Master Milk
Member
Ah, sorry. I'm American.
Where on that site should I be starting?
Handbook and safety gear? Alright, I guess I'll start there.
What's a 250?
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Ah, sorry. I'm American.
Where on that site should I be starting?
Handbook and safety gear? Alright, I guess I'll start there.
What's a 250?
ClassyPenguin
Banned
Click on the state that you are located in, and register for a rider course.
250cc, it's an engine size. The best beginner bike is the ninja 250.
MSf also makes a great handbook
Death Dealer
Member
Or a Honda CBR250R. I've only ridden the old ninja 250. The magazines say the Honda has better torque. But the Ninja has more hp.
Master Milk
Member
Ah, it's a place for lessons. Cool, thanks. I thought it was just a general safety site at first.
The process seems a lot easier than I thought it would be.
Thanks guys, I appreciate the help.
Fallout-NL
Member
I usually point this out whenever this matter comes up. This goes for 2 cylinder models by the way. 600cc inline fours (like the Yamaha R6) are too much for a beginner.
ClassyPenguin
Banned
The new generation of the Ninja 250 and the CBR 250 have really great hardware.
A beginner is most likely to grab at the brakes in a panic stop causing the tires to lock.
In a 600, since the brakes are more sensitive, it will increase the changes of laying the bike down.
A 650 like the Ninja 650 is middle of the road. For bigger riders, I can see how they will be more comfortable on that bike than the 250.
A beginner is most likely to grab at the brakes in a panic stop causing the tires to lock.
In a 600, since the brakes are more sensitive, it will increase the changes of laying the bike down.
A 650 like the Ninja 650 is middle of the road. For bigger riders, I can see how they will be more comfortable on that bike than the 250.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
That's like saying a 350Z is a better beginner's car than a Civic. I mean I see the argument you're making but it really does come down to the motor being too much for a beginner.
How do you guys feel about early 2000's VFR-800s?
I've had a V-Star 950 for over two years now, and it doesn't fit my driving needs. I have a long commute, a bunch of it on SoCal freeways and a windscreen less cruiser isn't that much fun on them (between 80+mph speeds and splitting lanes). I've got 15k on that bike and am ready to move on.
I'd like something sporty but all the smaller powered bikes fit me like a mini bike. My brother in law really loves his VFR, and I like it, I just prefer the inline four sound. I looked at some new bikes, and I really liked the Ninja 1000, but I don't want to drop that much money on a bike right now. I'm finding VFRs that look pretty nice in the 4k range, thinking I should do the change soon Cruisers don't sell well in fall and winter.
I've had a V-Star 950 for over two years now, and it doesn't fit my driving needs. I have a long commute, a bunch of it on SoCal freeways and a windscreen less cruiser isn't that much fun on them (between 80+mph speeds and splitting lanes). I've got 15k on that bike and am ready to move on.
I'd like something sporty but all the smaller powered bikes fit me like a mini bike. My brother in law really loves his VFR, and I like it, I just prefer the inline four sound. I looked at some new bikes, and I really liked the Ninja 1000, but I don't want to drop that much money on a bike right now. I'm finding VFRs that look pretty nice in the 4k range, thinking I should do the change soon Cruisers don't sell well in fall and winter.
thesoapster
Member
Yes but the nicer components on a 650 twin compared to the 250 will in some ways make it safer. The 350Z likely handles better due to a number of better features, better braking, etc. Of course the engine is more powerful, but a 650 twin for someone who has done the MSF BRC is plenty manageable. A 350Z would be closer to a 600cc sport bike...I think it's more like saying an Accord or something is better than a cheap bottom trim small underpowered car.
The Interceptor model of the VFR? They look kinda cool and sound much cooler. They are a tad bit underpowered and heavy, though (but if you've been riding a cruiser that may not be an issue). I'm not sure what your budget is, but I think I'd look at other standards. The Z1000 would be another Kawasaki you might try to find used. Though really these bikes have smaller windscreens that help a little but are not going to provide a stellar amount of wind protection. I'd start looking at BMW, personally. They do hold their value, though, so even used they tend to be a little bit up there. If you're fine with the weight issue, maybe look at used sport touring bikes from other brands - FJR, Concours, etc.? You could also take a 650 twin standard and put a taller screen on it. That would probably be most economic considering how many of those are floating around. Despite the smaller engine size, a 650 twin bike is still likely a bit lighter than the cruiser (and could very well still produce similar power) so it should work itself out.
