Theonik
Member
Cider drinking competition.
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UK PoliGAF |OT3| - Strong and Stable Government? No. Coalition Of Chaos!
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
Gove and Johnson were the Brexit brothers and had the same well of support - they didn't need each other's friends; they had the same friends. Gove's decision to run for leader was designed to split that support and ensure that neither of them could be leader. It was basically a murder-suicide. In short:
It was a murder-suicide, but it wasn't intentional. I think Gove wanted to be Prime Minister so went for it. He'd long cultivated - baffling, I know - a reputation of being serious and humble. Many times he'd said he didn't feel up to the task of being PM. Some even believed him, incredibly. So his decision to step in was framed as the serious brexit boy stepping in for the national interest. Except everyone saw through the bullshit.
Tactically I think he wagered that he could claim enough of Boris' support by virtue of Boris being a buffoon.
Theonik
Member
Spuck-uk
Banned
You seem upset my fine fellow.
It's a practical, time tested manner for dealing with the problem of the landed classes!
Royal_Phalanx
Member
You seem upset my fine fellow.
This guy really looks like he's from the 1920s.
Audioboxer
Member
This guy also votes like he's from the 1920s
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/24926/jacob_rees-mogg/north_east_somerset/votes
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
Rees-Mogg is a cunt. He plays up to his own privilege and many people seem to laugh it up but he is only shameless; there is no wit. He is everything that is wrong with the Conservative party.
This guy also votes like he's from the 1920s
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/24926/jacob_rees-mogg/north_east_somerset/votes
The one thing he voted to allow people to do on that list is the only one which affects other people
Psychotext
Member
On a randomly associated note...
...was chatting to a women who is selling a house I'm interested in. The guy next door is a Lord, and apparently spends most of the time in London.
...was chatting to a women who is selling a house I'm interested in. The guy next door is a Lord, and apparently spends most of the time in London.
Audioboxer
Member
I mean, it gets better
*Cut*
*Zoom*
Damn, dude really doesn't like welfare.
But foodbanks? Bro, let me tell you about foodbanks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8PJgZtu5ZE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEdk6vQEfhg
Kinda confirms my suspicions that the reason he's anti smoking-bans is that it'll kill off the poor. It can't be because he's got a libertarian streak because he's perfectly ok with telling people who they can marry and when they can die
Theonik
Member
This was actually from the state funeral of Margaret Thatcher that makes it more amusing for me if anything.
Man of the People, Vox populi, Vox dei
To be fair all of these stances are consistent with his libertarian and religious views in the sense that while socialist and Christian ideology align one does not necessarily see it as the job of the state to do charity but instead sees it as an individual imperative and/or the job of the Church. Such people /love/ foodbanks but hate benefit. On smoking same principle applies personal imperative keep the state out.
On marriage he thinks it is an issue of sacrament. Let the church decide etc.
Audioboxer
Member
A rotten candidate for a rotten borough.
Boris running away from suggestions of lifting the public sector cap, just like he does a runner from everything else.
Can't believe people want him to be Prime Minister. Can't believe he wants to be Prime Minister. You'd think someone with a genuine lust for power to make better moves. Then again, he's excelled at failing upwards before.
Fiscal responsibility is the Government's latest attempt at keeping austerity as status quo, although I expect it's a temporary defense considering how flimsy under scrutiny it is.
Can't believe people want him to be Prime Minister. Can't believe he wants to be Prime Minister. You'd think someone with a genuine lust for power to make better moves. Then again, he's excelled at failing upwards before.
Fiscal responsibility is the Government's latest attempt at keeping austerity as status quo, although I expect it's a temporary defense considering how flimsy under scrutiny it is.
Dirtyshubb
Member
To be honest I think falling upwards applies to all the prominent Tories. Every one of their tenures will be remembered as either a complete failure or another example of a systematic destruction of a public department.
As much as I dislike Osbourne I do have a lot of respect for his ability to rationally assess his own ability to become prime minister and correctly see it would never happen/would be a bad idea. That seems to be something 99% of politicians lack, probably because they are surrounded by sycophantic staff who are paid to agree with them all day.
For all of their faults, Cameron and Osbourne at least appeared to be competent at what they wanted to do, and seemed in control - even if what they were doing was still horrendous. They did at least earn their way to the top of the Conservative party.
But yeah, the current cabinet mostly do just seem to be like that.
Tbh its one thing giving me hope at the moment, because it does feel like this is the start of the end for the Tories in government for a while.
" Minister suggests women hit by pension age change 'take up apprenticeships' " - The Guardian.
I have to wonder what planet Conservative ministers live on sometimes.
I have to wonder what planet Conservative ministers live on sometimes.
The limits to Labour's 'constructive ambiguity' over Brexit
Nothing all that surprising about that analysis. Still it is a very good summation of their problems regarding this issue.
