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[thabtoUK]

Just leaving this here:

http://metal-gear.net/2015/08/31/mother-base-coin-aka-in-game-currency-prices-revealed/

*Steps away*

 

[maxcriden]

https://d.maxfile.ro/pofmydhxac.webm


WORDS AND DEEDS

Someone should make a Quiet thread before both this and the OT blow up lol.

Mods pls someone make one.

So, are you Quiet-ly ashamed of your words and deeds? | MGSV spin-off discussion

Title suggestion. I do think it's a discussion worth having.

Just leaving this here:

http://metal-gear.net/2015/08/31/mother-base-coin-aka-in-game-currency-prices-revealed/

*Steps away*

Un. Real. Is there a thread about this?

 

[border]

So....this game was presumed to be about how Big Boss turned into a bad guy.

But it's actually about how a guy pretending to be Big Boss killed another guy trying to destroy the world with parasites? Does it at least explain why Venom Snake turned into a bad guy?

 

[KOMANI]

i think Metal Gear is about the story of how Kojima turned bad.

Re-listening to tapes... it really needed help on the localization. It's bad. And you can tell the actors aren't acting with other actors... everyone is on a different level.

 

[convo]

It's funny that Kojima felt the need to explain how Big Boss survived Outer Heaven,

Are you sure there? All off you can keep on believing that Kojima always lied and actually wanted to continue metal gear past MGS2 ,but i can believe working at the company and the success of the series made him have to do the in-between stories. It's all about filling in the gaps with whatever is possible. Big leaps in logic or retcons definitely help.

 

[Sub_Level]

So....thsi game was presumed to be about how Big Boss turned into a bad guy.

But it's actually about how a guy pretending to be Big Boss killed another guy trying to destroy the world with parasites? Does it at least explain why Venom Snake turned into a bad guy?

No. Either Big Boss or the Patriots sent Solid Snake to kill Venom. He may not have been that bad of a guy in the first place.

What's more, it was thought this game would show more of the conflict between Zero and Big Boss, but that conflict only really lasted from 1972 (Les Enfants Teribles) to 1975 (GZ). After that, Zero helped Big Boss before being decommissioned by Skullface, and it was Zero's unhinged will in the form of the Patriot AIs that Big Boss fought against from 1995 - 1999.

 

[Formosa]

Has anyone experienced the "lighting" problem where the area should be sunny/bright but it's dark?

 

[Kralamoonard]

Just saw this pop up in by sub box, and since I'm a Junior I can't make a thread. Was wondering if someone wanted to post it:

NXGamer Analysis (spoiler free): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rN72T2z9zSc

 

[Alienous]

It did rather seem like the game was answering questions either GZ or itself posed. The (completely predictable from the minute you turn on the game if you're looking for it) twist is self-contained payoff within the game. There's really no shocking twist to be had outside of BB not being the guy from MG1 and even that isn't Earth shattering. The Paz thing is neat (the implication that GZ had a false narrator is neat anyway, the actual cutscene is hard to watch) but kind of irrelevant for anything going forward. I don't know that we even really gained any insight into Liquid (we knew he was arrogant...we knew he had father issues). There was no one moment in the thing that makes you rethink the rest of the series. If there is I haven't processed it yet.

That's the only reason why I'm more OK with the parasites than I ever was with the nanomachines. If that's your one McGuffin sure, whatever. All the bullshit in the game is because of that one thing? Sure.

It was MGS4's lazy 'All your prior questions are because of this' that was bullshit.

The twist doesn't tie in with the McGuffin and doesn't seem like it explains anything. I just don't get why. A man just like Big Boss 'becomes a demon', but not Big Boss? Why?

 

[.....]

For those that were wondering about the Snake Eater theme

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4RwZ0X59-E

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

so after finishing quiets mission I can't use her anymore? Well mgsv can fuck off then, I barely used any other buddy she was so fun

 

[behroozbadboy]

So, no fucking chico in TPP?! Oh well.