Fallout-NL
Member
Thanks, yes the Interceptor. I don't want another Twin or anything from BMW though. I'll take a look at the Z1000, that looks pretty nice. I'm somewhat flexible on budget, but don't want to spend more than 5k for a used bike.
Fallout-NL
Member
Congrats. One of the best handling bikes you can buy.
As for accessories... open/carbon exhaust and performance ECU. It's like night and day. Kinda pricey though.
SLEEPS7ALK3R
Banned
Is it possible to grow into a Triumph Speed Triple having completed a riding course without having owned a motorcycle before?
Planning on getting termis eventually, will probably have to wait till next year though, kind of a big cash outlay, and the bike is already plenty powerful enough. Termis do sound awful good though.
As for the speed triple, a 130hp bike for you first bike is a bit sketchy IMO.
Fallout-NL
Member
Try the Street. Already quite a handful. Speed is way too much for a beginner.
Planning on getting termis eventually, will probably have to wait till next year though, kind of a big cash outlay, and the bike is already plenty powerful enough. Termis do sound awful good though.
Yes, I can't get enough of the sound and it's the reason why I invested in the first place. However, what I hadn't expected is that the ECU/exhaust combo would completely transform the feel of the engine. It's so much smoother and less nervous. It feels like a healthy bike now.
It would have been a shame not to spend the extra money, that's what I'm trying to say
. So once you can afford it, I can't recommend it enough.thesoapster
Member
R1's rashed case piece (from last August track high side) is now replaced after drilling out the rashed bolt that remained. Put a case cover/protector/slider on that section. Changed the oil/filter. Removed mirrors and lights fuse. Put number decals on. Final step - put rashed up side fairings back on. Tape up bike on Saturday and get it loaded. Track day Sunday. I will try not to crash this time.
As mentioned, even the Street Triple would be a lot. Keep it in the back of your mind, buy a cheaper used bike (like a 500 or 650 parallel twin perhaps), ride that for a season (try to do many miles) and then consider buying the dream bike
As mentioned, even the Street Triple would be a lot. Keep it in the back of your mind, buy a cheaper used bike (like a 500 or 650 parallel twin perhaps), ride that for a season (try to do many miles) and then consider buying the dream bike
thesoapster
Member
Getting the bike finalized for the track day, I went and put it up on my center stand thingy (Bursig stand that raises it up of two points in the center frame region). I've used this thing a lot. Well, I discovered that if it's not on perfectly level ground, that stand's ability to stand up at all is severely compromised. I lifted the bike up, and it was fine...started backing away, and the fucking stand (and bike) just tipped over to the right. I was so pissed. I got lucky as shit, though. I had my side/under fairings off, new sliders, etc. Nothing was damaged at all. Just some scrape/rash on the right frame slider and bar end slider. My right rearset lost a touch of its black paint, but is otherwise fine. Phew........was surprised how easy it is to pick up my bike when using proper technique. All remaining prep went smoothly. And now it waits...(with my friend's BMW R1100)
thesoapster
Member
Mesh? Cannot be talked into a fully perforated leather jacket?
Cannot recommend pants as my experience is low, but for gloves Held is always a safe bet. I have Knox Handroids that I love. They held up quite well in my high side/slide and will be re-used. For total durability, Held should hold up the best, but I was told the Knox gloves have better dexterity (and they sure feel very nice for a full gauntlet race glove).
No leather. It may be passable but I wouldn't wear it. I have a fairly breathable leather jacket now that I don't wear in the warmer months.
Got myself a 2011 Honda CBR250R, my first motorcycle. I don't have a lot of experience but it feels like a great little bike. I'm still learning and taking things slow. I like in a fairly busy area of Seattle. So mostly I get up early, like 6-7am and try to take it out before traffic gets going. It took a little while before seeing another car didn't make me feel really jumpy and nervous.
I've been getting more and more confident with each ride, and took it out for an hour-long ride down the west side of Lake Washington last week. The first couple times out, I had a rough time, including stalling the bike numerous times (in the middle of a busy intersection once, doh), and getting stuck on an incline, unable to get the bike moving. I've since gotten a lot better on starts and inclines. The main thing I'm working on now is getting a better feel for the bike's capabilities. I am still too tentative off the line. I didn't really notice it until I got "smoked" by someone in a Prius (who wasn't paying any attention to me), but yeah, I need to get my speed up faster. Also turning from a stop is still kinda rough for me. Turn the handlebars before you take off, apparently.
