Night Angel
Member
That's concerning.
Hopefully they don't fuck it up.
Hopefully they don't fuck it up.
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Final Fantasy VII Remake is a multi-part series
- Thread starter PhillipCostigan
- Start date
Balmung421
Member
I don't see the problem. Life is Strange proved to me that episodic gaming works. Can't wait to see how this turns out
OK, I know that generally consumers don't really care about how game development works, but if you want to try to understand why they are going this way, I'll try my best.
1- Final Fantasy VII was a full game, they just needed to remake that.
Every remake means taking the original product and improve on areas not possible before. Anyone expecting this as a graphical/audio remake only would be disappointed no matter what. That would be a Remaster. Everything from aspect ratio, gameplay systems, storytelling mechanics, environment assets, locations and so much more were made for a 1997 game with limitations from that era.
Some of these limitations are responsible for specific features in a game. One of the best known cases is how Silent Hill's fog was created to hide pop-in, which was impossible to avoid. But that can go to generic examples which fit any title: divide locations to mask loading and avoid memory issues, camera positioning to hide weird visual glitches and so on.
So a remake is also an opportunity to improve on some of these limitations and also create something new and refreshing.
2- The data size can't be that much. They could fit it in a couple Blu-Ray discs.
FF VII has a lot of unique assets and locations. If you are curious, take the original or one of its ports and see how many unique assets you can find. They were able to do this in exchange of static rendered backgrounds and no voice acting, which are impossible to get away with in a modern AAA game.
3- Final Fantasy XIII Trilogy has content comparable with FF VII and their data sizes weren't as big.
This is a continuation of comment on the second question. It might be true or not (I'm not sure, I never played that trilogy), but from what I've seen, asset repetition is more common. Not that it's a bad thing. I'd say it's impossible to avoid that without going overbudget and getting massive delays. Remember, this is a remake, with fully 3D maps, NPCs and, of course, a bunch of new content. Add to that a fully voice-acted game (with localization) and unique assets everywhere and your costs go way up.
4- They will make me stop playing or cut parts to make it episodic.
They might. If they miss this opportunity. Here's the thing. Every developer I've talked to about this (no one from Square, I should mention) understood this decision. Game development costs today are simply obscene. You add that to a project which turned into a franchise of its own like Final Fantasy VII and they explode.
I see this as basically: make it episodic (or multi-part series, if that somehow means something different) or don't make it at all, because the costs are prohibitive.
And this is also an opportunity for designers and writers to do their job well. Maybe they will stop an episode/part at a scene some of you speculated. Maybe they will create something new to make it fit better. Maybe they will mess up. Maybe they will find the perfect spot to stop and still leave you to explore an area. It is feasible, to say the least.
Making it episodic/multi-part means being able to recoup costs to still have budget to continue the game in this case.
Now, maybe you don't agree it's a good decision. I won't discuss on that because I don't believe in changing opinions. If you don't think it can work, that's OK. I just hope I shed some light on the decision.
1- Final Fantasy VII was a full game, they just needed to remake that.
Every remake means taking the original product and improve on areas not possible before. Anyone expecting this as a graphical/audio remake only would be disappointed no matter what. That would be a Remaster. Everything from aspect ratio, gameplay systems, storytelling mechanics, environment assets, locations and so much more were made for a 1997 game with limitations from that era.
Some of these limitations are responsible for specific features in a game. One of the best known cases is how Silent Hill's fog was created to hide pop-in, which was impossible to avoid. But that can go to generic examples which fit any title: divide locations to mask loading and avoid memory issues, camera positioning to hide weird visual glitches and so on.
So a remake is also an opportunity to improve on some of these limitations and also create something new and refreshing.
2- The data size can't be that much. They could fit it in a couple Blu-Ray discs.
FF VII has a lot of unique assets and locations. If you are curious, take the original or one of its ports and see how many unique assets you can find. They were able to do this in exchange of static rendered backgrounds and no voice acting, which are impossible to get away with in a modern AAA game.
3- Final Fantasy XIII Trilogy has content comparable with FF VII and their data sizes weren't as big.
