Support NeoGAF

[DOBERMAN INC]

First Anime I ever saw was Gunbuster around 1995 and no one I knew had any idea what anime was or cared, so It didn't really matter to me.

Stopped watching new stuff after trying to watch Naruto for a while and noticing the creepy stuff coming out. Now I seldom watch at all bar pulling out my old stuff.

 

[CarpeDeezNutz]

When I was a teenager in high school around the 90s nobody really knew what anime was.

I had copies of ghost in the shell, Akira, Ninja scroll, etc. and lend them to people and they really liked it, not just nerdy types.

After that my interests went to electronic music and djing.

Now it's shit like waifus and those body pillows what is that all about?

 

[Extra Sauce]

Went from ultra-geeky to ultra creepy.

/thread

 

[PeskyToaster]

FTFY

You actually broke it because it was a reference to a thread on here.

 

[Timbuktu]

Not where I am from, it's just normal. That is east Asia though. I don't there is an equivalent for western animation over here.

 

[captainpat]

It feels less like anime's the "red headed stepchild of the geek community" and more like it's just a bigger target. It's fandom is way larger than most than most sections of the geekdom.

 

[Spieler Eins]

No. When your tapes came with this on the front end, you knew you were fixing to watch some dope shit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIeLlDN8RsM

Why can't we get more of this nowadays.

 

[Crayolan]

Anime is considered more taboo by people into other geeky things because they actually get second-hand exposure to it via the internet. The average person tends to know absolutely nothing about it so they don't see it as any different than anything else, unless you show them something really over-the-top.

 

[Megalosaro]

It's a shame most westerners haven't seen UC Gundam. Changed my life.

 

[Daingurse]

It's a shame most westerners haven't seen UC Gundam. Changed my life.

The 08th MS Team is my favorite Gundam series. Hell, might also be my favorite Mech series. Either that or Eva.

 

[dorkkaos]

The 08th MS Team is my favorite Gundam series. Hell, might also be my favorite Mech series. Either that or Eva.

Oh man, UC Gundam is amazing. Currently reading through Gundam The Origins, and I really like a lot of the changes they did.

 

[bengraven]

I remember a brief moment in the mid-90s when it was secretly "cool" in a counter-culture way. I remember the fine ass art school girls would always borrow our VHSs, on the down low of course. I remember a short article in TV guide about Akira one time and was like "WE DID IT WE MADE IT". And sure enough it was becoming popular.

Then for a few years it was, like Star Wars is now, kind of open. This is around 2000, then again maybe it was just my area and my peers, but everyone seemed to be okay with talking about Pokemon and Akira...post Matrix, Animatrix I suppose. Even as late as 2006 I had kids in my call center (we hired as young as 15 there) reading Jump and trading Narutos on boring weekends. Then suddenly the manga aisles shrinked and the kids looking at them ended up with more and more zits as time passed. I missed out on when it was "popular" in schools.

I kind of wish I had been born a couple years later, but then again I haven't watched anime in 15 years...except the first six episodes of Titan and some Ghibli movies with my son.

 

[Megalosaro]

The 08th MS Team is my favorite Gundam series. Hell, might also be my favorite Mech series. Either that or Eva.

I actually don't like 08th ms team that much. I think it's the worst UC ova. Too schizophrenic.

 

[brawly]

Precisely. Had a co-worker approach me in my cube one day, said the box for my Gon figure I keep in-said cube catched his eye. Turns out he likes anime and had recently binge watched all The Hunter x Hunter 2011 available on netflix and found the show amazing. Put my fist out immediately for a bump.

I know that feel. Was at a friends apartment on a saturday night, with another one of his friends who I knew a bit from Xbox Live and his roommate (never seen him before that). Few hours in I found out his other friend and roommate are into anime (the other friend probably even more than me) and we ended up watching clips of cool battles and openings on youtube. They're not geeks whatsoever. It was awesome.

 

[Daingurse]

I actually don't like 08th ms team that much. I think it's the worst UC ova. Too schizophrenic.