But having a blast! Off to get some new gloves right now actually. I got a set of perforated leather, but it turns out they are just not warm enough for Seattle's 50-degree mornings lately. My frickin' hands always feel like they're going to freeze off after about 30 minutes.
I've been getting more and more confident with each ride, and took it out for an hour-long ride down the west side of Lake Washington last week. The first couple times out, I had a rough time, including stalling the bike numerous times (in the middle of a busy intersection once, doh), and getting stuck on an incline, unable to get the bike moving. I've since gotten a lot better on starts and inclines. The main thing I'm working on now is getting a better feel for the bike's capabilities. I am still too tentative off the line. I didn't really notice it until I got "smoked" by someone in a Prius (who wasn't paying any attention to me), but yeah, I need to get my speed up faster. Also turning from a stop is still kinda rough for me. Turn the handlebars before you take off, apparently.
But having a blast! Off to get some new gloves right now actually. I got a set of perforated leather, but it turns out they are just not warm enough for Seattle's 50-degree mornings lately. My frickin' hands always feel like they're going to freeze off after about 30 minutes.
I was looking at going from a YBR125 to a Street Triple once I do my test, but realistically I probably will get something cheaper first that I can drop and scratch without any worry.
You can probably shift a lot quicker than you suspect. Once you hit the actual lever and shift gears get back on that throttle immediately and give it some juice! Don't rev it like a madman but give it a enough to keep the bike moving well as you release the clutch. You can release the clutch pretty quick as long as you have the throttle going so that it won't stall.
Once you're past first you can probably shift at a higher rpm than you are now as well, but shifting quicker and accelerating faster should do the job to burn a Prius haha. For low speed turns just do it like this guy... You'll get used to low speed turns eventually, practicing in an empty lot would probably help the most. It's sorta just knowing how much speed is enough to not fall over.
@daw840 - I would just check Revzilla.com or motorcycle-superstore.com and see what you like. Most textile stuff is in the 150-250 range. I'd probably get a nice Dainese if I didn't wear hi-viz stuff.
Use just the back brake. Take your fingers completely off the front brake when trying to start on an incline.
When I first started riding someone told me this and it was one of those AHA! moments.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
I crushed the head of a 5' long snake with my front tire. I tried to dodge it but it whipped around and back-tracked straight into my path.
Who's going to take care of its children now? I'm a monster!
Who's going to take care of its children now? I'm a monster!
thesoapster
Member
Track day went pretty well. Did not get enough track time, though. Lots of people signed up, and B group was as fucktarded as ever (worse than before in a number of ways). There were 3 or so crashes in B group alone, and several more in I and A. Ugh. Definitely going to be in I next time. That said, a few good sessions were had. Edited video will be on its way in the near future. I have to say my most humbling moment was when one of the control riders (arguably the fastest guy there as he was the head control rider) passed me as we prepared to enter a turn...and he had a passenger on his bike. I believe the GoPro picked up a "...fucking son of a bitch!!" hahaha.
ClassyPenguin
Banned
As much as I appreciate Ducati's beauty, their seats are terrible. The only one I would get for normal use is the Monster.
To answer your question, I would say at least a year or about 8,000 miles (I put 15K on my first year of riding, but I live in SoCal).
To answer your question, I would say at least a year or about 8,000 miles (I put 15K on my first year of riding, but I live in SoCal).
I'm kinda in the same boat as that question.
Most people progress in a fairly linear manner if they start on a 250. They start on the 250, go to a 600 supersport and then move on to a 1000cc if they feel inclined.
For me, I'm wondering if it's more of the experience you get riding rather than the power of the bike you're riding at the moment. I'm riding my GS500 right now, but I'm wondering if I'd be ok with a jump straight to, say, an S1000RR that has essentially 4x the power after I've ridden for a few years. What would you guys that have moved up in a progression say to something like that?
Edit: As an aside, I've ridden my friend's Honda 599 and have to say something like that is really more than enough power for the road in any situation I think I'd come across, but if an S1000RR came by and I had the funds no doubt I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I'm really looking to track a bike in the coming years.
Most people progress in a fairly linear manner if they start on a 250. They start on the 250, go to a 600 supersport and then move on to a 1000cc if they feel inclined.
