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Welcome to Wii U's BC for Wii: It's a console within a console! :(

and that's a markedly small change compared to streaming that content without latency over wireless to another device.
A lot of the software for that should already been written or even built into the firmware. Then again the home button menu isn't built into the Wii (its a file contained in every channel and disc).

It still takes time but if nothing else it just shows how rushed Wii U has been to market.
 

adroit

Member
Can I choose a game and use my credit card to buy it without re-entering information each time now?
According to Cheesemeister's translation of Nintendo Japan's FAQ:

What information is managed on a per-User basis?

The following: play history, the User's Mii, Parental Settings (excluding the Wii Menu), and game save data (some games may have save data shared by all Users). The following can be managed for network-enabled Users: friend information, Wii U Nintendo eShop balance, credit card information, purchase history, e-mail address, Nintendo Network ID, location information, birthdate, gender, and other registration information.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=44220903&postcount=1

Edit: This is probably only for Wii U eShop purchases. If I were a betting man I'd bet that the Wii Shop (WiiWare and Wii VC) still requires you to re-enter your credit card info for purchases. But that's just my guess.
 

Terrell

Member
A lot of the software for that should already been written or even built into the firmware. Then again the home button menu isn't built into the Wii (its a file contained in every channel and disc).

It still takes time but if nothing else it just shows how rushed Wii U has been to market.

It's no small job to take over 600 titles, change them for compatibility outside of the Wii sandbox and then add new features on top of that. So it's hard to say that it's because the console was rushed or just the huge amount of time would need to be dedicated to such a task that was better suited to getting everything else finalized prior to launch.


Let's assume, momentarily, that in 2011 when the VC release schedule dried up, it was due to a combination of prepping 3DS titles for VC and the knowledge of a new console on the horizon from Nintendo. By the time the Gamepad and features of it got pinned down and finalized, it would have been 2012. Work on migrating them over and working on new releases for VC to support couldn't have even started until then. 600 titles changed over in less than a year? Yeah, I don't see that happening. Considering the Wii's VC library, they'd need a good chunk of them ready to go before they re-introduced them, as many of us remember things like the 360 backwards compatibility scenario, where gamers were asked to wait and wonder when the stuff they bought would be compatible. Better to have a large amount ready at launch and fill in the blanks later.

And let's not forget potential legal hoops involved if Nintendo wanted to, say, allow VC purchases to work on more than one device per purchase.

There's a lot of factors involved, so until we see an end result, we don't know what's keeping them from being released.
 

ThatObviousUser

ὁ αἴσχιστος παῖς εἶ
I for one am very, very happy with this development.

High possibility homebrew will work out of the box now, or at least will be enabled fairly quickly. Was worried I'd actually have to put my Wii discs in to play them after a year of running-from-hard-drive bliss.
 

jmizzal

Member
I for one am very, very happy with this development.

High possibility homebrew will work out of the box now, or at least will be enabled fairly quickly. Was worried I'd actually have to put my Wii discs in to play them after a year of running-from-hard-drive bliss.

Yup they way this set up is looks like you can just start your homebrew right up
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Let's assume, momentarily, that in 2011 when the VC release schedule dried up, it was due to a combination of prepping 3DS titles for VC and the knowledge of a new console on the horizon from Nintendo. By the time the Gamepad and features of it got pinned down and finalized, it would have been 2012. Work on migrating them over and working on new releases for VC to support couldn't have even started until then. 600 titles changed over in less than a year? Yeah, I don't see that happening. Considering the Wii's VC library, they'd need a good chunk of them ready to go before they re-introduced them, as many of us remember things like the 360 backwards compatibility scenario, where gamers were asked to wait and wonder when the stuff they bought would be compatible. Better to have a large amount ready at launch and fill in the blanks later.

And let's not forget potential legal hoops involved if Nintendo wanted to, say, allow VC purchases to work on more than one device per purchase.

There's a lot of factors involved, so until we see an end result, we don't know what's keeping them from being released.

In one of the less recent Iwata Asks features (or some interview maybe?), it was brought up that the team that was responsible for the VC releases also was responsible for the 3DS eShop and they were then working on the Wii U eShop. So your theory of resources being stretched thin may be spot on. Ah, it was the Bill Trinen 1UP interview (9/14).
 

goomba

Banned
Does the Wii-U have its own VC?

If you can then transfer your VC games from Wii to Wii-U , wouldnt that make VC games playable on the GamePad?
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Does the Wii-U have its own VC?

If you can then transfer your VC games from Wii to Wii-U , wouldnt that make VC games playable on the GamePad?

We simply don't know what will be on the eShop at launch right now other than "new" download-only games and retail software downloads. There will eventually be a Wii U VC, though.
 