Huh, well you're entitled to your opinion. It was my favorite UC related thing.

 

[Saucycarpdog]

A japanese teacher at my old university once told me that usually half of her language courses have those people, that either dress up as Visual Kei fans or go to a university lecture in their cosplay and she found it quite sad, that the country is reduced to this.

I can relate. There's an interesting parallel at my university. We have a Chinese club and a Japanese club. The Chinese club is run by actual Chinese speaking chinese-americans. The Japanese club is run by English speaking white guys who love to cosplay. Never seen any actual Japanese-american individuals running the club.

 

[NinjaBoyLao]

Not in my county(Philippines), even the grandpas are into Slam Dunk and Ippo so they understand the appeal of animes.

And I think 70% of the population here can sing the Japanese Voltes V theme.

 

[brawly]

Not in my county(Philippines), even the grandpas are into Slam Dunk and Ippo so they understand the appeal of animes.

Impeccable taste.

 

[Pancake Mix]

From the late 90s to the early 2000s anime was kinda considered mainstream. But today, yeah it has a limited niche audience.

Pretty much. If you were a kid who watched Pokemon or any other anime on TV you were normal. You may not have even known or comprehended they were Japanese, they were huge.

Additionally the best animated film of 2002 was the international release of Spirited Away according to the Academy Awards.

There was nothing geeky about its turn of the millennium mainstream appearance in the west.

 

[Nightbird]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mQScjlXbBE

This is perfect lol

 

[TickleMeElbow]

Not until the really geeky stuff started making it's way to the west. If most people in Japan think it's geeky, then it's going to be seen as ultra geeky over here.

 

[Kusagari]

The most popular stuff has always somewhat evaded the image from what I've seen.

I'm always amazed by the fondness people in my age group seem to have for DBZ, even among females. I graduated high school in 2007 and I remember that Naruto and Bleach seemed to be fairly well known and watched even among those who would be considered jocks.

I feel like nothing, except maybe Attack on Titan on some level, have even come close to being known like those shows though. I'd imagine talking about anything newer would get looks or question marks.

 

[zero shift]

Anime has never been less geeky than it is currently. The 2000s boom really helped it get somehwat accepted in the mainstream, at least by Millennials.

 

[Platy]

There are few things more geeky than giving a different name for some cartoons just because it was made in Japan =P


Also, I read once that most animes started appearing in USA TV channels in "black focused channels" so the first generation of anime fans were mostly African Americans, is it true ?
Because I know society see anything embraced by them as something NOT geeky =P

 

[TwEE-N-Toast]

Nah not really, I would say it was seen even less geeky then video games and way less geeky then comics. There was the general Saturday morning cartoon fair. Then the stuff you would find while hanging out in music stores. Stuff like 3 x 3 eyes, Ninja Scrolls or Ghost in the Shell. You would loan or trade those with people it would blow most folks minds.

I'm not sure the creepy peso stuff was being exported then, or if so not enough to even notice.

 

[Thaedolus]

There are few things more geeky than giving a different name for some cartoons just because it was made in Japan =P

Actually my senpai Miyazaki-sama does not consider stupid Ghibli animations "animé," but rather traditional animation, while "animé" exists as a subset of "animation," specifically referring to the low budget trash seen on TV.

 

[Ushay]

Let's email Stevie and ask him.

Holy shit son, good call.

 

[PfantzyPantz]

Actually my senpai Miyazaki-sama does not consider stupid Ghibli animations "animé," but rather traditional animation, while "animé" exists as a subset of "animation," specifically referring to the low budget trash seen on TV.

This is how I go about it, and it's what people refer to when they say something looks 'too anime' in game threads. But anime fans always get mad and defensive.

I want to laugh at that Butthurt Anime Fan video, but it just makes me cringe because of how spot on it is.

 

[psynergylover]

It felt pretty mainstream during the DBZ Toonami era over here in America, but other than that I think it's been a really geeky niche.

