• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Was Wolfenstien TNC rewarded in review scores for its SJW agenda?

Status
Not open for further replies.
I did not play TNO or TNC because I thought Wolfenstein (2009) was garbage. That game was not satisfying at all. Had sponge enemies, and a half-baked linear level design that threw enemies at you. Dumb AI, poor feedback on guns and shooting into enemies/environment. Unbelievable boring.
Wolfenstein is one of those games like Bulletstorm, that tries to generate interest by being loud and obnoxious over a boring gameplay loop. IMO, Shadow Warrior 1/2 and Doom (2016) are way, way, way better experiences in this regard. The shooting is way better. So when I have seen gameplay footage of TNO, TNC and now Youngblood it still just looks like garbage to me.

Are reviews affected by SJW? Well, they are affected by lots of things. A review is a subjective opinion, and that opinion is informed by the taste of the reviewer as well as his/hers current mental state. It's not like we have not seen lots of very hyped up games get undeserving scores we look back on with a big ???? in hindsight. GTA4 and Bioshock Infinite being obvious examples to me of games that sought of swept across on a undeserving cloud. And not long after they came out, a lot of people came to their senses and realized that they weren't that good.
But that is why reviews don't matter. They don't give an accurate picture of anything because they are made in a vacuum, on a deadline. That's the worst way to rate and judge the worthiness of anything. The idea of doing a short term review is stupid and inaccurate. You can make a state of game based on a short experience with it, but reviews try to paint the legacy and quality of a game over the course of forever.


Political tendencies, hype, confirmation bias and a host of other logical fallacies betray the quality of a review. And at the same time, you have pundits who need to make 10,000 character reviews for their outlets. And either they cannot think of stuff to say, or what they have to say is not interesting, so they start talking about different shit in their reviews. We see this with music and movie reviews too. Reviewers go rogue and start overanalyzing or seeing shit there ain't there to get their paycheck. Or they try to bait gulleable readers who need reviewers reaffirm what they want to believe because what metacritic says somehow makes it more true.

I know professional critics from respected outlets who don't even go watch the movie they are reviewing. They watch a trailer, watch a synopsis and conjure up an opinion based easily digestible and known information. And I bet you that happens in a lot of video game reviews too, where they are rushing through the game to get that ad revenue. Whoever gave a fuck about integrity at any point? There never was and there never will be when the main incentive to make reviews is fuck you, give me money.

I don't care. I never gave a shit about reviews, and I think its a waste of time to try and fix the hangups of people who need to give their hottakes for money. Major waste of time. I'd rather talk to people about what they think of video games, who play them because they enjoy them. I don't remember the last time I read a video game review that was well thought out or well written.

Video games are a lot more popular these days, so a lot of non-gaming people are moving in. More outlets and portals need gaming reviews because their audience cares about games. So that increases the chance of people who are not so into-games coming in. And then they start making it about everything other than the gameplay, because games doesn't really interest them or because they simply don't know. You can talk forever about the political similarities or whatever to whatever you want. It sounds very smart, and I am sure that with the deadlines most newsrooms have an editor is not going to look over your shoulder as you compare Tetris to LGBTQ rights in Russia.

And fuck it. Good for them. You get to make money on being bad at your job. How can I be salty at that? I wish I could just do something, phone it in and get paid. And you get to give your hottakes that rustle some jimmies to millions of people? Must be satisfying for some of these people.



At the end of the day, I still think a lot of people are misguided in their anger. Stop being upset over "journalists" with an agenda. It doesn't matter. It doesn't break the world. Journalism has always been hypocritical and eating of itself. Its completely fine. You don't wanna be stuck as that person who is there getting triggered about what other people say and do. If you have ever met someone on the left or the right who is like that, you can clearly see how much their life sucks and how stressed they are, because they get triggered that easily. Getting triggered by things outside your control is a fast way to depression, stress and not enjoying your life. Just say fuck it, and move towards positive forces.

