Nocturnowl
Member
Its that time once again where the drip feed of a new pokemon generation begins, leading to what will almost certainly be another journey through a region containing 8 gyms, and some sort of villainous team that want to use the box legend to aid in whatever nonsense scheme theyre concocting, and that's fine by me for the most part.
Sun and Moon may be the future, but as of late I wager a number of us instead looked to the past with the recent virtual console releases of the 1st Generation Pokemon titles. Though antiquated and fundamentally flawed in ways, I have to admit that I enjoyed this trip back down nostalgia lane way more than I expected to and part of that is because despite the many advances the series has taken over the years, there are some things about the original adventure that still hold strong to this day that the series could do well to draw from.
Kantos gradually opening map structure
I think I made a big post about this way back when the Pokemon community threads around here were in their own first generation which is lost to the deep depths of GAF and didn't gain much traction. Fortunately upon bringing up this point briefly again recently posters like Revven and GSnap elaborated on it in the current Pokemon red/blue/yellow OT so I'm now convinced I'm not crazy.
So to reiterate...
Kanto may not be the flashiest region but its not just remembered for nostalgia purposes alone. Adventure is an important element of these games and exploration with options is a big part of what makes things more adventurous. Kanto guides the player on a rather linear journey through the games first half, a bit of back tracking every now and then that helps make the world that much more connected but otherwise it does a good job of keeping players knowing where to go.
The Rock Tunnel area almost feels like a graduation ceremony where upon emerging the other side in Lavender town the game begins to let go a bit. The map doesnt fully open up until you deal with some events in Celadon City, namely getting the Silph Scope and going back to Lavender Town to tackle the Pokemon tower. Still the brief gap between these events leaves more routes open to the player to discover (albeit both of them end with a Snorlax) and the fourth gym to tackle if you so feel like it.
When youre handed the pokeflute to move Snorlaxs progression preventing backside from the equation its like getting the keys to the Kanto kingdom, combine this with a glass of fresh water for the Saffron City gate guards and theres a sudden sense of freedom in how you choose to tackle some of the games upcoming events.
Typically Ill rush down cycling road to get to the safari zone early as possible, some may begin to tackle Saffrons Silph Co and others may choose to soak up some exp battling the long path down from Lavender Town, maybe they want the Super Rod, I didnt so I just bypassed the whole route entirely.
Rushing down to Fuchsia can also net you the HMs for Surf and Strength and the appropriate gyms locking the usage of these abilities are ready to tackle. Basically by the time I went to do Silph Co I had already gone to scoop up Articuno from the Seafoam Islands.
For another example maybe a Blue version player wanted Magmar and took a quick trip down from Pallet to Cinnabar to nab one as early as they could and just skip Seafoam entirely.
Times have changed now, the modern games seem to fear kids getting lost or confused as to where to go which has slowly led to the game progression becoming increasingly linear. Many paths blocked off with random events (Black2 even has a bit of fun with this, random dudes just dancing in the middle of the path because FUCK YOU) or a greater swath of HM gating (Looking at you Sinnoh).
Which ultimately led to the otherwise decent and quite varied Unova region of Gen 5 having the most bland map layout possible in its original state, at least what I can say here is that they used HMs as the tool for optional exploring as opposed to main game progression but the point still stands that is choice of map structure tended to leave a negative response no matter how much Unova had in it even before the sequel expansion.
Would it really be asking too much to have the freedom to explore once more beyond the halfway point of the game? A region map that neatly connects back on itself so backtracking without Fly is something more feasible and also doesnt require dragging an HM slave around to ensure you can re-smash that one rock that manages to keep blocking a specific path?
I think the Sinnoh region was stung by this the most of all because the region itself is teeming with the potential of exploration but ultimately railroads you through.
Put it this way, in Gen 1 a Lapras is forced on the player as a reward for slogging through the majority of Silph Cos rocket gauntlet. In Gen 6 Lapras is forced upon the player because theres a small section of water to cross and the game is going to teach you how to surf by force.
repels effect wore off
The Caves of Endurance
Now admittedly I think we all shudder at this, I dont think anyone leaps for joy at going through Mt Moon or Rock Tunnel, the fact that they have Pokemon Centers by their entrances pretty much sets the tone.
Still theres something to take away from these tiring treks and thats preparation. The Pokemon series throws all manner of items at the player yet how often does anyone ever need to bust out an ether to restore PP, contemplate escape roping back out to recover instead of losing half their money or just be prepared with antidotes and potions in general?
