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World Cup 2010 7/02: Netherlands Vs. Brazil, Ghana vs Uruguay |OT|
- Thread starter Wessiej
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jamesinclair
Banned
ReyBrujo said:That is the difference between European and American soccer. In America, after everything fails, you play with your heart and soul. A player from down here will do anything to prevent his team from losing. An European one will likely let the ball in, pick his pay and go back to his mansion to rest
I agree, and thats the biggest weakness for the brasilian team: they've turned into europeans.
A great example is to watch the UEFA Champions league final and the Libertadores final. The champions league final is low energy, everyone has made their money, they just need to show up and pass the ball around. The LIbertadores final, theyre playing for EVERYTHING.
gutter_trash
Banned
like C.Ronaldo... he doesn't give a shit about the national team, doesn't play with heart, doesn't have the will to win, doesn't have the creativity to adapt to the match situation
he makes his gazillions at Real Madrid, he has money to burn. He gets frustrated and shuts down and disapears.
in the Uruguay match, you saw Floran everywhere, Floran here, Floran there, Floran everwhere
where the fuck was C.Ronaldo in the vs Spain game? why can't he be present? fuck him
and Wayne Rooney too was on the same boat C.Ronaldo, fuck them both
he makes his gazillions at Real Madrid, he has money to burn. He gets frustrated and shuts down and disapears.
in the Uruguay match, you saw Floran everywhere, Floran here, Floran there, Floran everwhere
where the fuck was C.Ronaldo in the vs Spain game? why can't he be present? fuck him
and Wayne Rooney too was on the same boat C.Ronaldo, fuck them both
WOW.
To address a few of the talking points in this thread: Ghana outplayed Worstguay. They were better, but so were South Korea, and they both lost to Worstguay.
Re: Suarez's handball. Two sides to this. On the one hand, it was disgraceful. It was cheating, not playing by the rules (HINT: Breaking the rules is not playing by the rules. Idiots. :lol ). On the other hand, he really did show brilliant presence of mind. I'm not predisposed to cheating, and if I were in that same situation I'm not sure if I would've been quick enough to calculate the utility cost of a handball. I probably would have went for the header and my team would be out of the World Cup.
In Y2Kev's words: Evil genius. Yes, it was evil/cheating/shameful/etc. It was also genius. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth and a knot in my stomach, but know this: Ghana are not innocent. They would have done the same thing. They also cheated (shameful simulation which went unpunished) against the US. Granted, they outplayed the US and this is several orders of magnitude worse as far as changing the outcome of the game, but it shows that they're not above doing the same thing: winning at any cost.
To address a few of the talking points in this thread: Ghana outplayed Worstguay. They were better, but so were South Korea, and they both lost to Worstguay.
Re: Suarez's handball. Two sides to this. On the one hand, it was disgraceful. It was cheating, not playing by the rules (HINT: Breaking the rules is not playing by the rules. Idiots. :lol ). On the other hand, he really did show brilliant presence of mind. I'm not predisposed to cheating, and if I were in that same situation I'm not sure if I would've been quick enough to calculate the utility cost of a handball. I probably would have went for the header and my team would be out of the World Cup.
In Y2Kev's words: Evil genius. Yes, it was evil/cheating/shameful/etc. It was also genius. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth and a knot in my stomach, but know this: Ghana are not innocent. They would have done the same thing. They also cheated (shameful simulation which went unpunished) against the US. Granted, they outplayed the US and this is several orders of magnitude worse as far as changing the outcome of the game, but it shows that they're not above doing the same thing: winning at any cost.
As would I. Would I be pissed if I saw the other team to that to my team? Damn skippy. That said, this happens in EVERY sport ALL the time. Commentators, who usually were players, say they would have done the same thing.ccbfan said:
You do everything in your power to win, and if you break the rules, you get punished. He wasn't hurting anyone. He wasn't ending anyone's career. He effected a game and not a life.
I have no issue with what he did.
HybridMonkey
Neo Member
Why is everyone arguing about the player and the actions committed. The real problem is the rule. He thought the ball was going in and in desperation he stops it from going in knowing he's giving his team a second chance. I have no problem with this. The real argument is why, if under the discretion of say the referee, a goal is not awarded when a violation is being committed to prevent a clear goal. It's the rule I have a problem with.
