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Playtonic removes JonTron from Yooka-Laylee.

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G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
They could either act or not act.

Not acting was beginning to draw attention to the degree that it had to be addressed.

Acting got them what they have now.

This was a forced hand.
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No it was not. That's absurd. If they were worried about the response then why would they choose the more violent one? That's absurd.

Edit: the reaction now is far more hateful and intense. You can't say their hand was forced into choosing what is obviously the option with the more hateful and intense reaction
 
M

Maengun1

Member
Sparrowhawk said:
I'm sure plenty of you have already seen and/or shared, but goddamn...

9905989998.jpg


The fact that this is showing up in my newsfeed and that people think that blatant racism is just a "different political view" is just blowing my mind right now.
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loool these people are so dumb. Basically RIP playtonic's social media for the next 3 months. You can literally copy and paste these identical comments after every ~~~controversial~~~ racist gets kicked out of something
 
M

Ms.Galaxy

Member
Tadaima said:
They could either act or not act.

Not acting was beginning to draw attention to the degree that it had to be addressed.

Acting got them what they have now.

This was a forced hand.
Click to expand...

Mhmm...

Or, you know, the devs saw the racist, bigoted bullshit Jon said and thought to themselves, "Hmm, maybe having such scum being associated with us isn't a good idea." Just a radical idea, I know, but maybe they were actually disgusted by what Jon said.
 
L

LinLeigh

Member
Tadaima said:
People were digging up old statements and attempting to link them to racism, bigotry, etc. Not just on GAF, but elsewhere, such as on Twitter. Everywhere Yooka-Laylee was discussed, they were being asked for action.

The far right should be condemned, but we shouldn't turn a blind eye to the very reason Playtonic acted. Had there not been an overblown reaction to JonTron's inclusion, they likely would have tried to play it down and wait it out rather than risk botching the launch.

Playtonic was given no choice but to put themselves in front of the masses and face the far right directly in the eye.

It is shitty that this happened to them through no fault of their own. That is my point here.
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"Don't crucify a young person over 1 stupid remark"

People proceed to proof that it wasn't just a mistake.

But then people get told not to dig for dirt. Looks like we can't win.

For many years people have said not to worry about Internet culture. Young people are just trolls and try to rile you up.

Well guess what this was not true. It has allowed terrible world views to fester.

Now we have people saying that we have to be nice to the scumbags because we might alienate them even more.

Perhaps it is time we show that these things aren't acceptable in modern day society.
 
T

TetraGenesis

Member
Ms.Galaxy said:
Mhmm...

Or, you know, the devs saw the racist, bigotted bullshit Jon said and thought to themselves, "Hmm, maybe having such scum being associated with us isn't a good idea."
Click to expand...

This is IMPOSSIBLE.

No person in America would ever willingly disavow themselves from hate, racism, and xenophobia unless they were pressured into it!
 
F

FlutterPuffs

Member
All Jon Tron has to do is to take a few minutes to self reflect and check the tweets of the fans who is supporting him.

That's all it can take to see where exactly you stand.
 
T

Tadaima

Member
LinLeigh said:
"Don't crucify a young person over 1 stupid remark"

People proceed to proof that it wasn't just a mistake.

But then people get told not to dig for dirt. Looks like we can't win.

For many years people have said not to worry about Internet culture. Young people are just trolls and try to rile you up.

Well guess what this was not true. It has allowed terrible world views to fester.

Now we have people saying that we have to be nice to the scumbags because we might alienate them even more.

Perhaps it is time we show that these things aren't acceptable in modern day society.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying we should be nice to the bully.

We just shouldn't bother provoking him, lest we desire his attention.

Playtonic are smart guys. I know one of them personally from an old writing gig. They clearly don't agree with the views of JonTron and his hateful following. But to so publicly stand up and make themselves a target of hate so close to such a carefully curated launch is stupidly of the highest degree. They did this not out of goodwill and standing up for a cause, but out of pressure to act.
 
M

Mechazawa

Member
FlutterPuffs said:
All Jon Tron has to do is to take a few minutes to self reflect and check the tweets of the fans who is supporting him.

That's all it can take to see where exactly you stand.
Click to expand...

Who needs to do that when you have an army of racist nutrests tripping over themselves to defend you?

Dig in and get that idiot manchild money, baby. Worked for Colin.
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
I'm not saying we should be nice to the bully.

We just shouldn't bother provoking him, lest we desire his attention.

Playtonic are smart guys. I know one of them personally from an old writing gig. They clearly don't agree with JonTron's and his hateful following. But to so publicly stand up and make themselves a target of hate so close to such a carefully curated launch is stupidly of the highest degree. They did this not out of goodwill and standing up for a cause, but out of pressure to act.
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This does not makes sense, the pressure to not act is much more intense. If they were bowing to pressure then they would've said nothing. They made their own choice. They did not blame others and they do not need you to blame others for them
 
B

Bastables

Member
Tadaima said:
I'm not saying we should be nice to the bully.

