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[Doc Holliday]

Wether the pose is appropriate or not is debatable what I found odd is the guy who complained had no issues with his daughter killing people with guns.

 

[Siege.exe]

No, she isn't. She's staring below the camera's eyeline. Mercy, Hanzo, Mccree, they're staring at the camera. Even Widow is staring at the camera. Tracer is drawing sight straight down to that ass. I've got like 700 games of Overwatch played, I've seen these poses a LOT.

Tracer would have to turn her head a full 180 degrees to be able to look down and see her own ass.

 

[17 Seconds]

She's not looking 'to the side' she's looking down.

she's definitely looking to the side.

 

[stufte]

She's not looking 'to the side' she's looking down.

Yah sorry, she's not looking at her ass, she's at best looking at her "backpack".. thing. Her eyes are pointed down and towards the camera, it'd be impossible for her to be staring *at* her ass.

 

[quesalupa]

Bruh I'm a straight dude and I'm okay with looking at shirtless muscley Dante and Chris Hemsworth. Just let me keep my butts.

 

[Yukinari]

People say the stereotypes are problematic in Punch Out. I say its the muscles.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

So why do you think it's crazy that I believe that?

Because there are perfectly valid reason for taking "offensive" to the pose and it has nothing to with being puritanical. It's just straight up pandering for no reason.

 

[Cynar]

Wether the pose is appropriate or not is debatable what I found odd is the guy who complained had no issues with his daughter killing people with guns.

Seriously. That's the most fucked up thing. Fine with guns but keep that butt away!

 

[TheYanger]

I don't have the context of what this character is supposed to be like, or how it fits with the rest of the game, but generally speaking, I wouldn't have minded if this pose was kept in, as to my eyes it looks like what Blizzard presumably intended to evoke. Just reminds me of Bayonetta, a character that's arguably strong and heroic. But I also don't mind if it's not kept in if others do mind it. It's just a butt pose after all. Doesn't make the game any worse for me, but possibly makes it better for others. Go for it.

Ultimately it's Blizzards call, and based on the short statement in the OP, it seems their intent with the butt pose differed from how some interpreted it, and so Blizzard changed it to better suit their creative vision.

There is no problem here. It's pretty dumb and sad how there always seems to be this overreaction to the commonplace news of a developer changing or removing something based on feedback, when that something is butts or tits.

If you read the first few posts you'd already know that there IS a character, like bayonetta, in the game that it is in character for, and she also has an ass pose, and nobody is clamboring for that to be removed.

 

[LycanXIII]

It's more towards the camera than the line shows.

 

[Veldin]

Left this page alone until now, refreshed to see it went from five to fourteen pages.

wow.

You underestimated the power of butts.

 

[AtticuSMT]

No, she isn't. She's staring below the camera's eyeline. Mercy, Hanzo, Mccree, they're staring at the camera. Even Widow is staring at the camera. Tracer is drawing sight straight down to that ass. I've got like 700 games of Overwatch played, I've seen these poses a LOT.

Just throwing out there that the "ive played X amount of games" doesnt really help your argument.

If the argument was "tracer looks slow in this game" and you came in saying "no she is fast, trust me, ive played over 700 games" Then it would work, and I would say "Yea, this guy knows what he is talking about"

But this isnt the case, we are all looking at the same picture, a pose, its not moving, its not doing anything (shock, i've played the beta too) and the only time its a little different is the zoom out for the first like 1-1.5 seconds of showing off the final team.

We are all looking at the same picture, and we are all seeing different things, you can try to convince people to see what you see, but the majority of posts say "look back/looking at device on her shoulder/looking at camera"

 

[Mechanized]

Not really, I learned that blizzard listens to it fans.
The removal was warranted. It just pandering.
Also you have this dumb stuff:

Fuck off. You can not like my opinion or disagree with it but to insinuate I am dumb because I don't share the same view as you is bullshit. So fuck off with the passive-aggressive name calling or just say what's really on your mind, coward.

 

[Zolo]

Random question, but are butts considered more sexual than breasts? I just find it interesting the main times recently, it was a butt pose that needed to be changed.

 

[Dylan Sexbang]

This is an entirely optional victory pose right? Amongst plenty of others? Meaning you don't ever have to see your Tracer in this pose if you find it distasteful. Then why remove it? Don't like it, don't use it. That's all it should have come down to.

Hell, when I left WoW 90% of the female blood elves were running thong and bra transmog and I didn't bat an eye. Why remove options? That's the worse part of changes like this is when it takes out something optional.

 

[frontovik]

Cheers, love?

 

[Sn4ke_911]

TheYanger you can't be fucking serious.

She is NOT looking at her ass lol.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

I honestly don't care either way, my first post on page one literally says who cares.

What is really weird to me is the posts that say stuff like "Tracer would never pose like that" etc.

Tracing eyes and stick figure outlines for ass protrusions.

Like what.

 

[Siege.exe]

Random question, but are butts considered more sexual than breasts? I just find it interesting the main times recently, it was a butt pose that needed to be changed.

