lastplayed
Member
Yeah, like in the first few Trek movies.
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Star Trek Discovery - official trailer in OP, 15 episodes ordered, premieres 9/24
- Thread starter Jackpot
- Start date
Yeah, like in the first few Trek movies.
Hot new infographic courtesy of TrekMovie. More uniformity at the [Great] Link below.
http://trekmovie.com/2017/06/22/a-close-up-look-at-star-trek-discovery-uniforms-infographic/
I like it, one thing that always bothered me about star trek is they went on away missions in what looked like dress uniforms. The shoes especially was bad for terrain, it's wonder there weren't more fucked up ankles.
Fluffernutter Pancake
Member
Looks more like Star Trek than any of the movies since the Abrams reboot. About time.
You just know that the art direction and costume people on this show were sitting around in meeting rooms, rubbing their hands together in anticipation of getting their shot at designing official Federation stuff and saying to each other, "And ANOTHER thing that's always bothered me about the way they handle uniforms is..."
The attention to detail and the way they've tried to make things a little more practical for a rough n' ready galaxy just screams typical fan arguments were people argue all the details until they've got it worked out in their head to satisfaction about how "it oughtta' be."
I think it should be like that....to a point. There should be a dude who sits in the corner reading a newspaper and when they shout out something stupid he will just say "Nope" and that would be the end of it
Octavianus
Banned
Me too. I was initially a bit put off by most of the things shown in the trailer, including the uniforms, but they've really grown on me. I think they might actually be my new favourite Trek uniforms.
That's a good point. I've liked most of the uniforms on trek but that always bothered me as well. These look far more practical.
BrokenFiction
Member
Why Star Trek: Discovery Was Delayed Multiple Times
http://www.treknews.net/2017/06/20/star-trek-discovery-delay-reason/
http://www.treknews.net/2017/06/20/star-trek-discovery-delay-reason/
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Are they saying it was delayed multiple times because of the art direction?
That's an interesting angle to take
That's an interesting angle to take
Like Damar's fateful line, the Discovery news keeps on keepin' on. Don't expect the show to shy away from considerable interpersonal conflict between its human characters.
Plenty more at the link.
Yeah, I don't uh... I don't entirely buy it, heh. But I'm not surprised that it factored, at least.
Plenty more at the link.
Yeah, I don't uh... I don't entirely buy it, heh. But I'm not surprised that it factored, at least.
I don't buy that one bit. It sounds like a backhanded way of defending their current art direction by saying "we put a ton of effort into this and this is what we settled on".
Fuller leaving wasn't an art direction but an likely a overall creative one. I've been hearing the go around about the contention between creative and CBS executives and Netflix ripping their hair out over the multiple delays since they're handling international distribution.
Adding rank detail to the badges doesn't look as pronounced as rank insignia on the uniform cufflinks or pips around your collar. I always thought the TOS Starfleet insignia showing divisions was a nice detail but it was the color of the uniforms that bought that out. Even the Wrath of Khan era uniforms, while, a bit too formal looking (but the best IMO) were all red but had an expanded colors for the collars (white, red, green, gold) + Kirk's admiral's unform had an obvious gold trim the other uniforms didn't. Subtle but actually the most balanced ranking uniform (maybe along with the First Contact-style admiral's uniform + the future Janeway one ... which was kind of inspired by both the TNG and TOS Trek films)
whyamihere
Banned
Nope. That's not the word at all.
The Elite
BOSS
Uh Huh.
Good stuff. Relieved to see that they're embracing the serialized approach. Viewing habits have changed a lot in 12-15 years, so the dreaded "We have to ensure that new viewers just tuning in to this week's episode aren't lost" consideration is no longer a big deal. Once TV accepted the fact that it could actually be like novels, in the sense that the stories could be longer, more drawn out, and work like chapters rather than self-contained short stories, dramatic TV really took off and showed what it could do better than a two hour movie.
