You'd probably be surprised how many of your favourite things are made by people with fucked up opinions like that. I personally can't fault someone for leaving their shitty views out of what they produce, makes more sense to fault them for their shitty views instead.
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JonTron Releases a Statement
- Thread starter LionPride
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You'd probably be surprised how many of your favourite things are made by people with fucked up opinions like that. I personally can't fault someone for leaving their shitty views out of what they produce, makes more sense to fault them for their shitty views instead.
Not really. Game development is very very liberal for the most part. As is hollywood.
JonTron's extreme racism isn't something you are going to see a lot of from traditional media creators.
Don't write it as one word or it will get cut off in mobile.
I think you give people too much credit, America (and the rest of the world) is filled with racists. Like just off the top of my head I was pretty surprised to find out the views of the Dragon Quest composer and Clint Eastwood. There's more than likely plenty of individuals who hold horrible views in both game development and Hollywood, but they don't want to face the consequences of speaking up.
These people are outliers and are in the vast minority though. The games industry is very liberal. Atleast the developers are. Management and publishers might not be though.
ShironRedshift
Member
It's a very, very good thing in that case that there's a deluge of entertainment content available, more than ever before and more than is humanly possible to even consume (and seriously, taking a moment to digress here, it really is fucking awesome to take a moment to think about just how much content there is on these sites and how wonderful it is to have that kinda choice and that many options available to us. Things are really fucking good right now.
). That being the case, it's extremely easy for me to avoid stuff from people who have terrible views. Like, right now I'm following over 100 people on Twitch but regularly watch like, maaaaaaaybe 5 of them because of how impossible it is to stay on top of that much content.
With that many options available, it's not only easy to avoid racist pieces of trash/filter them out of my rotation if they somehow manage to sneak their way in, but actively helpful in more ways than oneboth as a clear sign that I won't ever support racists even if they make content I like and helps clean up my following list a bit that was way too full to begin with. Two birds, one stone.
But yeah, with how many options there are on sites like YouTube and Twitch, I don't buy arguments like this. None of these guys are that unique and there's already too much content and too many options to choose from to begin with. Filtering out the trash when it manages to find its way through is no problem at all for me with that being the case. Plenty of other fish in the sea. The trash will not be missed.
I used to enjoy his content. I think he's a funny, talented guy but at this point I'm not even sure an apology will bring me back. He would have to do a skateboard kid-like review of his own debate making fun of his own idiot statements the whole time, donate thousands of his own money to civil rights organizations and vow to never talk politics publicly again.
comshoplesce
Member
Sorry for not knowing, but who is he?
Good on you for, as someone said last page, calling a spade a spade.
If only that stupid GAME_JAM reality show hadn't failed, and he hadn't met Zoe Quinn there, hadn't gone down the anti-SJW/anti-PC/gamergate, hadn't retweeted a NSFW comic of a gamergate gangbang, hadn't teamed up with alt-righters, hadn't said "retarded" maybe this wouldn't have happened? This scandal has been 3 years in the making.
2014:
"Did Hitler give up?".
He actually said that.
Head, meet desk, again and again and again and again...
Yeah lol this was cut off at 'because' on my phone
YouTube streamer and member of the gaming media/press. Legitimately pretty talented at making high-pace jokes and quips, often meme-worthy. You've probably seen a number of his GIFs.
And, it turns out, a full-blown racist who also can't debate for shit.
I wonder how many confidantes are behind him saying 'No Jon, don't let them win, go harder on this'
It's a mistake
Pride will be the death of your country, honestly...
well like. I think these youtubers live in their own bubble due to their fanbase. Because their fanbase "love" them so much they continue to support them no matter how many stupid things they do. It's kind of an extension of people not being able to reconcile criticism towards media they like. It's entirely likely that when someone criticises a thing they like as racist / sexist / homophobic etc they project that criticism onto themselves , "they are saying the thing i like is racist, so i like racist things so they are saying i'm racist" , Its a continual pattern that has been around for a while.
Gamers, for example, can't even take genuine non politicized criticism of the things they like. Just look at the shit around Jim's review for Zelda, even though he considers it a good game. its ridiculous. So many people lack critical thought while simultaneously everyone is saying if we talk about stuff in the open the correct ideas win. But in the current climate the latter is not going to happen, because many people place their ego on the line when it comes to criticism, they see it as an attack on themselves rather than an attack on the product / media / internet personality that they like.
while im from the UK you are still right. people here are dragging us down over pride due to Brexit :S
Glass Shark
Banned
The guy sat and had a long conversation expressing his views, it wasn't like he had a momentary mental break or just slipped and said something stupid.
It seems like people basing their identities and egos off of media and IP is more and more commonplace. When consumerism comes to define who we are, an attack on a product or production is an attack on us.
This such an adolescent thing. Gamers have spent so long saying they want their hobby to be taken seriously. Then when it is - when reviews become reviews instead of marketing - they reveal that they're sniveling manchildren who weren't actually ready for it.
This is amazing. Neil is the best.
Gai Murakumo
Member
Pride becomes the downfall of most nations and people. Good Pride (i.e. Pride of family and positive accomplishments such as athletics/academics/business success) are few are far between nowadays. Bad Pride such as what we see here can be a kin to being extremely stubborn which leads to a downfall of many people. I have been a fan of Jon's for many years but these recent events have really turned me off of him. I wish he would just stick with the comedy and not try to be political. In this day in age I do not understand the mentality of people who view the world this way. With globalization and a increase in a connected world due to the internet thoughts and ideas such as this should be lessening, unfortunately they are not.
