SuperPac
Member
http://www.mygamercard.net/leaderboard.php
EA's sports games far and away have the lamest achievements.
EA's sports games far and away have the lamest achievements.
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Xbox 360 Achievements are like the greatest things ever...
- Thread starter Baron Aloha
- Start date
Kung Foo Kid
Member
LakeEarth said:
For right now, some give gamer pics which is kinda neat. There is alot of possibilities at least a system is in place for it.
Version 3.0
Member
I thought the points were cool until I realized they have no value on Xbox Live. I thought, briefly, "Hey, maybe if I beat 3 or 4 games, I'll have enough points to download Dig Dug or something." But no, they're worthless.
So they're just to be taken on their own. But they're entirely subjective and only loosely reflect the effort it takes to gain them.
At least the achievments themselves are okay--I approve of games acknowledging that you've accomplished something (at the very least--extra content is much more appreciated). But the online "bragging rights" part is kind of silly, and won't last--the first cheat device to hit the system renders it meaningless.
So they're just to be taken on their own. But they're entirely subjective and only loosely reflect the effort it takes to gain them.
At least the achievments themselves are okay--I approve of games acknowledging that you've accomplished something (at the very least--extra content is much more appreciated). But the online "bragging rights" part is kind of silly, and won't last--the first cheat device to hit the system renders it meaningless.
SuperPac
Member
Leondexter said:
That's if there is a cheat device. Even the Gameshark for the original Xbox was never as full-featured as the previous ones on other systems. It just used gamesaves (were they even hacked?) on a memory card, and the only company that can make 360 memory cards right now is Microsoft. I don't know how the 360 save system works, but if saves are somehow tied to a specific Gamertag it will be even harder to work a cheat device on the 360. You'd have to have some way of editing the Gamertag they're associated with.
Leondexter said:
If you just look at someone's points, the only real thing you can say is if they play a lot or a little. The points are just a very broad snapshot of that gamer. That's why MS created gamer profiles. You can see exactly what achievements they have completed. For instance... http://live.xbox.com/member/JediMike
Not to get off-topic, but IIRC, there was no cheat device on Xbox.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
This whole Unlockables/Achievements battle is nonsense. Amped 3 has a very well structured Achievement system AND gives you unlockable content for every single Challenge (completely seperate from Achievements) you complete. So, if a developer wants to grift the system they will, but don't act like it's inevitable or that somehow this process signals the end of unlockables because this particular game proves that to be patently false.
(And, although this is a different thread it's the same thing with the whole Kameo/Christmas argument. The game has tons of unlockable content, all tucked into that shiny disc you paid fifty bucks for. Aren't there like ten of those Spirit Animals or WTF she uses to punch things and you only start off with three? As far as I can tell, the Christmas thing seems to be a skin for the entire game. Sounds like $2.50 worth of content to me.)
But anyway, as far as Achievements go, I'm on the love train. They encourage you to try out aspects of a game you might not have been crazy about in the first place (PD0 is a great example of this, in that you have to devote a good amount of time to every multiplayer mode, whereas I'd be perfectly happy to play Infection non-stop but after the drive for Achievements opened me up to other modes, I've been enjoying those as well). And when it comes to bragging rights, it took the XBL community all of 18 seconds to realize how flawed the Sports Games were and, like someone else pointed out, in half a second you can "drill into" anyone's Profile and see where they got the points. No one takes the raw number seriously. It's all about where it comes from. Anyone worth impressing with your Gamerscore knows the many ways to exploit it, thus making said exploitation pointless.
(And, although this is a different thread it's the same thing with the whole Kameo/Christmas argument. The game has tons of unlockable content, all tucked into that shiny disc you paid fifty bucks for. Aren't there like ten of those Spirit Animals or WTF she uses to punch things and you only start off with three? As far as I can tell, the Christmas thing seems to be a skin for the entire game. Sounds like $2.50 worth of content to me.)
But anyway, as far as Achievements go, I'm on the love train. They encourage you to try out aspects of a game you might not have been crazy about in the first place (PD0 is a great example of this, in that you have to devote a good amount of time to every multiplayer mode, whereas I'd be perfectly happy to play Infection non-stop but after the drive for Achievements opened me up to other modes, I've been enjoying those as well). And when it comes to bragging rights, it took the XBL community all of 18 seconds to realize how flawed the Sports Games were and, like someone else pointed out, in half a second you can "drill into" anyone's Profile and see where they got the points. No one takes the raw number seriously. It's all about where it comes from. Anyone worth impressing with your Gamerscore knows the many ways to exploit it, thus making said exploitation pointless.
On a lighter note, if any of you are IGN Insiders, you should check out this thread where this kid gets the biggest pwning I've seen in a very long time on a message board.
