Hell, you can get a laundry list of anime that fit this trope, since this and female childification are so prevalent in the medium. The shtick is a kind of perfect form of wish fulfillment for insecure, lonely otaku and their alt-right western counterparts.
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Born Sexy Yesterday
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Hell, you can get a laundry list of anime that fit this trope, since this and female childification are so prevalent in the medium. The shtick is a kind of perfect form of wish fulfillment for insecure, lonely otaku and their alt-right western counterparts.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
That's exactly what the final sentence says. You just don't like it.
Count Dookkake
Member
Lol, it literally does not, but you do you.
I don't "like" it, because it seems sloppy in comparison to the rest.
7DollarHagane
Banned
It's broadly true, depending on your age.
There's an element of fantasy involved here in "first love" and being young and discovering love, but with the experience of adulthood. "if i knew then what i know now" kind of thing. Most people have fond memories of their first flings and boyfriend/girlfriend in high school or college. That kind of excitement and discovery decreases natrually as you get older/married/etc. But you don't nostalgically remember the pain of rejection, cheating, and judgement that comes with many of those young adult/20s relationships.
Some innocence is not sexy, some is.
Some experience is sexy, some isn't.
I think figuring out which is healthy and which is creepy/unhealthy is part of growing up.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
huh. ok.
rokkerkory
Member
Awesome video and its so true. I wonder as males will we ever not be attracted to born sexy yesterday though?
4 is a cutie
Banned
Yeah I feel like I recognized this subconsciously and that's why that anime scenario always made me roll my eyes
7DollarHagane
Banned
There's a reason college seniors look forward to seeing the freshman class. It's not just a movie trope, this kind of thing happens with insecure men in real life all the time.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
I mean... yes?
I'm a male, and I'm not attracted to such characters, because it's creepy and gross to want to fuck someone like that. It's basically sexual abuse at that point.
7DollarHagane
Banned
I think that every weekend in every city in the world men go out to bars looking for women like this. They always have and always will. And some women play the role because they like the attention.
Messofanego
Banned
This was really well done, especially the angle of male fear for an equally experienced and smart woman. It's no wonder men brought up on sci-fi tend to not be able to deal with or shun women who are not submissive, are as intelligent if not more, and have past romantic history. Appreciate the positive examples like Cloud Atlas, I'd also add Ex Machina as subverting it.
A lot of young men are insecure around women with more sexual experience than them. If you are a late bloomer, that is going to be basically everyone (especially if they are attractive).
Bobby has brought up the predatory nature of the trope (and OG Star Trek definitely went there), but if we're looking at the Japanese examples, the male stars are just as likely to be hapless virgins with zero experience with women. This trope offers them a completely clueless dream girl with even less experience than they have
EDIT: The video does a good job pointing out that the male protagonist is often only special because he's the first man the Born Sexy Woman has really socialized with. She has literally zero expectations, so he can't fail to meet them.
Messofanego
Banned
Starman is brought up in the video actually, along with Pleasantville and Blast From The Past.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0thpEyEwi80#t=13m30s
Pleasantville is a good example to bring up, because Tobey Maguire's character desperately wanted to escape to a world where everyone was like this, because of his insecurities in his actual life. He's supposed to be the sort of guy the trope appeals to.
Ah. Havent finished it.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
Don't hate.
What is your dad's cinematic body of work though?
Don't worry Count, I kind of cringed at that last statement too. The video did such a great job at explaining why innocence is sexy only to conclude the opposite is true. This trope may be gross, creepy, sexist or whatever, but the reality is many guys find it sexy, whether we like it or not.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
oh boy
4 is a cutie
Banned
adamsappel
Member
CrimsonSquall
Member
Just be first theory
Hades Hotgun
Banned
Looking for validation.
To add to what other have said about how Ex Machina subverts the trope:
It's not only about Ava, Caleb originally thought Kyoko was human. He was only interested in Ava thinking he could shape her.
What is the crap? Like freshman ladies cant choose who they date? Its pretty common that some women prefer older guys
Back to the thread. This trope is weird, i only made half way through but the only movie i had see was fifth element. I guess i dont watch enough sci fi?
