-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Eurogamer: NX = portable w/ carts, detachable controllers, Tegra, TV Out, no BC, Sept
- Thread starter Wollan
- Start date
- Status
I mean I think this is a 3DS replacement and not some magic PS4 in a 5 inch 4k screen but if there's one thing the NX does not need and which we know will fail it's old ports. A company launching a game in 2016 would immediately cancel out support for a 2017 system.
All things considered equal.
Still so good. Makes zero fucking sense at times, but... still so good.
Agent Unknown
Member
I'm by no means on team SMD at this point (at least regarding his stance on powe, ect) but this sounds kind of sensationalized. What do you mean by "mercifuI"? "Merciful" as in they were fired but as a compromise NOA decided they didn't have to face any legal consequences from their employee agreement? And as others here have said NOA surely didn't need SMD's help to figure out who it was, the marketing budget was like a big "Here I am!" sign with flashing lights pointing to the floor they were on.
Spyder_Monkey
Banned
Malo's post not a wrong assumption to make, it's just not indicative of any assumption.
DerekOfTheDykes
Member
Yeah, this doesn't really mean anything. Considering that, if Eidos has devkits, they likely only got them earlier this year, it was never really an option.
All the NX needs to have western third party AAA support is for it to have a large enough install base, enough power to run the game in question in some form, and is relatively easy to port to.
If the NX hits 20-30 million units and is easy to port to, it will get the western third parties. Even if Ubisoft and Activision half-ass the launch window, if NX sells well they'll all pay real attention.
For every excuse that was given for lack of support for Wii U, the ultimate problem was that the install base was too small to justify the cost of a port given the relative difficulty of porting to Wii U.
If you mean Western 3rd parties, I totally agree. I expect plenty of JP support, though.
So what was the argument again? Something about this SMD guy claiming its an AMD chip and not Nvidia? I really don't feel its worth arguing at this point considering we don't even know anything official about the NX except claims by Eurogamer/Digital Foundry and even that feels like stretching it.
D
Deleted member 465307
Unconfirmed Member
I stand by my post on that website. 1) It would be Wii U all over again if NX got a port of a game 7 months after it launched as its 3rd party support. Given the original release date of February, planning for NX then would be even weirder. 2) The odd response to the second question makes me think the game isn't entirely ruled out and NX could get the Director's Cut/GOTY version like Wii U did. Not saying it will, but I'm saying that weird response makes me think it's not off the table.
For launch NX needs your typical large scale dev support from Ubi/EA + strong first party titles + one or two third party western exclusives.
This breeds the opportunity for publishers like Eidos and more to support the platform in the future. Right now the majority of western devs who aren't in touch with Nintendo need that reassurance that the platform is worth their investment.
This breeds the opportunity for publishers like Eidos and more to support the platform in the future. Right now the majority of western devs who aren't in touch with Nintendo need that reassurance that the platform is worth their investment.
BluePikmin11
Member
That's not much of a substantial response man. :/
What's the entire situation right now with SMD?
It's not worth rehashing or explaining as it's off-topic for this thread.
DerekOfTheDykes
Member
"Merciful" as in, the consequences could have been far worse than they were.
I don't really want to fight over everyone's belief that NOA didn't need help. I know for a fact they wouldn't have found the source without SMD. Simple as that.
Call it sensationalized, but the point is more that SMD's word is completely worthless. He doesn't have any sources. If he did, somebody would have knocked on his door again, and he would have given them up and deleted half of his website and youtube channel again.
EDIT: But yeah, I do want to get back more on topic. To tie back in, right now the only WORTHWHILE thing we have to go on is what we've heard from Eurogamer, which may be accurate but may be incomplete or slightly off. I really just wanted to clarify that SMD is so untrustworthy as to be basically guaranteed to be making things up if he claims to have sources.
And I would expect not to hear anything major until Nintendo decides to reveal it.
You've been here longer than me. SuperMetalDave is Trevelyan9999 on NeoGAF. He just doesn't seem to come here anymore after that leak occurred and a terrible one at that for using no discretion since there was plenty of time to think of what to do with it.
