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******* vs. David Jaffe - Meltdown
- Thread starter nerbo
- Start date
WasabiKing said:
It could. It runs more risk than reward in the long run though. Reward in that it got people to look at a $10 game. Risk in that if the game doesn't live up to this entire drama (I'm talking about everything he's done to end up in this "spotlight"), he is going to bear the brunt of it all. Could be a real shot to the guy's credibility. All over a $10 game. I mean, already the guy says he's pissed off good friends in the industry already. Was it really worth it?
If the game kicks a lot of ass online, then the risk pays off for him.
Personally, I really regret that the game has slipped this far. There's some good movies coming out in theatres, good anime sales coming up, and good full priced games coming that I want too. All places that extra $10 will go into nicely. Calling All Cars may not fit in for me now. =/
Madman said:
I was getting ready to respond, then I reread the bolded line, and I just have to laugh at you, so :lol. There you have it. I would like to come up with an analogy to put into perspective how dumb you sound, but for some reason (hmm), I just don't think you'd get it :lol
While I see that point, in my opinion I don't think the industry's liberties are being limited. I think there will always be opposition to certain games no matter what the respect. Movies still have the same issue, look at that recent Dakota Fanning fiasco. Music still has it's problems as well, the rap genre has generated negative buzz to that industry for a few decades now. If you take a look at Thrill Kill, I think that was the only issue of the industry's liberties being threatened IIRC. As for the second part of your post, we already have a "2 crowds" industry. Licensed bullshit, and daring more artistic games on the other side.Ranger X said:
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
JdFoX187 said:
You need a stroll down memory lane. Read this post again and understand that you were missing the point by suggesting Jaffe's outburst was related to criticism of his GAME when it was actually related to criticism of him for going back to repair bugs in a game.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6266073&postcount=163
JdFoX187 said:
I don't know what you've been ****ing smoking.
I don't give a shit about Jaffe. I don't know him, I don't think his games are the best around, and I don't agree with everything he does or says...I also don't feel any emotion, outrage, or loyalty when I read his outbursts. It just happens to be that:
a) He is justifiably pissed off that someone has insulted him for actually trying to improve a game based upon criticism that he himself described as "a good, valid point".
b) You seemed to have largely missed the point with all your analogies about people crying when their PRODUCT is criticised, and your comments about how Jaffe reduces the respect people have for the entire industry, and your ignorant suggestion that Jaffe has only made GoW and Calling All Cars...hence the warning that if you continue to talk out of your arse you should expect to be called out for it.
FirstInHell said:
Who the **** cares.
His blog is comedy. He's not posting those comments with vitriol and rage oozing out of every pore on his body.
Your judgemental moral crusade is pretty ridiculous.
Mustaphadamus
Member
I love this dude (Jaffe). He keeps everything 100% and above board!nerbo said:Full story via Wired Game|Life.
Great entertainment. I'd post the quote here, but once you read it, you'll see why I'm opting not to. :lol
[edit] I'm not taking sides or anything here, just enjoying the show
Madman said:
Already said it. If you don't get the concept of an analogy, and can't recognize when one is being used then I've got nothing for you.
For the last time though (just to say I tried), the comparison wasn't to that of Jaffe and a little girl or his game and the bargain bin. It was a comparison to Jaffe's passion for his game and unwillingness to give it up and that of a little girl's passion for her doll and unwillingness to give it up to a garage sale.
Looking at it that way, it is more of a complement
If you read the rest of the article, it wasn't the slightest bit insulting. It actually contained mostly facts, and showed that the author understood Jaffe's reasoning. Why would they start an article with an incredibly insulting sentence, then go on to be completely respectful and understanding?
thanks said:
Genres of games are starting to widen imo. We also need to get rid this stereotype that tells it's only a toy and it's for kids. There isn't any AO games yet and most retailers don't even want to imagine selling those (another proof of bad/wrong video game image). Stores can't even rely on selling videogames, they need to be renting stores and used stores at the same time. We simply aren't on the music and movie level about pretty much anything imo. It's just the beginning for videogames right now. We are in no way vast and diverse as movies or music yet. Also, i agree there are already 2 styles of games but it's not as definite and clear cut yet as movies and music. You can make a living with movies and music without going too commercial. With videogames you're still pretty ****ed. There is an indy scene but that "non-commercial" crowd is only starting to get out there imo.
