ViolentP
Member
Why people want to be artificially sanctioned for using their imagination during a video game, I will never understand.
Probably because this is an inaccurate representation of the draw many have towards trophies.
Why people want to be artificially sanctioned for using their imagination during a video game, I will never understand.
That's your response? A witty one-liner? So edgy! Lol, thanks for conceding.
Counter argument amirite? Okay.gif
I thought you were out. Welcome back.No thanks. Keep playing your shitty games developed by shitty psychologists capitalizing not on good game design but addiction models.
Before trophies we had cheats codes, hidden menus, extra costumes, secrets and a lot of cool stuff never seen again after the PS2/X1 gen.
I thought you were out. Welcome back.
I'm under no illusion it'll ever go away, but to argue that trophies don't change the game experience for people who aren't interested in them is disingenuous and ignores historical context.
This. The way it used to be, if you wanted to roll around and wreck the world at max level you could just download someone's save file. To the extent anything like that is possible now, you risk getting your console banned for cheating to protect the perceived value of other people's imaginary internet points.
I'm under no illusion it'll ever go away, but to argue that trophies don't change the game experience for people who aren't interested in them is disingenuous and ignores historical context.
Not a chance, I am glad there are no trophies. Trophies just become a checklist of stuff you feel like you have to do (if you care about them), 99% of the time they are not fun.
There is nothing inherent about Trophies that keeps you in any paid ecosystem, that's a ludicrous argument. There was a mass exodus of Microsoft customers to Sony's ecosystem which meant abandoning any achievements they had behind them. Any argument that achievements are intended to retain customers has already been disproven by how many MS customers migrated to Sony.. Good policy retains customers, not an achievement system.
Aren't they easily ignored if not interested though?
Not a chance, I am glad there are no trophies. Trophies just become a checklist of stuff you feel like you have to do (if you care about them), 99% of the time they are not fun.
this was literally your response
It's like you are missing the most bare minimum of self awareness. ��
My arguments have already been stated and none have been negated. Sorry not sorry that you don't agree, do you know how opinions work? all counter arguments boil down to people not happy about things other people enjoy.
Probably because this is an inaccurate representation of the draw many have towards trophies.
It's not inaccurate at all. It's a cynical interpretation that you don't agree with. That's fair.
Yes but I don't like them so no one should have them.
I just don't understand. Why are fanboys so irrational and have such fervor defending a garbage anti-customer company like Nintendo that can't even provide a simple trophy system that has zero negative impact on games? I just can't.
I just don't understand. Why are fanboys so irrational and have such fervor defending a garbage anti-customer company like Nintendo that can't even provide a simple trophy system that has zero negative impact on games? I just can't.
I don't want these data points available for developers. I want them to be creative and not use these data points as it contributes to "me too" game design.
I personally think Trophies are one of the worst things that happened to gaming and people just eat it up and cry if they aren't there.
Before trophies we had cheats codes, hidden menus, extra costumes, secrets and a lot of cool stuff never seen again after the PS2/X1 gen.
Now we have trophies and paid DLC, no cheat codes, no hidden menus no nothing. Trophies don't even do anything at all for you. No free gear no unlocking, no nothing. They basically made people happy about a tiny picture pop up.
The only game that has done it justice is Bloodborne where if you platinum they give you a PS4 theme or something. I just don't get why people defend them without thinking what they took away.
You're trying way too hard. That wasn't my response, nice cherry pick. I quoted an entire paragraph of you throwing a fit over someones opinion in response to you saying you were only providing "counter-arguments." That entire paragraph embodied everything about your rant that was being responded to. Your response is "you got nothing." Uh, what?
I tell you if you know how opinions work, which is a valid criticism to your rant, and you follow by asking me the EXACT same sentence verbatim in all your responses.
I am ending this right here because you seemingly lack the comprehensional skills for a valid argument, and have proven my point without realizing it. Plus, this thread is already full of back and forths from everyone. PM me if you wish to continue, otherwise go ahead with your last word having, edgy witty retort.
The only reason I wish there were trophies/achievements would be to push me in the direction of some things that I might otherwise never find. Like if there was an achievement for finding all 25 stables or whatever...I'm pulling that number out of my ass btw...I might be more inclined to go search them all out.
Wow. I never made this connection. It all makes sense now.
Bingo.
The only reason I wish there were trophies/achievements would be to push me in the direction of some things that I might otherwise never find. Like if there was an achievement for finding all 25 stables or whatever...I'm pulling that number out of my ass btw...I might be more inclined to go search them all out.
It makes no sense. What does make sense is that they removed free bonus items so they could sell them on PSN and XBL instead. You only need to look at what happened to aesthetic bonuses to get your answer on this. They were free now they're not.
Plenty of games do this. I saw scenes in portal 2 I would have otherwise missed. I engaged in a secret boss battle in Nier Automata I would have otherwise missed if it weren't for the trophy to find and upgrade every weapon.
Opponents of trophies are ignoring these type of trophies to convenience their argument.