There are lots of outlets and communities out there with people who really like video games, and the way they talk about it, actually increases your own joy of games. There are people here on NeoGaf who say that they are tired of politics in games, but they are the first people to get triggered and spread that shit around. Don't click on garbage, don't share garbage. Share the good shit. Share that video or article that details something interesting or profound. Something that will make us appreciate video games more.

A lot of the journalism in gaming runs on triggering people on controversies and making mountains of molehills. They don't have any power. This shit cannibalizes itself once people stop clicking on it. Find the creators, designers and journalists who have something good to say. And thats all you should do.

You can use tools on google and youtube and other places to hide search results around certain outlets. I was getting so annoyed by Forbes clickbait articles popping up on phone every day. And I always wanted to click on them because the headlines were very relevant to my interests in tech and gaming. Almost everyday they were curating these almost auto-generated low effort articles about Cyberpunk, MMOs, Apple, MMA and other shit that interest me. I had to remove forbes from google search results to avoid that shit.


Make a list of the garbage publications you don't like- left and right wing. Make a list. And remove that shit from your life. Find that good shit instead.
 

Fox Mulder

Member
The game is built around killing Nazis and resisting the occupation of America. Of course people are grasping at everything these days to tie it to Trump or a political agenda.

I've beaten both and enjoyed it more than the first just for the dumb story bits. The level design felt a bit worse than the first one, probably to accommodate the different abilities you can choose.
 
Last edited:
I just don’t understand how some of you folks claim to see a divisive agenda in a game about killing Nazis.

Killing Nazis is pretty much our birthright as Americans.

But according to some of you....

So is killing Nazis now viewed as an SJW agenda?

Apparently it now is! The nefarious progressive movement has successfully hijacked the all American pastime of killing goose stepping fascists!

In other news, the next Indiana Jones movie will feature AOC as a female Indy! Take that, you troglodytes!
 
Last edited:

MagnesG

Banned
I think it it had a refreshing story, though the shooting is significantly shittier than before. Had no drive at all to replay those, such a bore.

At times I do feel like the game was intended to attract new fans (wacky afro black char.). I think it was a mix of both.
 

Vlaphor

Member
Killing Nazi's isn't an SJW agenda, it's an American institution.
You know the people referred to in America as "The Greatest Generation"? They killed Nazi's.

"On the weekends, I love taking my family out for a bit of fun"
"So what do you all spend your time doing"

kVAnmyV.gif
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I think it it had a refreshing story, though the shooting is significantly shittier than before. Had no drive at all to replay those, such a bore.

At times I do feel like the game was intended to attract new fans (wacky afro black char.). I think it was a mix of both.

I'm so confused........Why is a black lady with a huge afro in a game a way to attract new fans? It's an alternate history timepiece set in America in the 1960s. It's literally what people like her would have looked like.
 

Mista

Banned
I just don’t understand how some of you folks claim to see a divisive agenda in a game about killing Nazis.
Holy shit whats so hard to understand? ITS NOT JUST ABOUT THE NAZI KILLING, ITS ABOUT THE WHOLE SJW PACKAGE IN THE GAME

For fuck sake who gives a fuck about killing Nazi's? I don't. It's a game at the end of the day. My people were always shown as terrorists in games🤷🏻‍♂️
 
Last edited:

ResurrectedContrarian

Suffers with mild autism
Why did Id Software give up this franchise? The recent Doom was so damn good, and yet they evidently handed this franchise over to a team that has no historical connection to the old games & a lot of predictable, shitty political posturing as well. It's an odd decision. In any case, the trailer alone put me off this game for reasons related to the thread, and I have 0 interest in giving this developer a chance.
 

MagnesG

Banned
I'm so confused........Why is a black lady with a huge afro in a game a way to attract new fans? It's an alternate history timepiece set in America in the 1960s. It's literally what people like her would have looked like.
I should clarify, not specifically about the race, it's the wacky personality. I love to elaborate more but later.
 

