he had become aware of its existence, but didn't know he could use it. With every previous One having acceded to the Architect, it can be assumed that no 'One' prior to Neo had ever had the chance to test that connection in the real world: all Neo's precedents would have re-entered the Matrix, freed the required number of survivors to rebuild Zion, before giving himself up for the Machines to disseminate the One program to allow it to eventually be passed onto his successor. When Neo returns to the real world, his awareness of his connection to the machines, via his power's link to the Source, allows him to detect the sentinels and use that connection to disable them, even if he doesn't (yet) know exactly how he's doing it. He's not doing anything to the sentinels physically, but subconsciously (wirelessly, if you like) sending a command from his powers, through the Source, and into them. Him tapping into a part of himself he didn't previously know existed and does not yet understand how he can control, the part of him which spans both the real and the Machine worlds, is what sends him into a coma.

I don't know if that explanation helps clarify things, and there's a bit of interpretation and a few gaps involved, but contrary to popular belief there is an explanation given. Like a lot of the sequels, it just requires quite a bit of work to piece it together and the dialogue is written and delivered so mechanically (sometimes intentionally, but it still doesn't help) that it's easy to gloss over.

Yes, that is the explanation. But it doesn't fully satisfy me. We know that Neo stopped the sentinels because they were hooked up wirelessly to the Source. But to me that doesn't explain why he could see the world after he went blind. I know it's explained that everything is inter-connected, like an Internet of things. But it was never explored in-depth. If that's the case, it would be a great opportunity to expand on that concept.

Although for me personally, the Inception(Leonardo DiCaprio movie) theory is a lot more interesting, and has more potential in terms of depth. And it's more plausible to me. But we'll see what they went with.

I just hope it's a good movie.

 

[mcjmetroid]

Is there ANY chance this will turn out good? They haven't even made a really good film since V for Vendetta and now there's only one of them. Jupiter ascending really sucked. Their track record to me isn't the best, though I'll admit I enjoyed Cloud Atlas. From Wiki :

1995	Assassins	No	Yes	No	[19][12][77]
1996	Bound	Yes	Yes	Executive
1999	The Matrix	Yes	Yes	Executive
2001	The Matrix Revisited	No	No	Executive	Documentary
2003	The Animatrix	No	Yes	Yes	Direct-to-video Wrote: "Final Flight of the Osiris" Story by: "The Second Renaissance Part I & II" and "Kid's Story"
The Matrix Reloaded	Yes	Yes	Executive
The Matrix Revolutions	Yes	Yes	Executive
2005	V for Vendetta	No	Yes	Yes	Second unit directors (uncredited)[12][219][220][221][222][223]
2007	The Invasion	No	Uncredited	No	Rewrites[35][224]
2008	Speed Racer	Yes	Yes	Yes
2009	Ninja Assassin	No	No	Yes
2012	Cloud Atlas	Yes	Yes	Yes	Co-directed with Tom Tykwer
2014	Google Me Love	No	No	Executive	Short film[225]
2015	Jupiter Ascending	Yes	Yes	Yes
2021	The Matrix Resurrections	Lana only	Lana only	Lana only

 

[Slicker than your average]

I'm intrigued but you just know it's going to be shit.

 

[xandaca]

Yes, that is the explanation. But it doesn't fully satisfy me. We know that Neo stopped the sentinels because they were hooked up wirelessly to the Source. But to me that doesn't explain why he could see the world after he went blind. I know it's explained that everything is inter-connected, like an Internet of things. But it was never explored in-depth. If that's the case, it would be a great opportunity to expand on that concept.

Although for me personally, the Inception(Leonardo DiCaprio movie) theory is a lot more interesting, and has more potential in terms of depth. And it's more plausible to me. But we'll see what they went with.

I just hope it's a good movie.

Re: Neo being able to see after he's blinded, to me he was 'seeing' through his connection to the Machines, and in the same way they do: the only things visible to him were either connected to the Source (power lines, sentinels) or the Matrix (Agent Smith inside Bane's body). Symbolically, it was his third eye opening on his way to enlightenment.

As for the Matrix-within-a-Matrix-within-a-Matrix theory (which I assume is what you're referring to with Inception), I personally don't see any justification for it in any of the films or see what it would bring to the story or the themes. A lot of the symbolism in the films is based around dualities and mirrored opposites, and having the real world be a second Matrix adds another layer which doesn't make any sense. The third 'level' of reality, if you like, is the fusion between the real world and the Matrix which has been achieved by the end of Revolutions: the humans are freed if they want to be and thus the separation between the two worlds has broken down, in the same way that Neo brought about that third way by no longer battling his opposite (Smith), but merging with it. I could have given a much more detailed answer about twenty-odd years ago, when I a bit (unhealthily) obsessed with the 'meaning' of these movies, especially since I haven't seen them in several years, but the broad strokes I remember is that Neo's journey is heavily based in Hinduism and achieving enlightenment (peace) by breaking the karmic cycle of cause and effect. I don't see any room for the real world being another Matrix within the existing symbolism.