I'm very interested to see how they approach the Roddenberry mandate of having better, more evolved humans, but still bring in the politicking, in-fighting and personal clashes that make human relationships such good TV when it blows up in people's faces.
Octavianus
Banned
That is great news. You can tell ds9 and some later stuff was already shying away from that rule but it was still there and I always thought it was dumb as fuck.
I feel like it's fine if they deviated from Roddenberry's rule about interpersonal Starfleet officer conflict, but I'd prefer it if that didn't comprise the brunt of the conflicts on the show. Trek has played fast and loose with that rule from TNG onward. For example in DS9 you had O'Brien and Bashir not getting along for the first 2 seasons. It was a running thread that actually took center stage for a few episodes.
I'm mostly curious about how far they're willing to take it. Bashir and O'Brien was just a simple matter of two people with different personalities clashing a bit in some areas. But I wonder if this means we'll get stuff like actual "office politics" of whether they'll stay away from that. Like bridge officers back stabbing each other to get a promotion, or corruption in higher levels of starfleet for profit or power. The kinds of things we--unfortunately--read and hear about every day in politics or corporate hijinks. Like if you get some bridge officers deliberately sabotaging another person's efforts just to make them look bad, possibly get them demoted and then maneuver themselves into a better position, that'll be a very different--possibly much more depressing--take on humans and how far they've come.
This takes place before Kirk's time and closer to the more turbulent era of human interstellar conflict so I'm totally okay if the drama between officers goes in to the extent of what you described. In previous Trek shows, if they wanted to explore that kind of backstabbing drama without any kind of mind-control scenario, they'd introduce a new character to upturn the status quo, but he/she would be gone in the span of one episode.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Even in TNG, you get a couple of episodes about Riker being seen as a failure for staying as a commander, so stuff like ambition and mobility is still there. Shelby basically comes on the Enterprise looking to steal Riker's job during the Borg incident.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I don't know if "art direction" is a valid excuse... but Star Trek up until Enterprise was cancelled was something of a well-oiled production machine. Ever since TNG there was always a Trek series in in the pipeline. The sound stages, standing sets, and art departments were always in motion.
Starting up Trek for TV again from scratch does sound like it would quickly become complicated, if one wanted to preserve the franchise's history of elaborate sets and wardrobes. Not to mention a universe of props all designed to look as if they came from the same place.
Starting up Trek for TV again from scratch does sound like it would quickly become complicated, if one wanted to preserve the franchise's history of elaborate sets and wardrobes. Not to mention a universe of props all designed to look as if they came from the same place.
Even more from Entertainment Weekly, it seems.
http://trekcore.com/blog/2017/06/new-hints-about-star-trek-discoverys-storyline/
http://trekcore.com/blog/2017/06/new-hints-about-star-trek-discoverys-storyline/
Ohh my. Well that is the opposite of what I wanted to hear. Now it's going to be a bunch of whining.
CW Trek, ugh....
I actually went back to the shows because I was tired of petty bullshit between characters in other shows. It's like the creators are in my head fucking with me.
Well seeing as how Enterprise very much went in that direction and failed, I really don't know if that approach is going to work. A few years ago I might have agreed, but now, I don't think you mold Trek to the audience, you let the audience adapt.
Looks like both about to let the choppers do the talking
Oh, whoops. I thought someone linked that pic earlier. Guess not.
Anyway, it's the Shenzhou's transporter room. The Shenzhou's an older ship than the Discovery. It brings the noise and the funk. We'll see what Discovery's looks like, but the press is talking up stylistic differences between the two ships and even that vague background shot of the Discovery's bridge in the Lorca reveal pic seems to validate that.
I like this weird transporter room, though!
Anyway, it's the Shenzhou's transporter room. The Shenzhou's an older ship than the Discovery. It brings the noise and the funk. We'll see what Discovery's looks like, but the press is talking up stylistic differences between the two ships and even that vague background shot of the Discovery's bridge in the Lorca reveal pic seems to validate that.
I like this weird transporter room, though!