 

[ZenTzen]

That's the only reason why I'm more OK with the parasites than I ever was with the nanomachines. If that's your one McGuffin sure, whatever. All the bullshit in the game is because of that one thing? Sure.

It was MGS4's lazy 'All your prior questions are because of this' that was bullshit.

The twist doesn't tie in with the McGuffin and doesn't seem like it explains anything. I just don't get why. A man just like Big Boss 'becomes a demon', but not Big Boss? Why?

both of them became a demon, BB became something he didnt want to, and Outer Heaven and Zanzibar Land are pratically the same thing

 

[Sub_Level]

So, no fucking chico in TPP?! Oh well.

Mentioned in a tape.

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

so is the Paz we knew, the 9th paz?

 

[Sub_Level]

so is the Paz we knew, the 9th paz?

No, the 9th agent he presumably interviewed for the Peace Walker infiltration job. It's kind of irrelevant since she notices Zero was lying about people in the next room. He might have just been bluffing to try and scare her, see if she was up to the task.

 

[Alienous]

both of them became a demon, BB became something he didnt want to, and Outer Heaven and Zanzibar Land are pratically the same thing

Exactly. That's why I don't get it.

It's stupid, the entire concept.

"You're too unique and special to die, so we'll make someone just as good as you in a matter of weeks"

What? He's a fucking CQC expert like he has the muscle memory for it after fucking Ocelot taught him? It took him longer to train D-Dog.

And why doesn't Ishmael have a beard?

All this just to make a Big Boss that is evil? But Big Boss is evil. This dude wasn't dead. He was an amnesiac they programmed to be someone else against his will so Big Boss could have a vacation. He could of had kids, or a wife, or friends.

It's one of the worst twists in a story, ever. Its inclusion in the canon invalidates everything that comes after it; it's all shit now.

 

[Sub_Level]

All this just to make a Big Boss that is evil?

No. Their justification (and I don't agree with it) was to make another Big Boss so the original would be protected. It was similar to the insurance given by the clones.

Ocelot also mentions that Big Boss is working on Zanzibar while Venom is out spreading the myth of Big Boss.

Zero absolutely wanted Big Boss to live and for his legend to be maintained. That's why he kickstarts this body double plan before he succumbs to Skullface's virus. Skullface is protrayed as pretty much just a bad guy, albeit one with a tragic past. He is similar to Volgin in that respect. They aren't sympathetic to any degree like Solidus or The Boss.

Was it necessary for the story to be that way? I don't think so.

 

[unknownhero]

I hope there's a way to mod quiet back in after the missions in the pc version. I wonder if there will be a topic for modding V on the pc?

 

[Alienous]

No. Their justification (and I don't agree with it) was to make another Big Boss so the original would be protected. It was similar to the insurance given by the clones.

Ocelot also mentions that Big Boss is working on Zanzibar while Venom is out spreading the myth of Big Boss.

Zero absolutely wanted Big Boss to live and for his legend to be maintained. That's why he kickstarts this body double plan before he succumbs to Skullface's virus. Skullface is protrayed as pretty much just a bad guy, albeit one with a tragic past. He is similar to Volgin in that respect. They aren't sympathetic to any degree like Solidus or The Boss.

Was it necessary for the story to be that way? I don't think so.

But I don't get what's so important about Big Boss.

The messages conflict. "You are Big Boss. A dude became Big Boss. It's the legend, not the man" and "Big Boss is special and unique. We must duplicate him to protect the original".

They don't work together. Anyone can be Big Boss but Big Boss is a one-of-a-kind.

Utter shit.

If Big Boss is working on Zanzibar it's just them trying to do the most evil shit.

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

if there's no way to get quiet back, this game is dead to me.
I don't wanna start again.

 

[Kamina]

I hope there's a way to mod quiet back in after the missions in the pc version. I wonder if there will be a topic for modding V on the pc?

I know what mod you really want to see on Quiet, don't try to deny it.

 

[TwoDurans]

I know what mod you really want to see on Quiet, don't try to deny it.

What's the over/under on how long it'll take for that particular mod to be created? I'm thinking 5 days.

