I wouldn't worry too much about this, at this point. I would expect a healthy mix of HH and console style games. For example, BotW is surely console style, and if it does well there will be more like it. Regardless, Nintendo's development teams won't suddenly find only doing smaller experiences to be as exciting of a use of their time and skills, so I do expect a good mix.
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Eurogamer: NX is different, and different is Nintendo's best option.
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I wouldn't worry too much about this, at this point. I would expect a healthy mix of HH and console style games. For example, BotW is surely console style, and if it does well there will be more like it. Regardless, Nintendo's development teams won't suddenly find only doing smaller experiences to be as exciting of a use of their time and skills, so I do expect a good mix.
sir_bumble_bee
Member
It irks me how a lot of people seem to neglect JP third party support. Sure, Nintendo might not get a lot of games from EA, Ubisoft, Activision, or Bethesda, but I can see Sega, Capcom, Bandai Namco, Square Enix, and Koei Tecmo making large contributions (especially if the NX is the only handheld on the market).
marcbret87
Member
Yes, of course, I'm not saying otherwise, the PS2 is maybe the console with the best catalogue ever, what I mean is that the idea that Nintendo could release a console like PS4/One, receive third party support and that this would lead to them selling millions and millions is really hard to believe.
Confused Cheeseburger
Member
I'm actually interested in the NX if turns out a more powerful vita like handheld with the full might of all nintendo's software divisions behind it. I was cold on it, but if this is what they're doing I'm definitely looking at it and weighing it against the Neo.
Time of death, 8:39 am
Time of death, 8:39 am
The real problem, in my opinion, is two-fold.
1) This is so different from other platforms available that any developer wishing to release games on it will need to put in a lot more effort that is exclusive to one platform. This is the opposite of the usual strategy now, which is to release your game on as many platforms as possible with minimal changes.
2) All games will need to be tailored to both a hi-def TV and the portable's screen. This means it'll take even more effort. How will devs feel about this?
Think of how much smoother and better looking Breath of the Wild would be if it were on X1/PS4.
Why wouldn't their games be as diverse if they became a 3rd party developer? There is no evidence supporting that claim. If anything, they'd have more resources to put into game development, since they wouldn't have to support hardware.
1) This is so different from other platforms available that any developer wishing to release games on it will need to put in a lot more effort that is exclusive to one platform. This is the opposite of the usual strategy now, which is to release your game on as many platforms as possible with minimal changes.
2) All games will need to be tailored to both a hi-def TV and the portable's screen. This means it'll take even more effort. How will devs feel about this?
Think of how much smoother and better looking Breath of the Wild would be if it were on X1/PS4.
Why wouldn't their games be as diverse if they became a 3rd party developer? There is no evidence supporting that claim. If anything, they'd have more resources to put into game development, since they wouldn't have to support hardware.
family_guy
Member
Only thing really different about NX based on current info is the alleged detachable controllers. Sony already did the handheld thing that could be played on the TV thing with PSP Slim.
This is a very good post.
The WiiU is what happens when you try to do everything at the same time
marcbret87
Member
A Nintendo that is behind a single platform that can play everything is truly a Nintendo to be fearful of. If the 3DS had the output of a "single Nintendo" I am willing to bet its userbase would be a bit bigger than it would be now. The drought would have never happened. Not that 60M+ is something to be ashamed of honestly.
Nintendo will continue selling their software on their own systems for as long as it is viable. It's simply more profitable when you take into account revenue sharing.
Nintendo will continue selling their software on their own systems for as long as it is viable. It's simply more profitable when you take into account revenue sharing.
wonderful103
Member
Think how much better uncharted would look on a PC.
Wouldn't Sony's games be just as diverse if they released them on steam instead of ps4? There is no evidence that they wouldn't continue to fund the last guardian for a decade so they could eek out a few thousand sales on steam. Multi-million sellers made to diversify their own hardware like Knack would probably have sequels right now if they were just third party. They would surely also keep around developers who keep underperforming in their stable too. Because reasons. And they wouldn't have to can the large amounts of people dedicated to hardware, so they could use them for... Uh... Software for steam. Because of reasons. Think of the millions of extra sales and the 30 percent less they'd be making on them!
You mean losing games such as Another Code, Elite Beat Agents, Actionloop, Endless Ocean, Disaster, Excite Truck, Sin & Punishment, etc.? Seems to already have happened without Nintendo going third party.
