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[KRod-57]

Oh god. It's a fucking college. 'Conversation with our political opposition' has nothing to do with this. It's not a dialogue, it's hate speech.

Actually, conversation with our opposition has everything to do with. At least to me, I consider Milo to be in opposition to my views, and this event was literally him having a discussion with people of opposing views to his. Personally, I'm not afraid to have an argument with Milo, and I think I could take him to school on a lot of issues. If you're not willing to have that conversation, that is your own choice, and I respect that.. but as Obama said, college students don't need to be coddled, and we don't learn anything when we try to silence those we do not agree with

"Lesile Jones is an ape"

"I am choose to be gay so I wouldn't have to deal with nutty broads"

That conversation is not worth having

I don't disagree in saying there is a certain point of absurdity where it is time to disengage from the conversation. What I do not agree with is when we avoid any attempts to have a rational conversation with the person. If you're not willing to give it a try, again that is your choice and I respect that, but I would also urge you to respect those who are willing to accept that challenge. I don't think we need to go the route of preventing the conversation from taking place

 

[Frozenprince]

Being gay is irrelevant to Milo's character. He's just an utter shitbag.

This. Milo was born privileged and coddled, the fact that he's gay doesn't indict gay people, he's just a hypocritical piece of shit.

 

[Evening Musuko]

I really struggle to imagine what set of circumstances makes being a 24/7 terrible human being a worthwhile trade for a pseudo-celebrity status amongst generally hate-filled people and recognition from people who hate you.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

We live in a world where we're more afraid of being called "biased" than calling out assholes for what they really are and a generation who brushes off Milo's behavior as "trolling for teh lulz".

We've brushed off this kind of behavior for so long that now we're paying the price.

 

[Breads]

Life must be easy for a foreign professional troll.

 

[Mr Cola]

Being gay is irrelevant to Milo's character. He's just an utter shitbag.

At several points he has made contradictory claims about it

He has said on record he chooses to be gay
He has said on record he does not choose to be gay
He has said on record that he sleeps with women
He has said on record he uses the fact he is gay as a shield

 

[DrForester]

How economically anxious of him.

Fuck these neo nazi assholes.

Can I get some background on this. I've been seeing the term a lot recently.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

I don't think we need to go the route of preventing the conversation from taking place

You're 100% ducking the issue that Milo was not there to have a conversation. He was there to paint a target on a trans student. That's not a point of view, that's not an idea, that's putting someone's life on public display for no reason.

 

[Frozenprince]

Having a conversation? A "conversation"? Are you serious? What is he conversing about? "Hey look at that girl, she's really a MAN LETS SHAME HER AND DEBASE HER. SHAME. RIDICULE. SHAAAAAAAAAAAAME."

That's not a conversation that's being a piece of human garbage. That's the equivalent of having a speaker there for the sole purpose of calling all the black students on campus apes.

 

[Media]

Actually, conversation with our opposition has everything to do with. At least to me, I consider Milo to be in opposition to my views, and this event was literally him having a discussion with people of opposing views to his. Personally, I'm not afraid to have an argument with Milo, and I think I could take him to school on a lot of issues. If you're not willing to have that conversation, that is your own choice, and I respect that.. but as Obama said, college students don't need to be coddled, and we don't learn anything when we try to silence those we do not agree with

It's not a conversation when it's just literally attacking some poor person in the audience. Why should anyone respect that type of speech? If he wanted to have a conversation about his views, he could have, but he couldn't help being an asshole and attacking someone personally. Which, of course, will set his rabid followers on her as well, because that's how it works.

 

[KRod-57]

You didn't read a single word of what Milo said and assumed, in spite of the mountain of evidence of his years as a target painter for neo-nazis on the internet, that he had something of value to bring, a part of an actual conversation.

You don't even know what a conversation is if you believe that to be true.

You're basically saying that we should not even attempt to have a rational argument with the person. I simply cannot agree with that

It's not a conversation when it's just literally attacking some poor person in the audience. Why should anyone respect that type of speech? If he wanted to have a conversation about his views, he could have, but he couldn't help being an asshole and attacking someone personally. Which, of course, will set his rabid followers on her as well, because that's how it works.