Jaguar Victory
Member
Yeah. It's quite common in anime, so I was surprised that there wasn't already some sort of formalized name for it. It's quite creepy when you think about it, because the male has almost all the power in that situation -- he has a very very strong influence on her personality, love interests...ect.
whatsinaname
Member
Forrest Gump maybe?
PSY・S;235235464 said:
I absolutely loathe this trope but I won't particularly shame people who enjoy this kind of power fantasy. The better attitude to have here is to say it's okay to have this fantasy as long as you recognize that it's not applicable in today's world.
jakonovski
Member
Best to separate the art from the artist if you want to enjoy things. Fifth Element is still a pretty good movie.
BlastProcessing
Member
Encino Man is a really interesting variation. At it's core it's still about giving normal dudes a partner that they could not normally get. The wish fulfillment in Encino Man is based around the idea of forming a close friendship with the super-popular jock instead of a romantic relationship. Like the female examples, Fraser only becomes their friends because they are his only conduit to understanding the world.
Then, through that relationship, Sean Astin still gets the girl as well. So it's sort of a High School wish fulfillment twofer.
Yes, that's him.
I see it more as fantasizing the perfect woman that doesn't come with all the baggage of life experience and I always thought that was the trope, but I can see where this is coming from but maybe to someone that thinks that way it can elicit that feeling. Relationships are not perfect because of each persons experience in life differing so the trope is written for men to fantasize about having the perfect woman and having a naive woman with mo experience the man can have everything they ever wanted. Definitely written for men but that's how I always viewed it.
I don't think so - you'd have to ask the female or gay male viewership whether they found Forrest's childish naiveté actually attractive and not just endearing.
Would Rocky from the Rocky Horror picture show fit the bill?
He's a recently created, highly sexualized hunk of a man - though i don't know if Janet is attracted to him because of his body and because, or in spite of him not being her intellectual equal.
StrangeRoboMemory
Member
I've always enjoyed Besson's films and style, but wow, that personal life. Dude has some issues.
SkeptiMism
Member
Yeah I wouldn't blame individuals for liking it. Not any more fucked up than people liking all sorts of different porn (a lot of which could be considered very problematic).
The problem comes when the idea is common enough in society (and thus we seeing it as a trope). I would like to see less shit like it and more mature questioning of things like male sexuality.
Yeah Forrest Gump might be a good example in some ways. Forrest is the naive dude there and while Jenny loves him as a friend and likes him otherwise, she doesn't really love him that way (despite having sex with him). He certainly isn't the dream guy for her.
A lof of essays could be written about the dynamic of Forrest and Jenny.
Why you gotta add the alt-right part, it's possible to be a lonely insecure western equivalent of an otaku without being racist or alt-right.
AnathemicOne
Banned
I've dated a naive woman in my life before, that shit wasn't fun. This trope is definitely annoying to see constantly play out (especially in anime which I'm an avid watcher of) when you have first-hand experience of the reality of such.
Messofanego
Banned
Well, just wait until those otakus start publicly idolising Japan as the perfect country where it's racially homogenous and they're proud of their race where there's no call for diversity by SJWs but why can't white people be proud of theirs, oh and they'd sure like a Japanese submissive woman just like their anime.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Great video about something I never really thought about before.
You'll lose your mind trying to drill into his skull. It's best to just kinda overlook him.
You'll lose your mind trying to drill into his skull. It's best to just kinda overlook him.
Nostremitus
Member
I don't have time to watch this yet, but damn, I'd never thought of it like that.
The only male version I can think of is Starman...
The only male version I can think of is Starman...
SkeptiMism
Member
I'm not sure if I believe that really. A lot of socially well adjusted people with decent self esteem have a lot of fucked up thoughts deep inside. And it's such a basic form of patriarchy to want to control women in one way or another - and in a way this is partly that (teaching them how to do things and basically be whatever you want them to be) - that it's not a surprise that a lot of men, even ones who are seemingly completely normal, have fantasies like this and are more or less attracted to it.
Not everyone no, but probably quite a lot. It's unlikely that it would be such a trope otherwise either.
Starman is brought up in the video. The point is that while the Starman is the naive dude there and Jenny falls for him, she doesn't fall for him because of his childishness, but in spite of it. His childish behavior isn't what's attractive.
I agree with Count Dookkake. Despite Bobby's silly armchair psychology, it's entirely possible to find the statement to be feeling a bit tagged on, while agreeing with the video.
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