For me, I'm wondering if it's more of the experience you get riding rather than the power of the bike you're riding at the moment. I'm riding my GS500 right now, but I'm wondering if I'd be ok with a jump straight to, say, an S1000RR that has essentially 4x the power after I've ridden for a few years. What would you guys that have moved up in a progression say to something like that?
Edit: As an aside, I've ridden my friend's Honda 599 and have to say something like that is really more than enough power for the road in any situation I think I'd come across, but if an S1000RR came by and I had the funds no doubt I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I'm really looking to track a bike in the coming years.
How many years of experience should one have before they take on the new Ducati 1199?
ugg what did they do to the lights?
here is my friend describing his 1098...
He has been riding for a long time, done lots of track racing and owned many fast bikes.
IDK if I would WANT a liter sport bike unless I was going to track it, they are just too fast for the street.
Allot of people buy them because "yay I have the fastest thing legally possible!" and end up never using half of the bikes potential, or killing/seriously injuring themselves not respecting the bikes power.
Death Dealer
Member
At least several years and tens of thousands of miles. It shouldn't be your first sport bike. 99% of all riders will probably turn faster laps on a Japanese 600.
thesoapster
Member
How many years of experience should one have before they take on the new Ducati 1199?
Those are 996 style lights, man!
Yep, agreed. Depends entirely on your type of experience, too. If you took MSF and got a bike like an SV650, rode some on the street, and then tracked it for a couple years you'd likely be well-suited to take on a Panigale. Whether or not you'd benefit greatly is up in the air. It's a very expensive bike to track...
If you were just thinking of riding on the street, yeah I mean you could probably manage the bike after a year of street riding on something smaller. But most guys I've seen who are on 1000s after a season of a moderate amount of riding (non-fast) a 600 cannot go fast on the 1000. There's not much point to owning a bike like that if you cannot ride it well.
I bet if you made the jump to a middleweight for a track bike (600 or 750) you'd be more than satisfied for a long time. Middleweights are better for a lot of the track experience, anyway. The only times I'm glad I'm on a 1000 at the track is when I'm coming out of a corner and have that little extra oomph that a 600 doesn't have, or when I'm passing.
SLEEPS7ALK3R
Banned
Are there any custom builders out there currently toying with the idea of full head, advanced helmets akin to Iron Man's? I've always been fascinated by this.
There's this artist on DeviantArt by the name of Machine56 that has a similar concept but I doubt the materials he uses meet the standard testing req's (DOT, Snell, etc.) for motorcycles. In fact, I don't even think it's a bike helmet...
Anyway, the idea of starting a project like this excites the hell out of me, since I've always been drawn to industrial design.
Here's my batshit 5 minute coffee break wank:
Make a cast of the head + face. Material used for inner lining: Unknown.
Strip down a head mounted personal viewer (preferably Hi-def, 3D, and with a big FOV) and head cam lens. Assemble... Not sure how... Fuck it.
Helmet's chin + "Jaw bone" come forward to allow you to take the helmet off (the inside of the chin is a perfect cast of your chin, so it's a snug fit once it's closed. Fuck it, you don't need to speak.) Pushing the jaw in brings the faceplate clamping down, like Iron Man (fuck yeah). Throw in a speed sensor and a fancy HUD and you're set.
Also, air vents. Important. Can't have you suffocating...
Do any of you have any info regarding this subject, any ideas? Possible benefit, hindrances? Is it impractical? IS IT FUCKING COOL?! Chime in.
There's this artist on DeviantArt by the name of Machine56 that has a similar concept but I doubt the materials he uses meet the standard testing req's (DOT, Snell, etc.) for motorcycles. In fact, I don't even think it's a bike helmet...
Anyway, the idea of starting a project like this excites the hell out of me, since I've always been drawn to industrial design.
Here's my batshit 5 minute coffee break wank:
Make a cast of the head + face. Material used for inner lining: Unknown.
Strip down a head mounted personal viewer (preferably Hi-def, 3D, and with a big FOV) and head cam lens. Assemble... Not sure how... Fuck it.
Helmet's chin + "Jaw bone" come forward to allow you to take the helmet off (the inside of the chin is a perfect cast of your chin, so it's a snug fit once it's closed. Fuck it, you don't need to speak.) Pushing the jaw in brings the faceplate clamping down, like Iron Man (fuck yeah). Throw in a speed sensor and a fancy HUD and you're set.
Also, air vents. Important. Can't have you suffocating...
