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VGLeaks rumor: Durango CPU Overview

D

Drek

Member
Ocellatus said:
If the rumors are true that the systems have the same CPU and that the 720 GPU is similar but just underpowered, it will likely turn into a situation where the performance simply scales up or down depending on the lead platform. In such a scenario, the developers won't really have to work very hard to exploit the extra power in the PS4. The games would probably all look better on PS4 in the same way they do when you upgrade a PC with a better GPU and more RAM.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. It could easily wind up being a generation where games are developed primarily on PC hardware with the traditional tiers of PC game performance scaling effectively tied to each console. X720 would be the target for "medium", PS4 the target for "high", and enthusiast PCs the target for "very high/ultra" settings.

Hydrargyrus said:
The lack of Blu-ray in that leak is probably even worst than the "always online" thing


8ghz GPU is a mistake... or wizard jizz
Click to expand...
Not wizard jizz, MS has a Time Lord trapped inside every GPU, breaking the laws of time and space to suit developers' needs.
 
J

jaosobno

Member
Bluray is a must and 8000 MHz is a typo. It should probably say 800 MHz (all rumors so far point to that core clock).

It's mostly just a rehash of a well known rumors.
 
T

TacticalFox88

Banned
So, as of right now, with the best possible information we have, what the genuine chances of Durango surpassing the PS4?

Because right now it seems like it's going to at the very least match it or be very close.
 
N

nelsonroyale

Member
TacticalFox88 said:
So, as of right now, with the best possible information we have, what the genuine chances of Durango surpassing the PS4?

Because right now it seems like it's going to at the very least match it or be very close.
Click to expand...

Pretty much all current rumours suggest PS4 has the edge, but nothing is concrete until Durango reveal.
 
G

grumble

Member
Drek said:
Pretty much. It could easily wind up being a generation where games are developed primarily on PC hardware with the traditional tiers of PC game performance scaling effectively tied to each console. X720 would be the target for "medium", PS4 the target for "high", and enthusiast PCs the target for "very high/ultra" settings.
Click to expand...

To be honest while this is a simple solution it also is a total waste. The gameplay experiences that additional power provides would be wasted if they're hamstrung by a lowest-denominator console. If all we get is prettier graphics then that's too bad. I guess we would depend on first-parties to challenge game limits, but even they would have a tough time getting around a culture of 'the same'.
 
A

artist

Banned
Reiko said:
Be honest, did you really thought what you were reading was true a year ago?

Because I sure didn't.

I went with full on skepticism when I posted it on GAF.

In the OP I said take it with a pinch of salt.
Click to expand...
Jeez, again deflecting the question.
 
A

antic604

Banned
Ocellatus said:
If the rumors are true that the systems have the same CPU and that the 720 GPU is similar but just underpowered, it will likely turn into a situation where the performance simply scales up or down depending on the lead platform. In such a scenario, the developers won't really have to work very hard to exploit the extra power in the PS4. The games would probably all look better on PS4 in the same way they do when you upgrade a PC with a better GPU and more RAM.
Click to expand...

Drek said:
Pretty much. It could easily wind up being a generation where games are developed primarily on PC hardware with the traditional tiers of PC game performance scaling effectively tied to each console. X720 would be the target for "medium", PS4 the target for "high", and enthusiast PCs the target for "very high/ultra" settings
Click to expand...

Fully agree here, at least for big budget multi-platform games using 3rd party middle-ware engines like Unreal, CryEngine or FrostBite. It would actually be great to leave some of those settings exposed to console users, so we could choose whether we prefer 60Hz framerate or advanced SSAO & AA, but that's probably not going to happen...
 
C

Cidd

Member
Y2Kev said:
IT'S OVER EIGHT THOUSSAANND
Click to expand...

Oh Lawd

gif-baby-lawd-gif.gif
 
R

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
Drek said:
Pretty much. It could easily wind up being a generation where games are developed primarily on PC hardware with the traditional tiers of PC game performance scaling effectively tied to each console. X720 would be the target for "medium", PS4 the target for "high", and enthusiast PCs the target for "very high/ultra" settings.
Click to expand...
This is what I'm expecting as well, perhaps a bit smaller of a difference. PS4 will likely see advantages in most games but it won't be a huge difference, at least for a while into the gen. I think a lot of people need to realize that rumored Durango specs are still a generational leap in power, just not quite to same extent as PS4.
 