For example, I remember the past Arizona-Pittsburgh superbowl. Before halftime there was that play where the Pit defender was running a clear path to the endzone with :00 left on the clock. People wondered why someone on the Arizona sideline in theory couldn't "take one for the team", run out, and trip the guy up before he scored. The answer is that the rules let the referee award the score if in his mind that violation stopped a clear path to a touchdown.
For example, I remember the past Arizona-Pittsburgh superbowl. Before halftime there was that play where the Pit defender was running a clear path to the endzone with :00 left on the clock. People wondered why someone on the Arizona sideline in theory couldn't "take one for the team", run out, and trip the guy up before he scored. The answer is that the rules let the referee award the score if in his mind that violation stopped a clear path to a touchdown.
gutter_trash
Banned
Xeke said:
he doesn't deserve to be just called "Ronaldo"
ReyBrujo
Member
Technically, field players cannot use the hands, so it could be considered cheating. However, there is a punishment for that and is straight red card (which enables the discipline table to suspend the player for more than one match, contrary to double yellow card which is only one match).
So, it is the last minute of the second extra time, the ball comes straight to you. If it scores, there is no way to recover (only a penalty kick can be executed after the time ends). Your goalkeeper has been beaten, and if you lose, you are out of the Cup. If you block it with your hands, you are expelled, and they get a penalty. There is the possibility of your goalkeeper catching it (or the executor missing the mark), which would allow your team to go to penalty kicks. But even if your team wins, there is a good chance of being suspended for one or two matches, which would be goodbye to the World Cup. There is nothing bigger for a soccer player than the final match of a World Cup, and Uruguay hasn't been there in 50 years.
What would you do?
From a South American perspective, if you doubt, you don't belong to the national team. The team is first and foremost, no matter if it means you will be watching the final match with the audience.
As mentioned before, it happens in every sport. Don't basketball players make faults when a member of the other team is running alone to score? Do they all end the game with 0 faults? No, they know they can commit 5 or 6 faults, so they use them to benefit the team. In soccer there is no goal tending (or penalty try as in rugby). To score the ball must cross the line, it is this simple. Giving a goal and expelling a player for doing this would be an exaggerated punishment (for example, a player punching an opponent to death in the midfield would be punished only with expulsion, but not with a goal).
Most of the times these matches end with a team with one less player and losing the game because the opponent scores. Ghana had its opportunity and missed it. In the World Cup, there is a line which divides teams between those that are prepared for the glory and those that must walk away and try again in the future.
Besides, if Netherlands/Holland/Lowlands/How_many_names_you_got? does something similar, I have no doubt Uruguay would score the penalty.
So, it is the last minute of the second extra time, the ball comes straight to you. If it scores, there is no way to recover (only a penalty kick can be executed after the time ends). Your goalkeeper has been beaten, and if you lose, you are out of the Cup. If you block it with your hands, you are expelled, and they get a penalty. There is the possibility of your goalkeeper catching it (or the executor missing the mark), which would allow your team to go to penalty kicks. But even if your team wins, there is a good chance of being suspended for one or two matches, which would be goodbye to the World Cup. There is nothing bigger for a soccer player than the final match of a World Cup, and Uruguay hasn't been there in 50 years.
What would you do?
From a South American perspective, if you doubt, you don't belong to the national team. The team is first and foremost, no matter if it means you will be watching the final match with the audience.
As mentioned before, it happens in every sport. Don't basketball players make faults when a member of the other team is running alone to score? Do they all end the game with 0 faults? No, they know they can commit 5 or 6 faults, so they use them to benefit the team. In soccer there is no goal tending (or penalty try as in rugby). To score the ball must cross the line, it is this simple. Giving a goal and expelling a player for doing this would be an exaggerated punishment (for example, a player punching an opponent to death in the midfield would be punished only with expulsion, but not with a goal).
Most of the times these matches end with a team with one less player and losing the game because the opponent scores. Ghana had its opportunity and missed it. In the World Cup, there is a line which divides teams between those that are prepared for the glory and those that must walk away and try again in the future.