 

[unknownhero]

I know what mod you really want to see on Quiet, don't try to deny it.

alright, I'll admit it......I want to see miller in a bikini dammit! I will not be ashamed of my words or deeds!

 

[Gbraga]

"You're too unique and special to die, so we'll make someone just as good as you in a matter of weeks"

Well, to be fair, we don't know if he's as good, just good enough to get shit done and continue the legend. It's about building the mythos, not just preserving one man. If it was only about keeping Big Boss hidden, they could just fake his death and train the medic to lead the troops in his place, without any of the nanomachines/parasites/hipnosis/whatever the fuck they did to make him believe he was Big Boss.

if there's no way to get quiet back, this game is dead to me.
I don't wanna start again.

There's no form of NG+? If you do her boss fight again on Mission Select, you don't get her back? That's pretty dumb. It's a bit cool that you lose such an important character like this for story reasons, so I like this concept, but it's supposed to be the kind of game where replayability relies a lot on keeping your stuff and going for higher difficulties, S ranks and self-imposed challenges. So it becomes a bit of a problem when, after a while, you'll have like 10x as much time with the game without Quiet than with her.

 

[ZenTzen]

Exactly. That's why I don't get it.

It's stupid, the entire concept.

"You're too unique and special to die, so we'll make someone just as good as you in a matter of weeks"

What? He's a fucking CQC expert like he has the muscle memory for it after fucking Ocelot taught him? It took him longer to train D-Dog.

And why doesn't Ishmael have a beard?

All this just to make a Big Boss that is evil? But Big Boss is evil. This dude wasn't dead. He was an amnesiac they programmed to be someone else against his will so Big Boss could have a vacation. He could of had kids, or a wife, or friends.

It's one of the worst twists in a story, ever. Its inclusion in the canon invalidates everything that comes after it; it's all shit now.

I agree with you that its a shit twist, but it doesnt really invalidate much, just that in MG1, the BB you killed isnt the real BB, and that BB isnt all that great, which at the same time, make Solid Snake the best thing ever, which is the only thing i'm ok with, since i much prefer Solid Snake over BB

 

[RK9039]

But I don't get what's so important about Big Boss.

The messages conflict. "You are Big Boss. A dude became Big Boss. It's the legend, not the man" and "Big Boss is special and unique. We must duplicate him to protect the original".

They don't work together. Anyone can be Big Boss but Big Boss is a one-of-a-kind.

Utter shit.

If Big Boss is working on Zanzibar it's just them trying to do the most evil shit.

It's hilarious.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

But I don't get what's so important about Big Boss.

The messages conflict. "You are Big Boss. A dude became Big Boss. It's the legend, not the man" and "Big Boss is special and unique. We must duplicate him to protect the original".

They don't work together. Anyone can be Big Boss but Big Boss is a one-of-a-kind.

Utter shit.

If Big Boss is working on Zanzibar it's just them trying to do the most evil shit.

Erm, the messages don't conflict. It's about keeping the image of Big Boss alive, and about being able to replicate it. MGS4 goes over this, actually. Zero simply wanted to keep BB near because that's simply his own feeling. Otherwise, being able to keep a 'big boss' alive for modern times, whether replicated or not, was what he originally wanted and eventually what the Patriot AI tried.

Dunno why you're confused to think why the messages conflict.

 

[TwoDurans]

I agree with you that its a shit twist, but it doesnt really invalidate much, just that in MG1, the BB you killed isnt the real BB, and that BB isnt all that great, which at the same time, make Solid Snake the best thing ever, which is the only thing i'm ok with, since i much prefer Solid Snake over BB

This. Is the twist unnecessary? Yes. Does it ruin the entire franchise? Absolutely not.

Honestly this whole thing seems like no one could figure out a good reason to make the connection with Big Boss leading Foxhound for the US and decided to have him and Zero make up, then say "well he wasn't actually the bad guy in MG1." Not the end of the world, but I'm certain people will overreact and hate it.

 

[Gbraga]

alright, I'll admit it......I want to see miller in a bikini dammit! I will not be ashamed of my words or deeds!

