These were a lot of fun to watch this morning.
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I just had a terrible thought: my Hama switch isn't going to support JP21 cables, is it? o_o
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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
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These were a lot of fun to watch this morning.
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I just had a terrible thought: my Hama switch isn't going to support JP21 cables, is it? o_o
sixteen-bit
Member
Any good JP21 RGB switches? I'm considering dropping a hundo on the Micomsoft one, LOL.
lol I can't even find one to buy, mind sharing where u are getting them from ?
IrishNinja
Member
aww yiss finally got the overlay on my remote, now i don't have to keep trying to remember what does what! so happy~
Bar81
Member
+1
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I would have assumed that plentiful European SCART switches would work just as well. Same socket type, just with a wire or two on a swapped pinout. Can anyone confirm?
Well, I'll be able to tell you soon. I'm using JP21 cables and have a Hama SCART switch on the way. Fingers crossed, fingers crossed.
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That guy who makes the FM remote overlays is a hero. Anyone know if there's a way to program a remote button to turn scanlines on/off?
I would like to know this as well. If every single lead on the pinout is wired then it should not matter as long as you keep everything consistent. If only certain leads are then it will be an issue.
Only place I've found the JP21 Selecty-21 for import is Solaris. They routinely go in and out of stock and have been out of stock for a good month now. They also went up in price about $20 in the last year.
sixteen-bit
Member
Solaris Japan sells they Micomsoft Selecty JP-21 RGB switch. Run a search on their site, I can never directly link to their product pages properly.
Shadow Hog
Member
The C button kind of already does that.
Clearly I should be pressing more of these buttons to see what they do. -_-
Does that bring up the scanline menu? That's good enough if so.
Perfect. Thank you.
Bar81
Member
Long OOS
Shadow Hog
Member
More or less. You hit the button, it says "V-LINE ON/OFF", you select the option you want with left/right, and there you are.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Some things I have figured out over time:
1.The low-pass filter should be avoided if you have a good source like RGB or component.... But it works a charm in cleaning up the image over composite. For most of us playing NES through composite, I really reccomend it. It is found on both the Standard and Meister picture modes.
2. At least for my TV, I've found a way to eliminate any bars or noise around the borders of the image (ie a white line on the left side of NES screen, or noise at the bottom of Genesis screen). The 4:3 mode on the TV actually masks out the unecessary image around the edge. That might seem obvious... But I never thought to try because I though it was only good at squeezing a stretched out 4:3 image back into its actual shape. I guess modern TVs will actually recognize when an image is 4:3 over HDMI and display it properly, but turning on the 4:3 mode in this case will actually force-mask out the edges.
Long story short, through these two things, I've basically got every console looking wonderful. Very emulator-like, with the solidity of actual hardware.
1.The low-pass filter should be avoided if you have a good source like RGB or component.... But it works a charm in cleaning up the image over composite. For most of us playing NES through composite, I really reccomend it. It is found on both the Standard and Meister picture modes.
2. At least for my TV, I've found a way to eliminate any bars or noise around the borders of the image (ie a white line on the left side of NES screen, or noise at the bottom of Genesis screen). The 4:3 mode on the TV actually masks out the unecessary image around the edge. That might seem obvious... But I never thought to try because I though it was only good at squeezing a stretched out 4:3 image back into its actual shape. I guess modern TVs will actually recognize when an image is 4:3 over HDMI and display it properly, but turning on the 4:3 mode in this case will actually force-mask out the edges.
Long story short, through these two things, I've basically got every console looking wonderful. Very emulator-like, with the solidity of actual hardware.
Looks like #2 may vary from TV to TV. On my Sony LCD projector I still get the line down the left side on NES games. :/
Have you sent another message? I've been exchanging messages this week.
Yes, I sent a "still waiting for my invoice here" message on Wednesday.
Went ahead and sent a message to retro_console_accessories myself, asking if she could mod one of the SNES RGB NTSC cables she has on display.
Not trying to roll with one of those breakout boxes since i'm passing the RGB through a component converter...and i'm not sure if having multiple things plugged up would degrade the image.
I'd have it like:
Not trying to roll with one of those breakout boxes since i'm passing the RGB through a component converter...and i'm not sure if having multiple things plugged up would degrade the image.
