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Mass Effect Fans Donate $80,000 to Charity to Help Change the Ending of Mass Effect 3

MechaX

Member
They can demand all they want but I hope it never happens. Since when do gamers have any say in how a storyline concludes? I really hope Bioware doesn't cave because it'll just be bad for the gaming industry as a whole. I do think it's great there's a donation for charity but it's unfortunate it's this cause.

The slippery slope argument doesn't really work in this case, especially since this is the first time in the gaming community that a reaction to something has been this strong. Instead, it shows that Bioware is indeed willing to listen to its fans when the moment really counts. To be honest, lots of developers say that they are willing, but how many of them would actually do that even when sitting upon mountains of cash?

The biggest point of all of this is that it's about sending a message. Bioware is well in their prerogative to decline to change the ending. Whether or not this risks negative implications in the future is up to Bioware entirely, especially since the buyers vote with their wallets. If this issue really is something very core to the buyer-seller relationship between Bioware and a fair amount of gamers, that's something to consider as well. Even mega-corporations eventually have to come down and say "we fucked up" to their consumers in the face of a big incident simply because their consumers is their life blood. This is not to say that everyone is forced to do this or that all business can or should do this, but I'm just not seeing why the gaming press seems to think that the gaming industry is somehow immune to this.
 
It's already been done to Fallout 3. Anyways I see Bioware not giving a shit about artistic integrity because they want to make more money. Valve also changed the ending to Portal 1 I believe to hype up the then upcoming Portal 2.

Woah woah woah.

Valve makes good things.
 
That certainly is not 'quick'. I have never beaten a Mass Effect game, is the ending just stupid? Or is it one of those 'it was all a dream' things?

Can it be summarized into 2-3 sentenced?

Whoops, glazed over the word quick in your post lulz

spoilers for a terrible ending below

Basically the entire universe is destroyed at the hands of mystical space magic and everything we've done through three games is pointless
 

DTKT

Member
ding ding ding

WHY NEXT TIME. We live in a world where you can improve on content you actually published.

Why not try to fix it now?

The slippery slope argument doesn't work. Mass Effect is the only series where the fanbase was invested on a single character they created and played throughout the 3 games. They failed to live up to the expections of the fan base and are now paying for it. I doubt it will ever happen again.

It's a "perfect conditions" thing.
 

Gestahl

Member
I went into it knowing a few vague spoilers about the possible fates of a few characters, but knowing nothing about the ending save "it's shit" I went into it with lowered expectations.

They still managed to completely whiff. Luckily, I had no intention of supporting Bioware afterwards anyway, so the fact that Mass Effect is dead doesn't bother me as much as it appears to be bothering most people.
 

RDreamer

Member
Self-criticism is a good thing. Acknowledge that they fuck up and they realize that they can do better next time.

It is a good thing, but actively demanding that an artist out and say their own work is shit is crossing a line I think. You can demand they change it for the good of the people that bought their product all you want, but demanding that they themselves call their own work shit is just beyond the pale. It strikes me as beyond condescending and like you're looking for affirmation that you're correct above all else. It makes me feel like you just want to pump up your own ego to feel good.
 
Blizzard does it all the time, it's called retcon.

I can't imagine Valve doing it because they have competent writers.

Valve patched the ending to Portal....

Edit: Someone already mentioned that, oh well.

I enjoyed every minute of Mass Effect 3 up until the end. I got my money's worth a thousand times over and an unsatisfying ending sucks, but I don't care if they change it or not.

Bioware knows what they did here and they knew they'd have to deal with the crazy fan backlash. I wouldn't pay for a different ending, but I would be interested in a completely candid making of / post mortem of what it took to make this trilogy and why the ending is so screwed up compared to the rest of the series.
 

Alchemy

Member
That certainly is not 'quick'. I have never beaten a Mass Effect game, is the ending just stupid? Or is it one of those 'it was all a dream' things?

Can it be summarized into 2-3 sentenced?

You spend all three games making huge galaxy changing decisions that end up meaning nothing.

The only difference between the forced ending choices is the color of an explosion.

Space ghost kid controls synthetics to kill organics so organics don't make synthetics to kill themselves.
 

chris121580

Member
The slippery slope argument doesn't really work in this case, especially since this is the first time in the gaming community that a reaction to something has been this strong. Instead, it shows that Bioware is indeed willing to listen to its fans when the moment really counts. To be honest, lots of developers say that they are willing, but how many of them would actually do that even when sitting upon mountains of cash?