We just shouldn't bother provoking him, lest we desire his attention.

Playtonic are smart guys. I know one of them personally from an old writing gig. They clearly don't agree with JonTron's and his hateful following. But to so publicly stand up and make themselves a target of hate so close to such a carefully curated launch is stupidly of the highest degree. They did this not out of goodwill and standing up for a cause, but out of pressure to act.
Click to expand...
So don't act against racist because you'll hated by racists...... this should always be the paramount variable otherwise racist pressure will be brought to you.

Maybe we should keep in mind the line, 'I don't fight fascist because I'll win. I fight them because they're fascists.


Remember the racist blow back due to having a female and black lead in the force awakens, fuck racists and their mewling.
 
N

Nanashrew

Banned
Pressure to act, pressure to not act, pressure in general. It's kind of the nature of the entertainment business. It's not something any business wants to have to deal with but there comes a time when you have to regardless of timing. There are veterans working in Playtonic and I'm sure they understand this and they chose to do something.
 
T

Tadaima

Member
Bastables said:
So don't act against racist because you'll hated by racists...... this should always be the paramount variable otherwise racist pressure will be brought to you.

Maybe we should keep in mind the line, 'I don't fight fascist because I'll win. I fight them because they're fascists.
Click to expand...
You should pick your battles wisely. You don't go to war before you are ready, unless your hand is forced. We are literally days away from launch. The timing couldn't have been worse.
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
None of that, from the far right, existed before Playtonic publicly stood up.
Click to expand...

What are you even talking about? You're saying this reaction doesn't count as 'pressure' to act? Why aren't they giving in now? If they were 'forced' by the tepid response before why are they unmoved by this harrasment now? You're not making sense
 
T

Toxi

Banned
Tadaima said:
I'm not saying we should be nice to the bully.

We just shouldn't bother provoking him, lest we desire his attention.

Playtonic are smart guys. I know one of them personally from an old writing gig. They clearly don't agree with the views of JonTron and his hateful following. But to so publicly stand up and make themselves a target of hate so close to such a carefully curated launch is stupidly of the highest degree. They did this not out of goodwill and standing up for a cause, but out of pressure to act.
Click to expand...
So you speculate Playtonic did something you think is stupid because of public pressure against it... Because of public pressure.

Seems legit.
 
S

SMD

Member
Tadaima said:
You should pick your battles wisely. You don't go to war before you are ready, unless your hand is forced. We are literally days away from launch. The timing couldn't have been worse.
Click to expand...

Hiya mate, when's good to stand up to racism and bigotry?
 
T

Toxi

Banned
Tadaima said:
You should pick your battles wisely. You don't go to war before you are ready, unless your hand is forced. We are literally days away from launch. The timing couldn't have been worse.
Click to expand...
I just want to remind you that the offensive thing Playtonic did was... Dropping a voice actor. From a Banjo-Kazooie clone.

...

Why would any legitimate fan give a fuck?
 
T

Tadaima

Member
SMD said:
Hiya mate, when's good to stand up to racism and bigotry?
Click to expand...
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
 
L

llehuty

Member
Ermmm, maybe people at Playtonic weren't ok with being associated with his ideas, so they decided to remove it, and took the risk becaise they puth higher sticking to their ethics and moral values instead of prioritizing making more money (or less, who knows).

I personally wouldn't be ok with pandering to racists.

I wasn't thinking of buying the game, but now maybe I will.
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...

It wasn't forced. You're still not making sense. Why are they not giving into the harassment now? Seriously explain it to me because it makes no sense at all
 
B

Bastables

Member
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...
Yeah their hand was forced by a racist outing himself.
 
M

Ms.Galaxy

Member
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...

Or they are people who don't want to be associated with someone literally spouting White Supremacy rhetoric. Again, just a crazy thought. What Jon said isn't a matter of opinion, but a dangerous ideology that breeds hate and fear, an ideology that has led to multiple genocides of innocent people because of their differences. You really think they want to be associated with that?
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
Because they stand for it?

They were forced to show with whom they identify.
Click to expand...

What force?! So me any force here. They aren't blaming other people so why are you? You're saying they only stuck up for their own values because of public pressure? That makes even less sense. No one forced them into making a statement, no one else is responsible for their actions.
 
C

Complex Shadow

Cudi Lame™
KojiKnight said:
Dude is almost 30... If anything he'll only continue to double down on this. Why learn or grow when your audience is literally encouraging you to stay the course.
Click to expand...

maybe cuz his audience is probably half is age and he should set and example. but yea I agree, I doubt he will do that.
 
F

FlutterPuffs

Member
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...
There's the problem again. If you only fight against racism when it's convenient.

With these guys, they'll do fine. What happened was against a group of fuccbois who will still play the game anyway. Even if there was a boycott, the result will be minimal.
 
A

Admiral Woofington

Member
I don't think their hand was forced by Neogaf, but forced by an affiliation or by a higher up who may have spoken with head of PR of something. Forced as in, let's say it now vs waiting.