Nothing all that surprising about that analysis. Still it is a very good summation of their problems regarding this issue.
Dirtyshubb
Member
Yeah thats true, I was actually watching an old PMQS recently and as much as I hate him Cameron was slick with his responses and did appear competent. Osbourne however I will never not think of him coked out of his mind on the bench lol.
I do also hope that because all of the ones left are complete idiots and incompetents that they wont be able to salvage what little respect they have left and the party will implode for a while at least. I think the catalyst for this though will be when they eventually replace May, I cant see them going for some unknown and every potential person is either a laughing stock or absolutely despised. What would be even better would be for someone like Borris to get it, absolutely embarrass himself and then have another leadership challenge. Make them look even more incompetent and chaotic then they already are. That would help kill off any quick recovery.
Personally, I always thought of Cameron as well trained but ultimately a shallow, transparent bastard. I was barely politically aware by the time the 2010 election rolled around, but even then, when I saw the infamous posters I was thinking to myself that they may as well have printed "MASSIVE FUCKING LIAR" next to his balloon head.
He's an ascended SpAd, so I shouldn't be surprised that he's little more than a careerist cunt. On the upside, the history books are hopefully going to paint Cameron as the moron that walked the economy off a cliff to settle a party dispute.
There's little of his legacy that'll be looked on positively. Maybe marriage equality, but even that was passed by the grace of progressive parties because his party of well-heeled, born to rule ponyfuckers wouldn't do it.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I think it's a question of timing for Labour, though. They need to let the Brexiteers be seen to have a chance, for everyone to realise that 'actually, this is disastrous', and then to be able to say 'look, we listened to the vote, we did our best - this isn't working'.
Things are moving that way, but very slowly. I'd be holding fire right now if I lead Labour too. It's not the right time yet.
Kotetsu534
Member
Crab, did you see my question about working class voting behaviour? I PM'd you. Sorry to ask again but I am interested in this stuff and don't know about the trends you referenced.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Oh, yes. Sorry, I'm terrible for these things - I often mean to come back to stuff and just forget. Basically, retail workers have much lower voting rates than manufacturing employees; and retail workers tended to be keener on policies that promote 'out-group' support (such as unemployment benefits), which manufacturing workers tend to be more skeptical of, favouring 'in-group' support (such as stronger employment benefits and working time regulations). Both of these stem from their class relations - it's much easier to unionise in manufacturing being the main one.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Your party is backing Brexit, leaving the single market, and leaving the customs union.
I think this works better if Picard is Labour and Data Lib Dem, they're even wearing the right colours!
Wrestlemania
Banned
Your party is backing Brexit, leaving the single market, and leaving the customs union.
If they had take pretty much any position other than the one they took for the campaign theyd have allowed the Tories to turn it into the Brexit referendum v2 that they wanted and Labour would have been slaughtered.
Theyre now in a position where their out of the single market but with the same benefits position, even though it was never achievable, gives them a way to transition to a more palatable position for remainers as its clear the Tory negotiated deal will never deliver that.
Haha, my thoughts exactly
Yeah you only have to look at the SNP to see how the alternative plays out.
The best thing is that 'exact same benefits' is what Davis promised in the House of Commons. So when the inevitable occurs and that isn't the end result of the negotiations, they have Davis to blame for not reaching the goals he set himself.
Then they and Tory remainers vote the deal down and all hell is let loose.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Christ, Corbyn really is all things to all men, isn't he?
When this 4D chess idea falls over, when Labour digs their heels in and continues to insist on us leaving the EU/SM/CU over the next two years, will this narrative stop?
The truth is staring at anyone who cares to take a cursory glance at Corbyn's past and Labour's voting record.
Guess she needs one. That good or bad?
Im reading The Guardian article and it mentions Robbie Gibb, not Andrew Marr.
Yep, he's the exec editor - I could've made it clearer but it doesn't say Marr himself.
Just an interesting observation when Fox accuses the BBC of being anti-Brexit and then one of their prominent editors (involved in most of its political programming) then quits and joins the government.
"Half of junior doctors having accidents or near misses after night shifts" - The Guardian.
Just a reminder that the implications of an incredibly overstretched NHS are wider than the NHS itself.
The Government have to get serious about the NHS immediately. No more ideological starvation of the service.
Just a reminder that the implications of an incredibly overstretched NHS are wider than the NHS itself.
The Government have to get serious about the NHS immediately. No more ideological starvation of the service.
Dirtyshubb
Member
Honestly while it's more important mistakes don't happen with medical staff, I'm willing to bet this happens with public sector staff everywhere. You run a service at bare minimum staff and resources and it takes its toll both physically and mentally.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
We all know they're not going to.
Camp Freddie
Member
I mean, they're BUPA people so it doesn't even affect them. But suggest VAT on private school fees and they'll shit themselves.
Cycle continues http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40517721
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