The biggest point of all of this is that it's about sending a message. Bioware is well in their prerogative to decline to change the ending. Whether or not this risks negative implications in the future is up to Bioware entirely, especially since the buyers vote with their wallets. If this issue really is something very core to the buyer-seller relationship between Bioware and a fair amount of gamers, that's something to consider as well. Even mega-corporations eventually have to come down and say "we fucked up" to their consumers in the face of a big incident simply because their consumers is their life blood. This is not to say that everyone is forced to do this or that all business can or should do this, but I'm just not seeing why the gaming press seems to think that the gaming industry is somehow immune to this.
You make some valid points which is nice to actually see on this board for a change. I just feel like even if Bioware does decide to change the ending that you're still going to have people with a constant chip on their shoulder because they didn't get the ending they wanted the first time. I mean is it really going to feel like the true ending if it's just some tacked on DLC because the fans complained and got what they want? You will still have people constantly bitching and you'll also have people bitching about the new ending as well. It really is a lose/lose situation no matter how this ends up
 

MechaX

Member
It is a good thing, but actively demanding that an artist out and say their own work is shit is crossing a line I think. You can demand they change it for the good of the people that bought their product all you want, but demanding that they themselves call their own work shit is just beyond the pale. It strikes me as beyond condescending and like you're looking for affirmation that you're correct above all else. It makes me feel like you just want to pump up your own ego to feel good.

As we are seeing now, things are a little bit different when it comes to an interactive medium that defines itself as an atypical communication between player choice and interactive experience that most people spent 90+ hours on over the period of five years.

You make some valid points which is nice to actually see on this board for a change. I just feel like even if Bioware does decide to change the ending that you're still going to have people with a constant chip on their shoulder because they didn't get the ending they wanted the first time. I mean is it really going to feel like the true ending if it's just some tacked on DLC because the fans complained and got what they want? You will still have people constantly bitching and you'll also have people bitching about the new ending as well. It really is a lose/lose situation no matter how this ends up

I agree that changing the ending won't solve everything, as there will always be the taint that ME was "that game with that ending." Hell, there is even the seldom discussed possibly of any new ending being even worse than the current one. But even at the worst possible outcome, I think it represents a learning opportunity that the gaming industry really needs as a whole. It would show that realities of disappointment are very, very close things even in favored series. It shows the developers that perhaps they need to think just a bit more about how they're treating the consumer-seller dynamic as opposed to their beginning and end-goal mostly being "screw the player with DLC." And it will show the gaming media that perhaps there really is a very different way that they view things in compared to the gaming public, casual or hardcore alike.
 

Vamphuntr

Member
How dare they compromise their artistic integrity to make fans happy!

I like how people defend the artistic integrity of Bioware while themselves clearly show they don't care. Cutting an important character from the ME 3 base game and making it as a 10$ DLC? No problem for them.

Retconning the story of DAO so that even if you are dead you can import a save in DAO Awakening and be magically alive for no reason? No Problem.
 

hamchan

Member
It is a good thing, but actively demanding that an artist out and say their own work is shit is crossing a line I think. You can demand they change it for the good of the people that bought their product all you want, but demanding that they themselves call their own work shit is just beyond the pale. It strikes me as beyond condescending and like you're looking for affirmation that you're correct above all else. It makes me feel like you just want to pump up your own ego to feel good.

That's why I think they won't change anything in the actual ending but add on it with epilogue DLC.
 
Don't worry, if anyone asks you can maintain that donating to children just ain't cool.

Look, I haven't bought the game yet, nor have I seen the ending, so I may be out in left field in this. I don't think anyone is deriding the fact that they raised $80,000 for Child's Play. It's commendable. What I think rubs people the wrong way is the pretext for raising $80,000 is to not appear like whiny, entitled gamers. The majority probably aren't BTW, but if it takes being disappointed about a videogame ending to raise $80,000 for sick kids it just screams first world problems. Again, the charitable effort is commendable but it seems more like an effort to legitimize a “movement” about a bad game ending rather than a genuine desire to help sick children.

The best way this could work out in my eyes is if EA made a matching donation or all proceeds from the inevitable DLC ending were donated to charity.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I like how people defend the artistic integrity of Bioware while themselves clearly show they don't care. Cutting an important character from the ME 3 base game and making it as a 10$ DLC? No problem for them.

Retconning the story of DAO so that even if you are dead you can import a save in DAO Awakening and be magically alive for no reason? No Problem.

All in the name of art, baby!
 

Cagey

Banned
I like how people defend the artistic integrity of Bioware while themselves clearly show they don't care. Cutting an important character from the ME 3 base game and making it as a 10$ DLC? No problem for them.

Retconning the story of DAO so that even if you are dead you can import a save in DAO Awakening and be magically alive for no reason? No Problem.

As someone said on Twitter...

Changing your art because your heavily invested fans request it? LACKS INTEGRITY.

Changing your art because your bosses or company want to make it more profitable? INTEGRITY.
 

RDreamer

Member
As we are seeing now, things are a little bit different when it comes to an interactive medium that defines itself as an atypical communication between player choice and interactive experience that most people spent 90+ hours on over the period of five years.

As I said, there's nothing wrong with demanding a change. You can do that. They can and likely should oblige. I don't think it lowers their artistic integrity, really. I have a problem, though, with the demand being that the writer himself needs to outright state what he wrote was shit. That's crossing a much different line.
 

hamchan

Member
I like how people defend the artistic integrity of Bioware while themselves clearly show they don't care. Cutting an important character from the ME 3 base game and making it as a 10$ DLC? No problem for them.

Retconning the story of DAO so that even if you are dead you can import a save in DAO Awakening and be magically alive for no reason? No Problem.

Pretty much.