"You must download all WiiWare/VC through the Wii Shop Channel, not to be confused with the Wii U's eShop. It's unclear whether or not you'll have to re-download all of your old downloadable games through the shop or if they'll come over in the Wii To Wii U transferring"


Oh lord, if this is how Nintendo approaches online we will be in for a ride
 

Eusis

Member
"You must download all WiiWare/VC through the Wii Shop Channel, not to be confused with the Wii U's eShop. It's unclear whether or not you'll have to re-download all of your old downloadable games through the shop or if they'll come over in the Wii To Wii U transferring"


Oh lord, if this is how Nintendo approaches online we will be in for a ride
More like how they did. The DSi shop was clearly more forward thinking than the Wii shop, as that got absorbed into the 3DS shop and there's no boundaries separating the two.
 
Anyone care to throw out a BS percentage representing the chance of all old VC games getting an updated version with GP capabilities and owning an older version getting you a free upgrade?
 

Eusis

Member
Anyone care to throw out a BS percentage representing the chance of all old VC games getting an updated version with GP capabilities and owning an older version getting you a free upgrade?
In the immediate future? 0%.

In the long run? Well, who knows. I'm not even trying until we have the system and see how digital stuff is being handled period.
 
More like how they did. The DSi shop was clearly more forward thinking than the Wii shop, as that got absorbed into the 3DS shop and there's no boundaries separating the two.

Then again, DSiWare doesn't have to be completely emulated, unlike VC releases.

It's much easier to make the DSiWare store compatible with the 3DS then it is to make ALL of the custom-built Wii emulators to run on the Wii U.
 

Terrell

Member
Anyone care to throw out a BS percentage representing the chance of all old VC games getting an updated version with GP capabilities and owning an older version getting you a free upgrade?

I'd say we're looking at a 50% chance it will be offered for a paid upgrade (less than a re-buy, but still a fee), 35% free upgrade, 15% of re-buying the whole shebang. 0% chance of not getting the upgraded VC titles at all.

The other spanner that gets thrown into the gears is the NES titles on 3DS. What we should really be hoping for is that, when 3DS migrates to Miiverse and NNIDs, those VC purchases will be de-tethered from the device and allow a download of a Wii U version of the VC title. Hell, maybe THAT'S what Nintendo is waiting for, for all we know.
 

Crub

Member
Considering the sloppy BC of GC on Wii, who is really surprised?

You couldn't use your Classic Controller. You couldn't return to the system menu without physically turning the console off. You couldn't even transfer saves files on an SD card. It was as barebones as it gets.
 

Eusis

Member
Considering the sloppy BC of GC on Wii, who is really surprised?

You couldn't use your Classic Controller. You couldn't return to the system menu without physically turning the console off. You couldn't even transfer saves files on an SD card. It was as barebones as it gets.
Save transferring aside, I'd hardly call that sloppy. Barebones, yes, but it was a case of perfect BC at the cost of not being able to implement any Wii unique features. It's biggest slight is the fact I can't copy GC data onto the Wii system memory, and not because I expected to actually use it from there but because it should've been easy to implement. The PS2 doesn't let you use PS1 saves on a PS2 card, or PS1/2 saves from the PS2 HDD, but it still lets you copy them over for backing up given how limited each format is relative to the next step up. Now that the huge memory cards are rare and overly expensive it'd have been nice to be able to juggle the saves as necessary, rather than permanently sacrifice data because Nintendo doesn't really care about working this stuff out (or is VERY bad about planning ahead software wise).
 
So does the Wii-U have a DVD player in it? Regardless of what Nintendo says, I don't have a DVD player in my room. My Wii is all that's plugged in.
 

Eusis

Member
So does the Wii-U have a DVD player in it? Regardless of what Nintendo says, I don't have a DVD player in my room. My Wii is all that's plugged in.
They probably disabled DVD/blu-ray playback despite the greater multimedia focus, so while it technically has a DVD player in it it probably won't play movies.
 
They probably disabled DVD/blu-ray playback despite the greater multimedia focus, so while it technically has a DVD player in it it probably won't play movies.

Why, Nintendo? Can a firmware update enable playback if the merciful Nintendo deems us worthy of the privilege a few years down the road?
 

netBuff

Member
Why, Nintendo? Can a firmware update enable playback if the merciful Nintendo deems us worthy of the privilege a few years down the road?

They probably don't want to pay licensing fee on every sold console for a feature few are going to be interested in. DVD and BluRay players are extremely cheap these days, just get one of those.

I don't think expecting a setup similar to the Xbox (DVD Video support purchasable as an extra) is realistic.
 

Eusis

Member
They probably don't want to pay licensing fee on every sold console for a feature few are going to be interested in. DVD and BluRay players are extremely cheap these days, just get one of those.