I just hope this shit only lasts for a week or two at most. I wish them all of the best. It's all speculation anyways, it just breaks my heart to see these attacks on them
 
T

Toxi

Banned
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...
You respect Playtonic so much you call their decision stupid and assume they are acting against their own interests without any confirmation.
 
M

Mechazawa

Member
Tadaima said:
We always should.

But these men and women are at the pivotal moment of their careers. They have spent years working towards this single moment. Their futures depend upon it. Standing up and making themselves a target of that hate at this pivotal moment is as honourable as it is outright stupidity.

Again, unless their hand is forced.
Click to expand...

It's interesting that you're so much more concerned about Yooka Laylee potentially not being a hit with fans of a racist than you are with the developer lowkey shipping their game with content featuring said racist.

Unless you wanted them to rip out his inclusion and for them to tell no one prior to launch, which would have been worse.
 
T

Tadaima

Member
Ms.Galaxy said:
Or they are people who don't want to be associated with someone literally spouting White Supremacy rhetoric. Again, just a crazy thought. What Jon said isn't a matter of opinion, but a dangerous ideology that breeds hate and fear, an ideology that has led to genocide multiple times of innocent people because of their differences. You really think they want to be associated with that?
Click to expand...
They were called out. They eventually responded after the pressure mounted.

Nobody at Playtonic wanted to be a target of this hatred. Their focus right now is on launching the game they have spent years creating. They cannot risk having to shut down their social media at this moment.

Hence they would not want to bring this upon themselves, unless forced.
 
C

CannonFodder52

Member
Admiral Woofington said:
I don't think their hand was forced by Neogaf, but forced by an affiliation or by a higher up who may have spoken with head of PR of something. Forced as in, let's say it now vs waiting.

I just hope this shit only lasts for a week or two at most. I wish them all of the best. It's all speculation anyways, it just breaks my heart to see these attacks on them
Click to expand...

I don't think their attention span is long enough to last more than a week or two.
It is unfortunate timing though.
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
They were called out. They eventually responded after the pressure mounted.

Nobody at Playtonic wanted to be a target of this hatred. Their focus right now is on launching the game they have spent years creating. They cannot risk having to shut down their social media at this moment.

Hence they would not want to bring this upon themselves, unless forced.
Click to expand...

How is it that the comments before are 'force' but the comments now aren't? Why are you not saying they're being 'forced' by the current harassment? Why would they not give in to it now?

Edit: you're really arguing against yourself. How can you say the 'force' before was so intense they had to act but what's happening now is clearly much worse for them. How is that not 'force'?
 
S

Spring-Loaded

Member
Admiral Woofington said:
Honestly chances are if Dunkey revealed what he really thought he'd be in the same camp of many youtubers of hating 'SJWs' and wanting to say whatever he wants to say without being called out on it, but at least he has been smart enough to not go to twitter and start talking politics.
Click to expand...

What gave you the reason to think that of Dunkey in particular?

If you don't, why do you believe YouTubers are, in some way, inherently against responsibility for what they say? Why do you think this mentality isn't just a fringe case? The perceived ephemerality of YouTube success requiring them to all band together no matter what?
 
T

Tadaima

Member
Admiral Woofington said:
I don't think their hand was forced by Neogaf, but forced by an affiliation or by a higher up who may have spoken with head of PR of something. Forced as in, let's say it now vs waiting.
Click to expand...
I think this likely is the case, given the way developer-publisher relationships work. There would have been discussions at Team17 before the action was taken and this statement was put out. But those discussions would have been triggered by increasing concerns about the way the public was (incorrectly) perceiving them.
 
N

Nanashrew

Banned
I barely saw any force on Playtonic. When I saw that one freelancer someone posted a link to much earlier in the threat, screenshots there were just 5 people total asking Playtonic about JonTron in Yooka-Laylee.
 
G

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
Tadaima said:
I think this likely is the case, given the way developer-publisher relationships work. There would have been discussions at Team17 before the action was taken and this statement was put out. But those discussions would have been triggered by increasing concerns about the way the public was (incorrectly) perceiving them.
Click to expand...

So why aren't they concerned about the harassment now? Why be so concerned about the weaker reaction? It just doesn't make sense at all.

Edit: And why are you spending so much time trying to call out people here? If you care so much about them why are you ignoring totally the current harassment going on? Why not call out the people who are actually trying to directly harm them?
 
A

Admiral Woofington

Member
Spring-Loaded said:
What gave you the reason to think that of Dunkey in particular?

If you don't, why do you believe YouTubers are, in some way, inherently against responsibility for what they say? Why do you think this mentality isn't just a fringe case? The perceived ephemerality of YouTube success requiring them to all band together no matter what?
Click to expand...
No, more like I've been seeing so many of my favorite youtubers revealing themselves to be against the supposed SJW culture more than anything. I've just grown cynical that the guys I love/loved have mostly turned out to have these backward beliefs. If Dunkey doesn't then hey, happy to be wrong. All I'm saying is that at the very least he has been smart enough to keep any opinion away.
 
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