This is a continuation of comment on the second question. It might be true or not (I'm not sure, I never played that trilogy), but from what I've seen, asset repetition is more common. Not that it's a bad thing. I'd say it's impossible to avoid that without going overbudget and getting massive delays. Remember, this is a remake, with fully 3D maps, NPCs and, of course, a bunch of new content. Add to that a fully voice-acted game (with localization) and unique assets everywhere and your costs go way up.
4- They will make me stop playing or cut parts to make it episodic.
They might. If they miss this opportunity. Here's the thing. Every developer I've talked to about this (no one from Square, I should mention) understood this decision. Game development costs today are simply obscene. You add that to a project which turned into a franchise of its own like Final Fantasy VII and they explode.
I see this as basically: make it episodic (or multi-part series, if that somehow means something different) or don't make it at all, because the costs are prohibitive.
And this is also an opportunity for designers and writers to do their job well. Maybe they will stop an episode/part at a scene some of you speculated. Maybe they will create something new to make it fit better. Maybe they will mess up. Maybe they will find the perfect spot to stop and still leave you to explore an area. It is feasible, to say the least.
Making it episodic/multi-part means being able to recoup costs to still have budget to continue the game in this case.
Now, maybe you don't agree it's a good decision. I won't discuss on that because I don't believe in changing opinions. If you don't think it can work, that's OK. I just hope I shed some light on the decision.
dantevsninjas
Member
I'm calling it now. $60 each. Be careful what you wish for...
Lionel Richie
Member
Yep, something about Dragon Quest that I can't ever explain just puts a big smile in my face.
Even IX.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
A JRPG.
We're talking VII here. It's the most sought after remake and one of the ultimate legacy games, with hugely influential characters. A game btw, that became a huge, massive hit, and single handedly put JRPGs on the map in the West, in a market that previously was lukewarm to the genre at best. Not just "A JRPG. "
You give treat this project right with development, and give it real, proper marketing, and it'll compete with any AAA game today.
Pinko Marx
Banned
Only square.
More like a Tranquilizer.
Life is Strange Episodes came out within a single year. If they could do that with FF7 they wouldn't be releasing them in an episodic format.
Obliterator
Member
Life is Strange and FFVII have zero in common in terms of pacing or game mechanics.
NightShift
Member
Bye bye world map.
I'm not too upset by this. As long as they are about to recapture the heart of the game, it can be a linear as it wants to be. I just hope SE plans out the releases of each episode accordingly.
I'm not too upset by this. As long as they are about to recapture the heart of the game, it can be a linear as it wants to be. I just hope SE plans out the releases of each episode accordingly.
It's pretty much the big unknown for me really that prevents me from saying if this is a good or bad decisions (beyond saying at least it's understandable).
Midgar itself is pretty linear so no real problem here. Once you leave it you have access to the overworld, but really you're still in an "A -> B" scenario most of the time (which in the context of episodes could easily be done with big zones with side shit similar to the game). Problem will really be the last part and how it'll tie in with the airship. That would be a huuuuge let down for me if the game went "nope can't go back to any of these locations"
DangerMouse
Member
Agreed. It'll all come down to the details.
If you saw that trailer, you'd know that they are. They are clearly giving it a ton of resources for it to look that good.
f*uk no! Not a FFX or XIII again!!! Good lord!
Absoludacrous
Member
It really won't. It would most likely hit normal large scale Final Fantasy numbers. Which is high, but not high enough to justify what people want out of it.
Amen. Before this was said I don't recall ANYONE suggesting or hoping that the goddamned game would be diced up and sold to us in small pieces. Now all of a sudden they pull this bullshit and they have defenders everywhere swearing that there is no alternative to such an approach. As if the advancing technology of the last 20 years means nothing, and that somehow as time has progressed, remaking FF7 has strangely become impossible.
I swear, if these studios don't like the Angry Joes and Jim Sterlings, why the fuck do they work overtime giving them suuuuuch prime material to work with breh? Shit is crazy.