Succinct Verbosity
Member
It could be possible that the Discovery staff are retconning a lot of Enterprise. When the show runners were asked what they thought of Enterprise they described it as "troublesome". I can believe transporter tech being too advanced for the time may be a thing they are looking into. Perhaps these are the first transporters to experimentally transport life forms in large quantities.
https://twitter.com/karterhol/status/877261300530806785?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Ftrekmovie.com%2F2017%2F06%2F20%2Fted-sullivan-dishes-on-discovery-drama-star-trek-villains-kirks-death-and-more%2F
https://twitter.com/karterhol/status/877261300530806785?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Ftrekmovie.com%2F2017%2F06%2F20%2Fted-sullivan-dishes-on-discovery-drama-star-trek-villains-kirks-death-and-more%2F
whyamihere
Banned
Guys.
A writer on the show = not the showrunner.
Showrunner = head writer on the show.
Ted Sulivan = writer on Discovery
Gretchen Berg + Aaron Harberts = showrunners
Succinct Verbosity
Member
My apologies. All the same, I do find the views of a writer for the show interesting.
I was not aware of this, actually, as I still haven't seen Enterprise. I've just hit the seventh season of Voyager, and will probably start up on Enterprise in a few weeks, as I usually watch one or two episodes every day. Only finally got around to wrapping DS9, which I hadn't seen in its entirety earlier in the year.
I'm curious now to see how the acting and character dynamics are in Enterprise if it really is more troubled than the past Star Trek series characters.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
Enterprise had a season long arc at one point and mini arcs in the final season, both of which are considered to be the turning point for the show (for the better). In most instances, Trek was gradually moving towards serialisation with Deep Space 9 and that had a hugely positive reception. It was the episodic nature of Voyager and Enterprise's early seasons that lead to franchise fatigue.
Absolutely, and thankfully we don't live in 2001 anymore, TV shows have never been more readily available than they are now, and shows are binge watched in a couple sittings by some. Thankfully this is going to be on the biggest streaming service everywhere but the US, people wont have to worry about missing episodes or keeping up, they can watch or catch up whenever they like, or watch the whole thing when its finished.
Game of Thrones being a more notable show of recent time that has done wonders for tv in that people want a more concise and smaller seasons with less padding episodes, characters that we can follow and watch grow for years to come, and I'm hoping we get that from Discovery. I don't need almost exactly the same story with different paint like we would get across TNG, DS9, and Voy to make up episode counts, give me a good story arc across a season that has some real stakes.
Zoe
Member
Oh?
Himynameischris
Member
Season 3 and parts of 4 of Enterprise are pretty great in my opinion. It's not better than the best of TNG/DS9 because the characters don't hold up to that standard but the story arcs are really well done.
Yeah. The arcs are great. I like T'Pol and Phlox a fair bit but overall the ENT cast is the weakest of the five. There's just not nearly enough focus on strong characterization, which is kind of a must for me in order for a show to join the pantheon of my favorites. But Seasons 3 and 4 are fantastic anyway.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Eh, the strength of Star Trek is to be a vehicle to tell classic science fiction stories.
It's why the most memorable episodes are ones where the Doctor finds out his entire crew is dead and long gone, or where Data is put on trial to determine if he's a sentient being. Even DS9's memorable episodes involve resets, like the one where they wipe out their own descendants or the one where Jake grows old after his father dies.
It's why the most memorable episodes are ones where the Doctor finds out his entire crew is dead and long gone, or where Data is put on trial to determine if he's a sentient being. Even DS9's memorable episodes involve resets, like the one where they wipe out their own descendants or the one where Jake grows old after his father dies.
I agree, ultimately Star Trek being episodic is a strength and not a weakness of the franchise. There are so many memorable and great episodes that I like to rewatch or that I recommend to people who want to get into Star Trek without watching hundreds of hours.
Heavily serialized shows don't have that advantage, you can't just show people one or two episodes. Babylon 5 for example is a show where I wouldn't even know what to recommend, the first season was mostly episodic but also kinda crap, then it becomes great but at least for me there are only memorable arcs and scenes, not necessarily episodes, they all blur together.