Games that are successful would also be released on third party systems. Games that don't have wide appeal aren't even made for Nintendo's own systems anymore (with the rare exception of Codename Steam and Ever Oasis, where somebody in the marketing department messed up).
Are you really comparing Sony's first- and second-party output to Nintendo's? That is just silly.
What percentage of people that bought a PS4 bought it specifically to play Sony's output? Whatever it is, it's far lower than the percentage of people that bought a Wii U specifically to play Nintendo's output, because that figure will be near 100%.
My argument is that Nintendo could survive--and thrive--as a 3rd party developer, simply because they make the games that they do. No other developer compares. No, not even Sega.
TwilightPrincess
Member
Xenoblade X, Bayonetta 2, Tokyo Mirage Sessions, W101, Fatal Frame, (Devils 3rd lol). It sucks that Nintendo let some so called 2nd partys die, but it´s not that they don´t bring games anymore that won't sell millions. If NX sells it´s likely that we will see more of that smaller games in comparison to the Wii U.
To be fair, Nintendo would not bring those titles if they did not expect them to be profitable. Same would happen as a 3rd party studio. Other publishers also release smaller titles.
And for a game like Devil's Third or Xenoblade, PS4 and Xbox One may even have a larger customer base. For games such as Bayonetta 2 and W101 there's just no audience, and I doubt that Nintendo would produce sequels to those or games in a similar vain anyway.
I like Nintendo. It's been one of my favorite companies growing up and I've owned most of their consoles save for the virtual boy. But anyone trying to spin Nintendo's decisions into a plus when it comes to graphical capabilities is delusional. Let's call the Wii what it really is: an anomaly. It was pure lightning in a bottle, an I don't think Nintendo will get that again. To take an under powered system and pair it with a unique controller was ballsy and different and it paid off. I don't think it can happen again.
Also, why couldn't Nintendo have a graphically capable console with a different controller? Why can't Nintendo have a robust online with voice chat, party making, and a solid digital distribution? Why can't Nintendo have anti aliasing, texturing, etc .? I'm sure all of that could have been done with the WiiU, but it wasn't. Also, why couldn't Nintendo give power another go? I'm absolutely convinced that if the GameCube had better marketing and didn't look like a purple Fisher Price toy it would have sold better. The NX is a "wait and see" at best and hopefully Nintendo has learned something from the WiiU that can help it.
Also, why couldn't Nintendo have a graphically capable console with a different controller? Why can't Nintendo have a robust online with voice chat, party making, and a solid digital distribution? Why can't Nintendo have anti aliasing, texturing, etc .? I'm sure all of that could have been done with the WiiU, but it wasn't. Also, why couldn't Nintendo give power another go? I'm absolutely convinced that if the GameCube had better marketing and didn't look like a purple Fisher Price toy it would have sold better. The NX is a "wait and see" at best and hopefully Nintendo has learned something from the WiiU that can help it.
ThatStupidLion
Member
as long as this machine will have a software library in line with their handhelds i'm stoked..and as of now, there's little reason for me to expect otherwise
Some Nobody
Junior Member
This is the most accurate post. If the NX has *everything* on point, it'll do fine. Not "Wii" fine 'cause you don't catch lightning in a bottle twice, but 30m is feasible.
But that's everything. The NX needs to be $199. People love to spend money on new toys, but the toys have to be cheap enough for an impulse buy. $299-$399 isn't an impulse, it's an "investment". It needs to launch with new Mario, Zelda, ports of MK8, Smash 4, and Splatoon--all with some kind of DLC and prettier graphics. And preferably with some version of Pokémon since it'll be doing handheld and console.
And it needs a roadmap going forward for its first year at least, hopefully Year 2 also.
If it botches price, there's a problem. Games? Bigger problem. Nintendo needs to nail it all. I
visiblemode
Member
The hardware doesn't have to be a world beater as far as raw power is concerned, but it has to be truly impressive for what it is.
Screen door resolution isn't going to cut it anymore.
I'm a huge N fan and will buy this anyway but I also adore Sony portables, particularly Vita which, I bet, goes down as my most played handheld of all time.
So that said, this NX would seem to be carrying all my hopes for an amazing handheld, going forward.
It needs to have an acheivements system of some kind and have a unified account system, at the minimum.