Lionel Richie
Member
This is a pretty unfair generalization to make and there's no way any collective epiphany will come out of shaming gamers just because some people associated with videogames are asshole. As always, it isn't the bigger group that is at fault here, it's the people that are actually doing shit that are culpable.
Maybe I should have been more specific, but I don't think it's unfair. When you remember that for a long time video games were considered toys for boys, when you notice that 30 year old women are now the largest demographic, when you remember the years that gaming fans were raging against companies for reaching out for this non-hardcore demographic, I think it should become clear that there's something within the hobby as it used to exist that makes it easy for people to sell regressive politics to the gamers who are feeling like the industry has moved on from them.
Sorry but the community at large doesn't get a pass. We are the ones that make guys like Jontron popular. We give them the platform to spew their shit to a wider audience.
kqedequalsvolvo
Member
Strongly agree. I think the other aspect to this is that there's also a pretty high passive tolerance for toxic and/or discriminatory behaviour - as in, yeah, not everyone into gaming acts like JohnTron, but there's plenty more who do not see such as behaviour as an issue and/or slam those who challenge it on the grounds of 'keep politics out of my games'/'they're going to take my games awayyyy', which again is largely representative what you describe. JohnTron thrives and maintains his subscriber basis because, whilst lots of people have spoken out about it, lots of people simply don't care or think it's an issue.
I'm sure it's not intended to come across this way, but I always feel in situations like this it's better to focus on there being a problem within the gaming community with discrimination than being overly concerned with reputational damage to the gaming community because of said discrimination existing.
Well to be fair, generally people *are* attacking people who like x stuff to; it's not just projection. Critiques of a video game for being sexist, for instance, never say "but hey you can keep enjoying it, we don't judge you for it all all no-sure." It's usually explicit or implicit judgement on who consumes it.
That doesn't absolve the knee-jerk, disproportionate responses or a lot of gamers essentially proving those critiques correct by their terrible behavior, but I find the idea that there's no value judgment connected to it laughable. The whole idea of why that stuff is problematic hinges on the idea that it negatively affects people who consume it, after all. Otherwise, why are you getting upset about someone else's preferences?
If only that stupid GAME_JAM reality show hadn't failed, and he hadn't met Zoe Quinn there, hadn't gone down the anti-SJW/anti-PC/gamergate, hadn't retweeted a NSFW comic of a gamergate gangbang, hadn't teamed up with alt-righters, hadn't said "retarded" maybe this wouldn't have happened? This scandal has been 3 years in the making.
2014:
To white nationalism in 2017:
I've been blind for years, wow.
If you never follow people whose work you like on social media, it's pretty easy to remain blind to their foibles for a lot longer. It's just the next step up from perusing Uncle Jim's Facebook feed and realizing the stuff he posts is terribly ___.
mullet2000
Member
I actually watched the Destiny interview after hearing about it so much for the last week.
Holy shit, it was worse than I imagined.
Holy shit, it was worse than I imagined.
dantevsninjas
Member
This dude should be a shield in BotW; he manages to deflect for almost 5 minutes straight without breaking.
Lionel Richie
Member
No, there's nothing with the hobby that inherently makes people into this regressive assholes you are portraying. Some people within the community are that, you could argue correctly that a lot of people are, but correlation does not imply causation and we should fight against the people who are actively bad people instead of fighting the whole demographic. Not that I think we should because it's the right thing to do, but because it's the most likely way to defeat this issue. Blame the people who do wrong, don't blame the whole demographic or you're going to get pushback that strengthens the questionable behavior. Same applies on every issue in our society.
If people were aware that Jontron was a douchebag, maybe you'd be right. But in this scenario it's likely most people who were his fans (and I'm not in that group because I always thought Game Grumps sucked ass and his videos were not for me) were unaware about this. If he continues his career as if nothing happened (which is definitely a possibility), then yeah we need to look at the part of the community that allows that.
grim-tales
Member
Youtube comments can be toxic. They don't seem to have a problem with him saying black people are genetically more likely to be criminals, and that foreigners "dilute the gene pool". What??
MrJoobJoob
Member
Not sure if already posted here, but this is on point:
https://twitter.com/FoldableHuman/status/841884691452043267
https://twitter.com/FoldableHuman/status/841884691452043267
Lol.
klabautermann
Member
How much deeper does this hole go, Jon?
As deep as he's willing to let his ignorance take him.
Also said the Richest Black man commits more crime than the Poorest white man. And those are facts.
Sounds like a terrible solution to me. Here's an image I downloaded from 8chan during Gamergate's height:
(Bonus points if you noticed that the hand clasping is based of anti-Semitic propaganda images.)
"Issues" within the gaming sphere - which are really just people being upset with trivial things - are tied to conspiracy theories and used to promote right wing ideas. Why didn't your game get a perfect score? Because the feminists are controlling the media, and oppressed men need to fight back.
The fact that gaming's demographic was a boy's club and has now widened has left a whole bunch of those anchors that alt right folks can cling to and use to spread their ideas. That's a problem in gaming culture, and we're not going to solve it by ignoring the issues in the culture, especially because people hoping to spread hatred aren't going to ignore them. It's important keep them framed within gaming culture.
AtomskEater
Member
I keep wondering if this also counts for black women. What's Oprah got going on?
Fucking lol that last bit. Lookin at you TB.
Darryl M R
Member
This has to be a jab at TotalBiscuit right?
Global drug cartel queen of course, who do you think El Chapo works for?
FOLLOW THE MONEY!
Oh, snap
MrJoobJoob
Member
We must do everything in our power to get Matt Lees to the top of the pyramid.
gamergate is basically old conversative conspiracies grafted onto another industry
jack_package_200
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