D

dragonelite

Member
seriously atleast insiders come up with a more balanced spec sheet.
8000mhz gpu high peek, No bluray low peak.

/firm believer of dual apu ballmer will make it hAPPEN believe.
 
G

grumble

Member
antic604 said:
Fully agree here, at least for big budget multi-platform games using 3rd party middle-ware engines like Unreal, CryEngine or FrostBite. It would actually be great to leave some of those settings exposed to console users, so we could choose whether we prefer 60Hz framerate or advanced SSAO & AA, but that's probably not going to happen...
Click to expand...

I'm not sure it's even a good idea; having a simple, streamlined experience for gamers is one of the selling points of a console. Any wait time between when you turn the console on and when you're having fun is a negative, as is any hassle fiddling with menus. If the developers make the call to streamline the experience further for players I think a lot of people are happier with it.
 
A

antic604

Banned
grumble said:
I'm not sure it's even a good idea; having a simple, streamlined experience for gamers is one of the selling points of a console. Any wait time between when you turn the console on and when you're having fun is a negative, as is any hassle fiddling with menus. If the developers make the call to streamline the experience further for players I think a lot of people are happier with it.
Click to expand...

Sure, but it doesn't have to be mandatory - they could bury it up in "Advanced options" and if untouched the game would run with default settings. Some games (Lego series) already give access to e.g. vsync setting, allowing you to choose between the IQ and framerate and I've not heard anyone complaining about them not being able to jump right into the action.
 
N

nib95

Banned
Master_JO said:
There was some information the source was willing to provide. The full details are below:

•While no confirmation on an announcement date, E3 will be “Party Central” in the Xbox booth
•The new ’720′ will have 3x the processing speed of the current 360
•No hard release date but it looks like Holiday 2013
•2 launch versions. 320 GB Arcade / 500 GB Pro. Exact pricing is unknown
•1 TB HD available as a separate purchase
•It will not include Blu-Ray
•No picture was available as prototype consoles are packaged in a 360 slim case to “avoid complications” about the design until announcement
•Tech Specs; AMD eight-core x64 1.6GHz CPU, Direct3d 11.x 8000MHz GPU, and 8GB of DDR3 RAM
•Xbox Smartglass is still a feature in use
•No word on Kinect 2.0
•No word on “Immersive” technology being implemented
Expect new information closer to E3


http://www.gamingcapacity.com/xbox-720-info-revealed-by-inside-source/

isnt this just like vgleaks rumors considering the CPU and GPU?
Click to expand...

Lol, guessing they meant 800mhz. Which could be a slightly downclocked 7850 (console alternatives generally are slightly under clocked), or based off of a 7950.
 
J

JJD

Member
ekim said:
Thanks!

my 2 cents :
I had some private chat with one specific GAF member and he told me that MS built multiple (power)options for Durango to be able to compete with sony if they beef up their specs. MS itself allegedly hasn't decided on a build when I had this conversation.

Up until now I was under the impressions that these builds only differ in clock speeds and maybe RAM specs.
I don't think it's impossible to run 2 APUs but it's highly unlikely (and not only because no dev besides first party won't be able to use this properly).
An APU+GPU approach sounds more feasible.

Tinfoilhat speculation:
What if MS leaked all the specs on purpose and also only gave this specs to devs so Sony got confident to go first? The leaked specs are enough to produce good looking launch games while they would be able to keep the bomb (aka a second APU/GPU) inhouse until the presentation.

Another thing could be that the second APU is basically the one that can be found in the 360 slim and it's only purpose is BC?
Click to expand...

Bkilian said on B3D that this rumor is false, and he mentioned that MS never worked with IBM on the Durango project until he left MS. He left MS 3 months ago.

Here is his word on the whole 2 APU rumor:

Originally Posted by expletive
The most surprising thing about this thread since the new 'rumor' is that bkilian, knowing what he knows, hasn't completely dismissed the idea outright. It's really the only reason why i haven't completely ruled it out as well. The whole thing just seems very un-"Microsoft 2012".

Originally Posted by bklian
I can't dismiss it out of hand. He very carefully stated that it is a decision only 2 months old, and I've been gone from the team for 3 months now. I still think it is bull, but I can't say I _know_ it's bull, since I don't. I've seen some of the executives make stupid decisions like this in the past, so it has a small chance of being true (but a very small chance).
Click to expand...
 