This is also why I never rewatched Babylon 5 as much as the various Star Treks despite loving it and being obsessed with it back when it originally aired in the 90s.
Heavy serialization works best for mini series or anthologies. Love or hate American Horror Story but "You have to watch all of it" sounds more reasonable when the story is told in 12 or 13 episodes, people will do that. It's much harder to get someone to watch 110 episodes of B5 plus tv movies.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I feel like In the Beginning is a good intro to B5, but yeah, it's a commitment even though S1 and 2 had some episodic episodes.
I think "soft" serialization can work, like maybe some two or three parters in between some standalone episodes. But in 2017 it's all about the SEASON LONG MYSTERY with QUESTIONS that will never be answered. And if one episode is bad, it'll drag down the entire season with it.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
The visitor required an overarching narritive for The Visitor to have the same impact. Several of the plot points such as the federation surrendering DS9 to the Klingons directly tie in with the Way of the Warrior one episode prior.
Hell, even on TNG you'd be hard pressed to find people who could argue that the introduction of the Borg through to Picard' assimilation and the damage shown in First Contact made the show worse - in fact where the mass market is concenened, the Borg storyline that ran through TNG defined the show and, again, in seen as a pretty huge turning point.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I don't think The Visitor really requires knowledge of the Dominion War. It's about a son losing his father and being unable to let go. Of course, it's science fiction, so it gets reset, but that's the core of the episode.
The Dominion War stuff did provide context for some good stand alone episodes, but DS9 was never really fully serialized in the way that Moore wanted it to be (and ultimately produced with BSG, which I think is an unwatchable mess because of the last season).
TNG's two parters and character arcs aren't real serialized episodes either. There are throughlines, such as Data's search for his humanity (often in conflict with Lore) and Worf's search for his Klingon identity, but there aren't season arcs of any sort that are recognizable.
Maybe you could argue the whole show is about Q testing humanity, which is why the finale is All Good Things, but I think that's stretching it.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
I think we can all agree that Voyager's rest buttons hurt the show, right?
At least the reset buttons in other Trek shows make sense because ships can hit up space docks and crews can go on leave. It's just strange how Voyager's pitch was basically inviting the show to embrace its new setting.
Also, on BSG I tend to agree Trek reigning in Moore was a great thing... But on that same note BSG was a better Voyager than Voyager ever was.
At least the reset buttons in other Trek shows make sense because ships can hit up space docks and crews can go on leave. It's just strange how Voyager's pitch was basically inviting the show to embrace its new setting.
Also, on BSG I tend to agree Trek reigning in Moore was a great thing... But on that same note BSG was a better Voyager than Voyager ever was.
SMOK3Y
Generous Member
Cool as
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Yes, fuck Year of Hell and Equinox - both major two parters that had absolutely NO IMPACT on the show. lol
The same thing happened on Enterprise, which showed serialization at its weakest in S1 and S2, where the TCW stuff went nowhere. They tried to make up for it with S3, but it was too late and ended with stupid Lizard Nazis.
I guess BSG was a better show than Voyager... but at least I can and have rewatched Voyager. It's been over 10 years and I still can't watch BSG again because of how they fucked up the final episodes. lol
Succinct Verbosity
Member
Even the last episode of Voyager is a huge reset button. It's terrible how that show turned out because the crew could have had a lot of potential (minus poor old Harry Kim).
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Yeah, fuck Endgame too. lol
It's also why I was kind of worried when I discovered that Fuller basically came into Trek during the Voyager years, but I guess that's not a problem now.
Octavianus
Banned
Endgame is one of the reasons I'm actually pretty ok with this not being set after Voyager as it's best to stay as far away from that as possible.
TrekMovie's got some more stuff going on today, including a short vid of Jason Isaacs getting a facial cast, Doug Jones hurting himself (he's fine) during an action sequence, and confirmation that Starfleet Command is a major set in the series.
