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What was wrong with Skyward Sword?

Can I ask a question? When people are talking about shallow combat, is this relative to other Legend of Zelda titles or adventure games as a whole? Because the series has never been what I'd call complex. I've always felt it was an afterthought, a small hurdle you overcame in order to enjoy the world and charming characters presented to you.

I don't know about shallow, but compared to other Zeldas I do find it extremely tedious. SS makes you sit there and wait for the opponent to block in one direction before you can attack. That kind of passive combat really grates on me. Compare it to WW, AoL, or really any other Zelda besides PH and SS (which are a bit too slow and simple for me combat-wise) and combat in SS just takes far longer than combat in a Zelda game should. It also never made me feel accomplished for defeating most enemies since it was just a case of Simon Says.
 

muteki

Member
Hated the overworld for the most part. Would have liked the sky-forest-volcano sections to be someway connected. Wii-mote got old, fast. Some bosses were just bad (Ghirahim, Imprisoned).

I didn't have trouble with the wii mote as far as accuracy goes, it was just to do the moves the game requires as fast as it does, means that you are making short quick flicks of the wrist instead of full arm swings 1:1. Which defeats the purpose. And I learned after this game I definitely don't want a 1:1 Zelda anymore.

Other than those things it was better than Twilight Princess to me. Dungeon design was really top-notch and I didn't feel like they gave up on the game halfway through development like in Windwaker and TP.
 

Asbear

Banned
Considering I got borderline depressed because of Mass Effect 3's failure as another entry in an otherwise awesome franchise, Skyward Sword was such a pleasure to play through. It felt like a breath of fresh air in a sea of mediocre games at the time.

FYI, MEU was my little place to escape to when I felt like my studying was getting too stressful and it was a rough winter where I lived in 2012 so ME3 not being like ME1 or ME2 where I could buy into the lore and immerse myself, felt like a pretty big blow. I know that might sound worrying, but don't worry - that stuff is behind me now.
 

zma1013

Member
I genuinly think the game is ruined by the bad controls and the constant interruptions. Skyward Sword is a game that was determined to make me hate it and it succeeded.

The controls only worked half the time and were constantly doing the opposite of what i wanted. "Oh whats that? You wanted to swing horizontally? Fuck you, here's a vertical swing haha!"

As for the interruptions, just let me play the game. That's my greatest wish for the next Zelda is, let me play the game. Stop stopping everything to tell me grass is green. I know that i need a key to open a lock. I know the my hearts are low, as if the non-stop beeping wasnt a giveaway. I know my battery is low. Have some faith in me Nintendo. Have some faith.

I pushed myself through to the very end and i would whole heartedly never recommend this game to a fan or newcomer. I am bitter about the whole ordeal. Yes it was an ordeal.
 

MrDenny

Member
What was the point in collecting the gratitude crystals.
By the time you collected them all, the wallet you get as a final reward is pointless.
There was nothing to buy, final reward was crap.
 

Servbot24

Banned
I'll also say that although the art style looked "neat", it didn't draw me in to the world. I didn't want to explore anything, due I think to the way everything was hazy and washed out. That combined with the level design just made me not care what was going to come next.
 

King_Moc

Banned
I wasn't that keen. I hated the "overworld". Flying was slow and dull, and the overworld areas just weren't that fun to traverse. It needed a proper overworld. I thought the controls were pretty good, but the game just felt uninspired in general.
 

Zomba13

Member
Fi sucks. Stop telling me shit I know every time I boot up the game again. Yes, I know that item can be used in crafting, it's why I'm picking it up. Yes, I know my HP is low, stop telling me, the beeping is annoying enough. Yes, I AM 100% fed up with your bullshit, how did you know?

Collecting the notes. That was annoying and tedious.


Can't think of much else. Loved the look, the music, the controls. Loved that it had a more "important" story to tell. Loved what they did with Zelda. Loved what they did with Impa. Loved the bosses.
 
The only major problem I have with the game is that motion controls are terrible.
It has some smaller flaws but they dont bother me too much. I'd still say its better than Wind Waker, due to that game being big and empty.
 

Kriken

Member
For me, the constant hand holding and pacing bugged me. The tutorial at the beginning was longer than necessary and I found something I hated more than Navi in the form of Fi.

