Incendiary
Banned
When Elizabeth brings Booker to the baptism, he says "it must have been 20 years or so ago." So they're likely bringing 1912 Booker to 1912 Comstock.
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SPOILER Bioshock Infinite SPOILER discussion
- Thread starter thomasmahler
- Start date
When Elizabeth brings Booker to the baptism, he says "it must have been 20 years or so ago." So they're likely bringing 1912 Booker to 1912 Comstock.
The One Who Knocks
Member
1912 age as it's mentioned in the ending that he was in his room for nearly twenty years before the Luteces came for him.
EDIT: And beaten
.Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Quantum what now? That a new cola brand or...?
That is a pretty tasty explanation, though, nice work. That tallies with what is shown, certainly...
....Buuuuuut
P) there are an infinite number of universes with their infinite probabilties, right? Negating all the minor changes (nose picking, fly in ear etc.) only the big possibilities create new universes... so why isn't Booker (perhaps even accidently) drowning got it's own universe? That'd be a pretty big deal.EDIT: I'm gonna hit another playthrough with the your binary interpretation in mind. Thanks, Sorian.
Bastard!
I agree that the discussion is nice but its a pain when I feel like the discussion is breaking the rules that were just set by our now all-seeing narrator (Elizabeth). I feel like the moment that we weren't supposed to be sure of was whether or not the final Liz disappeared. The scene after the credits just feels so shoe-horned in.
Although, I will say that the theory someone presented a ton of pages back was interesting. It was something along the lines of the timeline realized that the only way for the Comstock tree to vanish was for Elizabeth to meddle but the only way for her to meddle was for the Comstock tree to exist which made a paradox and since the universe won't allow paradoxes it just "reset" back to the last working moment. Which means Booker is stuck in this eternal cycle that is like his own personal hell. The song Liz sings also helps forshadowing this and the circle will not be broken apparently
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Bastard!
I agree that the discussion is nice but its a pain when I feel like the discussion is breaking the rules that were just set by our now all-seeing narrator (Elizabeth). I feel like the moment that we weren't supposed to be sure of was whether or not the final Liz disappeared. The scene after the credits just feels so shoe-horned in.
I took that as the whole probabiliti-verse disappearing, not just her. See? I understood it!
Yes. They both talk about being at Wounded Knee for example. Slate thinks Comstock is lying, but Comstock knows way too much about what "you" did there to be making it up.
Quantum what now? That a new cola brand or...?
That is a pretty tasty explanation, though, nice work. That tallies with what is shown, certainly...
....Buuuuuut
EDIT: I'm gonna hit another playthrough with the your binary interpretation in mind. Thanks, Sorian.
Just to get on that last point for you. Ignoring the whole binary for a second. For any universe to come into existence, there has to be at least a .000000000000......0000001% chance of it happening. If there is absolutely no chance that Booker drowns at the baptism (which isn't too much of a stretch, I don't know if you've ever seen one of those old school baptisms but your head is underwater for all of half a second) then it doesn't create a new universe. We can safely assume that the priest had no malicious intent so we can also assume that there is a 0% chance Booker could have drowned.
I took that as the whole probabiliti-verse disappearing, not just her. See? I understood it!
My man! That's my exact explanation for it!
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Not if there was always the possibility that Elizabeth would drown him, then there would be at least a .00000--- oh, I've gone cross-eyed.
I feel all warm and fuzzy now.
And that's why she is special, at first there wasn't that possibility but then she became god and went back and added that possibility. As the twins say "Lived, live, will live. Died, die, will die." But what is special is Liz can just hop in there and say "nope! Lived,live,will die! Drown asshole!"
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Press X to Drown Asshole. Ew.
Nope, I like the binary interpretation. It isn't specifically stated (as far as I recall) but it certainly fits snuggly with what is shown (the twins, the two outcomes of the uprising, the baptism etc).
I doff my cap at thee, sir...
EDIT: ...until I noticed your #TeamCG avatar...
The current working theory is that the lighthouse keeper (gatekeeper for Columbia) was ordered by Comstock to kill any intruders. We are forced to assume that the lighthouse keeper killed Booker in his very first go around, the twins saw this and helped along the process by going in there first on every other attempt and just offing the keeper themselves. They then set it up like that to give Booker more urgency in his made up story.
This made me think of a question though. Why do they give Booker a gun at the beginning that they know he will lose?
The One Who Knocks
Member
The lighthouse keeper was under instructions to kill/stop Booker so in order for him to survive he would have had to have been killed and because he was dead before arrival, yes, the Luteces almost certainly murdered him (and then made him beleive the false memories so Booker didn't decide to 'betray them' and go to Paris with Elizabeth on the First Lady).
Good question. Perhaps wherever he kept it (was he holding it in his hand? I can't remember) prevented him from placing something like the key and causing him to lose that instead. Alternatively, because it set up the expectation for him that there would be resistance and that he was entering a hostile environment (which he remarks upon entering the church when he talks to the NPC, he mentions that he better not ask too many questions [something along this idea] unless he wants to be made). It bolsters the idea that he is 'kidnapping' forcibly taking the girl.
EDIT: Below, very good spot! That would probably imply that he wasn't murdered initially in the lighthouse if they already knew he was there prior to the plan.
Why is a power source marketed as something individuals can use and bottled as such, though? Why would there not be any sort of restrictions on something that can cause as much damage as vigors? If it's like Rapture and they exist because there are no such restrictions, why don't more people use them?
I believe he is the "only one obstacle" from the photo in Lutece Labs.
Edit:
You can hear a couple talking at the festival early in the game and they mention how they would love to be using vigors but they are waiting for Fink to work out all the kinks first. Sounds like the regular populace knows that they can be dangerous and they are waiting for the OK that there is no real danger.