Plus they have to offer muliple "away" units interacting with one base. Otherwise the "family appeal" will be low.
Screen door resolution isn't going to cut it anymore.
I'm a huge N fan and will buy this anyway but I also adore Sony portables, particularly Vita which, I bet, goes down as my most played handheld of all time.
So that said, this NX would seem to be carrying all my hopes for an amazing handheld, going forward.
It needs to have an acheivements system of some kind and have a unified account system, at the minimum.
Plus they have to offer muliple "away" units interacting with one base. Otherwise the "family appeal" will be low.
just like all the xbox players when they went from 360 to xbox one, right?
oh wait, they all ditched microsoft for playstation because playstation offered the better experience. every new gen is a new start. people go to where the most attractive console is. if nintendo releases the most attractive console, people will flock to it.
of course it wouldn't guarantee anything overnight, but it would be a step in the right direction. I don't see why third parties wouldn't port their games to a new nintendo console as long as everything was on par and easy to do, like it is with ps4/xbone/pc.
I'm just sad that NX would not even be as powerful as X1/PS4... It seem that my dream of having a 3D Mario game to look like the latest Ratchet and Clank on PS4 is now dead 
Don't get me wrong, Super Mario 3D World -the latest 3D Mario- looks beautiful and IMO is one of the best looking games on Wii U but ya. Still a month left to see, TO SEE, if Nintendo reveals this thing on September and put all of this speculations to rest.
Don't get me wrong, Super Mario 3D World -the latest 3D Mario- looks beautiful and IMO is one of the best looking games on Wii U but ya. Still a month left to see, TO SEE, if Nintendo reveals this thing on September and put all of this speculations to rest.Those changes wouldn't happen fast as in one generation. Also what attracts people to playstation are its exclusive games first and the good hardware second.
Also microsoft made the biggest error in video game marketing history with xbone.
Skittzo0413
Member
The NX we're hearing about from Eurogamer is more than capable of running GTAV, likely much closer to the XB1/PS4 versions than the PS3/360 versions, so I don't really understand why the hardware being "different' is preventing it from getting it. Honestly this NX sounds more capable power-wise than a lot of us were thinking, and much more normal control-wise. So again, I don't really understand your point. If GTA V doesn't come out for NX it's likely because
A) The game is years old at this point and
B) The install base and audience composition makes it not worth it for the publisher as has been the case since the Gamecube, meaning the type of hardware or power of the hardware makes no difference.
Microsoft's and Sony's Xbox and PS divisions are backed by other billion dollar divisions which are more than capable of backing up those divisions if need be. Nintendo has no such diversification. If Nintendo had a failure on the magnitude of the PS3 they would have gone bankrupt or out of business, and it would have wiped out all of the profits they've earned for several decades.
This is why people say they can't compete in the same game. It's because they're not the same type of company- they are a games only company.
D
Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
1. Nintendo can't take the financial risk to put out a console on par as there's strong evidence that the market won't pay those prices for their hardware.
2. It's the middle of a generation and people are locked down. The PS4 and X1 came out the same month in 2013, making it easier for people/groups of friends that play together to jump ship from 360 to PS4. Much harder, and littler reason to switch, if a competitor puts out a comparable console mid generation. Why switch to play CoD with similar graphics on a new platform instead of the one(s) you already own?
3. I'm not convinced that a majority of the mainstream online 360 gamers--those playing CoD etc. (and obviously those playing Halo and Gears) switched--at least in North America. I did as I mostly quit playing online MP anyway, but I have a decent sized friend list and the people I played CoD with last gen are all still playing CoD on Xbox 1 with each other. Many of them area also on my PSN list and have PS4s, but they're not playing CoD their. Just anecdotal of course, and it seems like people switching over was far more prevalent in Europe.
It seem that my dream of having a 3D Mario game to look like the latest Ratchet and Clank on PS4 is now dead
I've wanted Super Mario Galaxy in HD since the day that game came out. The fact that Nintendo doesn't seem to care about the hardware aspect of their presentation is just so frustrating to me sometimes.
Speak for yourself.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Sammy Samusu
Member
Nintendo are in their own lane.
Nobody is going to tell them what to do!
A trendsetter is a trendsetter.
A risk taker is a risk taker.
Nobody is going to tell them what to do!
A trendsetter is a trendsetter.
A risk taker is a risk taker.