The controls are fine and the dungeons are okay, but in the end, it just didn't feel as fulfilling as Wind Waker or Majora's Mask for me.
 

Sami+

Member
Can I ask a question? When people are talking about shallow combat, is this relative to other Legend of Zelda titles or adventure games as a whole? Because the series has never been what I'd call complex. I've always felt it was an afterthought, a small hurdle you overcame in order to enjoy the world and charming characters presented to you.

Combat was never particularly good, but was slowly taking steps towards complexity with WW and TP. SS felt like a regression from that.
 
They finally add sprint to a Zelda and then they bring in dousing. DOUSING. THEY CREATED A TERM FOR THE MOST ANNOYING MENIAL THING THAT DOESN'T ACCURATELY CONVEY ANYTHING ABOUT WHAT IT ACTUALLY IS.

It's bad. I played for 2/3 hours and I was still waiting to have a good time. It doesn't matter to me that a game is well made if it takes more than an hour to get to the part where you feel like you're playing a game.

At least it sounds good and is pretty for a Wii game.
 

Moff

Member
worst zelda overworld ever and too much repetition/recycling.
apart from that a pretty amazing game, some of the best dungeons and bosses in the franchise, too.
 

RagnarokX

Member
Skyward Sword fell flat on its face on everything that matters to a Zelda, except for dungeons, which where mostly good.
-NPC were few in numbers and not that interesting. The relationship between zelda and Link was refreshing at the start, but lost value rather quickly after it became the standard ''save the princess''.
-Dungeons were OK: timeshift stones where amazing, to be fair. But the starting dungeon, which was literally 4 rooms if i remember correctly was disappointing to say the least.
-The overworld was barren and the items rarely had any use outside of dungeons.
-Controls to me where awful: it lead to a recycle of enemies and even bosses required very basic strategy, which almost always came down to swing patterns. Zelda could learn a thing or 2 from the metroid prime series. It also didnt help that some bosses where recycled
-Lack of Towns. there only was 1. It kind of took a central meaning in the game, as did Majoras mask, but the remaining areas where completely void of any meaningful interaction, whereas Majoras Mask was amazing with lots of secrets and interesting NPC outside of it ''main city''. The upgrade system was nice, but not really needed with the difficulty.
-Difficulty. Nintendos focus on making games acceptable for wide audiences comes at a cost of challenge, and its ironically hurting the Zelda series more than Mario; Bosses and puzzles are way way WAY too easy, hearts are given almost everywhere when not at full health, AI of enemies takes a defensive ''wait and defend/stay back'': just filling time, instead of being aggressive and challenging approach and are generally defeated with 3 sword strikes MAX. The combat is also a step back from TP; the 7 hidden sword techniques are absent from this game and although they weren't really necessary because of easy enemies, that's a different subject entirely. They are absent in Skyward Sword.
-Sidekick with fii was kind of original at first, but quickly became cumbersome with all the tips, talking and hand-holding to the max. The worst sidekick out of the franchise imo. Also dowsing was awful and the constant popup of ''you picked up item X'' and explaining what it does was fucking annoying. Remember the ''you picked up 5 rupees'' message from Twilight princess? This takes it to a whole other level, which is saying something!
-Music was lacking. Now don't understand me wrong: the use of orchestral tunes where awesome and there where some nice tunes. However most tunes, although orchestrated, where lacking melody-wise: they didn't have any catchy direction, ''they where just there'' if that makes sense. Oh yeah, no title screen music...a serious disappointment when I first played the game.
-Tedious filler such as searching for tadstones in the dark with a timer and guards was worse than searching for tears of light in TP, and the boring sections of land which you have to travel before reaching a dungeon which you onl travel once, dont hold any interesting secrets and where void of any interactivity of NPC...only to be filled with tedious fetchqeusts; The reminded me a lot of phantom hourglass's areas before you enter a dungeon. Not exactly e compliment.