Again, I do not disagree that there is a certain point in a conversation when it is better to disengage. What I do not agree with is avoiding all attempts to have a rational argument with the person. if you do not want to attempt it personally that's fine, I am speaking specifically about trying to block everyone from having the argument/ not allowing the argument to take place

 

[Psychoward]

Actually, conversation with our opposition has everything to do with. At least to me, I consider Milo to be in opposition to my views, and this event was literally him having a discussion with people of opposing views to his. Personally, I'm not afraid to have an argument with Milo, and I think I could take him to school on a lot of issues. If you're not willing to have that conversation, that is your own choice, and I respect that.. but as Obama said, college students don't need to be coddled, and we don't learn anything when we try to silence those we do not agree with



I don't disagree in saying there is a certain point of absurdity where it is time to disengage from the conversation. What I do not agree with is when we avoid any attempts to have a rational conversation with the person. If you're not willing to give it a try, again that is your choice and I respect that, but I would also urge you to respect those who are willing to accept that challenge. I don't think we need to go the route of preventing the conversation from taking place

Nothing is preventing the conversation from taking place. His free speech isn't being taken away if universities refuse to give him fame and money to speak at their schools.

You can still try to have a rational conversation with him on other terms. You'll fail, but you can try.

Colleges should not be giving this man any money or exposure to voice his hateful rhetoric. Period. End of story.

 

[Frozenprince]

At several points he has made contradictory claims about it

He has said on record he chooses to be gay
He has said on record he does not choose to be gay
He has said on record that he sleeps with women
He has said on record he uses the fact he is gay as a shield

Also this. He picks and chooses when his sexuality applies as a shield. He's probably bisexual, he's probably just co-opting the gay struggle so that he can have an excuse to spout hateful shit.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

This is straight up harassment. Not sure how this is free speech and I am a big fan of it.

UW should be ashamed.

 

[PopeReal]

LOL at conversation.

Targeting an individual is not conversation.

 

[Psychoward]

You're basically saying that we should not even attempt to have a rational argument with the person. I simply cannot agree with that

We have and it's failed. You can try to have a conversation with him in other settings. This setting wasn't a conversation, it wasn't a back and forth, it wasn't a debate. He was paid by the university to be the sole person with the microphone and he used the opportunity to harass and dehumanize a student.

Stop it.

 

[iMax]

Adelaide Kramer told the outlet she is quitting the university.

 

[Metalingus5150]

You're basically saying that we should not even attempt to have a rational argument with the person. I simply cannot agree with that



Again, I do not disagree that there is a certain point in a conversation when it is better to disengage. What I do not agree with is avoiding all attempts to have a rational argument with the person. if you do not want to attempt it personally that's fine, I am speaking specifically about trying to block everyone from having the argument

You're being willfully obtuse. Use your fucking brain.

 

[Frozenprince]

This isn't him presenting himself to have a rational argument.

This is him advertising for his new whatever media outlet he's pushing and to be a hateful piece of garbage and harass a girl whom he has never met because he hates the very idea of her existence.

Fuck that guy.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

Don't blame her if the administration views trash like this is free speech.

 

[Slayven]

Actually, conversation with our opposition has everything to do with. At least to me, I consider Milo to be in opposition to my views, and this event was literally him having a discussion with people of opposing views to his. Personally, I'm not afraid to have an argument with Milo, and I think I could take him to school on a lot of issues. If you're not willing to have that conversation, that is your own choice, and I respect that.. but as Obama said, college students don't need to be coddled, and we don't learn anything when we try to silence those we do not agree with



I don't disagree in saying there is a certain point of absurdity where it is time to disengage from the conversation. What I do not agree with is when we avoid any attempts to have a rational conversation with the person. If you're not willing to give it a try, again that is your choice and I respect that, but I would also urge you to respect those who are willing to accept that challenge. I don't think we need to go the route of preventing the conversation from taking place

A rational conversation takes at least 2 people, Milo isn't rational. If people want to engage that crazy, that is on them. But I am not going to pretend it is worth it or it is a good use of time

 

[Chie Satonaka]

Having a conversation? A "conversation"? Are you serious? What is he conversing about? "Hey look at that girl, she's really a MAN LETS SHAME HER AND DEBASE HER. SHAME. RIDICULE. SHAAAAAAAAAAAAME."