Chiggs

Gold Member
The game was definitely not reviewed fairly. My opinion is that it was given high marks for its fantastic cut scenes that featured a diverse cast, but the thoroughly lackluster game play was not acknowledged in the way it should have been. This was clearly evident by the number of "so that's it?" reactions online from people who had actually purchased and played through the game.

TNC is one of the biggest disappointments in recent memory.
 

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Holy shit whats so hard to understand? ITS NOT JUST ABOUT THE NAZI KILLING, ITS ABOUT THE WHOLE SJW PACKAGE IN THE GAME

For fuck sake who gives a fuck about killing Nazi's? I don't. It's a game at the end of the day. My people were always shown as terrorists in games🤷🏻‍♂️
In otherwords, you're taking the whole "Im not gonna defend my point, but scream loud enough at those who don't agree with me" approach.
 
Last edited:

Mista

Banned
In otherwords, you're taking the whole "Im not gonna defend my point, but scream loud enough at those who don't agree with me" approach to make a point.
I’m not screaming. Everyone here talking about the game being SJW propaganda didn’t just say “oh well because you kill Nazi’s in the game” they stated and showed all the package but yet people who disagree are talking only about the nazis killing. That’s stupid because people have been talking about things more than nazis killing 🤷🏻‍♂️ There’s a video in the thread, watch it.
 
Last edited:

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Why did Id Software give up this franchise? The recent Doom was so damn good, and yet they evidently handed this franchise over to a team that has no historical connection to the old games & a lot of predictable, shitty political posturing as well. It's an odd decision. In any case, the trailer alone put me off this game for reasons related to the thread, and I have 0 interest in giving this developer a chance.
id hasn't made a Wolfenstein game in over 25 years. Bethesda owns this franchise and reaalized that id was better served working on Doom.
 

Mista

Banned
id hasn't made a Wolfenstein game in over 25 years. Bethesda owns this franchise and reaalized that id was better served working on Doom.
Yeah, I agree on this one. Id doing brilliant job with DOOM so leave them at it. Wolfenstein games are fun and I enjoyed all of them even the most hated TNC
 

MiguelItUp

Member
I didn't understand the SJW claims at all, mind you I didn't complete TNC. However, I did put a ton of hours into it. To me, it just felt like they took the whole grindhouse ridiculousness to higher levels. Sometimes it was almost excessive. But I never once felt like, "Wow, this game is "woke"" or "Wow, this game is oozing with SJW nonsense", it honestly never crossed my mind. It just constantly felt ridiculous, which was what they wanted.

I've already seen multiple people say that they think YB looks like it's "woke" or SJW related. And why? Because it features two strong female characters looking for their father? Ugh.

Believe me, I'm not into any of the SJW nonsense, but it's pretty ridiculous to see accusations start appearing whenever theres a strong female character or something. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I’m not screaming. Everyone here talking about the game being SJW propaganda didn’t just say “oh well because you kill Nazi’s in the game” they stated and showed all the package but yet people who disagree are talking only about the nazis killing. That’s stupid because people have been talking about things more than nazis killing 🤷🏻‍♂️ There’s a video in the thread, watch it.
I did watch it and it is very much a case of a fishing expedition looking for reasons to be outraged. I am as sick of the PC culture we live in, but the game itself was not SJW agenda. I recently completed a second playthrough and while I had criticisms of the game gameplay wise, but even after looking for an SJW agenda I didn't find anything that wasn't stretching.

But like I told angellic, Im glad to be blind, because in the end Im in a great place allowing things to be judged on their own and not worried about an agenda. It's a great feeling.
 

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I didn't understand the SJW claims at all, mind you I didn't complete TNC. However, I did put a ton of hours into it. To me, it just felt like they took the whole grindhouse ridiculousness to higher levels. Sometimes it was almost excessive. But I never once felt like, "Wow, this game is "woke"" or "Wow, this game is oozing with SJW nonsense", it honestly never crossed my mind. It just constantly felt ridiculous, which was what they wanted.

I've already seen multiple people say that they think YB looks like it's "woke" or SJW related. And why? Because it features two strong female characters looking for their father? Ugh.