Those of you who can't see it, he basically made a thread title that said , "Wow, the single player in PGR3 is LAME!!", then he goes on to talke about how he got 87 platinums, and beat the game in 5 hours.
Then somebody posted a link to his gamercard and the guy hadn't even made it past Rank 5 or even made the Gold champion achievement.
This right here makes the online gamercard the greatest invention since the light bulb. No more can little bitch ass punks log on to message boards and talk about how such and such games sucks and they beat it in 2 hours, like Fable back in the day when everyone claimed to have beaten Fable in 6 hours which is a complete load of horseshit. Gamercards are great because now we can verify it and then call people out on their total message board bullshit
Those of you who can't see it, he basically made a thread title that said , "Wow, the single player in PGR3 is LAME!!", then he goes on to talke about how he got 87 platinums, and beat the game in 5 hours.
Then somebody posted a link to his gamercard and the guy hadn't even made it past Rank 5 or even made the Gold champion achievement.
This right here makes the online gamercard the greatest invention since the light bulb. No more can little bitch ass punks log on to message boards and talk about how such and such games sucks and they beat it in 2 hours, like Fable back in the day when everyone claimed to have beaten Fable in 6 hours which is a complete load of horseshit. Gamercards are great because now we can verify it and then call people out on their total message board bullshit
Well you CAN do it on another profile.bill0527 said:On a lighter note, if any of you are IGN Insiders, you should check out this thread where this kid gets the biggest pwning I've seen in a very long time on a message board.
Those of you who can't see it, he basically made a thread title that said , "Wow, the single player in PGR3 is LAME!!", then he goes on to talke about how he got 87 platinums, and beat the game in 5 hours.
Then somebody posted a link to his gamercard and the guy hadn't even made it past Rank 5 or even made the Gold champion achievement.
This right here makes the online gamercard the greatest invention since the light bulb. No more can little bitch ass punks log on to message boards and talk about how such and such games sucks and they beat it in 2 hours, like Fable back in the day when everyone claimed to have beaten Fable in 6 hours which is a complete load of horseshit. Gamercards are great because now we can verify it and then call people out on their total message board bullshit
:lol :lol :lolbill0527 said:On a lighter note, if any of you are IGN Insiders, you should check out this thread where this kid gets the biggest pwning I've seen in a very long time on a message board.
Those of you who can't see it, he basically made a thread title that said , "Wow, the single player in PGR3 is LAME!!", then he goes on to talke about how he got 87 platinums, and beat the game in 5 hours.
Then somebody posted a link to his gamercard and the guy hadn't even made it past Rank 5 or even made the Gold champion achievement.
This right here makes the online gamercard the greatest invention since the light bulb. No more can little bitch ass punks log on to message boards and talk about how such and such games sucks and they beat it in 2 hours, like Fable back in the day when everyone claimed to have beaten Fable in 6 hours which is a complete load of horseshit. Gamercards are great because now we can verify it and then call people out on their total message board bullshit
Not really. One could just not log into live at all..bill0527 said:This right here makes the online gamercard the greatest invention since the light bulb. No more can little bitch ass punks log on to message boards and talk about how such and such games sucks and they beat it in 2 hours, like Fable back in the day when everyone claimed to have beaten Fable in 6 hours which is a complete load of horseshit. Gamercards are great because now we can verify it and then call people out on their total message board bullshit
No Live/No broadband = lie all you want!
Still... :lol!!
truffleshuffle83
Banned
there is no way in hell you can beat the single player in five hours. theres 22 trophies with an average of like 4-5 races for each trophy. not to mention how many time youd have to retry levels on the platinum difficulty. took me like an hour to beat one time vs kudos race :lol
I like showing the achievements you reach in games and giving the acknowledgement and further proof of these achievements. When you really accomplish something difficult in a game - its nice to have this to show for it.
The whole "overall" score thing, though - hopefully people don't put too much into that. First, as some have said - some games are easier to gain points on than others. Second, I don't like the idea of people on Live seeing my card and thinking I'm a "n00b" (and more importantly, treating me differently in an online game because of it) simply because I have a time-consuming job, among other commitments, and can't spend all day racking up points for my card.
The whole "overall" score thing, though - hopefully people don't put too much into that. First, as some have said - some games are easier to gain points on than others. Second, I don't like the idea of people on Live seeing my card and thinking I'm a "n00b" (and more importantly, treating me differently in an online game because of it) simply because I have a time-consuming job, among other commitments, and can't spend all day racking up points for my card.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
There should be a board of people that determine how much each achivement should give points wise if they want this to mean anything. Capping 1000 points per game helps, but still.
Perhaps they could do random polling of users?
Perhaps they could do random polling of users?
truffleshuffle83
Banned
well i think im gonna actually try them with an A class car now. its crazy hard doing it with the F50
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
DopeyFish said:
Not really, i'm sure this idea might piss some users off, but go back and reassign the point values for some of the achivements.