I

itsgreen

Member
Master_JO said:
There was some information the source was willing to provide. The full details are below:

•While no confirmation on an announcement date, E3 will be “Party Central” in the Xbox booth
•The new ’720′ will have 3x the processing speed of the current 360
•No hard release date but it looks like Holiday 2013
•2 launch versions. 320 GB Arcade / 500 GB Pro. Exact pricing is unknown
•1 TB HD available as a separate purchase
•It will not include Blu-Ray
•No picture was available as prototype consoles are packaged in a 360 slim case to “avoid complications” about the design until announcement
•Tech Specs; AMD eight-core x64 1.6GHz CPU, Direct3d 11.x 8000MHz GPU, and 8GB of DDR3 RAM
•Xbox Smartglass is still a feature in use
•No word on Kinect 2.0
•No word on “Immersive” technology being implemented
Expect new information closer to E3


http://www.gamingcapacity.com/xbox-720-info-revealed-by-inside-source/

isnt this just like vgleaks rumors considering the CPU and GPU?
Click to expand...

Sounds reasonable enough to be truth. (When excluding the 8000 mhz GPU and replacing it with a 800mhz one ;))

The 3x performance seems very low and doesn't really compute with the specs...

Kinect 2.0 missing is weird, and it would be weird if MS doesn't give an option to download Blu-ray disc support since it most likely uses the format as a base.

Harddrive sizes don't make sense since both 320 and 500GB are 40 euro retail. 1TB is 60 euro retail. (2.5" SATA 300).

Much more likely is a base 500GB model and a Pro 1TB model... wouldn't surprise me if the Pro model would also include full Blu ray movie support for an extra 100$.
 
A

ascii42

Member
Multiple power options? It would suck to be developing for the Durango if that were true.

"Make several versions of your game. Hopefully it doesn't suck on whichever hardware we eventually choose to release"
 
T

Tears For Fears

Banned
itsgreen said:
Sounds reasonable enough to be truth. (When excluding the 8000 mhz GPU and replacing it with a 800mhz one ;))

The 3x performance seems very low and doesn't really compute with the specs...

Kinect 2.0 missing is weird, and it would be weird if MS doesn't give an option to download Blou-ray disc support since it most likely uses the format as a base.

Harddrive sizes don't make sense since both 320 and 500GB are 40 euro retail. 1TB is 60 euro retail. (2.5" SATA 300).

Much more likely is a base 500GB model and a Pro 1TB model... wouldn't surprise me if the Pro model would also include full Blu ray movie support for an extra 100$.
Click to expand...
No way are they charging for bluray that's market suicide. Sony already includes it out of box.
 
I

itsgreen

Member
ascii42 said:
Multiple power options? It would suck to be developing for the Durango if that were true.

"Make several versions of your game. Hopefully it doesn't suck on whichever hardware we eventually choose to release"
Click to expand...

Well it isn't like they have one IBM Power PC/Nvidia option and one AMD x86/AMD option.

If they'd do that they probably let developers aim for the lower option first and then happily surprise them with extra possibilities...
 
I

itsgreen

Member
Tears For Fears said:
No way are they charging for bluray that's market suicide. Sony already includes it out of box.
Click to expand...

Why not? They did it with Xbox 1?

Why pay 5$ for every console sold if you can take atleast 10$ profit on each one that wants Blu-ray support (and let the users that want it pay 15-25$)? And why include it in every box when it might not be a feature that is needed, "Blu-ray movie support* , * optional download 20$." might be enough.

Makes perfect sense to me.
 
T

Tears For Fears

Banned
itsgreen said:
Why not? They did it with Xbox 1?

Why pay 5$ for every console sold if you can take atleast 10$ profit on each one that wants Blu-ray support (and let the users that want it pay 15-25$)? And why include it in every box when it might not be a feature that is needed, a asterisk with possibility might be enough.

Makes perfect sense to me.
Click to expand...

Xbox had native DVD support and could be used without the remote. Albeit with a bit of modification. We are talking about gouging an already weak economy for something the competion offers for free. That's not good business practice at all. It's not happening, and if for some reason they do do it, they are in a world of hurt. Sony will use that as a bullet point.
 
