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[geordiemp]

I’ll take the Carmack Daddy!

No I am Carmarck

 

[Deleted member 775630]

CPU and RT capabilities are also hampered... https://www.neogaf.com/threads/what...hat-worries-developers.1565139/post-260062247

Omg the CPU argument is so utterly ridiculous. When there was a 100Mhz difference between PS5/XSX this didn't matter at all, and was always played down. But now when there's a 100Mhz difference between XSS/PS5, this is the end of the world?

In case of RT. Microsoft claims this will actually work, probably also because they can use that leftover GPU power (since 1080p is 4x less than 4K, and GPU is only 1/3 of the power) for RT. And also you are talking about the CU's here. Again. This was never an issue when the XSX had way more CU's and GPU power than the PS5, every time I heard that PS5/XSX are basically evenly matched. But now suddenly all these differences matter?

I find it really disingenuous how people are switching positions to make it fit their narrative.

 

[geordiemp]

Omg the CPU argument is so utterly ridiculous. When there was a 100Mhz difference between PS5/XSX this didn't matter at all, and was always played down. But now when there's a 100Mhz difference between XSS/PS5, this is the end of the world?

In case of RT. Microsoft claims this will actually work, probably also because they can use that leftover GPU power (since 1080p is 4x less than 4K, and GPU is only 1/3 of the power) for RT. And also you are talking about the CU's here. Again. This was never an issue when the XSX had way more CU's and GPU power than the PS5, every time I heard that PS5/XSX are basically evenly matched. But now suddenly all these differences matter?

I find it really disingenuous how people are switching positions to make it fit their narrative.

It will be even easier for 3rd party, they can do a Ps5 and XSX version similar and just gimp whats left quickly for tthe XSS as XSS owners dont care about graphics anyway. /s

 

[DarkMage619]

Nope, a gimped next-gen console that only to exist to serve game pass growth is not doing the industry great things, in fact, it does it a disservice. This strategy serves only MS and MS alone, your mental gymnastics to defend your favorite plastic is soo transparent.

You seem to lack some self awareness . If you don't like game pass or Xbox don't buy it. Your preferred plastic box will be safe. Ultimately the market will decide if XSS, XSX and game pass are successful. If consumers side with you MS will exit the game industry. I have a feeling MS isn't going anywhere.

 

[Jon Neu]

Sony fans can be more honest about the deficiencies of a competitor.

Sony fans can't even be honest about Sony, imagine against their hated enemy.

But you all would be happy then, like how happy you were during the Xbox One days because it was so underpowered and yet more expensive.

Yet what we are seeing is just salt everywhere.

Xbox fans take it upon themselves to stand for the brand.

Not at all. We have critiziced MS during the entire generation.

It's actually Sony fans the ones who take it upon themselves to stand for the brand, no matter what the brand does.

Shame, because everyone calling out this problematic approach to next gen could help everyone get better results.

You think MS is going to cancel the Series S because some people voice concerns on twitter? Stop bullshiting, please.

And MS is still going to get the best multiplats versions on the Series X, so for them all this concerns are basically irrelevant.

Next gen should be a technological jump, not whimper.

Well, tell that to MS and Sony, they are the ones who made 16gb consoles.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

It will be even easier for 3rd party, they can do a Ps5 and XSX version similar and just gimp whats left quickly for tthe XSS as XSS owners dont care about graphics anyway. /s

No, sorry the PS5 and XSX version can't possibly be similar. There's a 100Mhz difference in CPU, so they are going to have to make a lot of optimizations for the PS5 version to actually work. /s

 

[Jon Neu]

It will be even easier for 3rd party, they can do a Ps5 and XSX version similar and just gimp whats left quickly for tthe XSS as XSS owners dont care about graphics anyway. /s]

It's funny because it's true.

Except that the XsX version it's going to be better than the PS5 version.

No, sorry the PS5 and XSX version can't possibly be similar. There's a 100Mhz difference in CPU, so they are going to have to make a lot of optimizations for the PS5 version to actually work. /s

And with the variable clocks of the PS5, it's actually going to be more than 100Mhz difference in a lot of games.