The cheapest way to do it would be to randomly poll users after they complete the achivements to say. Say 1/100 users who complete an achivement.
-The points equaled the achivement
-Needs more points
-Needs less points
After 1000 people are polled, adjust the value and leave it.
truffleshuffle83
Banned
dopey...kick someone of your friends list. i tried to add you but it was full
Kon Tiki said:Well you CAN do it on another profile.
Yes, but now it'll be up to the bullshitters to prove their worthless claims by linking us to the correct profile where they "beat a certain game in under 30 minutes and now they're taking this pos back to EB."
If somebody actually beats PGR3 in 5 hours then they wouldn't have any problems at all linking us to the correct profile where we can see it.
This is true, but if once that person logs into Live, the achievement page will get updated. Most people are too stupid to delete their gamertags from their sigs before they start typing.
If someone doesn't have broadband, then yeah they can still lie all they want, but now most people are gonna take it with a grain of salt.
The reason why this is important is because a lot of opinions about games are formed from whatever Jonny694Life says over at IGN or Gamespot forums. Now we can see if Jonny694Life actually knows what he's talking about or if he's just a message board bot spouting off whatever happens to be the popular opinion of the day.
I read an article where the author compared the achievement points to an MMORPG. Basically, MS wants you to establish yourself in their community by using things like friends lists, XBL, and gamer achievements, so it makes it harder to leave. I never thought of it like that, but I can see the similarities.
Before with consoles, there was no "imprint". You were merely just a gamer and your time invested in a console wasn't really tracked. So if you spent 100 hours on Final Fantasy and decided to play Zelda, your time invested didn't mean anything to you. Now if I spend 100 hours on Oblivion... I have proof of that. That investment is hard to trade off. It now has value.
edit: I also believe that this takes value away from the 2nd hand market. Now a gamer will think twice about trading in a game. They might think... I've still got 4 achievements to unlock, I better hold on to that game.
Before with consoles, there was no "imprint". You were merely just a gamer and your time invested in a console wasn't really tracked. So if you spent 100 hours on Final Fantasy and decided to play Zelda, your time invested didn't mean anything to you. Now if I spend 100 hours on Oblivion... I have proof of that. That investment is hard to trade off. It now has value.
edit: I also believe that this takes value away from the 2nd hand market. Now a gamer will think twice about trading in a game. They might think... I've still got 4 achievements to unlock, I better hold on to that game.
hukasmokincaterpillar
Member
jedimike said:
Wow you're really sold on this huh?
I dunno, I have a feeling when I get on Live this type of stuff will go right over my head. Ive never been a stat junkie, I just play games to enjoy them. Having an "imprint" of play isnt going to enhance that enjoyment. I wouldnt mind having it there, but I just dont see the compulsion you're laying out here. When Ive dropped over 100 hours on Dragon Quest thats not exactly a number I want staring back at my face every time I boot up. :lol
AdmiralViscen
Banned
360 is awesome. Makes me wish I'd wanted one this year.
Cerebral Palsy
Banned
I don't really give a shit what my gamerscore is (if I did hello EA games!), but the achievements have made me finish my games (multiple times). PDZ alone I've beat on Secret Agent, and Perfect Agent. I'm halfway through the game on Dark Agent now. I'm also about to beat the game on Perfect Agent Co-op, and will beat the game on Dark Agent Co-op. Before I got my 360 it was normal for me to get to the last level of a game and never touch it again because I bought something new. Achievements rock and provide people like me (people with ADD) goals to stick with a game. Rock
hukasmokincaterpillar said:
I wouldn't say sold per say... Just intrigued by it all. I didn't think I would be the type of guy who cares either, but I do. It's emberassing to have a crap score in something like Geo Wars, so I find myself trying to get a score that is somewhat respectable. It's also rewarding when you have an achievement that your "friends" don't. Take a game like Hexic... in the past, I would have played it an hour or two and that was it. Now, I got goals. I'm playing it all the time. One of the goals is 100 games. I'm certain I will reach that goal, when I never would have before. There's like this weird internal drive to do it.
It's impressive to me to think about all the potential implications. How it provides something for all parties involved. This isn't concrete stuff... just hypothetical thought processing.
Gamer - makes you want to play the games more
Developer - makes you want to play their game more creatively
Publisher - Gets to sell more games because of the 2nd hand market
Manufacturer - Gets to keep the gamer from "straying"
Someone else got a similar owning in a thread on GAF, but I can't remember where. All I remember is that he said "yeah doing that was easy", and then someone linked his profile. Dammit, what who was that, what GAME was that?!?
