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[Kronotech]

Why are people so confused as to how 17 is able to keep up with SSB Goku now? Have you been spying on him all these years he's been missing? Do you know for a fact that he was not training but "only protecting the wildlife"?

1. We don't know what we haven't seen (e.g. characters training) and that doesn't mean it never happened
2. Stop losing sleep over how unbelievable a cartoon is
3. You're not thinking 4th dimensionally

 

[ZeroTheShadow]

Man, Toyotaru really is putting Trunks in the back seat of his own arc. Unless something big happens in chapter 24, Trunks pretty much spent the entire arc just getting his ass handed to him.

 

[ElFly]

Why are people so confused as to how 17 is able to keep up with SSB Goku now? Have you been spying on him all these years he's been missing? Do you know for a fact that he was not training but "only protecting the wildlife"?

1. We don't know what we haven't seen (e.g. characters training) and that doesn't mean it never happened
2. Stop losing sleep over how unbelievable a cartoon is
3. You're not thinking 4th dimensionally

y'all better not get angry at me in three weeks

well, Muten Roshi was stronger than Goku when he was introduced...what's so weird that he is on SSB level now? you don't know if he has been training off camera

besides it says Muten Roshi right there in the name. Invincible. Cannot be vinced. Y'all jelly it's just a cartoon

 

[ZeroTheShadow]

Why are people so confused as to how 17 is able to keep up with SSB Goku now? Have you been spying on him all these years he's been missing? Do you know for a fact that he was not training but "only protecting the wildlife"?

1. We don't know what we haven't seen (e.g. characters training) and that doesn't mean it never happened
2. Stop losing sleep over how unbelievable a cartoon is
3. You're not thinking 4th dimensionally

What ever dude. Trunks spent 17 years training in between appearances & everyone was pissed he was strong too.

 

[Slaythe]

What ever dude. Trunks spent 17 years training in between appearances & everyone was pissed he was strong too.

People got pissed precisely because he was shit after 17 years and reached SSB within 4seconds because Zamasu said mean things to him.

But when his mom got killed in front of him, fuck it, not rage inducing enough.

 

[Romars202129]

Sure, but Beerus is a major character for DBS so I can go along with it. This feels like a cheap nostalgia cash in.

"Oh, hey, you guys remember 17? He's back and he's on Goku's level now, who has been training with the God of Destruction. How does this make sense, you ask? ¯_(&#12484_/¯"



Again, if they're fully organic at this point, why are they considered androids?

I dont think 17's just fanservice, for the record. I think he might just have a pivotal role this arc.
That said, this kind of silly power up was already established with Frieza so...
For the record, I fully expect an explanation for this power up. Lets wait a bit. Remember, even Freiza had more explanation than just 'I havent been just sitting aroun'.

 

[ElFly]

you don't know how good was the relationship of Future Bulma and Future Trunks between androids/black

maybe she was an asshole to his son off camera

ever noticed how he was still single at 30? maybe because he had an overbearing mom for a single son

 

[Slaythe]

I mean if we get more about it, it will be when 18 sees him.

While Goku doesn't care because he had never met 17, the others will have to ask him how it happened.

 

[Slaythe]

you don't know how good was the relationship of Future Bulma and Future Trunks between androids/black

maybe she was an asshole to his son off camera

ever noticed how he was still single at 30? maybe because he had an overbearing mom for a single son

No.

He was single because he killed bae.

The girls from the future never quite forgave him.

 

[ElFly]

I mean if we get more about it, it will be when 18 sees him.

While Goku doesn't care because he had never met 17, the others will have to ask him how it happened.

maybe he is friends with Senbei Norimaki -and as a ranger takes care of robo bear- and has been drinking Robovita-A

No.

He was single because he killed bae.

The girls from the future never quite forgave him.

but he stole the bandanna which was half the charm

 

[Fj0823]

which dragonball villain is the most erotic

Zamasu,he really wanted to fuck himself

 

[ArchedThunder]

you don't know how good was the relationship of Future Bulma and Future Trunks between androids/black

maybe she was an asshole to his son off camera

ever noticed how he was still single at 30? maybe because he had an overbearing mom for a single son

I don't think he's single anymore.

 

[Romars202129]

I mean, they made his recruitment a two parter. I dont see why we shouldnt expect something next ep.

 

[ElFly]

I don't think he's single anymore.

because Future Bulma died

QED

 

[Host Samurai]

I wonder why Future Trunks just never mentions to try to gather the Super Dragonballs in his time now and wish everyone back.

 

[Daemul]

How hard is it to buy that Goku can hold back as a SSJ/ SSG. He had sex with Chichi as a SSJ, didn't kill her.

The reason why people aren't buying it is because the idea of Goku holding back against Krillin in Blue when he's already stronger (or was believed to to be stronger) than Krillin in Base form is hilarious.

It would literally imply that SSB Goku is suppressing his power level below that of his base form in order for Krillen to compete.