I doubt it. However, they managed to get the English referee replaced because they feared an English referee would bring problems after what the Uruguayan referee did to England.Pachael said:
Besides, if Netherlands/Holland/Lowlands/How_many_names_you_got? does something similar, I have no doubt Uruguay would score the penalty.
Tieno
Member
I don't think Suarez's move was calculated. It was desperation and reflexes. The situation was very chaotic and stakes were high.
A lot of players and goalkeepers have acted similarly in such a situation (GK handballing out of their area). I think Suarez's move was probably much less calculated than the usual fauling against advancing attacking players.
I'll be enjoying the dutch team, they're probably the european team who want it the most and play with the most heart. I just hope their wanting doesn't make them fuck it up now that they're this far.
A lot of players and goalkeepers have acted similarly in such a situation (GK handballing out of their area). I think Suarez's move was probably much less calculated than the usual fauling against advancing attacking players.
I'll be enjoying the dutch team, they're probably the european team who want it the most and play with the most heart. I just hope their wanting doesn't make them fuck it up now that they're this far.
MrPink93485
Member
I just want to say that Maxi Pereira, the Uruguay midfielder or whomever who totally shanked the ball way over the goal post in penalty kicks is now my hero. His face reaction after he misses it is PRICELESS.
In fact, when I get FIFA 11, the first thing I'm gonna do is get him on my team.
In fact, when I get FIFA 11, the first thing I'm gonna do is get him on my team.
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
MMaRsu said:And what a lovely goal that first goal was. If you look back at the replay you can actually hear the crowd go wild with no vuvuzela's.
I feel sorry for anyone watching that on a 3D TV. Must have been some scary shit.
MrPink93485 said:I just want to say that Maxi Pereira, the Uruguay midfielder or whomever who totally shanked the ball way over the goal post in penalty kicks is now my hero. His face reaction after he misses it is PRICELESS.
In fact, when I get FIFA 11, the first thing I'm gonna do is get him on my team.
Joker face right there.
I was so fuckin mad at him i punched the wall, glad the best goalkeeper in the WC saved his ass.
EL NENE!!
Patrick Bateman
Member
Damn, Ghana should really practise penalties. I don't get how you are supposed to score a goal when you only take 1 or 2 steps as a run-up.
Also:
That dumb cunt. :lol :lol
Also:
That dumb cunt. :lol :lol
MrPink93485
Member
SalsaShark said:Joker face right there.
I was so fuckin mad at him i punched the wall, glad the best goalkeeper in the WC saved his ass.
EL NENE!!
Nah. If Uruguay lost because of him, you couldn't honestly be too upset about it, because they were damn lucky to be in that situation in the first place. But he took that shot like a champ. He didn't cry after he shanked that ball. He smiled. He grinned.......because you know what, that was a hilarious shot.
Always-honest
Banned
the amount of beer consumened (and just thrown in the air) in The Netherlands Yesterday reallly made it a great year for beer brewers and bars instantly
The Chosen One
Member
Some of you still don't get it.
This is the equivalent of going studs up and intentionally snapping the knee caps of the opposing team's star player. Just because there's a mechanism in place to handle dirty/cheat plays like this (giving a straight red card), doesn't excuse the behavior. Doing something like this goes totally against the spirit of the game.
It's not the "ultimate sacrifice", "noble", "smart" or whatever you want to call it. It's cowardly. He thought he was beat so he gave up and grabbed the ball instead of taking it like a man. As I said before, it's like knocking over the board in chess right before you get check-mated.
Ironically, if he reacted with his body instead of his hands, he might have been able to poke/block the ball with a valid part of his body. Don't say every other play would have done the same thing because they wouldn't. Many times I've seen defenders hurl their bodies at goal-line shots. Heck, there is a popular GIF from this WC of the English player throwing his head at the ground trying to stop the shot. He didn't bitch-out like Suarez and use his hands, he stayed within the spirit of the game trying to make the play.