Size doesn't tell you everything. Xenoblade X is big, sure, but it also has only one city (if I've understood correctly), not all that much story to go through & is mostly just about MMO-ish monster hunts & fetch quests in those big environments. FFVII remade in the fidelity of what we've seen is a completely different beast. For one, it's far more story-driven. Even just re-creating every discussion/cutscene in FFVII is a far more massive job than all of Xenoblade X. Not to even mention the fact that the setting of FFVII is a whole planet with far more unique locations than Xenoblade, made even more daunting a task by assumption that they'd actually need to expand all of those locations considerably because a modern game can't just be all "run for 10 seconds -> loading screen -> next area; run for 10 seconds -> loading screen -> next area", but dungeons & cities & overworld areas need to be more connected, seamless.
Obliterator
Member
I mean how is open exploration on the world map and doing side content at your own leisure gonna fucking work when its chopped to pieces?
We're aware this is how it works.
That's kind of why it was a big deal when it was announced. The simple fact that it couldn't be done. Any asshole studio can release FF7 in tiny chunks, but an honest-to-goodness remake would be HUGE.
Aeriscloud
Banned
I'm sure they will, but no one who has been wanting this to happen for well over a decade will be able to wait for a complete box set.
My main concern is that the game will end up being a linear experience devoid of a world map and mostly comprised of Kingdom Hearts style environments that feel less like actual towns, cities, and real environments, and more like themed battlefields.
I haven't played many episodic games that allow much in the way of seamlessly backtracking into areas of previous episodes. I'm also worried that the whole "unique experience" thing in that each part could be handled as differently as they were with FFXIII I, II, and III.
Sure, maybe it won't be as bad as I fear, but with S-E's track record, I remain bothered by this news.
You realize that Final Fantasy VII sold about half as many units in its nearly 20 years on the Market as Skyrim did right? Fallout 4's first day shipment was greater than FFVII's worldwide LTD sales prior to the PC re-release.
The top games didn't sell nearly as well in the PS1 era as they do currently, and JRPG sales have been static at best.
Suzushiiro
Banned
$60 each is fine if each part has as much content as most other $60 games out there these days. Which would be pretty easy to do considering how much is in the original work.
Is this old or new? Do I even want to know?
Thanks for the information.
Hibiki Kurosawa
Member
Is this them thinking they'll try to make as much profit off this as possible, or them thinking they'll have trouble making a profit so they devised this. If it's the latter, then they should think again.
kitchenmotors
Banned
This post needs to be quoted again.
Honestly, this decision pisses me off as someone who has been a huge fan of FF7 since it came out. This is not what I wanted, at all.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
Yeah, it looks amazing.
But, what about content? What about keeping up that level of care from start to finish? I hope it all turns out for the best.
Why, cause the market doesn't really care for JRPGs as much? Like it didn't when VII first came out and became a gargantuan hit?
So the overall gaming audience (who aren't all necessarily JRPG fans) has grown. VII was the first JRPG for a massive chunk of its fans, so it's not like it can't be a crossover or breakthrough hit.
lifeexpectancy
Member
Are you kidding me with this nonsense? It's a remake. Not a sequel. If it's a eholly different game, title it as such and market it as such. If it's titled "FF VII Remake" it should BE FF VII Remake, not a "wholly different game".
Give me a fucking break. Posts like that are a marketer's wet dream.
Then you'd complain that they cut content.
Don't do it at all. Fans have been clamoring for this remake since the PS2.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
I really don't understand the crying and hyperbole in this thread.
No, shhhh. Let's whine and make things up with absolutely zero supporting evidence.
three_muffins
Member
....and cash more? FF7 Remake...be ready to pay 60 .....er....120 ......errr 180 for the complete game. :/
super-famicom
Member
And I still continue to consider Squeenix as dead to me.
Camp1nCarl
Member
Let's be honest, all the chapters will be full priced and then there will be an additional Season Pass for $59.99 for new costumes and other cosmetics/boosts.
Absoludacrous
Member
See kswiston's post. Being Final Fantasy 7 in 1997 is an entirely different beast than being Fallout 4 in 2015.