 

[ElFly]

so I assume Yamcha will be left to take care of 17's island?

given that he was setup as expecting Goku to ask for his help and all, gotta guess that Goku next week will say "ok I will get someone to take your place" etc etc

 

[Slaythe]

so I assume Yamcha will be left to take care of 17's island?

given that he was setup as expecting Goku to ask for his help and all, gotta guess that Goku next week will say "ok I will get someone to take your place" etc etc

Yeah sure let's get the one guy that could actually get killed by poachers.

 

[ArchedThunder]

The reason why people aren't buying it is because the idea of Goku holding back against Krillin in Blue when he's already stronger (or was believed to to be stronger) than Krillin in Base form is hilarious.

It would literally imply that SSB Goku is suppressing his power level below that of his base form in order for Krillen to compete.

Because he only went Blue to see if Krillin had the courage to stay in fights with fighters way stronger than him.

 

[ElFly]

Yeah sure let's get the one guy that could actually get killed by poachers.

maybe they will give him a gun

 

[Real Hero]

That Krillin episode was when I realised the show is smarter than lots of its audience.

 

[Hellwarden]

I mean, doesn't android 17 have unlimited energy because he's an android?

Considering that, is it that hard to believe he caught up to Goku considering he could train with little effort?

 

[Romars202129]

The reason why people aren't buying it is because the idea of Goku holding back against Krillin in Blue when he's already stronger (or was believed to to be stronger) than Krillin in Base form is hilarious.

It would literally imply that SSB Goku is suppressing his power level below that of his base form in order for Krillen to compete.

Tourney will have all kinds. If he liquifies someone krillin level while fighting Jiren, hes done. Same with a Jiren or Hit when it comes to krillin. It was good training for the both of them.

 

[Crocodile]

This thread has been a bit hard to follow since the most recent episode and I agree that power scaling has been especially wonky or poorly justified recently. Above else though, I gotta say LOL at some of the "comics" posted

 

[Fj0823]

Because he only went Blue to see if Krillin had the courage to stay in fights with fighters way stronger than him.

I honestly don't understand how people miss this.

That was clearly the intention.

At this point I'm sure people only watch Dragon Ball to see people punch each other and then make up numbers

 

[Slaythe]

I mean, doesn't android 17 have unlimited energy because he's an android?

Considering that, is it that hard to believe he caught up to Goku considering he could train with little effort?

Some people have their own pre conceive notions about who can get stronger and how.

This is partly due to last 20 years only focusing on saiyans.

It doesn't excuse them though, it's getting quite obnoxious on other forums/twitter.

 

[B-Dubs]

I mean, doesn't android 17 have unlimited energy because he's an android?

Considering that, is it that hard to believe he caught up to Goku considering he could train with little effort?

.

 

[Fj0823]

Some people have their own pre conceive notions about who can get stronger and how.

This is partly due to last 20 years only focusing on saiyans.

It doesn't excuse them though, it's getting quite obnoxious on other forums/twitter.

I remember people being offended that "a cat" was stronger than muh Goku when BOTG premiered in my country.

 

[Host Samurai]

I mean, doesn't android 17 have unlimited energy because he's an android?

Considering that, is it that hard to believe he caught up to Goku considering he could train with little effort?

Just go with it. Assume that he's been training and his cybernetic parts helped give him a massive boost in power if he is around SSB level. Just remember Frieza went from being weaker than a SS1 than reached god levels in 4 months with training. 17 already has a much bigger head start and 10 years of training stacked up.

 

[Daemul]

Because he only went Blue to see if Krillin had the courage to stay in fights with fighters way stronger than him.

I agree famalam, I was just showing why many other people didn't buy the holding back thing specifically.

I'm personally 100% fine with what is happening in the show right now, I'm sick and fucking tired of everything being focused on Goku and Vegeta, time for other people to get the spotlight, power scaling be fucking damned.

 

[Erigu]

When was it dated?

May 2, 2014.
(Slaythe didn't post the right page though.)

 

[Icyflamez96]

LOL

 

[ReplacementPelican]

Spoiler

Next arc? Couldn't you see Beerus getting pissed at Goku for almost destroying the universe because he wanted to fight strong opponents? I could see Beerus as the next main villain.

Spoiler

How would that make Beerus a villain? I'd be inclined to agree with him

 

[L Thammy]

what is this bullshit "the androids are organic" retcon garbage

 

[LSauchelli]

BTW, the "android blueprints" that Trunks and Krillin got to the Briefs clearly stated that the modifications were "bio-mechanical" in nature.

I looked it up, just to see if I remembered wrong. Yup, episode 365 of the manga.

There's also the fact Cell was also described as an android, even though he's clearly also fully biological in nature.

 

[Slaythe]

Romars and Hero. I hadn't seen your answers.

It's coming.

 

[Romars202129]

what is this bullshit "the androids are organic" retcon garbage

I mean, the fact they even had to make this scene.
But theres a difference between 100% organic and cyborgs.

 

[L Thammy]

y'all better not get angry at me in three weeks

I won't be mad. Roshi-jin are an endangered species; we need to stick together.

I honestly don't understand how people miss this.

That was clearly the intention.

At this point I'm sure people only watch Dragon Ball to see people punch each other and then make up numbers

I literally cannot get an erection unless I see kung fu lasers and try to quantify them. It's a legitimate disorder, look it up.