I pretty much agree with this post, except for the widening genres part. You mean ported, and/or western made, correct? In that case, yes you're right.Ranger X said:
Aside from that though, JAFFETOID is amazing. I never really cared too much for them before but this is pretty funny stuff.
thanks said:
Bah that was a general statement. 10 years ago there wasn't as many different games as today imo. It's getting there. Now we have cuisine simulation (ok not so much yet lol), brain training and game about wine and beer. That's what i meant by genres slowly widening.
I like Jaffe's blog too
Grecco said:
Um, you think? Granted, there is no proof Sony is upset. However, it would come as no surprise that Sony would be upset at him. Even though it's his personal blog, it doesn't matter. Companies are taking closer looks at their employee's personal blogs and so forth nowadays. Just because it's a blog, doesn't make you immune.
Lets also be honest. Jaffe works for a Sony owned studio. As much as we all like him for his honesty and candor, he's not doing Sony any favors by running around interviews cussing like a sailor and so forth. With all the bad PR spin bullshit Sony spits out on it's own, this certainly doesn't help either. If some opportunistic reporter wanted to, they could damage Sony as a whole even farther by just using Jaffe's profanity ridden interviews and saying "Do you really want to buy games from a company that directly employs foul mouthed hooligans like this?" and run with it full force.
It could have turned ugly depending on the circumstances. Still could.
Rabbit Lord
Member
Twisted Metal
Please Jaffe, please.
fanduck said:
I'll say this. While it could be interpreted that the statement that ******* made was not made to be insulting in nature, I have a hard time believing that. If they did, they would have stated otherwise in response to Jaffe.
The fact that they have made no clarification leads me to believe that Jaffe's interpretation was indeed correct. Perhaps it wasn't, but until they say "We didn't mean it in an insulting manner and we were only trying to make a metaphor" I will be under the assumption it was meant to be portrayed in an insulting manner.
While I respect your opinion and believe that everyone is entitled to one, your statements attempting to insult my intelligence were disrespectful and unecessary.
That's all.
Jaffe's outspoken character could have just as easily upset the dev teams he works with at Sony, not necessarily Sony execs. Jaffe is ironically Sony's best PR person outside of Phil H. ATM, so I'd think execs wouldn't care as much.
But the dev teams Jaffe works with have the privilege/curse of working in his shadow. He may not do it intentionally but he grabs the spotlight nevertheless which may raise issues of jealousy or may have people concerned that their little $10 downloadable game project is garnering more attention than they'd personally like to see. Hype that could backfire and then they're the ones left with CAC on their resume, without Jaffe's rockstar status.
But the dev teams Jaffe works with have the privilege/curse of working in his shadow. He may not do it intentionally but he grabs the spotlight nevertheless which may raise issues of jealousy or may have people concerned that their little $10 downloadable game project is garnering more attention than they'd personally like to see. Hype that could backfire and then they're the ones left with CAC on their resume, without Jaffe's rockstar status.
FirstInHell
Banned
MrSardonic said:
Apparently I care. I care enough no to buy his games because of the way he comes across. That is my choice and I believe that there are a lot of people who feel the same way as I do.
People have propped this guy up on a pedestal and he knows this. He plays up this character because he recognizes that it gets him the attention he needs. I am sure he is loving all of this and basking in how he has managed to get everyone talking about his $10 game. I am not buying into it and everyone here should not allow themselves to be polished like this.
bluemax said:
Guts? He's doing what he's supposed to do. The bugs shouldn't have been there. It's a good thing is it a downloadable release so they can just delay it before uploading it. Much easier model to go back and fix than a regular release.
I can understand that in this day, it's easy to praise a dev for fixing their bugs, but this is something they're supposed to do anyways. Can't run around patting people on their backs for fixing something that should have been caught long before this.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I swear Jaffe goes from being awesome to a complete asshat in the speed of light. Who ****ing cares if someone gave your game a low rating due to valid reasons and their own god damn opinion. It comes off as extremely disconnected to reality and arrogant when he pulls this stuff
Madman said:
I see your point, and I agree that yes, it is possible this was intended as an insult. But just the fact that this statement could go either way proves that Jaffe overreacted! Rather than considering both interpretations, he saw it as an insult and ran with it.