EDIT: ...until I noticed your #TeamCG avatar...
This story is crazy. Why not go to the king of crazy for all your explanation needs? Makes sense to me.
CambriaRising
Member
They seem to be very expensive and rarely available for purchase in vending machines. Think of it like nuclear deterrence though, if someone starts acting up Comstock's guard comes in and puts them down.
Not to mention the people's fear of the SongBird.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Amazing. So much detail.
1912 age as it's mentioned in the ending that he was in his room for nearly twenty years before the Luteces came for him.
EDIT: And beaten
If 1912 Booker is being sent to fight 1912 Comstock, how does the age discrepancy work? Isn't the Comstock Booker kills much older than he is?
Slightly off-topic and this is just me looking forward to the future but the LTTP: Infinite threads will be glorious. I really look forward to the pompous guy coming in and saying "I'm halfway through this game and the story is total ass, I'm done here" and we all just start laughing and nudge him along so that he can understand.
Uno Venova
Banned
Well I'm not happy with where the story went but you can't say they aren't thorough.
This works to some degree, I suppose. Depends on how long they've been around -- I mean, Ken's already set up a situation where these kinds of body alterations made things much worse
CambriaRising
Member
She loses it after she is captured by Comstock.
The audio diaries mention that constant exposure to tear technology causes you to degenerate rapidly, gives cancer, and causes sterility.
The One Who Knocks
Member
Both Bookers are the same age. The Lucete's tear device accelerates aging (as well as cancers, sterility and presumably a host of other health problems). This is in one of the final (the final?) Voxophones on the hand of the prophet.
EDIT: "The Prophet is dying. The metastasis has aged him so quickly. Why does this Comstock decay, while a Comstock in another world remains fit? If genetics are destiny, what accounts for the difference? Perhaps exposure to the contraption? Hm. It merits further study."
Your choices mean nothing. Maybe it's there to make sure you know that. I can't imagine it would be that hard to have two endings with a .1% difference.
Perhaps in some universes Booker chose the other. Her having neither there could be to cover both Bookers. *shrug*
Scott32020
Member
Is it ever specified what era New York is burning in that one tear? Looked closer to modern
Also, was I the only one thinking that was a reference to 9/11 when it was mentioned at first?
Also, was I the only one thinking that was a reference to 9/11 when it was mentioned at first?
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Nah, she has it almost all the way through the ending. I kept my eye on it.
That whole cage/bird thang didn't really go anywhere did it?
1983. I know that is right but I don't remember the evidence as to why.
Time lords have no use for silly trinkets.
So they're both the same age? Although thinking about it now, it's possible Comstock spent time in another tear then went back to his universe, or simply aged in his own universe, then went back to 1912 (or before) in another tear to build Columbia.
Edit: The one who knocks strikes again. Comstock is on some Solid Snake shit.
There's an ad on one of the skyscrapers.
I think it was 1984...
CambriaRising
Member
This works to some degree, I suppose. Depends on how long they've been around -- I mean, Ken's already set up a situation where these kinds of body alterations made things much worse
It could also be said that there is a deafening culture difference for the people of Rapture versus the people of Columbia. The Colombian people are a lot more conservative, and might be averted to trying something that is basically a drug.
Plus in Columbia you arrive before shit goes really bad, in Rapture it has been almost 8 months since the war.
Really? I could have sworn she wasn't wearing it when I took the thing out of her back
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Imagine the TV Tropes 'Wild Mass Guessing' section for Bioshock Infinite... "Elizabeth's a Time Lord".... GAAAAH!
That is a possibility but as the audio diary that someone put into their edit above states, I think they were trying to point to them both being the same age.
Maybe it's a case of most people using them for everyday means, but they're too expensive or not trustworthy enough to use more often. You see some subtle examples, like the shock jockey stations or the devil's kiss that's in chen lin's shop near the fire.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Honest, guv. I remember she still had it on when we were chatting around the infinite Lighthouses.
I scrolled through this video pretty quickly. Looks like she doesn't take off the necklace until you walk into the final baptism/drowning scene.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-VJ3j2bPJk
Edit: I should say, it doesn't disappear until there.
Double Edit: It would have been sick if one of the other Elizabeths that showed up was wearing the necklace you did not choose.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
So what is the central message of Bioshock Infinite? Whatever choices you make in life, you're still screwed.
I told my semi-religious fiancee that the moral of Infinite was that religion makes you a racist piece of shit. I think thats what Ken was going for....
Religion doesn't bother me, honest, I just don't care and make fun of everything
Who were the creepy kids(?) in Comstock House and why were they wearing masks and being reeducated?
Why did they only attack after the Boys of Silence were alerted to your presence?
That part felt really disjointed from the rest of the story but I probably missed something. It was like "now we need a scary section".
Why did they only attack after the Boys of Silence were alerted to your presence?
That part felt really disjointed from the rest of the story but I probably missed something. It was like "now we need a scary section".
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
I think thats what Ken was going for....
No wonder that developer had the hump.
That's a bloody good point.
It could have been so much bitchier. It was odd, but creepy in the right way. A nice break from the usual gameplay, too. I didn't have a problem with it. What I did have a problem with was turning around and being scared shitless by one of them after an entire game of barely anything scary.
jacksepticeye
Member
The choices you make are an illusion and not really your own, in the end the same thing is always gonna happen
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
It did feel kind of disjointed. I think this was just one of those things that spawned from the game being cut and reattached and cut and reattached over and over again. This and songbird are two of the biggest lack of information sections. Best section in the game though.
It's a god damn amazing point and that's why I haven't touched it yet. I want to say that is just silly spit-balling but it could totally be true but I can't fathom the implications that would bring to the story and ending.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Wouldn't your Elizabeth not exist at that point or was Booker married before that Baptism?