 

[Stuart360]

So either Microsoft flat out lied in the S Reveal vid (which i believe none of these devs have actually said), or they have at least exaggerated how easy it will be, and isnt as simple as simply taking XSX code and slapping it on S and turning doen the resolution, which is probably closer to the truth. Or devs are just annoyed about the bit of extra work involved, or they are are simply speculating and havent actually worked on a S devkit yet.

I'm pretty sure one of those scenarios will be the truth, and it seems at the very least it will take a bit more work than Microsoft are making it out to be.
I'm sure everything will work out in the end though.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Omg the CPU argument is so utterly ridiculous. When there was a 100Mhz difference between PS5/XSX this didn't matter at all, and was always played down. But now when there's a 100Mhz difference between XSS/PS5, this is the end of the world?

In case of RT. Microsoft claims this will actually work, probably also because they can use that leftover GPU power (since 1080p is 4x less than 4K, and GPU is only 1/3 of the power) for RT. And also you are talking about the CU's here. Again. This was never an issue when the XSX had way more CU's and GPU power than the PS5, every time I heard that PS5/XSX are basically evenly matched. But now suddenly all these differences matter?

I find it really disingenuous how people are switching positions to make it fit their narrative.

You are really not reading what I wrote more than superficially and of course took a warrior angle and brought PS5 into the mix... not that misquoting the CPU clockspeed difference, trying to take CU count and clockspeed separately to whitewash the point, etc... did not make it clear enough.

I find it interesting how you quickly you jumped on the console war angle to try to move away from talking about the XSS and the topic at hand.

 

[Md Ray]

No issue here.

Talented engine programmers from a massive AAA studio are bummed about XSS specs because... there's no issues?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Talented engine programmers from a massive AAA studio are bummed about XSS specs because... there's no issues?

Because his engine is a total (V)RAM hog. The engine's approach is "eat as much (V)RAM as possible even if you don't need it". That's why the dude wants 32 GB of RAM in consoles lmao.

 

[Panajev2001a]

No, sorry the PS5 and XSX version can't possibly be similar. There's a 100Mhz difference in CPU, so they are going to have to make a lot of optimizations for the PS5 version to actually work. /s

Assuming identical environment conditions yes, PS5 would either hold XSX back a bit or complicate devs life a bit or have some additions frame rate variations or a bit of all three... now double that delta and also consider that historically MS has chosen an approach that is awesome from a software compatibility perspective (fully virtualised CPU and GPU and generally higher level API’s than Sony), but does impose a small but present performance tax on the CPU and GPU side.

 

[Jon Neu]

I will say that I direly hope that this RAM situation doesn’t pull down the other systems. If it ends up being a problem, I hope developers downport from Series X and PS5, and compromise Series S in whatever ways it needs to be. That’s a line in the sand.

It's literally what is going to happen, as the MS dev told in the video presentation.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Because his engine is a total (V)RAM hog. The engine's approach is "eat as much (V)RAM as possible even if you don't need it". That's why the dude wants 32 GB of RAM in consoles lmao.

More ad hominem that does not seem to have much of a point, not really dealing with the bigger overall point aka what people have been saying for years and years and years (in multiple industries)... min specs matter:

 

[Jon Neu]

Because his engine is a total (V)RAM hog. The engine's approach is "eat as much (V)RAM as possible even if you don't need it". That's why the dude wants 32 GB of RAM in consoles lmao.

He literally said he wanted 128GB of RAM.

Of course he is having seizures after seeing the 10GB of the Series S.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It's literally what is going to happen, as the MS dev told in the video presentation.

That is either borderline lying/misrepresenting the truth (omitting how the XSX version is not developed without keeping XSS limitations in mind) or going to lead to worse and worse XSS versions as time goes by... if that were the case.