I'm sorry I implied you were dumb, I didn't really mean it. Would it make me a better person if I admitted I overreacted?
You know, it's cool to have "bravery" or whatever, and everyone knows that J.oystiq is just plain dumb, but he needs to stop putting himself in the middle of stuff like this. Whether he realizes it or not, HE is the one looking pretty childish right now, in my opinion. I'm not saying he has to take it up the ass or be overly nice, but there is NOTHING conformist/wrong/whatever with being professional.
I agree but want to take it a step further: even if they had NO good reasons, there's no reason for him to react like he does. People are smart enough to figure out when someone is a dumbass without Jaffe telling the entire world. He needs to grow up and deal with it.
Kintaro said:
But he's delaying his game in direct response to criticism of its faults. How often do we see that? Not as much as we should admittedly. Perhaps because he is at a major company he has the luxuries of time/resources necessary to do this. I still think it is pretty gutsy.
Odrion said:
<3 Do these blogger dudes even have formal journalism training? Let alone any formal knowledge of software development?
Take it down a notch. Don't get all Jaffe on me, I made a joke that you couldn't take and now you're using my status on an online forum as an insult. I simply found what you said as funny and you just didn't take it the right way. As for Thompson, he's only really attacked developers for making violent games, or for them/journalists/other members of the industry jabbing him personally, nothing else. If he started talking about God of War I'm sure it'd be about the sexual and violent themes more than the fact that Jaffe is profane on his personal blog. Even if he did, well then I'd be wrong, but that's not really the issue anyway. All I'm saying, and as I've stated before, is that it was funny that you described it as if Sony was running for president.Kintaro said:
Wow...it's official, Sardonic is Jaffe Jr. I bet you're going to grow up to be just like him :lolMrSardonic said:
Perhaps YOU should take a trip down memory lane. He took the game back in to make fixes to some things that were problematic in reviews. ******* made an analogy simply comparing him to a girl who didn't want to let her doll go. Did they ever say he was a girl or CaC was garbage bin crap? No. And you cannot honestly tell me they did. Why? Because it's not there. It's interperted that way by fanboys like you who want to argue on the Internet.
I made a mistake about Jaffe's history. I didn't know he made the Twisted Metal games. I apologized for that. But your argument is so damn thin that you have to stoop to personal attacks against me and dismiss my entire point simply because I didn't know one part of his pedigree.
The fact of the matter is the guy is whining on the Internet about a blog post. It's whining. There's no other name for it. He acted like a little kid jumping up and down and screaming at Wal-Mart. How you can justify his actions or how anybody can justify his actions, I'll never know. But, by your posts here, I understand somewhat.
McBradders
NeoGAF: my new HOME
I have a lot of respect for Jaffe. Firstly that Sony let him off the leash so much that he -can- actually post a personal blog about his professional life says a lot about them valuing him as a creative. Secondly, there is no denying that he's a talented game designer/director. I'll be the first to admit that I don't like everything he's done, but that doesn't stop me from appreciating it.
Right now the gaming press is in a fairly sorry state. How many "journalists" are willing to ask the hard questions these days? In fact, how many ever were? There are maybe two or three, and although I can't name them, I don't think they work for any of the big sites. I think it's good that Jaffe is asking the hard questions of them, taking them to task. Sure, he could use a little more restraint in his language (El Cliffy B has the same issue IMO), but I think it's high time the journalistic side of the fence to start showing a more credible face, stop regurgitating press releases and start thinking harder about how the review process works so it's fairer on the consumer, the publishers, and themselves.
Right now the gaming press is in a fairly sorry state. How many "journalists" are willing to ask the hard questions these days? In fact, how many ever were? There are maybe two or three, and although I can't name them, I don't think they work for any of the big sites. I think it's good that Jaffe is asking the hard questions of them, taking them to task. Sure, he could use a little more restraint in his language (El Cliffy B has the same issue IMO), but I think it's high time the journalistic side of the fence to start showing a more credible face, stop regurgitating press releases and start thinking harder about how the review process works so it's fairer on the consumer, the publishers, and themselves.