I don't think expecting a setup similar to the Xbox (DVD Video support purchasable as an extra) is realistic.
Both of those are why I think if anything happens it'll be buying a movie watching program off the store: that would be paying the license fee right there, and given the online focus there is literally no use for a dongle to plug in to enable it. Especially since the remote angle won't hold as strong: I'm sure some will want it and so they could do a bluetooth remote, but they're already playing up the angle of using the GamePad as the remote instead, so they probably won't make any multimedia remote.
 
I hope the Wii U can be hacked to allow VC games to be played on the Gamepad. I'd triple dip on sooooo may games.

Sorry, that's not physically possible. Nintendo's not just disallowing this because they feel like it...they're disallowing it because the games aren't PROGRAMMED to work with the Wii U Gamepad.
 
So much rage over such an unnecessary feature for a gaming console, especially in today's day and age.

It's important to me just like achievements are important to others. If I'm buying a multi-media console, then i want to game and watch movies on the console without buying a monthly subscription to netflix or hulu+
 

DekuLink

Member
Don't PS3 and 360 upscale PS2 and OG Xbox games? (I have no idea)

Upscale, Yes, but that doesn't increase the rendering resolution of the games, so they will basically look the same, only stretched. All TVs does that as well, otherwise It would be huge amounts of letterboxing when playing old systems like NES-NGC on a HD-TV.

What people really want is not upscaling but having the games render in HD.
 

netBuff

Member
Sorry, that's not physically possible. Nintendo's not just disallowing this because they feel like it...they're disallowing it because the games aren't PROGRAMMED to work with the Wii U Gamepad.

Isn't the current working theory that the ARM co-processor used for handling the GamePad is also used for Wii backwards compatibility functions in Wii mode? Such a setup would make it pretty much impossible to utilize the GamePad screen in any way when Wii software is active.

Both of those are why I think if anything happens it'll be buying a movie watching program off the store: that would be paying the license fee right there, and given the online focus there is literally no use for a dongle to plug in to enable it. Especially since the remote angle won't hold as strong: I'm sure some will want it and so they could do a bluetooth remote, but they're already playing up the angle of using the GamePad as the remote instead, so they probably won't make any multimedia remote.

I'm eagerly awaiting Intervideo WiiUDVD. It's certainly possible, but I don't know whether Nintendo thinks it is worth the investment with DVD players being so cheap these days.

It's important to me just like achievements are important to others. If I'm buying a multi-media console, then i want to game and watch movies on the console without buying a monthly subscription to netflix or hulu+

Buy a DVD/BluRay player, get some tape: There's your multimedia console (add a GameCube for good measure).
 

Eusis

Member
Upscale, Yes, but that doesn't increase the rendering resolution of the games, so they will basically look the same, only stretched. All TVs does that as well, otherwise It would be huge amounts of letterboxing when playing old systems like NES-NGC on a HD-TV.

What people really want is not upscaling but having the games render in HD.
Well, good upscaling on the console can be nice to have, especially since that can sort of force 480i games into 480p. Pretty much the only upressing you'll get, even though it's usually not as good as natively running 480p in my experience with PS3 BC. More vibrant on my TV though than 480i.
I'm eagerly awaiting Intervideo WiiUDVD. It's certainly possible, but I don't know whether Nintendo thinks it is worth the investment with DVD players being so cheap these days.
Well, DVD players are, but blu-ray isn't and may still be a serious consideration even with streaming being so widespread. And Wii U games definitely sound like they're running on blu-rays even if they're not labeled as such.
 

netBuff

Member
Well, DVD players are, but blu-ray isn't and may still be a serious consideration even with streaming being so widespread. And Wii U games definitely sound like they're running on blu-rays even if they're not labeled as such.

Where I live (Austria, Europe) BluRay players are only marginally more expensive than DVD players - they are pretty much affordable to anyone these days. I can't imagine BR devices are much more expensive in other parts of the world, therefore I don't see a huge base of users that want to play BR discs but aren't able to get a player to view them.
 

Rich!

Member
Where I live (Austria, Europe) BluRay players are only marginally more expensive than DVD players - they are pretty much affordable for anyone these days. I can't imagine BR devices are much more expensive in other parts of the world.

Yep. My Sony Blu Ray player cost me £60. Not bad at all.
 

Brera

Banned
I knew Nintendo would pull something like this. It's not as bad as I thought cos at least they'll let you keep your games.

Personally, I'll take the hit and rebuy and draw a line. Luckily, I stopped buying years ago for this very reason.
 
I for one am very, very happy with this development.

High possibility homebrew will work out of the box now, or at least will be enabled fairly quickly. Was worried I'd actually have to put my Wii discs in to play them after a year of running-from-hard-drive bliss.