My god, I thought I'd name a few negatives and honestly state my opinion, but I cant stop with naming things I didn't like. And you may think I'm just a hater: nothing could be further from the truth: I listened to Skywards sword main theme months before release and was hyped as fuck. Bought the special edition with gold wiimote day 1, and couldn't help but notice all the negatives.
I guess my main gripe with Skyward Sword is that not only they didn't address the issues found in previous installments (Difficulty, lack of NPC, few towns, barren overworlds, filler fetchquests, etc.), but those issues are even more apparent than ever before. Zelda just doesn't get a free pass anymore, just because it is Zelda. Nintendo needs to know there is more to zelda than just dungeons, look at Majoras Mask and evolve the formula from there.
Well, a lot of the negatives you listed seem to be in your head/misremembered.

1. There were a pretty standard amount of interesting NPCs to interact with. The game does not fall into standard save the princess until possibly the last hour. Zelda is pretty much in control of everything until the very end.
2. The first dungeons are always lackluster in Zelda games because they are first dungeons. I would say every dungeon after the 2nd one, maybe even including the second one, are classics. It was a step up from TP which started out with and ended with more lackluster dungeons.
3. The sky was barren, sure, but the surface areas were like minidungeons and the items got more use outside of dungeons than usual for Zelda games.
4. Well, can't really argue with opinions about controls. They worked properly, though. The motion controls added a lot more depth and challenge to combat that previous games.
5. It wouldn't make a lot of sense for there to be towns on the surface considering the post-apocalyptic setting. There are plenty of NPCs down there, though, and their interactions with the environment were at least as good as Wind Waker where the Rito have a post office and no dwellings. Skyloft is a good town as it is.
6. The sword techniques in TP didn't add any difficulty... they made an easy game even easier. TP encounters were pretty much wait for an opening and waggle. SS had you think more about how to tackle the enemies.
7. Dowsing was optional. Fi does not pop up and give hints as often as people think she does. People confuse a lot of optional things as being required. They actually fixed the rupee thing from TP. The treasures thing could be annoying, but honestly how often were you picking up treasures? They're not as common as rupees. Still, nowhere near as bad as Link's Awakening.
8. I agree that it didn't have as many memorable tunes, but it had some really good ones.
9. This paragraph made no sense. You seem to have confused the tadtones and the tears of light. The silent realms aren't timed, but if the timer reaches 0 the guards wake up and chase you until you collect another tear to fill up the timer. They're challenging and fun, unlike the twilight realm sections in TP that weren't challenging at all and just introduce you to areas you have to backtrack over again as a human. Doing the silent realms opens the path to new areas of the surface you have not visited before. Getting to them is not tedious. You just go straight to them, do them, and then go to the new area. The only part that was really tedious was when they make you go back to the first dungeon.
The biggest problem with the game was the recycled areas. They were fun the first time, kind of like an extension of the dungeon itself. But then for the next set of dungeons rather than having new levels, they just throw you back in the old ones and make you collect shit before you can access the dungeon. The whole triforce quest was beyond awful, so much low quality filler content before you can progress.

This is not true. You go back to the old areas just to access the silent realms. Completing a silent realm gives you an item that allows you to access a new area of the surface. Faron Woods -> Lake Floria. Eldin Volcano -> Volcano Summit. Lanayru Desert -> Sand Sea. The song quest wasn't that bad. The stealth mission and new section of Lanyru were good. The tadtones were fine.
 

Dezzy

Member
Making me do this to play it.
I'm not sure how good the game would have been without the motion controls, because I never made it through the first dungeon before I was sick of doing this to play:
drummania.gif
 

martino

Member
I loved it except item first time item description tutorial reboot each time quit/launch a gaming session...
 
Not as good as MM or Windwaker, but ALOT better than OoT and a little better than TP. It's around middle of the pack as far as Zelda's go. I enjoyed the controls a lot and I really liked the characters in this one more than other Zelda games (Groose Forever).

Fi isn't a bad character herself, it's the fucking developers that decided to make her repeat all the same shit every time you pick up something, but I really like her. She's no Midna, but that's not even a comparison because she's way better than Navi.

The music has some of the best Zelda has ever had to offer.
 