Believe me, I'm not into any of the SJW nonsense, but it's pretty ridiculous to see accusations start appearing whenever theres a strong female character or something. 🤷🏻‍♂️
Apparently you're blind because you can't see it!

Guess what? I'm blind too! You know what that makes us:
giphy.gif
 
Last edited:

Mista

Banned
I did watch it and it is very much a case of a fishing expedition looking for reasons to be outraged. I am as sick of the PC culture we live in, but the game itself was not SJW agenda. I recently completed a second playthrough and while I had criticisms of the game gameplay wise, but even after looking for an SJW agenda I didn't find anything that wasn't stretching.

But like I told angellic, Im glad to be blind, because in the end Im in a great place allowing things to be judged on their own and not worried about an agenda. It's a great feeling.
That’s why I bought and preloaded Young Blood. I’m in firstly for a good enjoyable game, everything else comes later.
 

JimmyRustler

Gold Member
Wasn't the SJW thing just about the promotion of this game? I finished it myself and honestly didn't notice anything - and I usually do notice this very quickly.
 

MadYarpen

Member
I don't know, don't see SJW problem in this game. Two strong women character are supposed to be an issue, or what? As for the gameplay, I played the first on PS4 with the controller, which i'm shit at. Part 2 I played on PC so that alone was an improvement for me, but there is something about it indeed.

Though when I rediscovered double guns I had a lot of fun. That's the way it should be played. You kill nazis with 2 guns period.

Also there was some good humour there. It is an OK game IMO.
 

MagnesG

Banned
Yes, you should clarify because it was a fairly accurate representation.
I don't know how to sum it up properly, but the idea of having a strong black character, ex-leader of black force united front? .. and a woman + wacky at that is definitely a new experience for some. Then the white supremacists are being rampant in the nationalists - KKK was included, slaveries are threatened to be back. It was such a heavy and kinda serious narrative, but it was definitely delivered comically in this game. I'm not so sure, not an American myself but I think that's the gist of it. Maybe it was weird, maybe it was uncomfortable.

I don't know. This is just my guess.
 

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I don't know how to sum it up properly, but the idea of having a strong black character, ex-leader of black force united front? .. and a woman + wacky at that is definitely a new experience for some. Then the white supremacists are being rampant in the nationalists - KKK was included, slaveries are threatened to be back. It was such a heavy and kinda serious narrative, but it was definitely delivered comically in this game. I'm not so sure, not an American myself but I think that's the gist of it. Maybe it was weird, maybe it was uncomfortable.

I don't know. This is just my guess.
Thankfully we will never know, but it never seemed like a stretch that the KKK would ally itself with the Nazi's. But it's not meant to be a serious game and I don't treat it that way.
 
Last edited:

PhoenixTank

Member
On the PC side I'd give TNC extra points for running a whole lot better than TNO. idTech5 vs 6 with Vulkan makes a massive difference. Going on metacritic, that doesn't seem to be what happened... but I don't really go by metacritic all that often. It'd probably even out for better gameplay vs performance (the gap is huge on my rig).

The score differences are mildly interesting but I feel like this thread frames the question poorly even if the intent is good (sorry). The title suggests the game is the entity with the agenda, while the meat suggests it might be due to mainstream publications' agendas.
Regarding the former, if the game has an agenda I don't think it really was any different than the TNO/TOB. As for the latter I don't really concern myself with reviews from most outlets - I tend to look for places/people that like games I already like (and ideally for the reasons I like them) so there is a decent chance I might like new things they do too. Gaming journalism as a whole failed a good while ago at being useful for anything else. I know a lot of people despise RPS here, but their lack of scores and plentiful meaty reviews had served me well for years and I think heavily contributed to me buying TNO way back!
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I don't know how to sum it up properly, but the idea of having a strong black character, ex-leader of black force united front? .. and a woman + wacky at that is definitely a new experience for some. Then the white supremacists are being rampant in the nationalists - KKK was included, slaveries are threatened to be back. It was such a heavy and kinda serious narrative, but it was definitely delivered comically in this game. I'm not so sure, not an American myself but I think that's the gist of it. Maybe it was weird, maybe it was uncomfortable.