I'd have it like:
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Rounding out the list with Daytona USA on the Xbox 360 (1080p):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzXY1omOUYw
I'm eventually going to make a full write-up on this capture card. For now, I'm putting together some high quality videos for download that show off its capabilities a lot better than Youtube does. I'm pretty satisfied with the compression quality, but I want to note that the colors still aren't as vivid on these videos below as they are straight from the card (and even the card doesn't produce colors that are quite as good as a proper RGB setup does). Also, if you want to view these, please save them to your PC. These files are huge, my bandwidth is finite, and I only ask that you not waste it by streaming and re-streaming from my site instead of just downloading them once.
Video codec: x264vfw
Audio codec: LAME MP3
NES (composite 480i 30fps): Super Mario Bros. 3
Genesis (RGB 240p 60fps): Sonic the Hedgehog
Dreamcast (VGA 480p 60fps): Shenmue
Xbox 360 (HDMI YCbCr601 1080p 60fps): Daytona USA
I'm also going to finally give this thing a proper streaming test with my full tournament setup just to make sure it performs as well as my old Intensity Shuttle. I'll probably be playing some New Super Luigi U on Twitch in an hour or so.
IrishNinja
Member
brb, gonna go message retro about you guys' messages
good to know! what's the standard rule, Natural for general interlaced, Picture for progressive sources, and now Standard or Meister for low-pass on NES? maybe time to update the wiki!
good to know! what's the standard rule, Natural for general interlaced, Picture for progressive sources, and now Standard or Meister for low-pass on NES? maybe time to update the wiki!
Aw yiss:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=161117364725
She is making orders again. Hopefully they'll arrive and work with no problems right from the start.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=161117364725
She is making orders again. Hopefully they'll arrive and work with no problems right from the start.
Friend of Sonic
Member
This is a great thread.
I sent in my TurboGrafx to a guy who modded it with Component output. I'm getting HORRIBLE jailbars-- he says it's the best it'll get and suggested a Duo to have minimal/nonexistent jailbars. Anyone have a modded Turbografx that can chime in?
I sent in my TurboGrafx to a guy who modded it with Component output. I'm getting HORRIBLE jailbars-- he says it's the best it'll get and suggested a Duo to have minimal/nonexistent jailbars. Anyone have a modded Turbografx that can chime in?
Don't most switches tap into the input's power line to feed a LED that lights up to indicate which input is currently selected? Since SCART and JP21 have their power at a different pin, I assume this could cause a problem? Although maybe it just won't light up that LED, but everything else will work fine?
baphomet
Member
Here's my newest work in progress. Building a supergun so I can play some arcade pcb's on my monitor. Looks alright for the first attempt I guess. It's pretty basic, but it'll do what I need it to. Neo Geo pads will work on it, have a kick harness adapter on the side so I can play any of the games with more than 4 buttons, typical coin, player 1+2 start, service, and test buttons, mvs stereo switch, audio attenuation circuit, RGBs and rca stereo output on the back, and also will support -5v for the games that require it. Once I get it completely finished up I'll post some pics of it running. Gotta admit it is a lot of fun so far putting it together.
bodeiseifer
Member
pic needed,my rgb model modded tg16 has a lovely picture even though the hard wired scart lead is all rusty.
Friend of Sonic
Member
http://postimg.org/image/yev4vi3dd/
It was really hard to capture the jailbars. They look worse in person. After further research this seems normal. Guess I need to fully research mods before I fork over 80-100 bucks. I probably would not have spent this if I knew the jailbars were going to be so apparent., but the modder was super cool and gave me a partial refund.
IrishNinja
Member
okay, got mine at 4:3 with boco's meister recommendation for NES use, and it does look better than it did before, thanks man! still wanting RGB but in due time~
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
If your TV can do 4:4:4 or full RGB, then you should use it. Otherwise you're needlessly limiting the range of colors that your TV displays.
Color spaces and chroma subsampling have nothing to do with latency.
I am pretty sure the Wii U outputs YCbCr709 or something close to it, based on some quick eyeball tests I did with NSMBU/NSLU. Not sure if it's game specific.
baphomet
Member
Soon man....hopefully soon....
Got my SNES RGB cable. Now just need to get my Saturn cable and I'm good.
My Hama switch came in, but I realized that I'm going to need either a female to male adapter or a JP21 cable with male and female ends to connect the output to the mini-din adapter cable. I really don't feel like going through to trouble to find that only to learn that the switch won't work with JP21 cables. Probably going to sell the switch now and cut my losses. If any of you are interested, PM me.
My Hama switch came in, but I realized that I'm going to need either a female to male adapter or a JP21 cable with male and female ends to connect the output to the mini-din adapter cable. I really don't feel like going through to trouble to find that only to learn that the switch won't work with JP21 cables. Probably going to sell the switch now and cut my losses. If any of you are interested, PM me.