 

[LSauchelli]

I wonder if some of the #17 and #18 biological modifications carried over to their kids.

 

[L Thammy]

BTW, the "android blueprints" that Trunks and Krillin got to the Briefs clearly stated that the modifications were "bio-mechanical" in nature.

I looked it up, just to see if I remembered wrong. Yup, episode 365 of the manga.

There's also the fact Cell was also described as an android, even though he's clearly also fully biological in nature.

Totally forgot about that, so I looked it up. Yeah, that is pretty straightforward right there:

 

[Slaythe]

Whatever the word was, it was the same word used to describe 19, 20, and 16 right? So it was natural to assume they were just like them. 17 had blue prints for crying out loud. You cant blame everything on the word android.
More than that... just being someone's creation suggests there power isnt natural, and therefore cannot be increased naturally.
Im all for it, for the record. Its a good fitting retcon that doesnt really contradict anything too bad.

Those are very good points.

I mean, they would have been, very good points, in the imaginary world where this didn't happen :

Can't believe you dared to throw the blue prints in my face while ignoring what the blue prints said.

They are living organisms, there is no reason to believe they can't improve.

The japanese terms for all those creations is "Artificial humans", not "androids". It makes much more sense.

Goku is a main character and wasn't missing for the entire last arc of DBZ nor almost all of DBS until recently?

What does that have to do with anything ? When Goku died he still came back stronger than everybody else because of what he acquired "off screen".

Trunks and Frieza are major characters.

First of all, that's a rather questionable point (no offense), so only major characters have the right to be relevant now ?

But anyway, 17 is now a major character, so problem solved.

Because that is what I asked and what I ultimately care about? It's clear Toriyama stopped giving a fuck at some point.

Yeah K. Read up there what was said in the manga.

So if they're entirely organic why are they considered androids at this point?

Because they're not. They are "artificial humans". And because Gero called all his creatures the same.

If he was that cocky and cared about getting stronger why does he give a damn about being a park ranger?

Because he met android 16 who loved nature, and his view of the world changed after he got murdered. That doesn't mean he can't keep his pride while being a park ranger. WTF ?

Sure, but Beerus is a major character for DBS so I can go along with it. This feels like a cheap nostalgia cash in.

"Oh, hey, you guys remember 17? He's back and he's on Goku's level now, who has been training with the God of Destruction. How does this make sense, you ask? ¯\_(&#12484_/¯"

It's ok, 17 is a major character now, like Trunks and Frieza, so all is good bb.

Again, if they're fully organic at this point, why are they considered androids?

I wonder if some of the #17 and #18 biological modifications carried over to their kids.

Considering Cell could use them thanks to their biology, it's highly possible indeed.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

All I'm saying is when my boys bust out super saiyan blue and start going toe to toe with goku and vegeta when they couldn't do it fused I don't wanna here shyt

 

[Slaythe]

All I'm saying is when my boys bust out super saiyan blue and start going toe to toe with goku and vegeta when they couldn't do it fused I don't wanna here shyt

Nobody else has actually gotten the blue form though, not even future trunks, so if present trunks gets it, you'll hear people whine.

 

[Romars202129]

Totally forgot about that, so I looked it up. Yeah, that is pretty straightforward right there:

Truthfully I did not know the biological stuff was from this far back. But this still doesnt say they can train to get stronger. Gero put parts inside them that gave them super powers. Its still a leap to think pushups would increase that power even with this.
Its not like gero put the parts in, had them train, and then they had the power. Until he said it was possible, its pretty debateable it was. And nothing in the rest of z expanded on it. And a trained up 18 would have really helped the Buu saga

 

[Kyzer]

Yall still trying to figure this shit out huh

 

[Kagari]

All I'm saying is when my boys bust out super saiyan blue and start going toe to toe with goku and vegeta when they couldn't do it fused I don't wanna here shyt

Don't worry they'll get as strong as Blue without actually getting it. Same with Ultimate Gohan.

 

[ElFly]

toriyama should just jump to giving people stands and save us the problems

 

[ArchedThunder]

All I'm saying is when my boys bust out super saiyan blue and start going toe to toe with goku and vegeta when they couldn't do it fused I don't wanna here shyt

At this point I'm starting to think Blue will stay exclusive to Goku and Vegeta and the other Saiyans will get other stuff, like Gohan taking his Ultimate form to new heights. Don't know what Goten and Trunks could get, unless they both get Ikari somehow.

 

[weshes195]

Yall still trying to figure this shit out huh

Even after decades and countless satire people still don't understand thatn compared to the need to the plot, power levels don't mean shit.

 

[Fulminator]

The reason why people aren't buying it is because the idea of Goku holding back against Krillin in Blue when he's already stronger (or was believed to to be stronger) than Krillin in Base form is hilarious.

It would literally imply that SSB Goku is suppressing his power level below that of his base form in order for Krillen to compete.

Well blues whole schtick beyond power is ki control, so in some way it could be easier for Goku to suppress his ki in blue form than in base form

Maybe that's just mental gymnastics though lol