I don't know. This is just my guess.

Some people need to learn more about American history then. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised but this person that you are talking about (that I bolded) existed in America a good number of times.

Angela Davis (One of the leaders of the Black Panther party in the 1970s )
http___npgsiedu_media_a1000110cjpg.jpg



And


Nikki Giovanni (Poet, Civil Rights Activist)
16c8873a27e3672c83dcff5512bda24c.jpg




I think it just made some people uncomfortable. It's hard for me to get a grasp on why though.
 

Acidizer

Banned
On PC I guess the shooting should be a non issue with KB/M.

and no-one is saying TNC is SJW because you shoot Nazi's... in TNO you shoot Nazi's, every Wolfenstien ever is based upon shooting Nazi's is it not.
 
Last edited:

Saruhashi

Banned
So is killing Nazis now viewed as an SJW agenda?

Are people ACTUALLY saying that though?

Might as well throw radewagon radewagon and The Wise Old Man The Wise Old Man in here too since they are also running with this weirdly twisted take.

There is, I think you would agree, a difference between the following statements. (Neither of which I agree with, for what it's worth)

Statement One - "I feel like this game is trying to conflate modern political views, specifically Republicans in late 2010s America, with Nazis and is also trying to push modern identity politics and associated ideologies into the game."

Statement Two - "Killing Nazis is an SJW agenda".


It is pretty clear from reading the thread that the points people are making are more or less in line with Statement One and people feel that it is a negative aspect of the game. As they see it at least.

So how does that become "SJW dogwhistles" or "killing Nazis is an SJW agenda"? Just seems like you have to go pretty far out of your way to make that connection.

Lads, you are so transparent. I just don't understand why you do it.
Would it really hurt that much to represent people fairly here?

I disagree that the game has an SJW agenda (at least I did not notice it) but I can express that disagreement without this hyperbolic, disingenuous crap that you, especially mckmas8808 mckmas8808 , are pushing here.

It's just a really shitty way to engage people, in my opinion.

It actually does kind of support the idea that "SJWs" would try to claim a game like this as representative of their views because anyone who says "well hang on I really feel like X, Y and Z in the game is too on the nose or panders too much to a certain crowd" can be dismissed with a pretty dishonest and shitty "whaaaaaat!? You are saying killing Nazis is an SJW agenda!? Nu-uh it's an American birthright!"

If the game does not have any SJW agenda AT ALL then how come there's so many people rocking up to the thread to try and twist some viewpoints into basically "so you're saying killing Nazis is bad".

I don't even understand really why you would do that.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Are people ACTUALLY saying that though?

Might as well throw radewagon radewagon and The Wise Old Man The Wise Old Man in here too since they are also running with this weirdly twisted take.

There is, I think you would agree, a difference between the following statements. (Neither of which I agree with, for what it's worth)

Statement One - "I feel like this game is trying to conflate modern political views, specifically Republicans in late 2010s America, with Nazis and is also trying to push modern identity politics and associated ideologies into the game."

Statement Two - "Killing Nazis is an SJW agenda".


It is pretty clear from reading the thread that the points people are making are more or less in line with Statement One and people feel that it is a negative aspect of the game. As they see it at least.

So how does that become "SJW dogwhistles" or "killing Nazis is an SJW agenda"? Just seems like you have to go pretty far out of your way to make that connection.

Lads, you are so transparent. I just don't understand why you do it.
Would it really hurt that much to represent people fairly here?

I disagree that the game has an SJW agenda (at least I did not notice it) but I can express that disagreement without this hyperbolic, disingenuous crap that you, especially mckmas8808 mckmas8808 , are pushing here.

It's just a really shitty way to engage people, in my opinion.

It actually does kind of support the idea that "SJWs" would try to claim a game like this as representative of their views because anyone who says "well hang on I really feel like X, Y and Z in the game is too on the nose or panders too much to a certain crowd" can be dismissed with a pretty dishonest and shitty "whaaaaaat!? You are saying killing Nazis is an SJW agenda!? Nu-uh it's an American birthright!"