Obviously not everyone is going to agree on what Suarez did because some people have "win by any means necessary" attitude. Of course if you have that attitude then you'll think Suarez was a hero and hold him in high regard. But it also means you're in the same group of people who thinks it's okay to break someone's legs as long as it improves your team's chances of winning.
This is the equivalent of going studs up and intentionally snapping the knee caps of the opposing team's star player. Just because there's a mechanism in place to handle dirty/cheat plays like this (giving a straight red card), doesn't excuse the behavior. Doing something like this goes totally against the spirit of the game.
It's not the "ultimate sacrifice", "noble", "smart" or whatever you want to call it. It's cowardly. He thought he was beat so he gave up and grabbed the ball instead of taking it like a man. As I said before, it's like knocking over the board in chess right before you get check-mated.
Ironically, if he reacted with his body instead of his hands, he might have been able to poke/block the ball with a valid part of his body. Don't say every other play would have done the same thing because they wouldn't. Many times I've seen defenders hurl their bodies at goal-line shots. Heck, there is a popular GIF from this WC of the English player throwing his head at the ground trying to stop the shot. He didn't bitch-out like Suarez and use his hands, he stayed within the spirit of the game trying to make the play.
Obviously not everyone is going to agree on what Suarez did because some people have "win by any means necessary" attitude. Of course if you have that attitude then you'll think Suarez was a hero and hold him in high regard. But it also means you're in the same group of people who thinks it's okay to break someone's legs as long as it improves your team's chances of winning.
Meh, what Suarez did was intelligent in my opinion. Ghana was the better team though, their midfield was rock solid through the whole tournament. Anthony Annan is definitely moving to a bigger club this summer, next Essien indeed. Probably the best DM in this whole tournament.
Gyan must feel absolutely horrible. He probably thinks he let down the whole Africa.
Gyan must feel absolutely horrible. He probably thinks he let down the whole Africa.
MrPink93485 said:
We got on that situation because of the damn horrible referee
but i wont get on that again :lol i totally get you though, el mono Pereira is awesome And man, i know we couldnt be too mad afterwards, but you cant even begin to imagine what those penalties were over here.
This was outside, everywhere outside
These are DURING the game, its not even the celebration :lol there were screens showing the match everywhere.
3 Million people population.. i think everyone was there.
Jinjo
Member
Stekelenburg & Sneijder are the heroes of the nation right now. I can only imagine the speech Van Marwijk gave in half-time, because the team played incredible after that. We were waiting for the 'good' Dutch match, this was it, right when we needed it. I still get goosebumps thinking about it. :lol
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
Jinjo said:
At the beginning of the second half it looked like he had been shouting a lot. Probably fire and brimstone sort of stuff, with a few clogs thrown at the walls for good measure.
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
Lach said:
People need to just let this go. He committed a foul and got punished for it. The end.
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
Lach said:
No.
Maybe there does need to be, but there isn't. Right now what he did was legendary.
However, he also fucked Uruguay, they have to beat Netherlands without one of their best strikers and probably highest goal scorers.
but then, they wouldn't have got there without. He jumped on the grenade for the team. Incredible play :lol
I cant believe what Suarez did yesterday.
It was a fuckin brilliant move in the hindsight but man thats some dirrrrrty play
there was no chance for them comming back and the goal was practically in. he used the 0.0001 chance to get his team out of this situation and the team pulled it off
It was a fuckin brilliant move in the hindsight but man thats some dirrrrrty play
he played second goal keeper and hindered a surefire goalindustrian said:
it was the 118 or so minutecatfish said:
there was no chance for them comming back and the goal was practically in. he used the 0.0001 chance to get his team out of this situation and the team pulled it off
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
farnham said:
He committed a tactical foul and got punished for it. It's no different than a last man foul.
If Ghana had scored their penalty then people wouldn't be complaining.
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
farnham said:
yep. that's why I said
If Uruguay actually managed to pull a freak world cup win out of the bag, that will go down as football legend.
im not complaining at all. i found it a brilliant move as i said for his team.industrian said:
but there is a difference between last man fouls and this
even in a 1 to 1 situation sometimes the keeper will get the ball or sometimes the striker will not be able to finish
in this situation the goal was practically in.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I'd still think of him as an Epic Douche.industrian said:
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