Snake with Quiet's costume might be a reality on PC?

 

[Formosa]

Has anyone experienced the "lighting" problem where the area should be sunny/bright but it's dark?

Anyone? No one?

 

[YoRHa No.2 Type B]

Couple of questions:

1. Once I updated both GZ & TPP, do I need to be connected to the internet in order to transfer my file?

2. Are you already able to redeem the codes from the collectors edition?

3. Has someone reached 100 % yet? Does something happen?

4. Are there no swim trunks or bikinis?

 

[Alienous]

This. Is the twist unnecessary? Yes. Does it ruin the entire franchise? Absolutely not.

Honestly this whole thing seems like no one could figure out a good reason to make the connection with Big Boss leading Foxhound for the US and decided to have him and Zero make up, then say "well he wasn't actually the bad guy in MG1." Not the end of the world, but I'm certain people will overreact and hate it.

But that isn't it.

He's still making an Outer Heaven when he's commanding Solid Snake and FOXHOUND. He's doing the exact same thing he did before the twist.

 

[Emedan]

This. Is the twist unnecessary? Yes. Does it ruin the entire franchise? Absolutely not.

Absloutely yes, it has impacted the story in a very negative way. Especially this game, it negates the whole premise of the game, and for what? It really just proves that Kojima doesn't understand writing at all, it's like a 1st grade story paper. Utterly incompetent and detrimental to the narrative in the game. I've said this before in the thread but I'll say it again.

You can't create a character driven story with the character not present

This wouldn't had been so fucking offensive if only we didn't look like Big Boss and sounded like him. It's idiotic and stupid, Kojima has never been a good writer to be honest, but before there we're at least enough left for us to create a competent story around the mess, now it's just completely ruined.

I've always been a story driven gamer, I play games to progress the story first and foremost, hearing this twist completely broke my spirits cause before this MGS was my favourite game series of all time - it was a series created for my taste it felt like, now for some stupid non reason it's ruined.

 

[Lonestar]

Couple of questions:

1. Once I updated both GZ & TPP, do I need to be connected to the internet in order to transfer my file?

2. Are you already able to redeem the codes from the collectors edition?

3. Has someone reached 100 % yet? Does something happen?

4. Are there no swim trunks or bikinis?

There's a recent update in GZ, that adds "upload save file", so that makes me think it's cloud based.

 

[TwoDurans]

You can't create a character driven story with the character not present

Here's where I think you missed the point of TPP. The character you want the game to be about, Big Boss, it isn't. It's a character driven story about a guy's descent into madness due to his idol, in this case BB, using him for his own gains. He was forced to live the legend, and build up the name of Big Boss all while the real deal was off setting up his Army without a Nation.

Then when the unthinkable happened and Venom had to save the world by murdering all the Diamond Dogs, Big Boss needed to control his monster and take him out, sending his two best recruits Grey Fox and Solid Snake. The entire story is about what a dick BB is, and how Venom was a victim. Think of it like Frankenstein and his monster.

Again, all the hate will come from people who wanted this game to be Big Boss' final ride, instead of the conclusion to the saga that finally links the old and new games together.

tl;dr - People are going to be pissed because TPP isn't the game they want it to be.

 

[Gbraga]

Here's where I think you missed the point of TPP. The character you want the game to be about, Big Boss, it isn't. It's a character driven story about a guy's descent into madness due to his idol, in this case BB, using him for his own gains. He was forced to live the legend, and build up the name of Big Boss all while the real deal was off setting up his Army without a Nation.

Then when the unthinkable happened and Venom had to save the world by murdering all the Diamond Dogs, Big Boss needed to control his monster and take him out, sending his two best recruits Grey Fox and Solid Snake. The entire story is about what a dick BB is, and how Venom was a victim.

Again, all the hate will come from people who wanted this game to be Big Boss' final ride, instead of the conclusion to the saga that finally links the old and new games together.

Deep inside, the abandoned child.