 

[Team Andromeda]

Again, they do handle it for single SKU multiple HW profiles releases (either they reduce the overall scope or release a version that only barely runs on the lower end machines... or they hold back the higher end hardware and/or ship you tons of configuration sliders for you to “optimise” the game... or do a mix of all those things).

The problem is not that it is impossible... it is just not free. Min specs matter.

The specs are good, its just the system main RAM size that's an issue, but none of us really know how much the new consoles SSD will alleviate that, this was not a feature open to developers this gen.

 

[Stuart360]

To be fair, i think Microsoft should of added an extra couple of gigs of ram in the S. On PC, 4k over 1080p/1440p usually needs about 2gb extra vram, and i'm guessing the os and services requirements on the S may be a little less than on X?, but still an extra couple of gigs would probably of helped a lot.

 

[Allandor]

Yeah but let's not pretend we are standing still with the XSS. The SSD, CPU and RT capabilities alone are enough to say it's a big leap from the current generation. GPU is fine for 1080p, the only issue there might be is the RAM.

switch is different. the 3rd party games on it not necessary launch and working on same day compared to xss and xsx. Also it not mandatory port while game on xbox must scale to two sku at same time xss and xsx with non one of those get left behind.

switch also on different tier. currently the frontrunner of game industry, the one that gonna push the industry technology, the game visual, the AAA games is sony and microsoft. All eyes on that. Those circle is the one will push the industry foward, raising the bar, while switch position is at other place, which is just something sitting middle of it, on its own market that doesnt bother with teraflops or whatsoever. The console launch with lower specs in mind while both ps5 and xsx launch at highest specs possible aiming at 4k next gen visual.

I get that, but memory scaling is also pretty easy. Features can be turned on and off all the time. Just look at PC space. Even 3GB GTX1060 cards can still run all the games. Yes the details aren't great and you sacrifice much more than resolution alone, but it works.

We live in a time of covid19 where many people lost their job or get earn less money. This console is more or less the right console at the right time. To increase the audience.
I would also have loved to see 12GB minimum (like the one x) but well, if it isn't cost effective, that it is just not possible.

1. you need less in memory at the same time because of the fast SSD
2. you need lower res assets (well actually you always need those even on the high-end consoles just don't the highest res set)
3. Shadow maps, .... -> lower the res (had been done all the time), saves much memory
4. GI ... well can be disabled or lowered, whatever helps to reduce the memory footprint
...

Developers always want more and more. But even on the last gen, Skyrim was created with less than 512 MB memory running from a DVD. The current gen than added much memory and developers couldn't get enough and somehow they no longer know how to save some?
Just show me a game, where the game logic was limited due to memory size? Every little bit of memory was used for graphics and this part can be easily scaled down for an audience where current gen graphics are more than good enough.

btw, developers don't need to care about the split pool on the series s, because this is the OS only pool.

 

[Panajev2001a]

The specs are good, its just the system main RAM size that's an issue, but none of us really know how much the new consoles SSD will alleviate that, this was not a feature open to developers this gen.

The specs are not horrible, but they do hold the XSX back somewhat still: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/what...hat-worries-developers.1565139/post-260062247

SSD helps, but is the same across XSX and XSS so it helps out in both machines about the same way.

 

[Jon Neu]

That is either borderline lying/misrepresenting the truth (omitting how the XSX version is not developed without keeping XSS limitations in mind) or going to lead to worse and worse XSS versions as time goes by... if that were the case.

You can work around any limitations, specially when those limitations aren't that big actually.

This gen we had multiplatform games running on switch, which is like literally a generation and a half beyond the other next gen consoles.

The Series S it's much more powerful and it's designed to be scalable between the Series X. It's going to be fine despite some devs bitching.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

More ad hominem that does not seem to have much of a point, not really dealing with the bigger overall point aka what people have been saying for years and years and years (in multiple industries)... min specs matter:

They matter very differently depending on what you're comparing. If the CPU of the XSS were at half the speed of the PS5, that'd be utterly terrible and would hold back 3rd party games a lot. On the other hand, GPU power and memory bandwidth are way more scalable, so the discrepancies there are not that big of a deal, unless you really push it (and let the Switch have something like 80% lower memory bandwidth compared to the PS4). Luckily, in the case of the XSS, we're dealing with modest discrepancies in areas where discrepancies are not a big deal (GPU power and memory bandwidth).