I think you're too optimistic here. Don't you have to connect to the internet to do the transfer? I think it highly likely Nintendo will nuke your homebrew right from the off, and will have done something to close down the avenues. They've been too savvy about this stuff lately just to let it go like that.
 
It really sucks that you can't play Wii/VC games on the controller. This was one of my most anticipated features of the Wii U, I was looking forward to playing Wii titles on a screen that doesn't make the games look totally pixelated and low-res. I held off playing several Wii games and any VC titles so I could play them on the gamepad.

I mean, Wii and VC titles are 480p, the gamepad screen is 480p, so they would probably look great on the controller while they look really bad on an HDTV. It would have been perfect, especially if they start putting GC games on VC. I hope this can be patched.
 

Crub

Member
Save transferring aside, I'd hardly call that sloppy. Barebones, yes, but it was a case of perfect BC at the cost of not being able to implement any Wii unique features.
They can have hardware BC and still put Wii U features atop of that.
 

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
We simply don't know if the system performs upscaling or allows the TV to do it. But I haven't seen an answer to the question of whether 480i/p can even be sent over HDMI. If not, one would assume the system renders at 480p, then upscales to a digital 1080p image that's sent to the TV.
HDMI absolutely supports 480p output. I do not, however, believe it can send a 480i image, however, but any TV with an HDMI input is going to be able to support 480p or higher anyways. For 480i support you'd have to use different cables.

*NOW* the question I have is; how will the WiiU handle Wii titles which do NOT support 480p? Madworld, for instance, only runs in 480i. HDMI won't accept 480i, however, so what will the WiiU do with such a title?

I mean, Wii and VC titles are 480p, the gamepad screen is 480p
The WiiU gamepad uses an actual 16:9 resolution (854x480) while the Wii outputs at a 4:3 resolution (640x480 or lower, depending on the game). Widescreen Wii games still use a 4:3 resolution but modify the FOV and HUD elements to appear correct when the image is stretched by the TV. So the gamepad would be a decent solution but certainly not perfect as pixels would still be stretched.
 
I mean, Wii and VC titles are 480p, the gamepad screen is 480p, so they would probably look great on the controller while they look really bad on an HDTV. It would have been perfect, especially if they start putting GC games on VC. I hope this can be patched.

My UK Wii VC titles are 240i, and all but (around) 8 of them have been updated or released to allow them to run in "interlaced mode" over component. That means that I still have about 8 games that I cannot play unless I set my Wii to 576i and use composite or scart cables. I just get a black screen and the audio.

I have a feeling that I'm gonna be screwed, except for the few Hanabi Festival games I downloaded, unless the Wii does some techno jiggery-pokery on the outputted image.
 

Pociask

Member
This is just piling on at this point, but Nintendo's solution is disappointing. How did the Wii play Gamecube disc games? You put the disc in. You clicked the icon that played a game in the disc drive. Boom. I don't understand why Nintendo couldn't use some kind of short-cut system to click an icon on the Wii U menu, then have the system stealth go into Wii mode, then pop out again. This method would also allow them to merge the stores. Their current division makes me worried about Nintendo's plans for the Virtual Console. On the one hand, yay, it'll still be around - on the other hand, why are they hiding it away in a submenu many new Wii U owners may never even access?
 

ccbfan

Member
LOL at all this discussion.

This is Nintendo, the most anti customer company in the world. They make a amazing things but almost everything they do is to suck the most out of their customers. (Sony and Microsoft are not much better but unlike Nintendo which is 99 percent, they're only 90 percent)

VC done this way? So they can get people to rebuy Wii U versions of VC. (It'll be the same exact game at the same exact price again)

No upscaling for Wii game? Thats cause the HD line of "Wii Classics "is coming.

All this talk about technical difficulty and crap is moot. This course of action makes Nintendo the most money and Nintendo always follow the course of action that makes them the most money.
 

Zia

Member
What the fuck am I reading ?

I'd agree. Can't think of many game companies that treat their customers worse. Maybe Activision. EA does online passes and the horror that is Origin, but they also include a plethora of services with their games.
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
What the fuck am I reading ?

Crazy rambling that buys into memes about Nintendo. And dismissing technical hurdles that affects everyone who has ever dealt with platform compatibility as dumb crap because it's Nintendo and Nintendo is evil.

This is why you see so much stupid shit about Nintendo. Because people are stupid about Nintendo, even more so than Sony and Microsoft.
 

Mael

Member
I'd agree. Can't think of many game companies that treat their customers worse. Maybe Activision. EA does online passes and the horror that is Origin, but they also include a plethora of services with their games.

Or you know Apple that think competition is evil and lawyers should make them go away or MSFT the company that makes competition go bankrupt.
Seriously if you can't think of a worse anti consumer company, you don't know many companies.
 
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