If the game does not have any SJW agenda AT ALL then how come there's so many people rocking up to the thread to try and twist some viewpoints into basically "so you're saying killing Nazis is bad".

I don't even understand really why you would do that.

To be fair, I don't see ANY of those things (Statement One) in Wolfenstien TNC. Not once did I personally see anything like that. I remember there was a week stretch where some weak minded dudes tried to make the Trump equals Nazis, we kill Nazis in the game, therefore we should all want to kill Trump nonsense. But again that was nonsense coming from paranoid people.

And I didn't see any modern identity politics in the game either. I literally have ZERO idea what any of those people are talking about (and it looks like you don't agree with those people either).

Come on now. Why not have a go at explaining why you think it makes them uncomfortable?
Some kind of "ism" perhaps?

Because I'm tired of guessing why and then people trying to roast me for having an opinion. I'm open to people explaining themselves and their thoughts to the forum, instead of me guessing and assuming. So I'm very interested in why it would make people uncomfortable. Those women are my heros. They are literally as much of a hero to America as a guy like John McCain.
 
Last edited:

Acidizer

Banned
On the PC side I'd give TNC extra points for running a whole lot better than TNO. idTech5 vs 6 with Vulkan makes a massive difference. Going on metacritic, that doesn't seem to be what happened... but I don't really go by metacritic all that often. It'd probably even out for better gameplay vs performance (the gap is huge on my rig).

The score differences are mildly interesting but I feel like this thread frames the question poorly even if the intent is good (sorry). The title suggests the game is the entity with the agenda, while the meat suggests it might be due to mainstream publications' agendas.
Regarding the former, if the game has an agenda I don't think it really was any different than the TNO/TOB. As for the latter I don't really concern myself with reviews from most outlets - I tend to look for places/people that like games I already like (and ideally for the reasons I like them) so there is a decent chance I might like new things they do too. Gaming journalism as a whole failed a good while ago at being useful for anything else. I know a lot of people despise RPS here, but their lack of scores and plentiful meaty reviews had served me well for years and I think heavily contributed to me buying TNO way back!

Yeah you are right. I assumed it was accepted knowledge this game's story was either SJW bullcrap or progressive braveness, depending on which side you fall. Turns out it's probably just something that's been blown out of proportion, but there is at least political overtones in TNC specifically.

Thread title can be seen as batey, probably why some people jumped in with dismissive angry comments, so my fault there.. but you should always read beyond a headline. Everyone should know that by now!
 

MagnesG

Banned
Some people need to learn more about American history then. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised but this person that you are talking about (that I bolded) existed in America a good number of times.

Angela Davis (One of the leaders of the Black Panther party in the 1970s )
http___npgsiedu_media_a1000110cjpg.jpg



And


Nikki Giovanni (Poet, Civil Rights Activist)
16c8873a27e3672c83dcff5512bda24c.jpg




I think it just made some people uncomfortable. It's hard for me to get a grasp on why though.
No. It was imagining those women taking up guns and shit, and being in leadership at that. Women if they're on top they
had always had to be ruthless and serious - in general to bolster their authority. Also having a child?
 

MrRogers

Member
Its review scores were inflated, perhaps as a much as a point or more, due to at the time, the mainstream gaming press hysterics on a right wing takeover of america, so of course they would promote and celebrate virtual nazi killing, which in many prog circles, is anyone right of center, hence the prog labeling TNC has. The press heralded the game as some coping mechanism for dealing with their anger against trump, righties, alt righters etc... The game itself isnt that woke, but it was used as such and tainted to a degree that the otherside straight up calls it SJW trash. I just think its a terrible game mechanically and design wise.

Just look up written reviews from this game from any mainstream site, really just read some, youll find it was the msm that first made this game political, not the gamers or right wingers.
 
Last edited:

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Are people ACTUALLY saying that though?