 

[Shmunter]

Sony fans can't even be honest about Sony, imagine against their hated enemy.

But you all would be happy then, like how happy you were during the Xbox One days because it was so underpowered and yet more expensive.

Yet what we are seeing is just salt everywhere.



Not at all. We have critiziced MS during the entire generation.

It's actually Sony fans the ones who take it upon themselves to stand for the brand, no matter what the brand does.



You think MS is going to cancel the Series S because some people voice concerns on twitter? Stop bullshiting, please.

And MS is still going to get the best multiplats versions on the Series X, so for them all this concerns are basically irrelevant.



Well, tell that to MS and Sony, they are the ones who made 16gb consoles.

No, just please don’t buy it. Tell other to not buy it.

 

[Md Ray]

Because his engine is a total (V)RAM hog. The engine's approach is "eat as much (V)RAM as possible even if you don't need it". That's why the dude wants 32 GB of RAM in consoles lmao.

Not really they moved away from megatextures for DOOM Eternal. They need more memory because RT BVH is very memory intensive.

 

[Jon Neu]

No, just please don’t buy it. Tell other to not buy it.

I'm going to buy the Series X.

But in this worldwide economical crisis, launching a Series S with gamepass for 299€ (or 25€ a month), is the most pro consumer move you can do.

Games are going to be fine.

 

[Jon Neu]

Not really they moved away from megatextures for DOOM Eternal. They need more memory because RT BVH is very memory intensive.

Next Gen consoles aren't going to use that much RT anyway, they don't have the hardware to do so.

But you can make RT on the series X and take it out in the Series S. With that you are already saving so much GPU perfomance and memory.

 

[Panajev2001a]

They matter very differently depending on what you're comparing. If the CPU of the XSS were at half the speed of the PS5, that'd be utterly terrible and would hold back 3rd party games a lot. On the other hand, GPU power and memory bandwidth are way more scalable, so the discrepancies there are not that big of a deal, unless you really push it (and let the Switch have something like 80% lower memory bandwidth compared to the PS4). Luckily, in the case of the XSS, we're dealing with modest discrepancies in areas where discrepancies are not a big deal (GPU power and memory bandwidth).

What is it about the Xbox Series S that worries developers?

Does that include the developers of the console?, as thats what they are saying in the S Reveal video. Same settings at a lower resolution. And the S has been designed to do just that. What do you expect them to say in a PR video?

www.neogaf.com

GPU power is scale able is a bit of a hand wavy way to explain things and it is correct in some areas and wrong in others as it is an oversimplification (reducing clockspeed and CU count impacts some parts of the picture in a way that does not scale linearly with resolution... see above link... RT is not 100% resolution dependent and there are portions of the GPU that are shared by all CU’s and are affected by the clockspeed downgrade and are not resolution related... HW scheduler, ACE’s, Prim processing unit, Geometry Engine, RB’s, etc...).

At least we are moving forward and away from the XSX is the lead platform and not held back by XSS at all .

 

[Panajev2001a]

I'm going to buy the Series X.

But in this worldwide economical crisis, launching a Series S with gamepass for 299€ (or 25€ a month), is the most pro consumer move you can do.

Games are going to be fine.

Bingo... now we have the pro-consumer angle. Not pro consumer enough, they could give it away for free .

 

[Team Andromeda]

The specs are not horrible, but they do hold the XSX back somewhat still: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/what...hat-worries-developers.1565139/post-260062247

SSD helps, but is the same across XSX and XSS so it helps out in both machines about the same way.