LordRaptor
Member
That and the fact that Nintendo are at least partially keeping those companies solvent and working in the games industry and not just making pachinko or whatever, by outsourcing work to them.
Boss Man
Member
Eh, idk man. I feel like part of Nintendo's thing is having some platform gimmick. Otherwise playing Mario over and over would get old, wouldn't it?
D
Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
Probably.
But Nintendo's effort with the Wii U from concept, price, name, marketing was orettyvdn bad coming off the 100 million selling Wii.
As was Sony's with the PS3 price, people will work second jobs to afford it comments etc coming off the most successful console if all time in the PS2.
It hell, even back to Atari's fuck ups after the huge success of the 2600.
There's a long history of game companies having huge success and getting arrogant and settings themselves way back.
Markets are fickle and consumers have tons of options competing for their leisure income and free time. There's no place for ever doing less to bend over backwards to appeal to your market if a company wants to stay on top.
Nintendo moved away from competing with Sony and Microsoft over 10 years. It's time for people to realize that they have no intention of pursuing that market ever. Frankly, even if they did, people would still be complaining. I'd much rather have two consoles that do completely different things than being more or less the same with different libraries. It was frustrating in the PS2 Gamecube Xbox days when offerings were more or less the same across the board, minus exclusives.
So this article just is reiterating what Nintendo has basically stated for years now? You would think with them having sources on the hardware they could actually add a little insight rather than milking their NX attention for clicks. Even throwing in that 3rd party jab is old hat that adds nothing to the discussion other than harping on a sentiment among gamers since the N64.
Seems pretty shitty of them since any Nintendo fans could tell you they were trying to take a different path with their hardware since at least the GameCube.
Seems pretty shitty of them since any Nintendo fans could tell you they were trying to take a different path with their hardware since at least the GameCube.
Of course it wouldn't happen in one generation. But in Nintendo case, you have to start somewhere.
Also, the bolded simply isn't true. the best selling games for PS4 are COD, GTA and sports titles. all multiplatform games... but they look and play the best on PS4, plus the thing was priced appropriately, so console gamers buy a PS4 in order to play those games first.
and i'm not sure if microsoft's marketing error was worse than nintendo's with wii u lol
not this shit again
nintendo has plenty of cash in the vault. they could do it if they want to. ps4 was profitable at launch with a ps+ subscription, and without a ps+ subscription after like 4 months. a cutting edge, $349 console that sells at/very close to a profit at launch doesn't sound like much of a risk, especially if they have a super appealing product to sell, like sony did with the ps4. and i believe nintendo can still sell an appealing, high end product, as they have some of the best games in the industry exclusive to their platforms. they need the right machine, the right marketing and the right games, from both first parties and third parties.
well obviously now it's not going to happen mid gen. they'd have to try it when ps5 launches.
before all this nx stuff got out, I was thinking they'd release a PS4-powered console in 2016, then another, PS5-powered console in 4 years to line up with PS5 launch. in this scenario, NX probably would have had some struggled, but it would have been a necessary first step in hopefully the right direction.
I'm just looking at the sales numbers here. PS4 is shitting on Xbone. hard. 360 players made the switch to PS4. lots of them.
theangrypirate
Member
Hahahaha, 'how much you wanna bet I can throw a football over them mountains?'
The games might look even better, but they'd have no good reason to tell the shareholders why they can afford to waste resources on lower-selling games.
Right, I guess I mean more the small projects that would not make for much monetary success compared to the blockbusters. Those that Nintendo continues to make, like Pushmo or BOXBOXBOY! there would no longer be a point to making. Investors would not be pleased. There would be no reasonable room in profits to bother, I think.
ViperVisor
Member
The Wii U differences that Nintendo spent good monies on are subtle.
It's a nice technical feat but when the instant streaming to the big screen on the controller isn't looked at most of the time it's not a good way centerpiece for a console. The motion controls are nice and precise as you see with aiming in Splatoon but not as visceral as the original Wii remote in your hand. The touch screen gaming functions had been happening for years since the DS popularized it. And the invisible feature that has been mentioned in this thread, it's an extremely energy efficient console.
$$$$ spent to enhance the visual experience does not have near the bang for the buck it did in the 90s or 00s. But it does still work. When you keep shoveling more coal into the steam engine you go move down the tracks predictably.