Why back in my day you got poisoned and feared its lingering effects, you stocked up on antidotes to ensure your pokemon didnt faint slowly and painfully as you scrambled through the dark. These days though your pokemon gets poisoned and it represses the effects outside of battle thus kinda defeating the point, it even wears off when they would otherwise faint. Poppycock I say, on top of this while theres still plenty of caverns to clamber through in the series to this day they basically come across more like mild inconveniences, Im just saying there isnt anything wrong with testing the player, it builds character and makes the items and general economy worth more (well I think they even dialled back on how much money you lose for whiting out but even so).
Most caves in the series now are something of a blur, they dont have that enduring legacy. Most of the ones I remember come from Black because the game was quite smart about making them visually interesting (Twist Mountain) or having unique pokemon instead of Zubat by the bucketload (see Chargestone Cave and its unique electric focused lineup).
Now Im not saying that I want a plethora of tedious caves to endure but I am saying that gauntlets like Mt Coronet are something of a rewarding experience in themselves.
Right now I cant even recall the main caves of Kalos, there was the reflection cave and one that I sloooowly rode a Rhyhorn over to?
2: The most ineffective trainer battle placement in the series
More optional areas in the main game
Obviously saying that modern Pokemon games have no optional areas would be pretty silly, the post game tends to rely on such things.
Still thats the post game, when it comes to the main game its never quite the same deal.
Kanto has Seafoam Islands and the Power Plant as optional areas with notable rewards (some TMs, items and Legendary Birds). Johto is practically the king of this throwing places like Mt Mortar, Ruins of Alph, Dark Cave and Whirl Islands in plain sight of the players standard journey yet you dont even have to venture through any of them if youre not invested in what secrets they hold (and lets face it, Mt Mortar is a horrendous troll, hope you had a slot ready for the not so legendary Tyrouge, yeah Ill just surf on past this one).
This once again steps back to that exploration point, you have options here to investigate these places or go and discover them, alternatively you might just think screw it and just carry on.
Now its not so much a case of these sort of areas no longer existing, going back to an earlier point Black/White used HMs as the optional tool to discover these sort of locations and nab some special pokemon like those musketeer chaps and the Larvesta egg.
Sinnoh while mostly doing its work in the postgame has bits and pieces like Iron Island and the Old Chateau as well, though of course the latters main draw with Rotom is once again post game content making an earlier visit less fruitful
Its more that these sort of areas seem to be less in focus, not to bag on Kalos again but it didnt have much to offer here as I recall, even one of the more seemingly interesting optional routes discoverable quite early on in the quest turns out to just be the stopping point for a post game legendary bird after youve encountered it seven or so times.
I guess my point here is to tease more locations that are worth exploring during the main game not for progression but for rewards. How about instead of just giving the player a Mega Lucario you have an area nearby where youll get one at the end if you actually want it?
(of course it's also worth saying here that Gen 1 has anaemic post game content but hey it was their first swing at this)
A worthwhile Safari Zone
Lets not underestimate the appeal of the original Safari Zone, it was a treasure trove of rare pokemon with most of them native to the area only obtainable within. You came across a Tauros and It felt like a big deal, even when you werent encountering the rarest beasts you were at least seeing ones that didnt reside elsewhere like Rhyhorn and Exeggcute and as a bonus the levels were high enough to match your team at the time. Its like a win/win situation. Lob in some TMs, Rare Candies and you have a safari stew going.
When the Safari Zone returned in Hoenn it was already showing signs of being a shade of its former glory, bike exclusive areas and pokeblock gimmicks aside there was a lack of excitement by comparison, look I like Xatu and all but when thats one of your big draws along with wheeling Pinsir back out like hes new and exciting then the lustre is somewhat lost.
Still Hoenns safari zone was a treasure compared to THE GREAT MARSH.
God damn does the Great Marsh of Sinnoh blow chunks, a Safari zone where what few rare and unique pokemon reside there are determined by daily chance, a safari zone filled with the same pokemon squatting in every other route, just in case you missed your 100th chance to catch Bidoof or Budew or Starly, AWFUL.
The lack of any more in Gens 5 and 6 makes me wonder if they forgot how to make the zone an appealing change of pace to bolster your dex. The solution of course is right there in Kanto.
Id add something about podding starts and difficulty but thats like a whole thread to itself, Im just going to say the new EXP share is great but please actually balance the game around it next time.
By the way this thread shouldnt be viewed in a Gen 1 is the best, new games smell kinda way because thatd just be a flat out lie, mechanically each generation improves on the last yet its almost like at the expense of that the actual adventure becomes more constricted. I just want Sun/Moon to hit a home run where I can get all the finely tuned updated mechanics and QoL improvements alongside a region I get to explore and where I dont need to be forcefully told how to use a pokemon center or play alongside friends that I really dont care for.