I didn't see this thread before. Thanks IrishNinja for pointing me out to it!
So, I recently acquired the XRGB Mini:
This is what I'm getting with just selecting Framemeister mode:
I'm very satisfied with the result. My retro consoles are finally enjoying the HD display after so many years.
All what remains now is to update the firmware
So, I recently acquired the XRGB Mini:
This is what I'm getting with just selecting Framemeister mode:
I'm very satisfied with the result. My retro consoles are finally enjoying the HD display after so many years.
All what remains now is to update the firmware
I'm currently in the market for a SCART switch. How many input ports? I'd be interested if it has at least 4, but I think all Hama switches are only 3...?
In any case I'm thinking about getting this one, I've heard good feedback about it on the system11 forum, and it appears to be one of the very few good switches to be still in production:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0015YYN1W/
1) No, it has a custom 8 pin input port for RGB, the S-video port is just an S-video port
2) Because RGB is better than S-video
I know RGB is better. I live in Europe and I always used RGB.
My XRGB Mini doesn't have a RGB port per sey but a converter RGB to S-Video.
I'm so confused right now 【・ヘ・?】
sixteen-bit
Member
That should be an adapter from JP21 RGB to 8-pin Mini-DIN RGB, not S-Video
Oh, I'm not familiar with that. It looked to me like S-Video, that's why I was confused.
I need to do massive googling session because there are still many things I don't understand.
Thanks for the info!
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
I didn't see this thread before. Thanks IrishNinja for pointing me out to it!
So, I recently acquired the XRGB Mini:
This is what I'm getting with just selecting Framemeister mode:
I'm very satisfied with the result. My retro consoles are finally enjoying the HD display after so many years.
All what remains now is to update the firmware
Have any impressions or pictures of a 3D Polygon Playstation game? I'm wondering how much one of these helps with one of those games.
JinjoUnchained
Member
OK, I'm ready to take the plunge with the Framemeister. I'm looking to hook it up to my N64, PS2 Slim (both composite out), and Wii (for which I have both composite and the component to HDMI adapter). My TV is 43 inch Samsung LED with HDMI and component in. The consoles and TV are all North American models, so no SCART, S Video, or RGB. What cables or adapters should I get in addition to the Framemeister for my setup?
Thanks. Once again, awesome thread!
Thanks. Once again, awesome thread!
Sure:
And it's not even optimized. I need t update the firmware (I don't have a way to read the micro SD right now) and purchase a RGB-21 cable (the French RGB or SCART doesn't work). Currently I'm using a S-Video cable.
FM has HDMI out to your TV, so no worries there.
N64: look into whether or not you want to mod this for RGB (see retrorgb.com). Otherwise, you'll go composite to Framemeister. It still looks great, it's just that the image via composite is not as crisp and the colors not as vivid as RGB.
Wii: if you have the Wii component cables, get a component to d-terminal adapter when you get your Framemeister (Solaris Japan sells them). The component cables plug into the d-terminal adapter and then into the FM. You could also use your component to HDMI converter and use the HDMI input, though that's adding conversion for no real benefit and (unlike getting VGA to FM) not needed.
PS2 slim: suggest reading the section on the PS2 on retrorgb. You should be able to get RGB out for it, which you should if you're primarily using it for 240p games. Otherwise, look into getting the component cables. Composite works and plugs right into FM, but as noted above, the image quality is not as good, and if you're going to drop the money on a FM why settle for crappy inputs?
RetroRGB also has great primers on RGB, cables, SCART v JP21, etc. Between that site and the FM review at hazard-city you should find most of what you need. The short answer: RGB cables (whether SCART or JP21) can be connected to the FM's mini-din port (looks like S-Video port, but isn't). If you have a SCART RGB cable you need a SCART to mini-din adapter cable. If you have a JP21 RGB cable you use the adapter that comes with the FM.
You can use the Framemeister itself as a reader if you have a USB cable.
The problem is that here in Europe (at least in France), USB cables don't have the same format. So, I can't do that either...
Edit: what kind of USB cable is this? I can't find it on amazon.
Edit2: it seems it's a UC-E6 type, which is not very common here. Well, I need to hunt for one of those.
JinjoUnchained
Member
Perfect, thanks for the info. I'll definitely get a component-to-d-terminal and look into modding my N64; thanks again.
Edit: I mixed up the different PPU projects, this is NOT the universal PPU. This is a project made by Viletim.
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617
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