Was basically going to say this; back when toonami was on regularly, every one was always talking about that and pokemon. I remember waiting in line for hours trying to get tickets for Pokemon: The First Movie and 2000. But then it quickly faded when I reached middle school then finally realized I was apart of a very small group in high school.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

From the late 90s to the early 2000s anime was kinda considered mainstream. But today, yeah it has a limited niche audience.

Anime never really got mainstream. It was just Pokemon and DBZ that transcended to the mainstream.

 

[PSqueak]

Why does everyone act like Dragonball Z isn't anime? Dragonball Z is beloved in pop culture, and even athletes and celebrities reference Dragonball Z in social media. But then the same people who love it would be like "EWW, ANIME"

Might be wrong, but DBZ got popular when geeky stuff like comics and videogames started making the first steps towards being accepted into the mainstream, this is why there was an anime boom in the late 90's and early 00's, however, DBZ was also a dying breed of shounen shows, many shows that were similar to it were brought, but for a time shows that captured that spirit became more and more rare, even before the raise of moe, anime went back into niche for lack of other super heavy hitters like DBZ that could appeal to a wider audience.

 

[yanipheonu]

It certainly has more stigma than basically any other geeky activity. The term weeaboo was invented for a reason.

Though if I look at any given anime section at a store, between the scantily clad girls and the strange images, I get it. It's more cultural dissonance than anti-geek behaviour I find. People are more inclined to not like anime because it's too foreign and strange, makes sense.

 

[FinalStageBoss]

Always has, always will be.

 

[vityaz]

Why can't we get more of this nowadays.

Man, it'd be pretty cool with a new production with that oldschool art style and stuff. Is there anything like that?

 

[Two Words]

When I was a teenager in high school around the 90s nobody really knew what anime was.

I had copies of ghost in the shell, Akira, Ninja scroll, etc. and lend them to people and they really liked it, not just nerdy types.

After that my interests went to electronic music and djing.

Now it's shit like waifus and those body pillows what is that all about?

"Where has my anime gone?"

 

[Dazza]

I was in anglosaxon country in my childhood in the 80s, we had heaps of Japanese animation even back then on mainstream TV. Just back then I didn't realise it was of Japanese origin. Speed racer, Voltron, Lion Voltron, Mighty Orbots and Technoman I all remember watching. And I consider stuff like Transformers, Ducktales, TMNT and Carebears Japanese animation nowadays

 

[Soriku]

Waifus, harem anime, body pillows, dudes covering their walls in wallscrolls of girls who look like they're twelve, that has all drastically changed how anime is perceived.

It had a mainstream moment, and manga especially became popular with both sexes in a way comics didn't previously, but now it's kinda seen as niche and for perverts. Which a lot of it is, frankly.

I think we're back to where we were in the early 90's, where the best shows are sort of enjoyed by anybody without the "anime guy" baggage. While someone being "into anime" and identifying as an anime fan primarily today often implies creepy stuff. Even if it isn't true.

I never got the impression that the average person associates anime fans with a primarily creepy moe waifu tint, unless this "average" person also frequents sites where anime is often discussed. It seems to me it's other anime fan who hate on that shit, as well people who don't watch anime who think they're self righteous by hating on anime while attacking the creepy anime.

In reality there are more than enough shows to watch that's not the typical moe stuff, especially for the average person who normally doesn't watch anime but might be interested in some.

 

[Nottle]

It's a medium like any other, if you like it that's good.

I think certain styles of anime evoke a certain feeling. Like people are ok with Ghibli because it's like Disney, or Bebop because it's mature. But bring in moe art and people think less of it.

I remember a discussion on the giantbomb cast, there seems to be a stigma against anime, like Metal Gear Solid is ok until you say "stylistically it's anime" or "it's like Ghost in the Shell." I remember someone saying well studio Ghibli movies are anime, and Brad was like "they are different," for some arbitrary reason they aren't "anime" because it's ok to watch.