And I love achievements still. My only problems is sometimes I get disappointed by some games having some insane achievements. Get to Wave 100 in Robotron? Beat Smash TV on one credit, are you insane?! I mean, major bragging rights if you can do it, but what if no one does it? I currently only got 65 out of the 200 points for Smash TV and I'm fricken proud of myself. Even the guys at the top of the leaderboard don't have half the possible achievement points.
Now even better than achievement points - Leaderboards! Its like having an arcade in your house that thousands of people play. Some of the leaderboards are dumb (Condemned counts amount of time played, whoopdie doo), but the Live Arcade ones are great. I never understood the addiction to Robotron before, but now that I'm 26th on the leaderboards, I'm foaming to play it again to get a higher rank. That's whats awesome about that game, you can always do better.
And I love achievements still. My only problems is sometimes I get disappointed by some games having some insane achievements. Get to Wave 100 in Robotron? Beat Smash TV on one credit, are you insane?! I mean, major bragging rights if you can do it, but what if no one does it? I currently only got 65 out of the 200 points for Smash TV and I'm fricken proud of myself. Even the guys at the top of the leaderboard don't have half the possible achievement points.
Now even better than achievement points - Leaderboards! Its like having an arcade in your house that thousands of people play. Some of the leaderboards are dumb (Condemned counts amount of time played, whoopdie doo), but the Live Arcade ones are great. I never understood the addiction to Robotron before, but now that I'm 26th on the leaderboards, I'm foaming to play it again to get a higher rank. That's whats awesome about that game, you can always do better.
BobJustBob
Member
One of the acheivements for Bejeweled 2 is to get past level 280 in Endless Mode. Like the name suggests, this is the mode in which you can never lose. According to the in-game leaderboard, the top scorer hasn't even made it to level 200, despite having played the game for over 100 hours.
So yeah, achievements are great when there's some thought put into them.
So yeah, achievements are great when there's some thought put into them.
Cerebral Palsy
Banned
LakeEarth said:
SnowWolf. He still hasn't created a black pearl in Hexic
http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=74574&highlight=pearl
Achievements are great because they're short or long-term goals that keep you interested in a game you normally wouldn't be as interested in. Also, the link to past achievements is like pulling up a credit report on someone. If people are bragging about finishing a game, and then you pull up proof that they didn't... it's easy ownage.
bill0527 said:
Ok, but the great thing about achievements is that you don't have to just look at the overall number. You can look at every single game to see who the douchebags are, and who has gotten the REAL achievements like CoD.
I'm 2/3 of the way through CoD on Veteran right now, and I'm a wuss at games, so it's not THAT hard.
Black Deatha
Member
Kasra said:
Uh huh, enjoy D-Day onward, than you'll see.
I agree, I am loving the achievments so far, I have all 970 on Condemned (why didnt they do all 1000?) all 1000 on CoD2 and Kong. I am dissapointed that it was so damn easy to get all 1000 on Kong. It's my hope that this is just more of a launch issue whith devs having not yet fine tuned the achievments and there value. I mean Kong's achievments are retarded, I recieved one for V-Rex anialator (I think that was the one) and it says Kong killed V-Rex's or somethng. But the stupid thing was I got that achievemnt at the end of a level with Jack while that very Kong level was loading!!
I am looking forward to see the achievments is games like Splinter Cell : Double Agent, and abviously like was mentioned Oblivion, though I kinda hope that with Oblivion since it's going to be such a big game that it has more that 1000 points total. Than again they could make most of the points consist of like 1 point here and there for finding certian items or something, :lol
~Black Deatha
Yeah, devs need to work on achieving a balance. Several of the launch games just had achievements tacked on as an afterthought. Kong just handed out 100% for completing the game. Perfect Dark requires you to spend like 50 hours online to achieve a meaningful percentage of the achievements.Black Deatha said:
Ideally, I would say the balance should be about 50-60% for completing the game at normal or higher difficulty, and 40-50% for higher difficulties, special achievements and/or multiplayer achievements.
It also would be nice if the number of points associated with achievements was visible in advance. You can get that information now by comparing to another player who has the achievements unlocked, so it seems silly to hide the numbers initially.
VALIS said:
I don't mean the amount of points, but the distribution.
For instance, I've played more than 10 hours of PDZ single player, and I've yet to gain a single achievement point for it. Kameo, on the other hand, rewarded points for reaching certain areas, and beating bosses. So, in essence, the achievements points are worthless as some games might give them way too easy, while others way too hard, or too focused on the online component.
Spinning Plates
Member
After playing some CoD2 and getting owned by a very good player I decided to check their gamerscore and no surprise then they had 1000 points. They had also fully completed Condemned (970 pts) which takes some doing with all the things you have to find and collect.
What's the highest Gamerscore you have come across so far?
What's the highest Gamerscore you have come across so far?
truffleshuffle83
Banned
kon tiki / inside the hole has one of the highest ive seen, i think hes at about 4000 now