That's not a conversation that's being a piece of human garbage. That's the equivalent of having a speaker there for the sole purpose of calling all the black students on campus apes.

People who claim to be liberals have bought into the lie that literal hate is just a "different point of view" and that we can win hearts and minds by engaging, conversation and education.

Of course, the people with this viewpoint are always the ones who don't have nearly as much to lose, which is why it boils down to having talks and arguments. I'm sure the student sees her life and the abuse that happened to her as more than a difference of opinion.

 

[Ahasverus]

He'll piss off the wrong person one day.

 

[MUnited83]

Fuck him, but I still have issues with the idea of no platforming.


Edit: having read more I would acknowledge that this case is different due to the harassment. In general however I stand by the fact that no platforming at universities is somewhat silly. Universities should promote debate and people should question these people rather than stop them from speaking.

Yeah, invite the KKK while you're at it too I guess, makes perfect fucking sense.


Some people are motherfucking scum and deserve absolutely no attention or platforming whatsoever. There's nothing to gain from letting these piece of shits have a say, and there is no debate. People always talk about "debate", but none of those fucking speakers come to have a debate to begin with. They come and are allowed to do a one-sided presentation of their fuckery. It's not a damn debate.

If you want to promote debates you do a fucking open forum where everyone has a equal voice. Inviting a fucktard to do his presentation unchallenged is not that, will never be that, and Universities should be fucking sued for investing their money in hate speech fuckwads.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

You're basically saying that we should not even attempt to have a rational argument with the person. I simply cannot agree with that

No, you're ducking it again. Milo has had hundreds of thousands of chances to have a rational discussion, and he has a long, long history of doing nothing but pointing his followers at a target to receive ceaseless attacks and harassment. A lot of GamerGate's targets were picked by him. Leslie Jones was picked by him. And now this student was picked by him.

The chances of a rational argument with Milo is zero, he has blown all of his chances and goodwill forever. If you think someone deserves unlimited second chances that's on you, but kindly get off your high horse here, Milo has zero credit left.

 

[Mr Cola]

Also this. He picks and chooses when his sexuality applies as a shield. He's probably bisexual, he's probably just co-opting the gay struggle so that he can have an excuse to spout hateful shit.

He is an opportunist, his greatest strength so far has been his ability to mould himself and understand a section of an audience. To his credit he has found fame and money doing it, but he has had absolutely no moral scruples, the thing about Milo that troubles me is that he is clearly smart enough to know what he is doing, he is no fool, he knows exactly where his bread is buttered and he can protest, and does, about who he is exploiting to get where he is, he can hide behind his rhetoric which we know he only partially subscribes to. This is by no means an ideologue who has lucked into a position of power, this is a man who has clearly moulded his way into power by seeing a gap in the market and selling his ethics for fame and glory.

I genuinely wonder where it ends for a guy like this.

 

[Frozenprince]

People who claim to be liberals have bought into the lie that literal hate is just a "different point of view" and that we can win hearts and minds by engaging, conversation and education.

Of course, the people with this viewpoint are always the ones who don't have nearly as much to lose, which is why it boils down to having talks and arguments. I'm sure the student sees her life and the abuse that happened to her as more than a difference of opinion.

Yep. Call me when this forum is full of white people and self professed liberals who've sacrificed and taken time out of their day and their lives to educate and discuss with racists and bigots.

It's not our responsibility nor our duty to do so. And the very idea that this clear and concise hate speech, which forced this poor woman to QUIT THE UNIVERSITY SHE CHOSE TO ATTEND is disgusting, dehumanizing, and wrong.