Sun and Moon may be the future, but as of late I wager a number of us instead looked to the past with the recent virtual console releases of the 1st Generation Pokemon titles. Though antiquated and fundamentally flawed in ways, I have to admit that I enjoyed this trip back down nostalgia lane way more than I expected to and part of that is because despite the many advances the series has taken over the years, there are some things about the original adventure that still hold strong to this day that the series could do well to draw from.
Kantos gradually opening map structure
I think I made a big post about this way back when the Pokemon community threads around here were in their own first generation which is lost to the deep depths of GAF and didn't gain much traction. Fortunately upon bringing up this point briefly again recently posters like Revven and GSnap elaborated on it in the current Pokemon red/blue/yellow OT so I'm now convinced I'm not crazy.
So to reiterate...
Kanto may not be the flashiest region but its not just remembered for nostalgia purposes alone. Adventure is an important element of these games and exploration with options is a big part of what makes things more adventurous. Kanto guides the player on a rather linear journey through the games first half, a bit of back tracking every now and then that helps make the world that much more connected but otherwise it does a good job of keeping players knowing where to go.
The Rock Tunnel area almost feels like a graduation ceremony where upon emerging the other side in Lavender town the game begins to let go a bit. The map doesnt fully open up until you deal with some events in Celadon City, namely getting the Silph Scope and going back to Lavender Town to tackle the Pokemon tower. Still the brief gap between these events leaves more routes open to the player to discover (albeit both of them end with a Snorlax) and the fourth gym to tackle if you so feel like it.
When youre handed the pokeflute to move Snorlaxs progression preventing backside from the equation its like getting the keys to the Kanto kingdom, combine this with a glass of fresh water for the Saffron City gate guards and theres a sudden sense of freedom in how you choose to tackle some of the games upcoming events.
Typically Ill rush down cycling road to get to the safari zone early as possible, some may begin to tackle Saffrons Silph Co and others may choose to soak up some exp battling the long path down from Lavender Town, maybe they want the Super Rod, I didnt so I just bypassed the whole route entirely.
Rushing down to Fuchsia can also net you the HMs for Surf and Strength and the appropriate gyms locking the usage of these abilities are ready to tackle. Basically by the time I went to do Silph Co I had already gone to scoop up Articuno from the Seafoam Islands.
For another example maybe a Blue version player wanted Magmar and took a quick trip down from Pallet to Cinnabar to nab one as early as they could and just skip Seafoam entirely.
Times have changed now, the modern games seem to fear kids getting lost or confused as to where to go which has slowly led to the game progression becoming increasingly linear. Many paths blocked off with random events (Black2 even has a bit of fun with this, random dudes just dancing in the middle of the path because FUCK YOU) or a greater swath of HM gating (Looking at you Sinnoh).
Which ultimately led to the otherwise decent and quite varied Unova region of Gen 5 having the most bland map layout possible in its original state, at least what I can say here is that they used HMs as the tool for optional exploring as opposed to main game progression but the point still stands that is choice of map structure tended to leave a negative response no matter how much Unova had in it even before the sequel expansion.
Would it really be asking too much to have the freedom to explore once more beyond the halfway point of the game? A region map that neatly connects back on itself so backtracking without Fly is something more feasible and also doesnt require dragging an HM slave around to ensure you can re-smash that one rock that manages to keep blocking a specific path?
I think the Sinnoh region was stung by this the most of all because the region itself is teeming with the potential of exploration but ultimately railroads you through.
Put it this way, in Gen 1 a Lapras is forced on the player as a reward for slogging through the majority of Silph Cos rocket gauntlet. In Gen 6 Lapras is forced upon the player because theres a small section of water to cross and the game is going to teach you how to surf by force.
repels effect wore off
The Caves of Endurance
Now admittedly I think we all shudder at this, I dont think anyone leaps for joy at going through Mt Moon or Rock Tunnel, the fact that they have Pokemon Centers by their entrances pretty much sets the tone.
Still theres something to take away from these tiring treks and thats preparation. The Pokemon series throws all manner of items at the player yet how often does anyone ever need to bust out an ether to restore PP, contemplate escape roping back out to recover instead of losing half their money or just be prepared with antidotes and potions in general?