 

[Alienous]

I need to purge the MGS timeline from my mind. It's meaningless trash now.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

I need to purge the MGS timeline from my mind. It's meaningless trash now.

I mean

people have tried explaining to you what happens

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

just went back to mother base and some cutscene with code talker played out, where the parasites where giving him a message about kaz

 

[Alienous]

I mean

people have tried explaining to you what happens

My problem isn't understanding it. It's just shit that invalidates some of the core aspects of MGS. Nothing has meaning, all the questions are just eventually explained away with ass-pull bullshit.

It's garbage.

just went back to mother base and some cutscene with code talker played out, where the parasites where giving him a message about kaz

I got that before the ending. Hasn't gone anywhere.

 

[SolidSnake305]

so after finishing quiets mission I can't use her anymore? Well mgsv can fuck off then, I barely used any other buddy she was so fun

Yeah I was pondering the same thing, they better fix it or there has to be a way to get her back, I spent a good amount of GMP on that girl.

 

[TwoDurans]

My problem isn't understanding it. It's just shit that invalidates some of the core aspects of MGS. Nothing has meaning, all the questions are just eventually explained away with ass-pull bullshit..

Such as?

 

[BreezyLimbo]

My problem isn't understanding it. It's just shit that invalidates some of the core aspects of MGS. Nothing has meaning, all the questions are just eventually explained away with ass-pull bullshit.

It's garbage.

It reinforces what MGS4 said. If you have issues with BB being replicated in order to keep his image alive, than take it up with MGS4? MGSV is a continuation of that, that BB isn't unique, that anyone can be him.

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

Is this Paz scene for real

 

[Alienous]

Such as?

The Patriots. The Zero/BB feud. Big Boss being evil.

The games work seperately but are not cohesive together. There is no point trying to assemble a plot, there isn't one.

It's goofy shit. Characters coming from nowhere to goof it up. God dammit, Kojima.

 

[razzmahtazz]

I mean

people have tried explaining to you what happens

Lol. Give up. Lots have tried over the span of this thread. It just won't get through to them now.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

The Patriots. The Zero/BB feud. Big Boss being evil.

The games work seperately but are not cohesive together. There is no point trying to assemble a plot, there isn't one.

It's goofy shit. Characters coming from nowhere to goof it up. God dammit, Kojima.

.....wat.

The Patriots are still the patriots, separate from Zero. Unless you mean the human Patriots, who were already split up by MGSV.

In MGS4 BB admits that he didn't have much of a feud with Zero. That Zero just wanted to be friends.

And BB was never seen as the ultimate evil. The MSX games don't give him enough characterization other than 'he's a bad guy go kill him'.

Jesus christ it's not that hard to understand.

 

[Shauni]

Here's where I think you missed the point of TPP. The character you want the game to be about, Big Boss, it isn't. It's a character driven story about a guy's descent into madness due to his idol, in this case BB, using him for his own gains. He was forced to live the legend, and build up the name of Big Boss all while the real deal was off setting up his Army without a Nation.

Then when the unthinkable happened and Venom had to save the world by murdering all the Diamond Dogs, Big Boss needed to control his monster and take him out, sending his two best recruits Grey Fox and Solid Snake. The entire story is about what a dick BB is, and how Venom was a victim. Think of it like Frankenstein and his monster.

Again, all the hate will come from people who wanted this game to be Big Boss' final ride, instead of the conclusion to the saga that finally links the old and new games together.

tl;dr - People are going to be pissed because TPP isn't the game they want it to be.

I don't...disagree with this. I think what you have here is a good thought process on the whole thing. Makes a lot more sense, at least thematically, when you put it this way.

 

[KOMANI]

The Patriots. The Zero/BB feud. Big Boss being evil.

The games work seperately but are not cohesive together. There is no point trying to assemble a plot, there isn't one.

It's goofy shit. Characters coming from nowhere to goof it up. God dammit, Kojima.

You're absolutely right... The lore means nothing now.... Best just to think of them independently. In all honesty, the first 3 solid games don't contradict each other too much. From 4 and onward the shit hits the fan on a summer day.