 

[AntChum]

Why would anyone with both a sense of decency and more than two brain cells to rub together wish to have a conversation with Milo in any capacity? He's a dolt, whose only meaningful contribution to society will be the laughs elicited when he finally gets what's coming to him.

 

[Lucreto]

He has a right to spew his bile unfortunately.

If people just start throwing rotten fruit at him he will eventually learn.

But knowing him he will be like Bart Simpson and the electrified Cupcake.

 

[theCalamity]

While I'm with most of you in having a personal disdain for David Duke and his views, I don't fault the college for allowing him to speak on their campus. We should be open to having a conversation with our political opposition


Obama said it best ->https://youtu.be/mi5da2AhDCY?t=241

.

I was going to put Hitler, though.

 

[Frozenprince]

He is an opportunist, his greatest strength so far has been his ability to mould himself and understand a section of an audience. To his credit he has found fame and money doing it, but he has had absolutely no moral scruples, the thing about Milo that troubles me is that he is clearly smart enough to know what he is doing, he is no fool, he knows exactly where his bread is buttered and he can protest, and does, about who he is exploiting to get where he is, he can hide behind his rhetoric which we know he only partially subscribes to. This is by no means an ideologue who has lucked into a position of power, this is a man who has clearly moulded his way into power by seeing a gap in the market and selling his ethics for fame and glory.

I genuinely wonder where it ends for a guy like this.

I mean he's Glenn Beck with slightly less of a moral compass and a slightly larger ability to cuss.

That's really all he is, just another political commentator trying to become self important and wealthy through exploiting ignorance and hatred.

 

[Misha]

I hate that someone's existence is an "opinion" or "political". Saying that legitimizes the possibility that they are somehow subhuman.

 

[Mr Cola]

Why would anyone with both a sense of decency and more than two brain cells to rub together wish to have a conversation with Milo in any capacity? He's a dolt, whose only meaningful contribution to society will be the laughs elicited when he finally gets what's coming to him.

Well Milo has openly been avoiding debating with people, he has even lied on air about his dealings with people who he claims to have "dodged him" to debate, when in fact he has been the one avoiding it. He is a man for a pulpit not a lectern, he preaches he doesnt discuss.

 

[karasu]

Fuck him, but I still have issues with the idea of no platforming.


Edit: having read more I would acknowledge that this case is different due to the harassment. In general however I stand by the fact that no platforming at universities is somewhat silly. Universities should promote debate and people should question these people rather than stop them from speaking.

You can't debate someone who is flat out unreasonable. This is his business. He has no interest in whether he is right or wrong.

 

[Frozenprince]

This is a man who was banned from twitter, a place where actual, literal Nazi's are allowed to post and propagate their hatred, because he was interested in nothing more than spreading hate and harassment non-stop 24/7. He doesn't want, nor need, to engage in civil discourse or debate.

He makes his money by harassing and targeting people and making them the victims of hate mobs. That's how he makes his living.

 

[SodiumBenzoate]

I have watched dozens of his speeches now, I listen to all the ones I can and heard him on podcasts too, enough to know all his talking points, all his rebuttals, he is such a strange character, when he first started to appear in the UK on Sky news he provided quite an upstanding image, he argued on tv on tech, gender issues and presented himself almost entirely as someone of integrity, whether he had it or not. Watching him turn from that over the last 2 years to what he is now is incredibly strange, when he was serious before he made some interesting points that, if you didnt agree with would make you think, make you look up, I genuinely like having my thoughts challenged so having someone like him who goes very much against what you know appeals. But what he has turned into is so far from where he used to be and it exists in a world where it feels like he is play acting, he feels anything but sincere, half the time when he makes comments like the above he laughs afterwards, he plays it off, reading it in text is obviously much more vitriolic but if I had a hunch I would legitimately believe that he himself does not believe half the things that come out of his mouth.

What he has done rather incredibly is use his status to exploit a gap in the media that Trump exploited wherein he is actually immune from criticism, in the sense that, you cant really hurt him, you outcast him he becomes more popular, you call him a racist his fans protect him, what he actually is is somewhat irrelevant now.