Why back in my day you got poisoned and feared its lingering effects, you stocked up on antidotes to ensure your pokemon didnt faint slowly and painfully as you scrambled through the dark. These days though your pokemon gets poisoned and it represses the effects outside of battle thus kinda defeating the point, it even wears off when they would otherwise faint. Poppycock I say, on top of this while theres still plenty of caverns to clamber through in the series to this day they basically come across more like mild inconveniences, Im just saying there isnt anything wrong with testing the player, it builds character and makes the items and general economy worth more (well I think they even dialled back on how much money you lose for whiting out but even so).
Most caves in the series now are something of a blur, they dont have that enduring legacy. Most of the ones I remember come from Black because the game was quite smart about making them visually interesting (Twist Mountain) or having unique pokemon instead of Zubat by the bucketload (see Chargestone Cave and its unique electric focused lineup).
Now Im not saying that I want a plethora of tedious caves to endure but I am saying that gauntlets like Mt Coronet are something of a rewarding experience in themselves.
Right now I cant even recall the main caves of Kalos, there was the reflection cave and one that I sloooowly rode a Rhyhorn over to?
2: The most ineffective trainer battle placement in the series
More optional areas in the main game
Obviously saying that modern Pokemon games have no optional areas would be pretty silly, the post game tends to rely on such things.
Still thats the post game, when it comes to the main game its never quite the same deal.
Kanto has Seafoam Islands and the Power Plant as optional areas with notable rewards (some TMs, items and Legendary Birds). Johto is practically the king of this throwing places like Mt Mortar, Ruins of Alph, Dark Cave and Whirl Islands in plain sight of the players standard journey yet you dont even have to venture through any of them if youre not invested in what secrets they hold (and lets face it, Mt Mortar is a horrendous troll, hope you had a slot ready for the not so legendary Tyrouge, yeah Ill just surf on past this one).
This once again steps back to that exploration point, you have options here to investigate these places or go and discover them, alternatively you might just think screw it and just carry on.
Now its not so much a case of these sort of areas no longer existing, going back to an earlier point Black/White used HMs as the optional tool to discover these sort of locations and nab some special pokemon like those musketeer chaps and the Larvesta egg.
Sinnoh while mostly doing its work in the postgame has bits and pieces like Iron Island and the Old Chateau as well, though of course the latters main draw with Rotom is once again post game content making an earlier visit less fruitful
Its more that these sort of areas seem to be less in focus, not to bag on Kalos again but it didnt have much to offer here as I recall, even one of the more seemingly interesting optional routes discoverable quite early on in the quest turns out to just be the stopping point for a post game legendary bird after youve encountered it seven or so times.
I guess my point here is to tease more locations that are worth exploring during the main game not for progression but for rewards. How about instead of just giving the player a Mega Lucario you have an area nearby where youll get one at the end if you actually want it?
(of course it's also worth saying here that Gen 1 has anaemic post game content but hey it was their first swing at this)
A worthwhile Safari Zone
Lets not underestimate the appeal of the original Safari Zone, it was a treasure trove of rare pokemon with most of them native to the area only obtainable within. You came across a Tauros and It felt like a big deal, even when you werent encountering the rarest beasts you were at least seeing ones that didnt reside elsewhere like Rhyhorn and Exeggcute and as a bonus the levels were high enough to match your team at the time. Its like a win/win situation. Lob in some TMs, Rare Candies and you have a safari stew going.
When the Safari Zone returned in Hoenn it was already showing signs of being a shade of its former glory, bike exclusive areas and pokeblock gimmicks aside there was a lack of excitement by comparison, look I like Xatu and all but when thats one of your big draws along with wheeling Pinsir back out like hes new and exciting then the lustre is somewhat lost.
Still Hoenns safari zone was a treasure compared to THE GREAT MARSH.
God damn does the Great Marsh of Sinnoh blow chunks, a Safari zone where what few rare and unique pokemon reside there are determined by daily chance, a safari zone filled with the same pokemon squatting in every other route, just in case you missed your 100th chance to catch Bidoof or Budew or Starly, AWFUL.
The lack of any more in Gens 5 and 6 makes me wonder if they forgot how to make the zone an appealing change of pace to bolster your dex. The solution of course is right there in Kanto.
Id add something about podding starts and difficulty but thats like a whole thread to itself, Im just going to say the new EXP share is great but please actually balance the game around it next time.
By the way this thread shouldnt be viewed in a Gen 1 is the best, new games smell kinda way because thatd just be a flat out lie, mechanically each generation improves on the last yet its almost like at the expense of that the actual adventure becomes more constricted. I just want Sun/Moon to hit a home run where I can get all the finely tuned updated mechanics and QoL improvements alongside a region I get to explore and where I dont need to be forcefully told how to use a pokemon center or play alongside friends that I really dont care for.