Might as well throw radewagon radewagon and The Wise Old Man The Wise Old Man in here too since they are also running with this weirdly twisted take.

There is, I think you would agree, a difference between the following statements. (Neither of which I agree with, for what it's worth)

Statement One - "I feel like this game is trying to conflate modern political views, specifically Republicans in late 2010s America, with Nazis and is also trying to push modern identity politics and associated ideologies into the game."

Statement Two - "Killing Nazis is an SJW agenda".


It is pretty clear from reading the thread that the points people are making are more or less in line with Statement One and people feel that it is a negative aspect of the game. As they see it at least.

So how does that become "SJW dogwhistles" or "killing Nazis is an SJW agenda"? Just seems like you have to go pretty far out of your way to make that connection.

Lads, you are so transparent. I just don't understand why you do it.
Would it really hurt that much to represent people fairly here?

I disagree that the game has an SJW agenda (at least I did not notice it) but I can express that disagreement without this hyperbolic, disingenuous crap that you, especially mckmas8808 mckmas8808 , are pushing here.

It's just a really shitty way to engage people, in my opinion.

It actually does kind of support the idea that "SJWs" would try to claim a game like this as representative of their views because anyone who says "well hang on I really feel like X, Y and Z in the game is too on the nose or panders too much to a certain crowd" can be dismissed with a pretty dishonest and shitty "whaaaaaat!? You are saying killing Nazis is an SJW agenda!? Nu-uh it's an American birthright!"

If the game does not have any SJW agenda AT ALL then how come there's so many people rocking up to the thread to try and twist some viewpoints into basically "so you're saying killing Nazis is bad".

I don't even understand really why you would do that.
Let's say you do agree with statement 2: Ok fine. But please provide some examples. Whenever they are asked to do so, either they don't respond or say that your are blind if you can't see it. And most importantly I never, not once, have gotten one suggestion of how or different to make the game that wouldn't upset them. What they would take out, what they would change, etc. None of that. It's just outrage.

I am a very middle of the road person, and I am just trying to be entertained and not look for reasons to be offended, because no matter what you say, no matter what view you have, somebody is going to be offended.
If that makes me ignorant or blind then so be it.
 

Saruhashi

Banned
To be fair, I don't see ANY of those things (Statement One) in Wolfenstien TNC. Not once did I personally see anything like that. I remember there was a week stretch where some weak minded dudes tried to make the Trump equals Nazis, we kill Nazis in the game, therefore we should all want to kill Trump nonsense. But again that was nonsense coming from paranoid people.

And I didn't see any modern identity politics in the game either. I literally have ZERO idea what any of those people are talking about (and it looks like you don't agree with those people either).

Me neither. Possibly in the marketing of the game but I don't remember that so well.

My point is more that people are not saying "killing Nazis is an SJW agenda" but you are, for some reason, representing them that way.

I don't think it's helpful and at worst I think it does kind of contribute to the idea that these games DO have an agenda and that people will actually show up to defend said agenda with hot takes like "so is killing Nazis now viewed as an SJW agenda".

It kind of becomes almost a self-fulfilling prophecy then.
The game gets some backlash over a perceived "agenda" and instead of people pointing out that this isn't really true they more or less get hit with "are you saying killing Nazis is bad" and that creates a feedback loop.

The game is pretty decent and does things that I think games are uniquely placed to do by going way over the top with the characters and the events and the action.

If people reckon it has an agenda then I honestly think it's easier, and just more honest, to point out why it probably doesn't contain that. Surely that is always preferable to alluding to certain implications about the content of their character?

You don't like that game where you have to kill Nazis hmmmmm? Veeeeerrrry interesting! :)
 

Stuart360

Member
On PC I guess the shooting should be a non issue with KB/M.

and no-one is saying TNC is SJW because you shoot Nazi's... in TNO you shoot Nazi's, every Wolfenstien ever is based upon shooting Nazi's is it not.
The SJW sympathisers know that, they are just trying to be smartarses. Its like the people that purposely say 'I dontz get da EPIC Store hate, iz it really too hard da click another launcher dudes? when they know thats not the reason why people are against Epic.
 

joe_zazen

Member
There were a lot of reviews touting how "killing Nazis is so satisfying!", IIRC.