Zalman

Member
Making me do this to play it.
I'm not sure how good the game would have been without the motion controls, because I never made it through the first dungeon before I was sick of doing this to play:
drummania.gif
That's not how you play the game.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
One complaint that's always brought up which I fail to understand is collecting the tadtones. That wasn't difficult at all. Did you all miss that you could use the spin move to suck nearby ones toward you? Or did you simply suck at controlling Link in the water? Both that and flying was easy and felt great to me.
 

Myriadis

Member
I don't know about shallow, but compared to other Zeldas I do find it extremely tedious. SS makes you sit there and wait for the opponent to block in one direction before you can attack. That kind of passive combat really grates on me. Compare it to WW, AoL, or really any other Zelda besides PH and SS (which are a bit too slow and simple for me combat-wise) and combat in SS just takes far longer than combat in a Zelda game should. It also never made me feel accomplished for defeating most enemies since it was just a case of Simon Says.

I'm currently thinking about it, and the only enemies that I remember doing this are the boboklins or whatever they're called and the skeleton soldiers. The spiders, the huge fat bobolkin with the shield, the lizards with the stone arms and all the smaller enemies don't require you to wait at all. It's only a shame that these boboklins are one of the most used enemies in the game. And even the skeletons are much faster and active.

Making me do this to play it.
I'm not sure how good the game would have been without the motion controls, because I never made it through the first dungeon before I was sick of doing this to play:
drummania.gif


No surprise you couldn't even get through the first dungeon.

-------

As someone who really enjoyed Skyward Sword, I can still see its flaws. I would've also loved an interconnected world instead of the three sections. Text speed should've been instant in most conversations, only fixed speed in important cutscenes like in Ocarina of Time given that they sometimes adjusted the speed on events happening on screen.

I'm actually one of these who liked some of the filler content. I liked everything up to the second dungeon and especially the third dungeon. But for some reason, I don't like almost any of the tasks they gave you for the forest area. The other areas simply had much better ones, more diversive and fun, especially the desert.

That game also has some of the best sidequest (pumpkin bar, the love letter and the dusty home) while having some blatantly mediocre ones that are simply badly hidden fetch quests. They could've done more with this.

That game does so many things right, from the amazing soundtrack to the wonderful dungeons and bosses, useful items, interesting characters and the smooth new gameplay mechanics (I'm one of these who completely loves the motion control). But it introduced or kept a good bunch of bad ideas.
 
One complaint that's always brought up which I fail to understand is collecting the tadtones. That wasn't difficult at all. Did you all miss that you could use the spin move to suck nearby ones toward you? Or did you simply suck at controlling Link in the water? Both that and flying was easy and felt great to me.
This.

After seeing the complaints about the tadtones I was really worried when I got to them. Took less then 30 minutes (timed it) to find them all and it was no problem... Only real complaint I have about that section is the frame rate dropped to LOL levels at several points when looking down on the woods from the surface of the water.

Biggest problem with SS is the slow text from Fi and the shopkeepers. The shopping interface was a step back from TP but everything else was an improvement.
 

Domstercool

Member
The initial start was slow, but once it got going, damn, Skyward Sword was amazing. The dungeons were simply outstanding, and unlike a certain handheld Zelda game, these dungeons actually required you to use multiple items to get through. It was one of the few games that made every item feel it had a use in each dungeon and overall, some of the best dungeons in the series.

The combat was fantastic as well. It added some depth to the normal lock on and hack away like a madman gameplay that some of the other Zelda titles were like. The combat could be made even better if it was 100% freedom, but even with eight directions, it was still some of the better combat in the series. The only issue I had with controls was sometimes it would lose centre, but a quick button press fixed that. I never had any issues with my swinging of the gold wiimote that came with the Skyward Sword package.

Zelda herself. Loved her design and how she turns out to be not a princess but more of Link's best buddy.

I do miss an proper overworld, but I did like how the ground was one big dungeon linking to the game's main dungeons.
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
Ah, SS, the game that I dislike the more I dissect its inner workings.

Overworld is a mess, pacing is worse, the combat is sorely lacking enemy variety(also try not targeting some of the enemies and laugh as they never block), Fi is a character that regurgitates the obvious yet doesn't even actually help a player who manages to get stuck making her wholly useless.

A lot of the issues are small niggling things which is a shame, but it still has some big flaws in its own right.