His talks have slowly evolved into pantomimes where the audience shouts back things at him, he posts funny images and plays the clown to a bunch of people who take it as gospel.

I think Mr Cola is the only one who understands what Milo is really doing. He's a postmodern nihilist troll, not a regressive transphobic conservative. He's interested in attention, not a political agenda.


And that makes him worse, not better.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

He has a right to spew his bile unfortunately.

If people just start throwing rotten fruit at him he will eventually learn.

But knowing him he will be like Bart Simpson and the electrified Cupcake.

He wasn't just spewing bile. He was specifically targeting someone. Sexually harassing them too.

 

[SilentRob]

While I'm with most of you in having a personal disdain for Milo and his views, I don't fault the college for allowing him to speak on their campus. We should be open to having a conversation with our political opposition


Obama said it best ->https://youtu.be/mi5da2AhDCY?t=241

It's the promotion of hate speech and sexual harassment in an educational institution for fuck's sake. When does this line of thinking stop? Should we invite Neo-Nazis and allow them to single out a specific person of color with cries of "HEY N****R, I THINK YOU HAVE THE BRAIN OF A FUCKING APE"? I mean, they are certainly my political opposition. Jesus christ, man.

 

[KRod-57]

Nothing is preventing the conversation from taking place. His free speech isn't being taken away if universities refuse to give him fame and money to speak at their schools.

You can still try to have a rational conversation with him on other terms. You'll fail, but you can try.

Colleges should not be giving this man any money or exposure to voice his hateful rhetoric. Period. End of story.

but again, I do not fault the college for allowing him to speak on their campus. We are adults, and we should be open to allowing other adults the opportunity to have an argument with one another on campus.

We have and it's failed. You can try to have a conversation with him in other settings. This setting wasn't a conversation, it wasn't a back and forth, it wasn't a debate. He was paid by the university to be the sole person with the microphone and he used the opportunity to harass and dehumanize a student.

Stop it.

If you've already given up on attempting to have the argument, that's fine. What I do not agree with is when you do not allow others the opportunity to attempt to have a rational argument with the person

You're being willfully obtuse. Use your fucking brain.

How am I being obtuse? I'm saying if you are not willing to give the argument a try, that is your choice and I respect that. What I do not respect is when we do not allow others the opportunity to have that argument.

You tell me I should use my brain, and that is exactly why I am willing to have the argument

 

[SapientWolf]

Fuck him, but I still have issues with the idea of no platforming.


Edit: having read more I would acknowledge that this case is different due to the harassment. In general however I stand by the fact that no platforming at universities is somewhat silly. Universities should promote debate and people should question these people rather than stop them from speaking.

Abuse isn't a platform though. He doesn't even have an intellectual argument.

 

[Kai Dracon]

He has a right to spew his bile unfortunately.

If people just start throwing rotten fruit at him he will eventually learn.

But knowing him he will be like Bart Simpson and the electrified Cupcake.

He doesn't have a right to get invited and paid by any organization or school that he or his fans want so that he can go there and harass people.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

I have to disagree, he is definitely a political opposition to my views personally, and to say he is not open to having a conversation is completely inaccurate considering that is literally the reason why he was there to speak on that campus. The people who are not open to having a conversation are the ones who believe he shouldn't be allowed to speak on campus

I mean, we're talking about a habitual abuser of other people who was so aggressive that even Twitter couldn't turn a blind eye to his harassment.

But okay.

 

[Frozenprince]

He called her a tranny FFS. There is no ARGUMENT ABOUT HER HUMANITY. IT'S NOT SOMETHING OPEN FOR DEBATE.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

but again, I do not fault the college for allowing him to speak on their campus. We are adults, and we should be open to allowing other adults to have a argument with one another.



If you've already given up on attempting to have the argument, that's fine. What I do not agree with is when you do not allow others the opportunity to attempt to have a rational argument with the person



How am I being obtuse? I'm saying if you are not willing to give the argument a try, that is your choice and I respect that. What I do not agree with is when we do not allow others the opportunity to have ha argument.