O

onQ123

Member
nib95 said:
Said processing speed. Might only be comparing CPU's.
Click to expand...


or the whole System


Xbox 360 was said to have a 115 GFLOPS CPU & 240GFLOPS GPU


355 GFLOPS x 3.5 = 1.24TFLOPS


8 core Jaguar @ 1.6GHz = 104GFLOPS CPU + 1.23TFLOP GPU = 1.33TFLOPS

so maybe that's how they came to those numbers.


but really it just look like a website trying to get some hits by putting a story together from random stuff they found on the internet.
 
JonathanPower

JonathanPower

Member
Master_JO said:
There was some information the source was willing to provide. The full details are below:

•While no confirmation on an announcement date, E3 will be “Party Central” in the Xbox booth
•The new ’720′ will have 3x the processing speed of the current 360
•No hard release date but it looks like Holiday 2013
•2 launch versions. 320 GB Arcade / 500 GB Pro. Exact pricing is unknown
•1 TB HD available as a separate purchase
•It will not include Blu-Ray
•No picture was available as prototype consoles are packaged in a 360 slim case to “avoid complications” about the design until announcement
•Tech Specs; AMD eight-core x64 1.6GHz CPU, Direct3d 11.x 8000MHz GPU, and 8GB of DDR3 RAM
•Xbox Smartglass is still a feature in use
•No word on Kinect 2.0
•No word on “Immersive” technology being implemented
Expect new information closer to E3


http://www.gamingcapacity.com/xbox-720-info-revealed-by-inside-source/

isnt this just like vgleaks rumors considering the CPU and GPU?
Click to expand...

Cool, the 8GHz spec pretty much confirms the 4D dual-APU staked design.
 
JonathanPower

JonathanPower

Member
itsgreen said:
Sounds reasonable enough to be truth. (When excluding the 8000 mhz GPU and replacing it with a 800mhz one ;))

The 3x performance seems very low and doesn't really compute with the specs...

Kinect 2.0 missing is weird, and it would be weird if MS doesn't give an option to download Blu-ray disc support since it most likely uses the format as a base.

Harddrive sizes don't make sense since both 320 and 500GB are 40 euro retail. 1TB is 60 euro retail. (2.5" SATA 300).

Much more likely is a base 500GB model and a Pro 1TB model... wouldn't surprise me if the Pro model would also include full Blu ray movie support for an extra 100$.
Click to expand...

Yes, but my guess is that the player would not be internal. Remember the HD-DVD add-on? Well, it will be something like this:

sgmSdiE.jpg
Click to expand...

On a serious note, that's the prototype of the next gen AMD APU.

https://twitter.com/repi/status/306835055114866688
 
N

nib95

Banned
onQ123 said:
or the whole System


Xbox 360 was said to have a 115 GFLOPS CPU & 240GFLOPS GPU


355 GFLOPS x 3.5 = 1.24TFLOPS


8 core Jaguar @ 1.6GHz = 104GFLOPS CPU + 1.23TFLOP GPU = 1.33TFLOPS

so maybe that's how they came to those numbers.


but really it just look like a website trying to get some hits by putting a story together from random stuff they found on the internet.
Click to expand...

Ok, when you put it like that, it does add up.
 
E

Elios83

Member
fillup said:
No Blu-Ray = No Buy. Seriously MS, I hope to god you are not that stupid.
Click to expand...

I don't think thay can be that crazy, it's true that in this way they could have the perfect excuse for always online, no used games....but going fully digital without Blu Ray is just suicide. They can't be that stupid.
 
M

Meccanical

Member
They were merely testing you.

You all are not prepared for it's new quantum Futuresex™ Quad-APU with 69.6969 ziggaflops of ultra sexy processing power. Clocked at 99oopsihertz it will take gaming into the future, the past, the present, then back to the future because it left it's keys, then forward to the yesterday to rock you into five seconds to now.
 
O

Osiris

I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
pharmboy044 said:
They might have a high capacity medium like Blu-ray but no movie playback (eg, DVD playback kit)
Click to expand...

So it'll be an all-in-one entertainment device that's not quite all-in-one?

Yeah, that's not gonna happen.
 
I

itsgreen

Member
pharmboy044 said:
They might have a high capacity medium like Blu-ray but no movie playback (eg, DVD playback kit)
Click to expand...

If they don't have blu ray as a spec they can still have blu ray...

To call yourself a blu ray player and carry the logo and play movies you must buy a license and stuff...
 
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