Probably
Usually our goods from China take 35 days to arrive in Europe by boat. If the Chinese NY will end around mid February (I didn't check yet) goods would arrive just in time to be distributed around the end of the last week of March more or less
You're making things complicated, when I said that pre-production vould have started. Volume production of actual retail packaged units is what I'm saying wouldn't start until ~4 months before launch.
is the hot chip presentation related to https://youtu.be/5GOZjlwIwfk
Agent Unknown
Member
Here we go again with the age old "If the install base reaches X units the third parties will come!" spiel. People like Reggie are the ones who normally resort to that Kool aid as a post launch talking point, come on. Western or not, any third party who has even a semblance of real interest and confidence in the system's appeal both to them and their user base would be planning at least a few ports now if they really thought it might be worth their time and resources at any point.
So why spend discussing about it instead of...that Hot Chips event that was suppose to be up right now?
In fact, was there any big announcement? I can't seem to find any news nor tweets about it.
You have the wrong followers on twitter. Give it some time, they will soon see the light
(I hope)
Agent Unknown
Member
Kind of what I figured, thanks for being willing to clarify. And as you said it's clear at this point that was SMD's only real source.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Kirbyfan is right--months old ports on this system would be a terrible idea, just like they were on Wii U. The games absolutely bomb and all it does is give third parties an excuse not to support the system. If I were Nintendo, I'd try and work it out where new ports only were released.
The details on Parker leaked hours ago and that was basically all we were expecting from Hot Chips. New details on what parker is gives us insight into what NX could be
There is no difference in terms of contents between pre production and production, just quality and safety assestments to be done
So I am not making anything complicated, considering that my initial post was related to the possibility that the Foxconn rumor of a psp - like device could be related to NX and that they are probably ready to enter the production phase (so no chip development still up in the air)
If they still are in the prototyping phase in September they will miss the march dead line for release simple as that
Btw, as you prefer.
DerekOfTheDykes
Member
Because it's true. One can hardly blame western third parties, or ANYONE for that matter, of being skeptical of Nintendo right now. So it should come as no surprise that many don't have projects planned even if they have devkits.
I mean, sales alone won't do it, but a sufficient install base, combined with a feasible input method, the right amount of power, and a porting process that doesn't throw brick walls up left and right, and as a business you have no reason NOT to support it.
Despite what Reggie says, the Wii U was NEVER going to get all those third party titles. It probably wasn't powerful enough to run even toned-down versions of many of them, and from what we understand the porting process would have been difficult. Those hurdles aren't worth even ATTEMPTING to overcome for a small install base.
Sales alone aren't some silver bullet. But a lack of install base IS one of the major hurdles, along with things like power and ease of porting.
EDIT: What this means is, Nintendo's first party efforts, as well as titles from eastern third parties, will probably make up most of the system's library to start. That will certainly find it success in Japan (assuming nothing is terribly off-putting about the console itself), but that will need to also build up the right size install base in the west to really see third party support. The required size of that install base is probably a soft number, heavily influenced by the power of the system and how easy it is to port to. Look at the Vita, after all!
Agent Unknown
Member
And how many of those ports weren't watered down specifically due to third parties' perception of the system and its user base like Dead Space Extraction and the later Madden games with 'toonish graphics? I'm talking on-par ports.
So then, you believe that volume production for the XboneS began in January or sooner? And would this also apply to phones?
Hm, true. Bad example.
Don't forget Takashi Mochizuki from WSJ unless his sources turn out to be shit. He first reported on the hybrid device last year although it was described as a handheld used in conjunction with a console.
His recent article last month then changed the wording to a hybrid because this was according to his source.
Yesterday he reported about the PS4 Neo and PS4 Slim which he got from sources so he definitely has his insiders considering Eurogamer confirmed that leaked PS4 Slim as real. (Unless someone spent money and effort to engineer a PS4 Slim which would have been more than 3D printing a smaller PS4 with the original's internals inside it. lol)
First of all the game comes out tomorrow, why would they be developing it for a system not announced?
Secondly they didnt even do the Deus ex HR DC WiiU port it was Straight Right games, if Square wanted a port, they would go to them again
Thats the point though. They literally put in work to downgrade just because the wii had a huge install base. If its got a decent install base and it runs the games while being easy to port to, there's literally no reason it wont get western 3rd party support.
DerekOfTheDykes
Member
Well, to put this more in line with my position, I'd argue that much of this is because the Wii was significantly weaker than it's competition and it's primary control method didn't have simple 1:1 button mapping with the other systems.
I mean, let's go back to Dead Space. You can't just cut that to 480p and put it on the Wii. Did the system even have enough processing power and memory to run that game as it was designed? And sure, we could find a way to map the controls onto the Wii Remote and Nunchuck, but reworking to a pointer is clearly not the same as a simple 1:1 controller port with two sticks, a dpad, four face buttons, and four shoulder buttons.
