PleaseDontBanMe
Banned
Life isn't fair sometimes
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Tekken 7's Leo referred to as "he" on official site, had boobs in last game
- Thread starter MrCookiepants
- Start date
There are a lot of contradictory statements regardless if it was just the localization team making up stuff or if the character was trans in japan too.
Doesn't help that the joke in Captain Rainbow about "undeniable proof of their gender" is that the item (a vibrator) actually doesn't mean anything.
I think it's pretty much the best guess to say at least one member of the species is trans.
LordKasual
Banned
Yeah, her name is Elenore. Everyone know's she's a woman at this point.
Whether or not she has made a conscious opposite gender decision though is not established. Unless they're establishing it for her in this game, which i guess is okay? It's definitely a "with the times" decision though, because it never felt like they designed her with this in mind back when she was released.
Leo's gender has always seemed like a character quip of sorts. Like Bob being fat as hell but moving like a Ninja. Or Bridget in Guilty Gear being male, and identifying as a male, but everyone think's hes a girl. It's never brought up as a big deal until it's played as a joke, but it doesn't seem like a big deal to Bridget himself.
Which is why it's a bit odd that this kind of designation would be done on the webpage of the game, instead of in the actual game itself.
But I guess Tekken has made passive progressive changes to itself in the past (TTT2's beautiful decision to make everyone speak their own language instead of English), so if this is the path they're going, i guess its fine. In this case though, it's just a bit cheap.
R_thanatos
Member
I guess that means that :
-It's a different leo
Or
-Someone changed the timeline
Or
-She's got a special body that changes gender every couple of months ?
-It's a different leo
Or
-Someone changed the timeline
Or
-She's got a special body that changes gender every couple of months ?
It would be funny if it's number 3
They got a vampire that inflates it's tits after drinking blood....why the hell not.
SomedayTheFire
Member
Or they're transgender/genderfluid
LordKasual
Banned
What I am fond of here is how Leo's gender is explicitely not made a big deal in the game. He or she doesn't go around telling everyone what they identify as. It's not made the defining trait of the character, never played as a joke, and that shows an understanding of how to deal with this issue in a tasteful manner.
Perhaps something changed during Tekken Revolution because she didn't have any swimsuit costumes unlike the other female characters.
Or
-He is gender-fluid
Or
-He is explicitly a transgender man who doesn't care to get surgery
You guys don't need to make this more complicated than it is.
Prototype Viktor
Member
R_thanatos
Member
Guys , i have nothing about transgenders but maybe you should ease up and accept that some people can have fun with other ideas.
NOFUNALLOWED.jpeg
The n00b Avenger
Member
He said Leo was 'originally thought up as a woman'. There's a distinction between Leo's current status and his/her status when they were first creating the character.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0M4Xx7RoDQ
It's clarified here around 21:15 where someone asks about the announcement linked above. While originally intended to just be a woman, when they finished the design and saw how it came out neutral, they changed their minds and decided to present Leo as a gender neutral character instead.
Interestingly enough, around 24:00 he talks about the English pronoun problem of he and she and how things like that can change depending on the perspective of whoever happens to be writing at the time.
WTF.
Eolz
Member
Or
- the website has mistakes in
Or
- it's a terrible japanese joke
Or
- Harada is trolling you
Did anyone ask Harada yet btw?
MrCookiepants
Member
Yeah, in-game at least it's been handled well. Definitely something I'd like to see more of.
Please explain.
Garou
Member
History has taught me that I don't trust English official sites that have the pre-order button as their most prominent feature with lore-related stuff regarding Japanese fighting-games. That stuff is even in Japanese usually very subtle, so there is quite a good chance that the editors for a website just go with whatever seems plausible on the surface. For me nothing's canon that is not inside the game itself.
Toni
Member
Cyber Caesar
Member
Namco should expand on the Steve Fox, Emma, Leo connections.
TriAceJP
Member
Harada spoke on it years ago. She was designed as a gender fluid character so people would play her without having to worry I'd they were playing a boy or a girl.
She was later revealed to be a female. Her story and dialogue make no gender reference.
Tekken 7 hasn't changed anything.
There are two sex's male and female. I can identify as a 90 year old woman, does not make it true and most likely infers a mental illness.