The main spec's are incredible for a £250 console, it's the RAM that will be an issue. I have no idea how it will pan out with the SSD being used for system RAM. I can't see it being any worse or holding developers back with the vast difference in Ram layout and structure to the Gube, PS2, OG Xbox limits going though to the PS3 and 360

I highly doubt Doom was made with Switch spec's in mind either. At the end of the day its market share that will determine who gets developer support

 

[El Pistolero]

It’s not next gen. What a dumb decision if you buy one. PS5 digital For only $100 more!
Ass for every saddle I guess...

Yeah...I do not think that Sony can hit the $399.00 pice point. $449.00 is far more likely, imo.

 

[Panajev2001a]

The main spec's are incredible for a £250 console, it's the RAM that will be an issue. I have no idea how it will pan out with the SSD being used for system RAM. I can't see it being any worse or holding developers back with the vast difference in Ram layout and structure to the Gube, PS2, OG Xbox limits going though to the PS3 and 360

I highly doubt Doom was made with Switch spec's in mind either. At the end of the day its market share that will determine who gets developer support

You are saying a lot of things and in isolation I do not have a lot of issues with them. Taken together and paired against the effect XSS has on the new generation jump, PC baseline, and XSX is another ball game though. Switch version of Doom is less of a supporting point for your argument than you may think I am afraid: different SKU, ported later, by a different team, and clearly impaired (30 FPS with drops and bad frame pacing as well as a lot lot lower resolution and botched sound effects) despite a superbly scalable engine.

Do not think the XSS specs suck for a £249 machine yet they are also disappointing somewhat, not just for the fact that they hold the XSX back and not having multiple HW profiles and a clear new generation reset (soft as you have BC) is why I and I think others like consoles in the first place.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

Because his engine is a total (V)RAM hog. The engine's approach is "eat as much (V)RAM as possible even if you don't need it". That's why the dude wants 32 GB of RAM in consoles lmao.

Not only id software talking that xss is problem but also senior technical producer at remedy, multiplayer designer at infinityward and unity dev. Did you even bother to read this thread or you just know better because you have some imaginations in your head ?

 

[Jon Neu]

By the way, the SSD on the Series S it's beeing really overlooked. It has half the memory, but it's the exact same as the Series X.

With the target resolution of the Series S being 3 or 4 times less, it's going to have a lot of SSD resources freed to help with the ram constraints.

Switch version of Doom is less of a supporting point for your argument than you may think I am afraid: different SKU, ported later, by a different team, and clearly impaired (30 FPS with drops and bad frame pacing as well as a lot lot lower resolution and botched sound effects) despite a superbly scalable engine.

And still they managed to make a Switch port, which is a port to a super underpowered machine with an architecture so different from the rest.

The Series S it's a much more powerful machine with the same architecture as the Series X.

 

[Reallink]

So this is my final take:

	Xbox Series X	Xbox Series S	Difference	% Decrease
CPU	3.6Ghz SMT on	3.4Ghz smt on	200Mhz less	5.56%
GPU	52 CUs @ 1.825Ghz	20Cus @ 1.565Ghz	32 Cus less & 260 Mhz less	61.54 % Cu @ 14.25% Frequency
GPU TF	12.125	4	8.125 TF	67.01%
RAM Pool 1	10 GB @ 560GB/s	8 GB @ 224 GB/s	2 GB & 336 GB/s Slower	20 % @ 60% Frequency
RAM Pool 2	6 GB @ 336 GB/s	2GB @ 56 GB/s	4 GB & 280 GB/s slower	66.67% @ 83.33% Frequency
SSD Storage (base10)	1000 GB	500 GB	500 GB less	50%
4K UHD BR	1	0	No Bluray	100%
Price	$500	$300	$200	40% prices Decrease

So for 40% less price you get no uhd blu ray a gimped gpu (67% worse), slightly slower cpu, less RAM @ massively reduced bandwidth & half the ssd storage.

It is a terrible deal / terrible value, they should be pricing this thing at $199, bang per buck its a Joke look at the numbers and some are just purely looking at the price and think its great value, its not great value at all, its awful value.