You're going to need to explain literally everything out of this sentence.Nope , trophies are a distractor , most used for dudebro comparations
Nope , trophies are a distractor , most used for dudebro comparations.
"Dudebro"
How are trophies distracting when preferably they have an option to turn them off?
It seems like they already have a preconceived notion on what trophies represent and that notion is a very negative one. I put about 80 hours into FFXV and I loved it but I wanted more. That trophy list gave me direction on further content I could capitalize on. I don't care how angry some people may get, I will not apologize for seeing the value in that.
Wow. I never made this connection. It all makes sense now.
This. The way it used to be, if you wanted to roll around and wreck the world at max level you could just download someone's save file. To the extent anything like that is possible now, you risk getting your console banned for cheating to protect the perceived value of other people's imaginary internet points.
I'm under no illusion it'll ever go away, but to argue that trophies don't change the game experience for people who aren't interested in them is disingenuous and ignores historical context.
They give you a reason to do other things in a game besides completing it. I never did anything else before the system was invented. Finish game, see credits, move on.
I think it's actually the best thing that happened to gaming and I find it sad that Nintendo didn't bother to implement something like that with the Switch.
The industry changed as a whole. Unlockables and cheats are not as common as in the past, but neither is adventure / platform games where they fit better.
this is a case of correlation does not equal causation.
Being able to turn something off doesn't mean it isn't inherently a distraction when on, just like being able to ignore most the cut scenes in BotW doesn't mean that the voice acting suddenly isn't shit. Optional things can be bad.
A few weeks ago, I was going through my older trophies and revisited my Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas trophies. Each tile is a funny little picture with the vault guy that kind of illustrates the action or quest line with a cheesy joke or reference as the title. I used timestamps to trace my journey through the game, and the pictures jogged my memory of the quests, like fighting a horde of giant ants or hilariously walking out of the Dead Money casino ridiculously overburdened with gold bars. Made me nostalgic for the games, and now I'm about halfway through Fallout 4 as a result.
But yeah trophies are a blight on gaming and should be expunged from the earth entirely
I really don't get the active dislike against trophies. If you don't care about them, that's fine, but you don't have to be against them for people that like them. I personally don't really care about my trophy level or anything, but if I really like a game, it feels nice to platinum it as an official completion sort of thing. I've always wished Nintendo would add something similar to all their games.
I don't think your comparison is valid. You're obliged to hear the voice acting if you want the story to be told to you. You can ignore trophies completely and it won't affect your gaming experience at all if you don't like 'em.
So I am against them because they do nothing and I think they ate into some cool stuff we used to get in the past.
The only game that IMO has a worthwhile platinum trophy is Bloodborne as you get something out of it. Don't know about any other examples.
If you and people that like them would advocate for a trohpy-reward system, even if it is like a stupid avatar pic, I would be all for trophies.
So would you?
I think there's a disingenuous nature to the argument that trophies are easily ignored, or at least I don't think it serves as a proper argument for them to exist in every single game.
For one, the argument that one can consciously choose to ignore them is not the point. The point is that trophies do have a psychological effect on the player (otherwise they wouldn't be there, because it would be a waste of development time), and it's more honest to recognize this and, from there, discuss how that effect fits into the design of any specific game in hindsight, then to tell people who don't want them in a specific game for specific reasons that they're "limiting choice" or otherwise being detrimental to others' experiences because "you can ignore it!"
Some of the psychological effect of trophies have been mentioned time and time again: as they're commonly implemented, they're skinner boxes that typically reward you for either mundane or incongruent tasks with a little notification and/or a log that you did the mundane or incongruent thing. This is likely to influence players to either A.) go out of their way to do even more mundane or incongruent things in order to keep attaining the positive reinforcement of merely earning an achievement, or B.) Make players who aren't so susceptible to that nonetheless aware of them anyway and have to adjust their experience accordingly by either outright avoiding doing things in the game or taking time adjusting the system options, both of which count as effects of their existence.
People have then explained time and time again that Breath of the Wild's greatest strength is that it deliberately decides not to overtly influence you to do anything that you wouldn't want to do outside of your own volition, and to be confident enough in itself that its design and inherent gameplay rewards are all players need to satisfy themselves. All it really does is tell you to destroy Ganon, and then after that it is hands off. It is both a deliberate callback to the first game in the franchise- made during a time where system-side achievements just didn't exist- and as Nintendo's take and counter to some of the modern characteristics and flaws of modern open-world gaming. To then advocate for the idea of putting achievements in such a game is simply antithetical to its goals and overall spirit. That's why people don't want them in Breath of the Wild.
Not everything that's "perfectly optional" belongs in every game. Not every game is for everybody. Not every game needs to uphold every single arbitrary standard of modern gaming just because every other game is doing it. There are literally thousands of games that offer achievements. Why do you need to insist that Breath of the Wild should gain them or is in any way obligated to, especially if your biggest defense of achievements is that they effectively don't matter and have no effect on anything? Well, if they have no effect, then you can live without them for one game.