I mean, it depends on who you ask.

 

[stufte]

Bruh I'm a straight dude and I'm okay with looking at shirtless muscley Dante and Chris Hemsworth. Just let me keep my butt.

Same. Shirtless Henry Cavill didn't upset my manhood or make me complain to the Man of Steel producers. Pleasant human bodies are nice to look at and aren't automatically sexualized just because they happen to be attractive.

 

[TheYanger]

It's more towards the camera than the line shows.

Meanwhile, normal people:

 

[Banana Aeon]

Wether the pose is appropriate or not is debatable what I found odd is the guy who complained had no issues with his daughter killing people with guns.

Hey man, butts are scurry. Much more scurry than murder.

 

[Servbot24]

I think you and others are reading entirely too much into a pose. Not everything is a subliminal message, and sometimes a butt is just a butt and not some sort of message about self worth.

It's not an intentional message, but practically everything in life is a message of some sort. That's how your brain gets you around. Most messages enter your mind without you even thinking about it.

I don't want to belabor the issue, but I'll just say this. Every character that you enjoy is because of specific reasons, some of which you realize, and some of which you don't. Shape language, color composition, etc - it all resonates with you on an individual level, some conscious, some subconscious. Not only does it resonate with you, it influences you, usually in an imperceivable way. Most of the time that influence doesn't actually matter all that much, but sometimes it does. Media creators have a responsibility to be aware of what messages they're sending, because although it may seem silly, they actually do matter in a big way. If the message they want to send is "girls are hot", that's fine. But I don't think that's in line with what Blizzard's going for here, so I admire them for removing parts of the game that don't align with the focus of what they're trying to do.

 

[23qwerty]

Fuck off. You can not like my opinion or disagree with it but to insinuate I am dumb because I don't share the same view as you is bullshit. So fuck off with the passive-aggressive name calling or just say what's really on your mind, coward.

omg

anyway I can't imagine this thread will remain up for too longer

another victory for the sjw lefty cuck developers that is blizzard or something else absurdly stupid that gg would say

 

[-Horizon-]

It's more towards the camera than the line shows.

Yesssss finally someone did it <3

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

Because there are perfectly valid reason for taking "offensive" to the pose and it has nothing to with being puritanical. It's just straight up pandering for no reason.

Do you have examples that you would consider not pandering?

 

[stufte]

Because there are perfectly valid reason for taking "offensive" to the pose and it has nothing to with being puritanical. It's just straight up pandering for no reason.

But is it pandering though? Your world view tells you that it is, but that's wholly subjective.

 

[truestatic]

Random question, but are butts considered more sexual than breasts? I just find it interesting the main times recently, it was a butt pose that needed to be changed.

Not since the days of Red Alert's Tanya Adams has a developer been super cool about having their characters routinely shove their cleavage in your face in a non-titillation based game. Butt's are slightly subtler. So long as we don't fill half the camera with em, like Bioware.

Meanwhile, normal people:

So she's not looking at her butt then? We're all agreed? Because I mean, regardless of where ELSE she's looking, I don't know what you can make of this to insinuate her own gaze sexualizes her.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

Hey man, butts are scurry. Much more scurry than murder.

Oh my God, stop triggering me. My uncle died in a drive-by mooning.

 

[VibratingDonkey]

If you read the first few posts you'd already know that there IS a character, like bayonetta, in the game that it is in character for, and she also has an ass pose, and nobody is clamboring for that to be removed.

Interesting. Thanks for the info.

 

[Sn4ke_911]

Meanwhile, normal people:

What do you mean with "normal people"? should everyone have the same lame pose? "normal people" can look in different directions you know.

 

[blankempathy]

Meanwhile, normal people:

Normal people don't look down and behind them? Seriously? So anyone who looks down and behind them are clearly just trying to get a glimpse of their ass? Come on now.

 

[cm osi]

Meanwhile, normal people:

moving the goalpost?

 

[smashballTaz]

Ah it's the frowned-upon, 'sexy' contortionist pose Marvel had Black Widow doing in all the Avengers 1 movie promo posters. There's nothing wrong with removing it from the game in my opinion, it's needless and doesn't add anything to the game. And from what I'm reading it doesn't suit the character either. It shouldn't have been an option in the first place really..

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Fuck off. You can not like my opinion or disagree with it but to insinuate I am dumb because I don't share the same view as you is bullshit. So fuck off with the passive-aggressive name calling or just say what's really on your mind, coward.

^Outrage culture

 

[TheYanger]

What do you mean with "normal people"? should everyone have the same lame pose? "normal people" can look in different directions you know.

Yeah, but youcan't look down and claim you're looking back at the camera. Again, her eyes draw you towards her ass, just like her posture, just like her arms and legs in framing.

moving the goalpost?

There is no goalpost. Blizzard already agreed, you guys are the ones outraged over a developer changing their in development product in the most trivial of ways. Gang up on me all you want, but if someone wants to MSPaint some lines onto the picture and claim that's what 'looking behind you' looks like, I'll do the same in kind.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

"Normal people"

What are you trying to say

Tracer doesn't conform to society? What's wrong with that? What are you, some sort of conforming-enforcer?