$199 is why it exists, remember MS are notorious for running semi-perpetual sales. They are fully aware a $300 S isn't going to sell particularly well against a potential $399 (or even $449) All Digital PS5. PS5 and Series X are never going to drop below $299, die shrinks, RAM prices, and flash storage prices can no longer be counted on to decrease over time.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

By the way, the SSD on the Series S it's beeing really overlooked. It has half the memory, but it's the exact same as the Series X.

With the target resolution of the Series S being 3 or 4 times less, it's going to have a lot of SSD resources freed to help with the ram constraints.



And still they managed to make a Switch port, which is a port to a super underpowered machine with an architecture so different from the rest.

The Series S it's a much more powerful machine with the same architecture as the Series X.

This Switch port comparison people keep doing... these Switch ports take at least a year longer to make, if we stick to the analogy you're talking waiting to get the S version of games because they need to find a way to make it run well there? Or outright delaying the games to get them to run on it (a lot of people believe this is why we still haven't gotten Cyberpunk into our hands, for instance)

 

[BlueXImpulse]

Not a developer. But this is the guy that leaked the release dates and prices for Xbox speaking about devs he’s talked to. Might be an older video

 

[Jon Neu]

This Switch port comparison people keep doing... these Switch ports take at least a year longer to make

Well, because again, the Switch it's a super shitty hardware (almost 2 generations below) with a complete different architecture.

And still they can make ports to it if they want to.

 

[Md Ray]

So this is my final take:

	Xbox Series X	Xbox Series S	Difference	% Decrease
CPU	3.6Ghz SMT on	3.4Ghz smt on	200Mhz less	5.56%
GPU	52 CUs @ 1.825Ghz	20Cus @ 1.565Ghz	32 Cus less & 260 Mhz less	61.54 % Cu @ 14.25% Frequency
GPU TF	12.125	4	8.125 TF	67.01%
RAM Pool 1	10 GB @ 560GB/s	8 GB @ 224 GB/s	2 GB & 336 GB/s Slower	20 % @ 60% Frequency
RAM Pool 2	6 GB @ 336 GB/s	2GB @ 56 GB/s	4 GB & 280 GB/s slower	66.67% @ 83.33% Frequency
SSD Storage (base10)	1000 GB	500 GB	500 GB less	50%
4K UHD BR	1	0	No Bluray	100%
Price	$500	$300	$200	40% prices Decrease

So for 40% less price you get no uhd blu ray a gimped gpu (67% worse), slightly slower cpu, less RAM @ massively reduced bandwidth & half the ssd storage.

It is a terrible deal / terrible value, they should be pricing this thing at $199, bang per buck its a Joke look at the numbers and some are just purely looking at the price and think its great value, its not great value at all, its awful value.

Series X is definitely a great value, IMO. Especially compared to building an equivalent PC.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

What is it about the Xbox Series S that worries developers?

Does that include the developers of the console?, as thats what they are saying in the S Reveal video. Same settings at a lower resolution. And the S has been designed to do just that. What do you expect them to say in a PR video?

www.neogaf.com

GPU power is scale able is a bit of a hand wavy way to explain things and it is correct in some areas and wrong in others as it is an oversimplification (reducing clockspeed and CU count impacts some parts of the picture in a way that does not scale linearly with resolution... see above link... RT is not 100% resolution dependent and there are portions of the GPU that are shared by all CU’s and are affected by the clockspeed downgrade and are not resolution related... HW scheduler, ACE’s, Prim processing unit, Geometry Engine, RB’s, etc...).

At least we are moving forward and away from the XSX is the lead platform and not held back by XSS at all .

Do you have any numbers to show the impact of CUs and clockspeed? I know about RT and it's why I believe we'll see barely any RT on XSS, but what about the other things? Never seen numbers for them before.

 

[Lort]

Microsoft claimed any1080p60 game would be 4k60 on xbx... Noone believed them.

They were right ( they did tones of research into it).

Expect the xss to be annoyingly close to looking the same as the other next gen console versions to most consumers.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Well, because again, the Switch it's a super shitty hardware (almost 2 generations below) with a complete different architecture.