One complaint that's always brought up which I fail to understand is collecting the tadtones. That wasn't difficult at all. Did you all miss that you could use the spin move to suck nearby ones toward you? Or did you simply suck at controlling Link in the water? Both that and flying was easy and felt great to me.

I had no issues with the tadtones from a gameplay standpoint, but from a pacing/story one they are in such a bad spot, especialy given how the player can tackle the areas. The story focuses on the imprisoned a lot and mentions how it comes back quicker and stronger each time. After fighting him for the second time it shortly after leads into where you pick the area you go to. I went to the forest first, which made me fight him a third time pretty quickly. So basically, clocks running on him coming back and it already didn't take long. And that absolute moron dragon makes me burn time doing that to prove myself after already acknowledging me as a hero. When her neighbor is possibly just about to come back and murder everyone. Brilliant!
 

Marlowe89

Member
Skyward Sword is a weird game for me because there were some aspects that I found very enjoyable and a some aspects that I thought were almost unforgivably bland. The dungeons, boss battles, and combat mechanics were arguably at the height of the franchise's design execution for me and to be honest I fell in love with a lot of the character designs. I don't know who thought it was a great idea to make the sidekick such a lifeless character though.

Unfortunately, it also contains my least favorite overworld in the entire series. If "content density" means turning the surface map into one big dungeon filled with corridors and busywork, I'd rather not have that included at all (although I do respect the experimentation). Conversely, the world above sounded fantastic in theory but was ultimately poor in execution, offering very little in the way of discoverable content - compared to something like WW's Great Sea, which featured several dozen islands with their own semi-intricate caves in addition to a multitude of other things to scavenge like watchtowers, submarines and submerged treasure, The Sky felt horrendously bare. I don't think I would have even minded the lack of interconnectedness as long as there was a strong sense of exploration, but there really wasn't.

In the end I tend to see Skyward Sword as more of a hit-and-miss experimental effort rather than a particularly memorable Zelda title, but I would love to see some of its design principles carried over to future installments.
 

GSG Flash

Nobody ruins my family vacation but me...and maybe the boy!
I agree with you OP. Easily the worst console Zelda game for me. I hated the controls mainly, but other stuff, such as the level select overworld, also annoyed me.
 

SCReuter

Member
Slow text, constant interruptions, and the inability to skip cutscenes are my largest issues with Skyward Sword.

Nintendo, you have a great game here, so how about you actually let me play it?
 
I knew I smelled another SS-hate thread; the Skyward Sword hatedom is quite persistent. ;)

Nothing was wrong with it in my opinion, it was/is a phenomenal Zelda/Action-Adventure game from both a game design (DAT Lanayru Province!) and presentation perspective (Just listen to this piece; there are a lot of fantastic under-appreciated tracks in that game)

The level/dungeon/puzzle and item design, in particular, is some of the best the series has ever had. I really admire Skyward Sword's "gameplay, gameplay, and more gameplay!" design philosophy; as far as I'm concerned, it nails theming/mood but it doesn't revel in thematic fluff for too long.
I can only hope that LoZ:U can have dungeon/mini dungeon/puzzle/obstacle design and item usage that is half as good as Skyward Sword's.

I guess my only (tiny) complaints with the game are the tad tone mission (it makes no sense from a narrative perspective and it wasn't particularly engaging), and the hidden "Hero Mode" (let us choose this option from the start; the mode sucks as a "reward")

Other than that I love the game, and it continues to be one of my favorite entries in the franchise.
:)
 

FirLocke

Member
I just beat Twilight Princess(really liked it, first Zelda I've ever finished) and have now just got back to SS, picking up from my 10 hour save from 2012 or something. I'm loving SS! Fi was actually incredibly helpful on getting me up to speed. A simple flick of the wrist is all that is necessary for the correct angle btw, no need for a swing of an arm. I forget that I'm using motion controls, so I guess that means I like the controls a lot. Certainly controls better than TP on the Wii!
 
T
Also, did we really need a stamina meter?
Do you mean the Stamina as a mechanic or the HUD element for the interface? In the case of the HUD element it is badly designed, intrusive and unnecessary. Had to get used Gecko codes to get rid of it and it was much better for the presentation. But the stamina/sprint system is one of the really good additions to the game.
Shit pacing that was soul sucking. Never bothered to finish it. Felt worn out.