 

[KingJ2002]

what butt?

my thoughts exactly

 

[LiK]

people are analyzing eye direction now?

 

[smashballTaz]

It's not an intentional message, but practically everything in life is a message of some sort. That's how your brain gets you around. Most messages enter your mind without you even thinking about it.

I don't want to belabor the issue, but I'll just say this. Every character that you enjoy is because of specific reasons, some of which you realize, and some of which you don't. Shape language, color composition, etc - it all resonates with you on an individual level, some conscious, some subconscious. Not only does it resonate with you, it influences you, usually in an imperceivable way. Most of the time that influence doesn't actually matter all that much, but sometimes it does. Media creators have a responsibility to be aware of what messages they're sending, because although it may seem silly, they actually do matter in a big way. If the message they want to send is "girls are hot", that's fine. But I don't think that's in line with what Blizzard's going for here, so I admire them for removing parts of the game that don't align with the focus of what they're trying to do.

This!

 

[Azerare]

Yesssss finally someone did it <3

The green lines will always help settle these debates!

Though if poses were optional, what's the issue? Don't like, don't use?

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

quoting myself from the overwatch OT:

Someone made a straw poll http://strawpoll.me/7212830/r (currently 94% against replacing, 2000+ votes)

Someone made a petition on reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/4cboqc/petition_to_keep_tracers_over_the_shoulder/ (81%, 3400+ votes).

We have many threads complaining about the change and how easily blizzard caved.

Then finally we have this thread: Overwatch's Strong Male Heroes and that one Junkrat PoTG.

That took the cake.


Here is a thread created by a mother who thinks the change is absurd: http://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20742895690

excerpt:

I love being a sexy night elf character. I love being Tracer. I love being Nova. I LOVE these strong women that can be confident in their abilities and their appearance, because in the real world, I'm none of those things. These games were an escape for me. I channel myself into these characters, because I would give anything to be just like them.

Blizzard, why am I not allowed to be strong and sexy? Why am I not allowed to love these characters as they already are? Why are you alienating not just me, but many other women that love these female characters as they are for a single voice?

I want Tracer to stay how she is. I want her to be strong, confident, and sexy. Please, PLEASE, stop trying to make this game too PC. Stop trying to make women like me out to be sensitive babies that can't handle beautiful women. Stop trying to cater to "families" when this game isn't mean to be played by younger children.

I doubt Kaplan expected this degree of response.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

people are analyzing eye direction now?

Lmao what is happening

 

[mikefrails]

Wether the pose is appropriate or not is debatable what I found odd is the guy who complained had no issues with his daughter killing people with guns.

The "muh kids!" defense is classic for that reason. The parents don't truly care.

 

[Banana Aeon]

Honestly, they should have just removed the pose cause it looks bad.

There's nothing there to flaunt sweetheart.

 

[G_Berry]

Wait, you can't have the outline of an ass in a violent game where you go around killing each other?

WONT SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!?














And women.

 

[stufte]

It's not an intentional message, but practically everything in life is a message of some sort. That's how your brain gets you around. Most messages enter your mind without you even thinking about it.

I don't want to belabor the issue, but I'll just say this. Every character that you enjoy is because of specific reasons, some of which you realize, and some of which you don't. Shape language, color composition, etc - it all resonates with you on an individual level, some conscious, some subconscious. Not only does it resonate with you, it influences you, usually in an imperceivable way. Most of the time that influence doesn't actually matter all that much, but sometimes it does. Media creators have a responsibility to be aware of what messages they're sending, because although it may seem silly, they actually do matter in a big way. If the message they want to send is "girls are hot", that's fine. But I don't think that's in line with what Blizzard's going for here, so I admire them for removing parts of the game that don't align with the focus of what they're trying to do.

Yes characters are often created to be asthetically pleasing. I know this because I concept characters for video games. I understand why artist make characters the way they do. But the idea that a butt is somehow going to tell a young girl that "only your butt matters" is highly dubious.

Also the pose was in the game in the first place because it aligned with their vision. They only took it out because of a misplaced worry about bad press from an already rabidly click-baity gaming press.

 

[GorillaJu]

My major hang ups are 1) her pose isn't blatantly sexualized, it's coy but not gratuitous by any stretch, 2) it doesn't seem out of character for her at all and 3) the idea that a character who is spunky and fun can't also be sexy some times is shallow and stupid

 

[Otnopolit]

Lmao what is happening

As the British say, they've "lost the plot"...

 

[Dmax3901]

I think you and others are reading entirely too much into a pose. Not everything is a subliminal message, and sometimes a butt is just a butt and not some sort of message about self worth.

That's not up to just you though. Society is more than what you personally read of a situation. Women are told that their looks are how they're valued by society in so many different ways every day of their lives. This situation, and games in general, are no different.

Spoiler

I guess I lied when I said I'd sit this one out