What's considered nerdy is so strange and the line is hard to define.
I work in a grocery store and most people are familiar with Star Wars and games like Tetris. But mention something a little deeper you'd probably come off as a nerd. Think how Dnd is considered dumb but everyone in the world watched Lord of the Rings.

Don't worry about the stigma, be who you are, just because you like something doesn't mean you instantly become some sort of weird outcast. Do what you like with pride and eventually people will come to respect it.

 

[John Kowalski]

dubbed anime was a pretty big part of my childhood, it can't have been this back then i mean i watched eva as a kid, in the morning before school

 

[rpmurphy]

I have a chuckle when I go to the Barnes & Noble in the outskirts of the city once every several months and see that its manga section keeps growing (at about eight full shelves now) and dwarfing the comics section.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

I have a chuckle when I go to the Barnes & Noble in the outskirts of the city once every several months and see that its manga section keeps growing (at about eight full shelves now) and dwarfing the comics section.

Manga sales are still doing better than comic sales from what I heard.

 

[torre_avenue]

I agree with everyone saying the creepy aspects of anime ruined its chances of mainstream acceptance. For example, take "Kill La Kill." KLK was one of the animes I heard a lot of universal praise from across the internet, and at its core its about 2 schoolgirls, probably younger than 18, fighting in string bikinis with scissor halfs. Of course, that is too strip away (heh) most of the context away from the show, but that's what I'm guessing a lot of people saw when they say KLK. It's creepy as shit. Even beyond that, the comedic moments where Mako's dad and brother peep on Ryuko in the bath are also kinda messed up. There are a lot of counter-examples to the creepy parts of it that say anime is a legitimate art form, stuff like "Tatami Galaxy" or "Paprika" or "Akira", but all the popular shows feature some kind of over-sexualized element to them. Let's take something fairly innocuous like "Himouto Umaru-Chan." This happens in one of the episodes, from the perspective of a 20-something dude to a high school girl. It's so creepy and out of place in an anime most likely oriented towards older kids-younger teens.

Anime had its mainstream moments with DBZ, Naruto, and AoT, but when the most popular anime in Japan are blatantly driven by over-seualizing characters because fans eat that shit up, anyone coming into the genre is bound to have their "this is messed up moment" between 3000 year old dragons, schoolgirls fighting in string bikinis, and jiggling boobs.

Which sucks, because Paprika was supposed to show the world the impossible possibilities anime could visually portray. Paprika is unfilmable for that very reason; its whole plot depends on what is wholly unique to the medium of animation. Anime could have been a host to a new wave of creativity and techniques, but it was more profitable to pander than to create cool new worlds. Don't get me wrong, I know the counter-examples to this but when something like "Monster Musume" becomes popular over a glorious piece of weirdness and creativity like "Nichijou", it shows where the priorities are at.

 

[foxuzamaki]

Precisely. Had a co-worker approach me in my cube one day, said the box for my Gon figure I keep in-said cube catched his eye. Turns out he likes anime and had recently binge watched all The Hunter x Hunter 2011 available on netflix and found the show amazing. Put my fist out immediately for a bump.

We just geeked the fuck out, which is frankly always fun. My office for whatever reason contains a lot of geeks. Grown ass geeks. Had a damn conversation about Mechagodzillas the other day.

I love That feeling, so much.

 

[ChosenPredator]

i don't think so i was surprised how much people were down with anime growing up

 

[DroidDev]

It felt pretty mainstream during the DBZ Toonami era over here in America, but other than that I think it's been a really geeky niche.

I think this is the crux of it. People often consume convenient media. Toonami made anime convenient, and it also filtered out a lot of the garbage. So now, you really have to seek out anime to watch it, which has made it niche. Also, that college humor video that one person posted can be unfortunately true in regards to some of the fans, so the fans can really give the medium a bad rep.