It's a nice technical feat but when the instant streaming to the big screen on the controller isn't looked at most of the time it's not a good way centerpiece for a console. The motion controls are nice and precise as you see with aiming in Splatoon but not as visceral as the original Wii remote in your hand. The touch screen gaming functions had been happening for years since the DS popularized it. And the invisible feature that has been mentioned in this thread, it's an extremely energy efficient console.
$$$$ spent to enhance the visual experience does not have near the bang for the buck it did in the 90s or 00s. But it does still work. When you keep shoveling more coal into the steam engine you go move down the tracks predictably.
LegendofLex
Member
Not having to sell hardware means less incentive to try to create diverse appeal, more incentive to turn your biggest games into reliable cash cows that will always sell without you having to make an effort to sell more hardware to a wider audience.
Efficiency for a third-party means "how can I maximize my returns on software?"
Efficiency for a first-party means "how can I create a sustainable ecosystem for software that lots of people will be attracted to and stick with?"
The NX does offer one use that's hard to replicate anywhere else, portable quick and easy multiplayer. Detach the controller and have two player Smash Bros anywhere. I'm assuming the system will let you use more controllers for 4 player if anyone has spares or their own system. It's perhaps a niche use but still something that's will be pretty unique to the NX.
If investors had much of a say, Nintendo would be focussing on smartphone gaming right now. Also, by that logic, Nintendo would not make the titles you just named even right now. Those titles are niche titles, profitable niche titles. Other 3rd party publishers have similar smaller games.
Sounds eerily like Animal Crossing: Amiibo Festival, Mario Tennis: Ultra Smash, Zelda Triforce Heroes, Mario Party 10, or Animal Crossing: Happy Home Designer. Looking at the 3DS and Wii U releases, it seems like this dystopian prophecy has already become reality to a large extent.
i speak for the market, not myself. i have every console.
well maybe nintendo can offer some kind of incentive to some of the bigger third parties to kickstart a relationship if the porting costs don't seem worth it to them
instead of
you know
wasting money and resources saving games like bayonetta 2 that go on to sell like 20 copies
that pained me to type, but if you're nintendo and looking to make money... partnering with platinum games isn't doing fucking SHIT for you
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
I don't know. I think this might finally do it.
family_guy
Member
I doubt every game supports this unless they really dumb down the controls.
Orniletter
Banned
Look at SEGA's output throughout their days as a platform holder and compare their output to last year. SEGA in the year 2015 is a hollow husk compared to their Dreamcast days.
You literally don't understand how much more freedom a console vendor has compared to a purely thirdparty software publisher that gets 0% of it's revenue through hardware.
LordRaptor
Member
Okay, but in the real world;
Bail out Platinum on a title they super wanted to make -> Great working relationship with Platinum, they come to you for work again
Pay EA to not actively spurn you on a FIFA release date -> "Cool, how much are you paying us for the next one? Because price just went up"
What if Sega was just heavily mismanaged and only made the jump to a 3rd party publisher when they were close to bankruptcy and thus could not properly fund their studios anymore? Just goes on to show that Nintendo better makes sure to no get into that position.
While the move away from their own hardware might have had a temporary motivational effect, there were far deeper problems at Sega. Just ignoring this and summing it up as "they had more freedom" is an overly simplistic statement that neglects reality.
madstarr12
Member
Well, Nintendo hasn't released a Console without a differentiated selling point in a while that hasnt been riddled with mess-ups and mistakes on presentation. I wonder if Nintendo can be successful enough with an ordinary games console without big issues like Gamecube had.
Crimsonsky
Member
A few years ago they said that this wouldn't happen because they believe in their products or something. Can't really remember the whole interview, but in it Nintendo said if they had to stop making hardware they would stop making games. I don't believe that for a single second. Iwata also walked that back quite a bit before his passing.
For quite a lot of people this is what we want and if capitalism has it's say it is likely we will get it. It isn't a bad thing though. There's really no reason why a game like Tokyo Mirage or even the Persona series itself couldn't be on Smartphones and Steam. Why not tap into the device hundreds of millions already have?
I'm just sad that NX would not even be as powerful as X1/PS4... It seem that my dream of having a 3D Mario game to look like the latest Ratchet and Clank on PS4 is now dead
Even if the NX were to have PS4 power, Nintendo focuses on 60 FPS when it comes to Mario games.
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