As I said, there's nothing wrong with demanding a change. You can do that. They can and likely should oblige. I don't think it lowers their artistic integrity, really. I have a problem, though, with the demand being that the writer himself needs to outright state what he wrote was shit. That's crossing a much different line.

I haven't seen people doing this too much really.
 
It is a good thing, but actively demanding that an artist out and say their own work is shit is crossing a line I think. You can demand they change it for the good of the people that bought their product all you want, but demanding that they themselves call their own work shit is just beyond the pale. It strikes me as beyond condescending and like you're looking for affirmation that you're correct above all else. It makes me feel like you just want to pump up your own ego to feel good.

They should be able to step back and view their work objectively. Right now, they are going on about artistic integrity and saying that fans shouldn't be mad when the game has gotten so many good reviews. They think their shit don't stink.
 

DTKT

Member
As I said, there's nothing wrong with demanding a change. You can do that. They can and likely should oblige. I don't think it lowers their artistic integrity, really. I have a problem, though, with the demand being that the writer himself needs to outright state what he wrote was shit. That's crossing a much different line.

I hope that no one was seriously asking that...
 

Cagey

Banned
They should be able to step back and view their work objectively. Right now, they are going on about artistic integrity and saying that fans shouldn't be mad when the game has gotten so many good reviews. They think their shit don't stink.

Piggybacking off the above post...

Fans who paid $60 (and over three games, $200+) declaring your product great but possessing an unimaginably terrible, serious flaw? Just whiners.

Reviewers who receive perks from your parent company declaring your product flawless? Objective, unbiased evaluators.

It's comical how gamers are eating their own for this.
 

hamchan

Member
Some are and it's absolutely pathetic.

Where? You can't use this as a broad brush against the fanbase anyways so it's quite irrelevant.

I for one am perfectly fine with telling Mac Walters his ending to this game is one of the worst pieces of shit story I've seen in a video game. I don't need to him to state it too or agree with me, that's up to him. I'm fine with him just hearing it. I'm sure most people feel the same way too.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
This "Retake Mass Effect" movement could do without that name. It just sounds aggressive and entitled. The Marauder Shields meme is kinda funny, but it's gonna get old real soon. I wonder how long the fervor will keep up.

Its just making fun of the pre release "retake earth" market.
 

RDreamer

Member
They should be able to step back and view their work objectively. Right now, they are going on about artistic integrity and saying that fans shouldn't be mad when the game has gotten so many good reviews. They think their shit don't stink.

They said they're looking into things and are going to address their problems. What the fuck more do you want? Just wait and see what they come up with before you complain some more.

It's human to stand behind your work and it's human to be attached to what you've written. Yes you can be objective about it, and having that quality is very good to have. But at the same time you cannot demand that someone say their own work is shitty. That is an unreasonable demand. They can change their work for you, and that's fair, but it's unfair to demand someone decry their own work.

I mean I'm a graphic designer and a writer. I know what it's like to create something. With my designs I know what it's like to create something for a customer. I've had many criticisms that I have to go back and redo. Some I agree with objectively, and some I do not. It's reasonable to change things, no matter what, since it's all about the customer and what they want. It would be unreasonable, however, that the customer demand I call my previous mock up shitty. If I come back to them with the exact design they want, how dare they say back to me "Ok, now tell me your last work was shitty. Say it to me. I want you to say it." That's humiliating and does nothing except stroke your own ego. Imagine if a customer at your work had a problem that you tried your best to fix for them, and you fixed it, yet they demanded that you tell them that what you had previously worked hard on was shitty.
 

MechaX

Member
As I said, there's nothing wrong with demanding a change. You can do that. They can and likely should oblige. I don't think it lowers their artistic integrity, really. I have a problem, though, with the demand being that the writer himself needs to outright state what he wrote was shit. That's crossing a much different line.

I agree to a certain extent. Publicly shaming him just for the sake of shaming goes nowhere. If he wants to defend his ending on the merits, people are well within their right to push back. If he comes to the conclusion on his work as a whole, that is his business. But I don't see much of a point in essentially demanding that he forfeit his own argument, whatever that may be, at this juncture.

Thanks for the spoiler......

To soften the blow, you have to really try to get that ending.
 

Antiwhippy

the holder of the trombone
I too am embarrassed whenever someone donates to charity. Do something better with your money you idiots!

Donating is fine, and should be encouraged. But donating just to prop your cause as "not being entitled and whiney"? Donate to donate, not to make your agenda look better.
 
If Bioware decide to change the ending to appease the fans, they might as well throw out any shred of credibility they had.

You make a 'Director's Cut' of a film to show what you originally had in mind for your vision/show a different interpretation.

Making a change to please your fans is shameless pandering, and an acknowledgement of your own failure as storytellers.
 

Derrick01

Banned
Donating is fine, and should be encouraged. But donating just to prop your cause as "not being entitled and whiney"? Donate to donate, not to make your agenda look better.

Just because Destructoid said that doesn't mean that's what's happening. This was the biggest way to get Bioware to know they're serious. People bitch on the internet all of the time and nothing really happens, but this is something meaningful.
 
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