Also having to constantly hold the controller straight up in the air to re-sync the motions was a right pain. Seemed to happen way to often.
Holding the controller straight up in the air to resynch? First time i heard of this. But i'll asure that you are doing it wrong, no need for that. Really curious to learn where did you heard that was neccessary.
I felt they were the best part of the game aside from Zelda's character.

Though, I can't say I approve of re-syncing all the time.
Now, im convinced the mayority of people complaining about controls don't even understand them.
I'm actually replaying the game for a second time now on Hero mode and I'm baffled by how much she interrupts the flow constantly only to state the obvious (I didn't really mind the first time around because I was just in love with the game). I'm not even bothered that much by the slow and unskippable text, but Fi is just hands-down my least favorite sidekick. I really hope they drop sidekicks for the next Zelda.
Ahhhh! That's exactly what is pointed out to people defending the game's pacing and/or Fi. It's in the following play through the pacing flows become pretty transparent.

If this game is cut to a 18-20 hour adventure it would improve tend fold.
 

Kaban

Member
It was a fun game from what I remember, but I haven't gone back to it since the musical notes bit. That was just a pain.

Also, battllng that big black goofy monster with no arms about a billion times.
 

The Boat

Member
They finally add sprint to a Zelda and then they bring in dousing. DOUSING. THEY CREATED A TERM FOR THE MOST ANNOYING MENIAL THING THAT DOESN'T ACCURATELY CONVEY ANYTHING ABOUT WHAT IT ACTUALLY IS.

It's bad. I played for 2/3 hours and I was still waiting to have a good time. It doesn't matter to me that a game is well made if it takes more than an hour to get to the part where you feel like you're playing a game.

At least it sounds good and is pretty for a Wii game.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowsing

Also. Dowsing is completely optional, as it's just a compass of sorts that you can choose not to use it.
 
A shorter, easier list would be "what's good about skyward sword?" As a huge zelda fan since I was a very young child, SS was terrible. It's a decent standalone game, but measured up as a zelda game? Nope.
 
Fi, while kinda cool in some areas.... really needs to know when to keep her mouth shut. Game's got way too much unnecessary unskippable text slowing it down.

Throw in loot messages every time you turn off the game, WM+ used for swimming... I liked the game a lot, but I'd probably call it the most flawed Zelda game. That doesn't make it bad or mean it's the worst Zelda, just got a lot of baggage hurting it.
 

McLovin

Member
If they got rid of the padding(about 1/3rd of the game), the useless drawn out tutorial, and made repeating text skipable or at least condensed the text to a one liner the second time through this would probably be my favorite Zelda game. This is one case where less game would have been better. I actually liked the controls and had very little issue with them. My brother on the other hand had a hard time. He kept waggling instead of motioning the attack. He must have fought the Jamaican Cyclops dude 10+ times.
 
Now, im convinced the mayority of people complaining about controls don't even understand them.
/QUOTE]

Why quote me for that? Aside from the constant resyncing , I thought the game was piss easy and felt the controls were the best part of the game.
Hey there Afrocious:
The "Resyncing" term would apply better to "Re Calibrating" motion Plus. If So you are probably talking about "Recentering". Recentering by the way, is the most strange, trivial, petty complain i've heard in recent times concerning a game. It would be like complaining about constantly "Resyncing" the mouse every time the user ran out of surface or complaining about "Resyncing" the camera to center is most third person adventuire games. Down on the Dpad is there for the user to reset the neutral position when the desire araises.

Now if by "Resyncing" you are talking about Recalibrating, then there are issues related to faulty hardware or some sort of abnormal interference.

Also, not directed to you Afrocious, you can't say the controls are bad because that's a fallacy. That some people don't enjoy them is another issue entirely.
 

zruben

Banned
Absolutely nothing was wrong with Skyward Sword. Zelda Cycle at it's best. Amazing game.

c'mon... I loved SS and finished it twice... but even I can recognize that it has some flaws.

on the top of my head:
-slow-ass text.
-empty sky
-annoying Fi tutorials / warning messages
-the swimming section
 
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