You tell me I should use my brain, and that is exactly why I am willing to have the argument

Someone committing at the very least sexual harassment does not deserve to be heard or reasoned with.

 

[Chmpocalypse]

Fuck him, but I still have issues with the idea of no platforming.


Edit: having read more I would acknowledge that this case is different due to the harassment. In general however I stand by the fact that no platforming at universities is somewhat silly. Universities should promote debate and people should question these people rather than stop them from speaking.

There's a difference between debate and hate.

When the speaker in question is there to spew the latter, they're not interested in the former. Thus, by your standard, they have no business being on that stage.

 

[Dali]

Yep. Call me when this forum is full of white people and self professed liberals who've sacrificed and taken time out of their day and their lives to educate and discuss with racists and bigots.

It's not our responsibility nor our duty to do so. And the very idea that this clear and concise hate speech, which forced this poor woman to QUIT THE UNIVERSITY SHE CHOSE TO ATTEND is disgusting, dehumanizing, and wrong.

This person may have quit the University, because fuck the University. After repeated warnings they still paid a shit stain to brow beat them. I wouldn't want to keep paying those assholes either.

 

[CornBurrito]

He has a right to spew his bile unfortunately.

Isn't he being paid by the University to speak?

 

[Rayis]

Milo belongs in a dumpster, he's human trash.

 

[Frozenprince]

The fact that we've legitimized this hateful shit as just "having a debate" or "having an argument" is why we're fucked.

 

[Chie Satonaka]

He called her a tranny FFS. There is no ARGUMENT ABOUT HER HUMANITY. IT'S NOT SOMETHING OPEN FOR DEBATE.

It's fucking ridiculous that we're even having this discussion.

 

[Wulfric]

I wasn't able to attend due to a couple other things going on, but this is the e-mail the chancellor sent out to the campus the night of the event. It's important to note Milo's talk was supported by a student org and not the school. The chancellor is a nice guy, although I still don't agree with giving Milo a platform for what is basically hate speech on my own campus. And to deliberately pick out a student in advance and insult her is beyond words.

Dear Faculty, Staff and Students,

Milo Yiannopoulos spoke tonight at UWM as part of his nationwide college tour. I have spoken with students and others who opposed his appearance, and some of them protested tonight. I understand and appreciate their concerns and perspective.

Yiannopoulos’ stop at UWM was sponsored by a student organization, Turning Point USA. UWM is prohibited by law from restricting access to its facilities based on the viewpoint of a student organization or a guest or speaker invited by a student organization. Free speech is one of UWM’s core values and I will support students’ decisions to bring a wide array of speakers to our campus – even if the speaker is controversial, and even if I disagree with him or her. One of the core tenets of public universities is learning about the world by communicating with people who think differently than we do. I would not deprive students or our community of opportunities to hear diverse viewpoints.

That said, I do not agree with Yiannopoulos’ views, and I strongly condemn the belittling of others and their appearance, and the encouragement of hate and harassment. I also will not stand silently by when a member of our campus community is personally and wrongly attacked. I am disappointed that this speaker chose to attack a transgender student. We are proud of the work of our LGBT Resource Center, as well as faculty and staff members, in fostering inclusivity and earning us recognition as one of the top universities in the nation for LGBT+ students.

Our campus has a wonderful diversity that fosters a creative and exciting learning environment. It is critical that we protect, support and celebrate the exchange of ideas and cultural traditions that take place here. The inclusivity and safety of our campus are top priorities. Every member of our community should feel safe and valued, regardless of beliefs, race, sexual orientation, immigration or other status.

We are at a pivotal moment in our nation’s history after a contentious and divisive election. We can continue to use language that widens the divide. Or, we can choose language that bridges gaps and heals. I urge you to join me in seeking ways to reach out and find common ground. I also urge you to respond to tonight’s event with positive messages, not anger. Join me on social media in using #UWMstandstogether to tell our city, state and nation about the wonderful things happening on our campus and the valuable contributions of our students, faculty and staff.