And still they can make ports to it if they want to.

The architecture is a fair point but still I think most developers would tell you SCALING UP is much easier than SCALING DOWN, meaning that MOST DEVS will be making games to fit the S and then add bells and whistles to the X version, which is why people say "held back" we can't know HOW MUCH that will hold it back and games might SEEM next-gen enough we won't care, but I do wonder if PS5 is going to put out exclusives that are jaw-dropping and make people wonder why there isn't more games looking that way. This isn't even me being a fanboy, I wanted Series X to be the console, I didn't want Series S to exist, I WANTED XBOX to compete visually with their games. I dunno, I guess there's a weird line you draw down the middle somewhere, what's the difference between someone who wants to attack XBOX because they're a SONY guy and someone upset with their decisions because they want better? I was upset with Halo Infinite's look as a Halo fan, for instance not as someone who wants X Sony franchise to have more mindshare than Halo. But whatever.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Not only id software talking that xss is problem but also senior technical producer at remedy, multiplayer designer at infinityward and unity dev. Did you even bother to read this thread or you just know better because you have some imaginations in your head ?

Yes, I've read the thread and I haven't seen a compelling argument about why the PS5 can be a ~1800p console with 10 TF of GPU power and 448 GB/s memory bandwidth while the XSS somehow can't be a ~1080p console with 4 TF of GPU power and 224 GB/s memory bandwidth.

(I personally don't buy that the PS5 will reach native 4K nor that the XSS will reach native 1440p in most next-gen exclusive games)

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Yes, I've read the thread and I haven't seen a compelling argument about why the PS5 can be a ~1800p console with 10 TF of GPU power and 448 GB/s memory bandwidth while the XSS somehow can't be a ~1080p console with 4 TF of GPU power and 224 GB/s memory bandwidth.

(I personally don't buy that the PS5 will reach native 4K nor that the XSS will reach native 1440p in most next-gen exclusive games)

If you don't buy the XSS will hit 1440p in most games then I'm not sure what you're arguing. That said the idea that is' just a resolution slide is silly...

 

[Shmunter]

Not a developer. But this is the guy that leaked the release dates and prices for Xbox speaking about devs he’s talked to. Might be an older video

So painful to hear.

and then this....

 

[Bernd Lauert]

If you don't buy the XSS will hit 1440p in most games then I'm not sure what you're arguing. That said the idea that is' just a resolution slide is silly...

I still see no compelling argument. I see a strawman though. I never said it's gonna be just a resolution slider. Lower quality textures and lower quality/no RT are also gonna be necessary in some games.

 

[Redlancet]

The same reason the sub $200 digital Xbox one S is flying off the shelves this gen huh?

xbox x on europe was 230 and sold like shit

 

[bellome]

I'm going to buy the Series X.

But in this worldwide economical crisis, launching a Series S with gamepass for 299€ (or 25€ a month), is the most pro consumer move you can do.

Games are going to be fine.

Not launching it at all would have been even more "pro consumer" you know.

 

[Shmunter]

Well, because again, the Switch it's a super shitty hardware (almost 2 generations below) with a complete different architecture.

And still they can make ports to it if they want to.

They were porting Afterburner arcade to the Commodore 64. Ports mean nothing in the context of drawing next gen baselines for the next decade and how they influence the future of games.

 

[MilkyJoe]

Those suits at Microsoft just took a shit on next gen in their greed for both price and power. They always talked about how they wanted to do away generations and here is their shitty plan. It has been proven time and again how weak base consoles limit what can be done to stronger consoles. The SeX will never reach its full potential. Looks like Sony exclusives will be the only true representation of next gen. Buy more developers Sony! Secure more 3rd party exclusivity! Developers please boycott having to deal with this shitty machine so it gets removed from the market!

 

[Astral Dog]

And the same developers love the switch
Maybe not becauseoof the specs but because of the consumer base.

Maybe when you can take your Xbox Series S to play on the toilet that will be relevant