Do any of you have any info regarding this subject, any ideas? Possible benefit, hindrances? Is it impractical? IS IT FUCKING COOL?! Chime in.
RapidCancel
Member
Have to agree with this...middleweights are amazing for track bikes and loads of fun to swing around. You'll def know who's on a liter bike at the track when they pass you as if it looks like you're standing still. Though I do want to track my liter bike, it's only been a year and I probably won't yet. I know a lot of people who have been using middleweights forever.
I mainly use my liter bike for street riding and it works pretty well. Has that extra power on the freeway whenever I need it and I'm never flat out riding like crazy anyway.
Kind of weird to see that one bike has huge chicken strips while my track bike has ripped up edges lol.
Those are 996 style lights, man!
The lights themselves are not bad, its that droopy "nose" thing that is throwing me.
Maybe I should take off early and stop by the ducati dealer to see it in person... always better to appreciate with your own eyes
Fallout-NL
Member
Yeah, it's gorgeous, no doubt. I might prefer the 1098 style nose, but sometimes the Ducati superbikes need some time to grow on you.
thesoapster
Member
My bike always ends up getting rid of the "strip" on the edge, but it takes time for sure. Not so many corners work well enough to go that fast through on the street. After this past track day my rear tire is nice and melted looking to the edge
1000s are way better on the street (not to start on of course). And since I've decided I'm not giving up street riding, I'll be holding onto the R1. It does plenty well at the track.
The lights themselves are not bad, its that droopy "nose" thing that is throwing me.
Maybe I should take off early and stop by the ducati dealer to see it in person... always better to appreciate with your own eyes
That bike without those big stupid lollipop mirrors looks realllly good. And yes it has hella big intakes there
Fallout-NL
Member
Hmm, never had my knee down before. But I've never done any track-days either. On the street I like to keep a bit of a margin.
thesoapster
Member
Dude...what!? WHAT!? Should definitely do a track day. It's great fun.
There are guys who pick great roads and go back and forth to make sure its clean and low traffic and knee drag etc. I wouldn't try it, generally speaking. I've gotten about low enough to do it, but you have to be thinking about the corner, body position, etc. The street demands that you focus on other things that you can mostly forget about on the track, and I never believe you ever fully "know" the street because of how its conditions constantly change.
...so do a track day
YuriLowell
Member
So I tried to take the MSF class about 2 years ago but the instructors we were given were awful, and I didn't even bother to come back for the second day.
Thinking about going back and taking the class from the local harley dealer, which costs twice as much, but has much smaller classes, and it lasts twice as long.
Thinking about going back and taking the class from the local harley dealer, which costs twice as much, but has much smaller classes, and it lasts twice as long.
thesoapster
Member
Looking over my track footage I haven't found much that would be really worth sharing, but this one small bit I uploaded to YT is, in my opinion. It shows the top control rider (not control riding) who is also a racer passing me before entering a corner...with a fucking passenger.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qSrJeyfIQQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qSrJeyfIQQ
Fallout-NL
Member
Dude...what!? WHAT!? Should definitely do a track day. It's great fun.
There are guys who pick great roads and go back and forth to make sure its clean and low traffic and knee drag etc. I wouldn't try it, generally speaking. I've gotten about low enough to do it, but you have to be thinking about the corner, body position, etc. The street demands that you focus on other things that you can mostly forget about on the track, and I never believe you ever fully "know" the street because of how its conditions constantly change.
...so do a track day
Hehe, I'll consider it. The YZF750 should be perfect for such an occasion.
RapidCancel
Member
My bike always ends up getting rid of the "strip" on the edge, but it takes time for sure. Not so many corners work well enough to go that fast through on the street. After this past track day my rear tire is nice and melted looking to the edge
1000s are way better on the street (not to start on of course). And since I've decided I'm not giving up street riding, I'll be holding onto the R1. It does plenty well at the track.
I literally drive a straight line for 45 mins to get to work, I'll never get rid of the chicken strips, but it doesn't bother me..it's exactly why I got the bike for lol.
My rear tire on the track bike on the other hand...mmm, so sexy lol.
What group are you in for track days?
Always a good idea, especially on the street. Even at the track, I rarely drag knee. If I do, I usually just lift my knee back up (knee pucks are expensive...) Not to mention that my fastest lap times usually has me not dragging knee. It just depends how tall you are. I'm short so I have to hang off like a spider monkey if I want to drag anything and tall people can do it barely leaned over.