So, in that case, the Wii DID get a lot of third party support. While they weren't often the same games, that's an example of the system getting in the way of the third parties. So they supported it, but more often with different versions or spinoff titles due to it not being easy to straight port titles (see Dead Rising: Chop til you Drop).
Basically, while it might sound like I'm saying "SALES WILL DO IT", I'm really trying to argue that it's a more complex issue and that there are many factors that can impede development. From what we understand of the X1 that is supposedly in the devkits, it should be powerful enough to run versions of many titles, and it isn't very difficult to port to. So, if that is all assumed (and you know what they say about assumptions) the biggest wall left is the size of the install base.
EA has to put at least 1 version of Madden on NX, they have to put it on every console at least once since they have NFL exclusive rights, which is why Madden came on WiiU and 3DS at launch, but they never put another one out.
LordOfChaos
Member
Pourquoi?
Father_Brain
Banned
You're missing any acknowledgement of audience demographics here.
Back in 2012, before the system even launched, third parties were shooting down potential PS3/360 ports to Wii U left and right, and it's very hard to believe that was solely about hardware architecture.
WTF.
James Scott
Banned
Made considerably better with parallel universes in Mario 64
I dont know. When the S launched? I am not that updated on that product :/
Plus, you dont have to count the two/three weeks of interruption due to the Chinese NY if they dont happen during the production phase neither so...
Do you really think that the mass production of such a complex electronic product takes few weeks from moulds opening, spare parts purchase, pre production shot, QA and SA, and WW shipments?
That sounds pretty strange to my ears, considering how timings for my company works for electronic goods mass produce and shipped in EU from China
Didn't know if WCCFTech links are allowed. (GAFs banned link list just keeps getting weirder, so I'd rather not risk it.)
It was just a summary about the Hot Chips Nvidia conference and how it details Tegra Parker. It seems like a good fit for gaming but Nvidia never mentions anything about it as such.
netgrimoire
Member
This!! That and shitty party games.
yes ( I doubt I am the first either...)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=214626720&postcount=14851
It launched a couple of weeks ago. And this would also apply to phones, correct? So phones start full production at least 6 months in advance, right? Because that would be kinda impossible for the iPhone 6S last year since the full ramp-up for 16nmFF+ only started in August last year. I also don't know where you're getting " few weeks" from. I'm just saying that full production ramp-up doesn't start until 3-5 months before launch.
DerekOfTheDykes
Member
You're right, I did miss that, sorry.
I mean, I agree that the western third parties are probably naturally uninterested in Nintendo. That's their default at this point. But if the Wii U had been easier to port to, and sold maybe twice as much as it did, we would probably be looking at a lot more third party support than it had.
And if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle. But you know.
Dark Cloud
Member
Wow, where is all the NX info I was promised today! Lol joking
Like I thought , Nintendo runs on their own timeframe. 4 days of the week left! You have to wonder if they do a digital event, then they may not announce it until a week prior in September. I have my doubts they would do something that didn't allow media to get to come to some kind of Iive event thing though.
Like I thought , Nintendo runs on their own timeframe. 4 days of the week left! You have to wonder if they do a digital event, then they may not announce it until a week prior in September. I have my doubts they would do something that didn't allow media to get to come to some kind of Iive event thing though.
Silent_Ocarina
Member
Wow, I feel really bad for that source. As far as NX goes, SMD didn't really leak anything meaningful to us. The most relevant we've received so far probably comes from the Eurogamer report as well as Takashi Mochizuki. Even with what we've been given, I feel there are certainly many unknowns about NX. When I look at the bigger picture, I feel like we don't really know that much about it at all. I'm looking forward to hearing more, but personally there isn't enough information on it for me to really decide if I think it's a good idea or device yet. I definitely don't expect anything substantial from the Hot Chips event. I feel that we've gotten all that we're going to get until the reveal.
The original source updated with some details from the Q&A after the hot chips presentation.
- Graphics performance at least 50% greater than X1 1.5 TFlops (presumably that's FP16)
- They answered yes to a question about potential applications of the chip for VR/AR
- Graphics performance at least 50% greater than X1 1.5 TFlops (presumably that's FP16)
- They answered yes to a question about potential applications of the chip for VR/AR
So probably roughly ~768 GFlops (FP32).
- Status