Also, from my anecdotal experience, I think anime culture can be pretty insular. I'll watch the occasional anime and I'll enjoy it. However, most people I know in real life who watch anime watch primarily nothing but anime, so they tend to live in a culture bubble. As a result of this, I think that anime more frequently panders to otaku sensibilities, which further alienates your average consumer and impedes chance of mainstream appeal. If I didn't grow up with Toonami, there's no way in hell I'd be watching any anime today. For anyone who hasn't already seen an anime that they enjoy, It's too difficult to find anime with mainstream appeal and too easy to stumble upon otaku-focused anime.

 

[RedSwirl]

What's funny about my own experience with anime is that as a kid in the early 90's, I was somewhat obsessed with traditional Japanese culture before I'd even been exposed to anime. Post-anime exposure, I don't think I could ever go back to that same state again.

No. When your tapes came with this on the front end, you knew you were fixing to watch some dope shit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIeLlDN8RsM

God damn that takes me back.

"Then one day I rented a vhs copy of Ninja Scroll from a Hollywood Video. It saved me. Anime raised me."

Lol, always loved this vid.

Good god. How many people in this thread were exposed to Ninja Scroll way too early in their lives?

Which might be because parts of the fandom are annoying as hell. I actually think there was a demographic shift around 2002/2003. Before that I remember most people in this fandom were adults that see it as what it is. Entertainment. Nothing more, nothing less. You had your ultra-fans, but they werent really as loud as now.

Then when the Internet got more and more popular around 2003-2005 and it was far easier to consume anime instead of downloading them through dubious methods, now "children" could consume this entertainment product. And thats when it went downhill in my experience. You had 12 year old people trying to convince others that anime are mature, because in Elfenlied people die in a gory way.
You had often social-outcasts, who use that medium as some sort of escapism and in my experience dont really have much knowledge about it themselves, but pretend they do and kinda act like missionaries of anime/manga.
You have those people who use japanese phrases in their sentences because "Japan is the country where milk and honey flows".

The medium itself has problems, but I think the main reason why people think "anime-fans" are weird, social outcasts is because of those "weaboos". I mean if I go to the bookstore and want to buy manga, I can be sure 2-3 sit there in their cosplays reading manga for free and being loud.

A japanese teacher at my old university once told me that usually half of her language courses have those people, that either dress up as Visual Kei fans or go to a university lecture in their cosplay and she found it quite sad, that the country is reduced to this.

(And like I said. Usually the loudest and most obnoxious ones are the ones that dont even have much knowledge about their fandom/entertainment medium and the ones that you can talk to without any awkwardness and wouldnt notice they watch anime (because they dont define themselves through it) are the ones you could talk hours about the medium, historical changes, shifting in the medium and of course anime/manga itself).

Find out what you like by yourself. I would never go into an anime-club. I mean I go to an anime convention almost every year and you find a lot of the people I described in the upper paragraph there. But also the ones you can talk to on a normal level.

Ironically, I've noticed the same thing on actual anime forums, which is where I've found the most level-headed discussion about anime. It's as if the people who really commit to it enough eventually see anime for what it is. I think in the 90's and early 2000's though everyone who was exposed to anime went through an initial phase where they had to seek out any anime they possibly could because it felt inherently new. Maybe that was an affect of how rare it was a the time.

 

[PAULINK]

Anime is not geeky, you guys just don't understand.

 

[Daingurse]

Good god. How many people in this thread were exposed to Ninja Scroll way too early in

I know I was too damn young when I saw it. Hell, growing up I remember being able to rent shit like La Blue Girl, and Night Shift Nurses from a local video store. I was in fucking middle school!

 

[Quasar]

I never thought it was. At least in terms of watching anime shown on tv. It was just more cartoons. Hell alot of the time people didn't know they were Japanese. Geeky was playing D&D.

 

[vityaz]

Anime is not geeky, you guys just don't understand.

it's called ANIME, it's not for girls AND it's not a cartoon. It's some of the best animation from a country superior to ours with deep, intricate plots etc


re: Ninja scroll, it was probably the first anime I saw when I was like ~9 years old. Good stuff, feeling like re-watching it now actually.