What exactly is in the game that would please them though?

It was in the marketing, and it worked in they guilted critics into scoring what appears to be a less fun game higher. Using social issues to make billionaires more money is gross. pete hines is defo good at his job.

Edit: oh, yeah, pete hines is quoted as saying they used real world current events to market the game. Link
 
Last edited:
I don’t know about SJW Agends, but I’m just now playing this game via Game Pass and there have been two moments so far where I’ve almost had my jaw drop with what I can only describe as “Jump The Shark” syndrome.

It’s not a bad game, I’m just having a little bit of a tough time getting through it. Not as hooked as I thought I’d be.
 

joe_zazen

Member
I don’t know about SJW Agends, but I’m just now playing this game via Game Pass and there have been two moments so far where I’ve almost had my jaw drop with what I can only describe as “Jump The Shark” syndrome.

It’s not a bad game, I’m just having a little bit of a tough time getting through it. Not as hooked as I thought I’d be.

Underwater sections are shit, and the opening hour is really slow. It might hook you, I am glad i stuck it out to the end.
 

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
It was in the marketing, and it worked in they guilted critics into scoring what appears to be a less fun game higher. Using social issues to make billionaires more money is gross. pete hines is defo good at his job.

Edit: oh, yeah, pete hines is quoted as saying they used real world current events to market the game. Link
OK, this is something that I can at least acknowledge as something that would i can rationally believe would rub the anti-PC crowd the wrong way. Thank you.
 

Saruhashi

Banned
Its review scores were inflated, perhaps as a much as a point or more, due to at the time, the mainstream gaming press hysterics on a right wing takeover of america, so of course they would promote and celebrate virtual nazi killing, which in many prog circles, is anyone right of center, hence the prog labeling TNC has. The press heralded the game as some coping mechanism for dealing with their anger against trump, righties, alt righters etc... The game itself isnt that woke, but it was used as such and tainted to a degree that the otherside straight up calls it SJW trash. I just think its a terrible game mechanically and design wise.

Just look up written reviews from this game from any mainstream site, really just read some, youll find it was the msm that first made this game political, not the gamers or right wingers.

This is kind of what I was getting at where it seems like there is sometimes a rush by people to "claim" a particular piece of content for their "side".

So while the media itself might actually be not that controversial, and probably would have gone "under the radar" without anybody noticing 10 years ago, people are on the lookout for hidden agendas and dog whistles.

Captain Marvel is "ours" and Alita Battle Angel is "theirs" and things like Game of Thrones is kind of interesting because people don't know if certain events cause the show to be "theirs" or "ours".

Even Sekiro fell victim to this with the "difficulty" debate often being framed as a "toxic gamers" versus "inclusion advocates" when I am pretty damn sure FromSoft never said "make the game difficult because GamerGate like that". :)

I think The New Order came out in early 2014 and so it managed to miss the boat on all of this bullshit.
By the time The New Colossus came around this kind of nonsense was in full swing and it shows.

I always thought these games would appeal more to the "right" to be honest. Big angry masculine dude using cool guns to tear through enemies. Seems almost anti-SJW overall. Even breaking him down in Part 2 is in line with most media that ends up showing the big dudebro has a sensitive side... so I dunno.

Either way I do think that the mainstream gaming press tried to "own" the game and tried to warp it into something that made a statement agreeable with their own political beliefs and thoughts on "Trumps America".

That is, until they realized the game was kind of difficult and the easy setting made fun of the player. :)
 

Boss Mog

Member
Oh just fucking stop it already. There’s no SJW agenda in any goddamned wolfenstein game you simpering moron. People need to stop trying to make up something that doesn’t exist for fucks sake. It’s not helping your credibility.
Did you even play the game? I don't know how anyone could say this if they had played the game unless they are SJWs. Even the game's advertising was SJW ffs.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom