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Microsoft will provide more TV-like advertisements through XBox Live

O

OldJadedGamer

Banned
Vane_MagicCity said:
I seem to get by just fine without having my devices advertise to me. You must have been gameless last gen since none of the consoles advertised to you.
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None of them did because the tech wasn't there to do it. Once the tech was there companies started to and it wasn't limited to just MS. People forget that Sony put ads in games on the loading screens doubling load times before you could play again.

It will be interesting bumping these old threads when next gen launches.
 
R

RukusProvider

Banned
Vane_MagicCity said:
I seem to get by just fine without having my devices advertise to me. You must have been gameless last gen since none of the consoles advertised to you.
Click to expand...

I actually was a Pc gamer since online was non existent or very poor.

Until the dashboard upgrade that brought in party chat, even my 360 collected dust. After that I gave up on the PC while waiting on the PS3 to step up. Never happened.

As of today, as my personal life continues to be more busy, I'm quite thankful in the manner in which Live has evolved. If Live today was the same as the beginning of this generation, pretty sure I'd be done with gaming.
 
J

jaypah

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
Nice snip, you're not very honest are you? I never said HAD to pay $60. Just forget it, you are purposely ignoring my point and snipping quotes because you can't debate honestly.
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Instead of double (or triple) posting, just use the edit feature to add to your last post until someone else makes a post.
 
S

see5harp

Member
njean777 said:
They can just do it like the ps3 and have ads in the store itself, not all over the place on the dashboard.
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They could do that but why would they? NXE was cleaner and simple but they are trying to consolidate Windows 8/Windows Phone 7/360 UI's while at the same time creating something more friendly for kinect controls. The way you access core gaming functions both in and out of game HAS NOT CHANGED.
 
V

Vane_MagicCity

Banned
OldJadedGamer said:
None of them did because the tech wasn't there to do it. Once the tech was there companies started to and it wasn't limited to just MS. People forget that Sony put ads in games on the loading screens doubling load times before you could play again.

It will be interesting bumping these old threads when next gen launches.
Click to expand...

I didn't know Sony did that, I'll look into it, it sounds like a shitty thing to do.
 
njean777

njean777

Member
see5harp said:
They could do that but why would they? NXE was cleaner and simple but they are trying to consolidate Windows 8/Windows Phone 7/360 UI's while at the same time creating something more friendly for kinect controls. The way you access core gaming functions both in and out of game HAS NOT CHANGED.
Click to expand...

Cuz I pay for it and want it that way? I should have the option of turning off the ads.
 
V

Vane_MagicCity

Banned
see5harp said:
They could do that but why would they? NXE was cleaner and simple but they are trying to consolidate Windows 8/Windows Phone 7/360 UI's while at the same time creating something more friendly for kinect controls. The way you access core gaming functions both in and out of game HAS NOT CHANGED.
Click to expand...

It seems pretty obvious that Microsoft has done exactly what Nintendo did, they abandoned core gamers to cater to casuals via motion controls. I am waiting for that to hit home with people because Nintendo certainly caught hell for it.
 
N

NullPointer

Member
RedNumberFive said:
It was on a singular game (Wipeout), I don't think it's fair to compare it to an OS level epidemic.
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And wasn't it removed after a shitstorm customer feedback? I remember pestering the hell out of them to remove it or refund my game purchase. Haven't played it in some time though.
 
R

RedNumberFive

Banned
NullPointer said:
And wasn't it removed after a shitstorm customer feedback? I remember pestering the hell out of them to remove it or refund my game purchase. Haven't played it in some time though.
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Last I checked it was gone, so can we put this to rest? To compare it to the 360 dash is disingenuous at best.
 
O

OldJadedGamer

Banned
RedNumberFive said:
Last I checked it was gone, so can we put this to rest? To compare it to the 360 dash is disingenuous at best.
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The point was that now that the tech is in place they can do stupid shit like this now where they couldn't last gen. Just because Sony removed the ads on the loading screens now doesn't change that they tried to get away with it in the first place and actually put it in a game. MS is just getting away with it looking at sales of memberships and sales of the machine.

Vane_MagicCity said:
People complained, advertising removed and it hasn't happened since. Shitty thing to do but gamers reacted correctly and won. How will it play out with Microsoft, will they remove the ads when people complain?
Click to expand...

How long have people been complaining and have sales reflected these complaints? Huge companies listen to one thing.
 
njean777

njean777

Member
see5harp said:
But you don't pay for it...I mean it's pretty obvious that you have no idea what you are taking about in relation to how the 360 works.
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Wait, so my 60$ doesn't go to playing online? Then what am I paying for, thin air? I was answering your question of why, I know how the 360 works I had one and my friends have them, they are all ad ridden.
 
James Sawyer Ford

James Sawyer Ford

Member
My 360 is just used for exclusives so this isn't that big of a deal to me, regardless it definitely sucks for those that actually pay for Xbox Live and use their 360 as a primary device.
 
V

Vane_MagicCity

Banned
OldJadedGamer said:
The point was that now that the tech is in place they can do stupid shit like this now where they couldn't last gen. Just because Sony removed the ads on the loading screens now doesn't change that they tried to get away with it in the first place and actually put it in a game. MS is just getting away with it looking at sales of memberships and sales of the machine.



How long have people been complaining and have sales reflected these complaints? Huge companies listen to one thing.
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Well, I can tell you that I am not paying another penny for Live and I am not buying another 360. I haven't bought Kinect and I don't forsee that changing. In fact, if my son didn't love the damn thing, I would be trading it in for a PS3, today, while they are still on sale.

My complaining comes with a little bite.
 
J

jaypah

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
It seems pretty obvious that Microsoft has done exactly what Nintendo did, they abandoned core gamers to cater to casuals via motion controls. I am waiting for that to hit home with people because Nintendo certainly caught hell for it.
Click to expand...

No need to wait, just go into any Kinect thread, E3 conference thread or sometimes just a MS thread in general. They always devolve into how shitty and casual MS has become. It's not a taboo topic.
 
S

see5harp

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
It seems pretty obvious that Microsoft has done exactly what Nintendo did, they abandoned core gamers to cater to casuals via motion controls. I am waiting for that to hit home with people because Nintendo certainly caught hell for it.
Click to expand...

I don't think MS has abandoned any of the hardcore by supporting a peripheral. It's an option that doesn't change a lot for the people using controllers. The mini game collections may trouble you but MS seems to be spending more money than ever publishing games on XBLA targetting their core audience.
 
V

Vane_MagicCity

Banned
see5harp said:
I don't think MS has abandoned any of the hardcore by supporting a peripheral. It's an option that doesn't change a lot for the people using controllers. The mini game collections may trouble you but MS seems to be spending more money than ever publishing games on XBLA targetting their core audience.
Click to expand...

The control scheme of the Metro UI being designed around Kinect is more than simply supporting the peripheral. Now if those of us without Kinect could go back to the NXE that would be fine but we can't.
 
S

see5harp

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
The control scheme of the Metro UI being designed around Kinect is more than simply supporting the peripheral. Now if those of us without Kinect could go back to the NXE that would be fine but we can't.
Click to expand...

NXE was a lot cleaner but you stating that "MS has abandoned the hardcore" is so melodramatic. When MS studios stop publishing games like Trials and third parties stop releasing games like The Witcher 2 then I'll start worrying about software that appeals to me. The dashboard getting Metroed isn't some landmark event that we will remember 10 years from now as the death of gaming on MS platforms.
 
V

Vane_MagicCity

Banned
see5harp said:
NXE was a lot cleaner but you stating that "MS has abandoned the hardcore" is so melodramatic. When MS studios stop publishing games like Trials and third parties stop releasing games like The Witcher 2 then I'll start worrying about software that appeals to me. The dashboard getting Metroed isn't some landmark event that we will remember 10 years from now as the death of gaming on MS platforms.
Click to expand...

Let me put it another way. The Wii UI was designed around motion controls and now Microsoft has done the same thing. Fair?
 
F

Fjordson

Member
Don't think I've ever opened any of the apps named in that article since I've had a 360.

If HBO GO is affected, then I'll be irked.
 
E

Eusis

Member
Fjordson said:
Don't think I've ever opened any of the apps named in that article since I've had a 360.

If HBO GO is affected, then I'll be irked.
Click to expand...
EDIT: Wait, I'm dumb, and was thinking of how it's behind the Gold gate. Still, if HBO or Netflix have ads then what the hell?
 
F

Fjordson

Member
Eusis said:
EDIT: Wait, I'm dumb, and was thinking of how it's behind the Gold gate. Still, if HBO or Netflix have ads then what the hell?
Click to expand...
If those two have ads then that's lame as hell.

The dashboard ads have never really bothered me. I put the disc in, press A, and the game boots up. But video ads in those apps would get annoying. Would much rather just watch HBO GO/Netflix on my iPad or PC at that point.
 
K

KageMaru

Member
upJTboogie said:
I don't see why it would carry less weight if they are defending their position well. A fanboy is a different story.

It would depend on what parts of Live they are criticizing, if it's putting more ads on a paid console service or what they lock out, that would be different from talking about performance issued when they never used it.
Click to expand...

If you're biased, your a fanboy. Right there the agenda removes any credibility they may have.

Either we're talking about different people or you think it's fine to bitch about things that don't effect them.

Crewnh said:
I've never subscribed and only used free months and trials. Does that make my criticisms invalid?
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No because you have experience with the service. =P Besides, I only said there's a chance someone's criticism is less valid.

Really though, would you take someone serious if they had no experience with a product or service?

njean777 said:
Cuz I pay for it and want it that way? I should have the option of turning off the ads.
Click to expand...

I agree we should have the option to turn them off. However, we haven't had the option since day one, so why expect it now?
unless you're just looking for a reason to bitch of course ;p
 
njean777

njean777

Member
KageMaru said:
If you're biased, your a fanboy. Right there the agenda removes any credibility they may have.

Either we're talking about different people or you think it's fine to bitch about things that don't effect them.



No because you have experience with the service. =P Besides, I only said there's a chance someone's criticism is less valid.

Really though, would you take someone serious if they had no experience with a product or service?



I agree we should have the option to turn them off. However, we haven't had the option since day one, so why expect it now?
unless you're just looking for a reason to bitch of course ;p
Click to expand...

I didn't like it from day one that I wasn't able to turn off the ads, that is why when I got a ps3 I stopped paying for live. The only way I ever had it after I got my ps3 is if my family got me a card for christmas/birthday. Other then that I havent paid for it since I got my ps3.
 
U

Uno Venova

Banned
KageMaru said:
If you're biased, your a fanboy. Right there the agenda removes any credibility they may have.

Either we're talking about different people or you think it's fine to bitch about things that don't effect them.
Click to expand...
I said criticize, not bitch.

I said one sided, not biased.

Biased implies an unfair stance, not what I said, not what I thought you meant when you said one sided.
 
S

see5harp

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
Let me put it another way. The Wii UI was designed around motion controls and now Microsoft has done the same thing. Fair?
Click to expand...

Sure but it's also about synergy between their platforms like iOS has done with their lines. I just don't see that as a major shift in their target audience. Like I said the way you actually use the core features of invites messaging have been unchanged since launch.
 
T

teh_pwn

"Saturated fat causes heart disease as much as Brawndo is what plants crave."
spawn031 said:
I don't want to live on this planet anymore. We're already overpaying for the current ads, now we just get more :(
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I use steam, Netflix, and directv dvr mostly. Other than everyone having a macbook air and it being in the script for no relevant reason, there aren't ads.

And diet coke. Weeds is all about peddling macs and diet coke.
 
njean777

njean777

Member
upJTboogie said:
Looking at most of the other products I use, I think MS is on their own with this one, Apple, other consoles, and Steam don't do this. I wonder how GFWL is.
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I agree with this, Only MS does this crap. Which is why I dont support them on the console front.
 
AgentP

AgentP

Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
see5harp said:
I don't think MS has abandoned any of the hardcore by supporting a peripheral. It's an option that doesn't change a lot for the people using controllers. The mini game collections may trouble you but MS seems to be spending more money than ever publishing games on XBLA targetting their core audience.
Click to expand...

They are spending money how? They take a huge cut from the profit, sure, but what are they investing? Are they paying for development? Are they advertising XBLA game on TV now?

A few XBLA and the yearly Halo/Fable/Forza game is not really catering to the hardcore when they spend much of their internal development and marketing on Kinect. I'm sure it will be better next gen ;)
 
S

SeanR1221

Member
I really can't stand the "MS abandoned us!!" attitude.

That's why I've been playing Mass Effect 3 and The Witcher 2, along with Trials and Fez.

I'm so abandoned guys!
 
S

see5harp

Member
AgentP said:
They are spending money how? They take a huge cut from the profit, sure, but what are they investing? Are they paying for development? Are they advertising XBLA game on TV now?

A few XBLA and the yearly Halo/Fable/Forza game is not really catering to the hardcore when they spend much of their internal development and marketing on Kinect. I'm sure it will be better next gen ;)
Click to expand...

I assume by publishing titles they are financing them to a certain degree. I don't know details but there are a ton of XBLA games coming out this year. Why are you winking at me like I'm trying to twist the truth? Do you really think I'm dying for games that appeal to me? I haven't even finished ME3, Trials Evolution, Witcher 2, or Fez. You are acting like the Vita is my only system.
 
U

Uno Venova

Banned
SeanR1221 said:
I really can't stand the "MS abandoned us!!" attitude.

That's why I've been playing Mass Effect 3 and The Witcher 2, along with Trials and Fez.

I'm so abandoned guys!
Click to expand...
When they say that I don't think they mean the software you can get anywhere else, more so what the console is providing you can't get anywhere else.
 
D

Dabanton

Member
Vane_MagicCity said:
It seems pretty obvious that Microsoft has done exactly what Nintendo did, they abandoned core gamers to cater to casuals via motion controls. I am waiting for that to hit home with people because Nintendo certainly caught hell for it.
Click to expand...

Whenever i see those terms my eyes roll back but we'll play along for now.

You have a 360 right? Switch it on and tell me with a straight face MS have abandoned the 'core'.

Last time i checked there were plenty of 'core' games available on the 360. MS unlike Nintendo actually cater quite well to both 'Core' and 'Casual' in fact it's more weighted onto the 'core' side of things.
 
V

Veezy

que?
Enjoying XBL isn't a bad thing. There's nothing wrong with stating that it is, factually, a superior service to PSN on PS3 (and whatever excuse for online Nintendo has). I don't believe anybody here that is frustrated with MS is saying that XBL isn't a solid service.

However, as has been explained, XBL is primarily a P2P multiplayer and friend list service. Complete with party chat, voice mail, cross game chat, and friend lists. While these are great, MS is obviously milking their customers. Charging for P2P gaming, to begin with, is pretty outlandish (as it's existed for free since the onset of PC gaming). However, they've included ads, at least since the 360, upped the price once, without distinguished new feature, added for pay avatar clothing, and are now including TV advertisements in already pay for services.

You, supporters of MS, are more than welcome to state that you will continue to happily pay the asking price, or whatever you're paying through online deals etc., for the service that MS offers. I have to believe, though, that stating that this isn't a blatant money grab and insulting to XBL customers is just ignoring the evidence.

Microsoft is couple hundred billion dollar company. You're allowed to call them out on their shit. Stop defending them. You're the customer. They need you, it's not the other way around. Then again, I'm sure, for most of you, they could hike the price up to ten per month and you'd excuse that as "who pays that much, AMIRITE?!" and believe that's not an issue either.
 
F

Fjordson

Member
upJTboogie said:
When they say that I don't think they mean the software you can get anywhere else, more so what the console is providing you can't get anywhere else.
Click to expand...
To be fair to his post, 360 is the only console Witcher 2 is on, and Trials Evo and FEZ are XBLA exclusives.

(I get your point in a broader sense, though)
 
G

GorillaJu

Member
It's a very common practice - establish a huge audience on good will and service, then really monetize when they've become reliant on it. Microsoft has never even been coy about stuff like this. From the beginning it was clear that the Xbox brand was a Trojan horse.

Sony isn't an angel, they're just inept at exploiting, which works out for the consumer.
 
C

coldfoot

Banned
odd_morsel said:
It's a very common practice - establish a huge audience on good will and service, then really monetize when they've become reliant on it. Microsoft has never even been coy about stuff like this. From the beginning it was clear that the Xbox brand was a Trojan horse.
Click to expand...

Apple and Google aren't bombarding their smartphone/tablet customers with ads. Not even on their STB devices. There are some companies that tend to avoid things that will piss off their customers. MSFT has never been such a company throughout its history.
 
N

NullPointer

Member
Veezy said:
Then again, I'm sure, for most of you, they could hike the price up to ten per month and you'd excuse that as "who pays that much, AMIRITE?!" and believe that's not an issue either.
Click to expand...
That's how I see it. Its too late for many people to question their (in some cases significant) investments in the platform. And of course for some they have no choice regardless (money/space/time) to explore alternatives so they have to make do.*

The walled garden seems like a land of infinite wonders until you hear the portcullis drop behind you.

* Of course others love the service as is or have no problems with it. Fair enough.
 
S

Speedymanic

Banned
coldfoot said:
Apple and Google aren't bombarding their smartphone/tablet customers with ads. Not even on their STB devices. There are some companies that tend to avoid things that will piss off their customers. MSFT has never been such a company throughout its history.
Click to expand...

And, who, outside of a few crazed forum goers are pissed off about the ads? Why is the Gold userbase apparently increasing if people hate those ads?

You and others might hate them, but in the grand scheme of things, MS doesn't care about what you and a vocal minority think, they care about the majority think, and all evidence points to them not caring about the ads.

You do know that both Apple and Google sell your data onto advertising companies, right? All your browsing history, purchase history, etc is sold to ad and various other companies. That, in my opinion, is much worse.
 
M

Mr_Zombie

Member
Speedymanic said:
And, who, outside of a few crazed forum goers are pissed off about the ads? Why is the Gold userbase apparently increasing if people hate those ads?
Click to expand...

Because that's the only way to play online on Xbox? Duh.

Why can't you understand that people stay with Gold/Xbox overall because at this point they are hooked to the thing. It's not like you can simply say "fuck you MS", sell the console, sell all your games (what about the collection of DD only games?) and change the platform of choice. Oh, and convince all your friends to do the same thing. Right now Microsoft can do whatever it wants because this late into console generation it is unlikely that someone would switch the platform. Whether users like the changes or not, most of them will stay. That doesn't mean those users can't bitch about ads covering most of the screen in the OS.
 
T

TheOddOne

Member
AgentP said:
They are spending money how? They take a huge cut from the profit, sure, but what are they investing? Are they paying for development? Are they advertising XBLA game on TV now?

A few XBLA and the yearly Halo/Fable/Forza game is not really catering to the hardcore when they spend much of their internal development and marketing on Kinect. I'm sure it will be better next gen ;)
Click to expand...
This has to be the biggest spin I have ever read. Yes, they have payed for development of titles and yes they have promoted them via commercials. Just because you avoid that information, doesn't mean you're right.
 
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