Adam Prime
hates soccer, is Mexican
This thread:
"Oh he changes his gender back and forth? That's so progressive!"
"Oh he changes his gender back and forth? That's so trollish!"
"Oh he changes his gender back and forth? That's so progressive!"
"Oh he changes his gender back and forth? That's so trollish!"
Prototype Viktor
Member
4 post since 2013
MrCookiepants
Member
Adam Prime
hates soccer, is Mexican
But does Leo know what he wants? Or rather, Namco?
I think that's the issue. What's Namco's intent here?
starchild excalibur
Member
If new players to the series - or people who haven't been following this character's saga - read official wording that the character is a "he," then this attempt at representing a gender-fluid character may be undercut by people's confusion.
If Leo was born biologically female, but identifies as male, it'd be nice if they included it somewhere within the actual bio of the character within the actual game. You can't just assume that everyone who plays this game has been following what members of the dev team have said outside the context of the game.
It's also one thing to design a character where people don't have to worry about them being male or female, and another thing to be coy about who a person is. If he's gender-fluid, then let's not hide that fact or relegate that info to interviews. Depict that person's identity unequivocally within the construct of the game and let's move on.
NinjaCoachZ
Member
Are there two sexes? How does that explain the various types of intersexuality? By definition, the fact that there are people born with reproductive anatomy or have hormonal makeup that is neither 100% "female" nor "male" disproves the idea that there are only two settings people can be born in. Even aside from that, sex is physical true, but gender (i.e. the expression aspect of things) is purely social. Gender norms as we know them are purely an invention of society that's not based on our biology, so there's nothing saying we have to subscribe to a certain set of characteristics or expressions purely because of our physical makeup.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Dimitri LH
Member
Nevermind that gender identity conflicts can probably be considered a type of intersex condition when you get down to it, with a brain that developed more like the opposite sex's.
Though people shouldn't be disparaged for identifying otherwise even if that wasn't the case.
Human Trashcan
Banned
This is such shit. This is the developers making no actual effort towards representation or diversity, but rather just doing "whatever" and letting the player fill in the blanks while getting credit for being so "progressive". Because it's vague enough that whatever interpretation you choose can be valid. Pure cowardice.
Acerac
Banned
I find it amazing that people seem to set up accounts just for shit posts like that.
All of these people in this thread. One of them can't understand something. Who has the mental illness?
NinjaCoachZ
Member
Oh absolutely. Intersexuality is basically just an umbrella for a whole variety of conditions. It and gender as a whole are a whole spectrum, really. It's quite beautiful when you get right down to it.
Yeah, I agree. Bamco have done a pretty good job at handling Leo, which is impressive considering Leo was created before discussion of trans and gender issues really became mainstream. I always figured though that Leo was genderfluid or simply non-binary; I figured if Leo was trans they would wear a shirt or a binder with their swimsuit but hey, who knows.
You are not long for this world, playa.
yanipheonu
Member
Localization can be... crude in handling ambiguously gendered characters.
C.Olimar788
Member
I hope it's an actual progressive step rather than just a joke, but I'm not counting on it. Leo could easily be genderfluid or DFAB, based on the info in this topic.
The Artisan
Member
the only man that can't go topless is bob
Saharah is also male in JPN Animal Crossing.Localization can be... crude in handling ambiguously gendered characters.
TheSpoiler
Member
Poor lost soul, you are looking for 4chan!
Try saying this on your real account.
Likely so they can voice their true feelings without repercussions. Same reason bigots hide behind anonymity online, spouting the most vile garbage they can while avoiding any actual backlash. They feel safe and protected. Cowardly, naturally, but it shows that their words and ideas are just as fragile as their egos, since they have to hide/mask themselves.
Ganryu is topless and super hot!
TriAceJP
Member
capylikesgames
Banned
I'll admit, the slightest genderfluid representation in games makes my day. Though I'm always wary, because most end up primarily joke characters. For example, Leo could be a "what's their gender? haha, you'll never know!" type of character, rather than "here's a genuinely genderfluid character". I can't say this for sure because I've never played a Tekken game, but it does happen. Granted, as long as the devs are tasteful, I have no issues. It's always nice to know rep for us is out there, even if the devs aren't doing it for our sake.
This thread has been surprisingly okay, except for a few of these. Here's something to help you be more informed.
