He has a point. People seem to think that Joe doesn't have to follow these things since he's just a guy in his room on Youtube. =P Check throughout the thread.
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Angry Joe gets called out by IGNs review editor for misquoting their Titanfall review
- Thread starter Dawg
- Start date
He has a point. People seem to think that Joe doesn't have to follow these things since he's just a guy in his room on Youtube. =P Check throughout the thread.
Alright, this makes more sense. Although I don't really think that Joe was singling out IGN's review. Again, he was more so talking about the overall reaction of major outlets. But that said, taking something from their preview and putting it on the screen is not good. Joe should be more responsible with the content he throws up on the screen when talking about certain sections. But I still think Dan comes off looking bad here. The way he went about it, and then taunting Joe over youtube views is just...I dunno, childish. Especially if you are a professional. But Joe also shouldn't have replied to him either. So I guess both lose out on this one.
Sessler sucks but for other reasons these days.
Vicetrailia
Member
I'm on Joe's side, I think the Dan guy is being oversensitive. I think Joe was being general, not singling IGN out or only targeting IGN despite using their score and quote as an example. Context kills.
No one disagrees with you here. =)
DyslexicAlucard
Member
Here is Joe claiming that all of the side missions only add an hour to the overall playtime. If the link doesn't work properly, it's 3:43 into the video.
Good enough proof for you?
Yeah, I had to re-read some posts a couple times. I was MISSING the point you guys were making. My apologies.
Heavy_D_Forever
Banned
He knowingly took a quote from a PREVIEW and used it while criticizeing REVIEWS.
Anyone who works in journalism would find that decietful and just bad practice.
It makes him look amatuer, which he is.
Anyone who works in journalism would find that decietful and just bad practice.
It makes him look amatuer, which he is.
Perhaps IGN shouldn't make such asinine, over zealous quotes pre release and we wouldn't run into this problem.
Yeah guys, we have to take it literally. Don't worry about the context of what was being highlighted by Joe. Let's take it literally because that's how we are.
Seriously though, I think Dan made a mad move. Joe's in the right, though how he acted immaturely during the spat.
Being an entertainer is a "real job". He do have bosses at the end of day and that's the public. If people stop watching him, he lose money. Sure he cant be "fired" like non freelancers, but he still have to put out work out for the public to consume or else he do not get paid.
Just because he's not censored and in constant fear of being fired for misspeaking, do not mean it's not a real job. It's new type of work created by how easy it is for anybody with a webcam to just go out there and do critique.
Antilurker77
Member
Messofanego
Banned
I'm not sure why this thread is still alive. It's not like we're waiting on these guys to give a press conference.
...Scatter...
Banned
I get Dan's point. Previews are not reviews, and as he is in charge of reviews at IGN, he feels like his work was being mis-represented. I believe Joe didn't think anything of the difference between a review and preview and that's why he got so defensive. It was his bad from a professionalism standpoint, and surely as he reflects on that later he will understand and will probably take this as a valuable lesson. There are real people's work that you're attacking on your shows. You better be right.
And if you picture someone you point out as an offender, and then rail about what you hate about offenders like that, when that "offender" didn't even do the things you just railed about, then you're wrongfully assigning that offense to them.
It would be easy to dismiss YouTuber's as just entertainment not to be taken seriously, but some of these channels have hundreds of thousands of views. They can damage your reputation.
And if you picture someone you point out as an offender, and then rail about what you hate about offenders like that, when that "offender" didn't even do the things you just railed about, then you're wrongfully assigning that offense to them.
It would be easy to dismiss YouTuber's as just entertainment not to be taken seriously, but some of these channels have hundreds of thousands of views. They can damage your reputation.
staticneuron
Member
DyslexicAlucard
Member
A debate can continue after an event, even if those directly involved have resolved it. I don't know why you're confused, to be honest.
Heavy_D_Forever
Banned
I have no problems with YouTubers. Yahtzee is a brilliant journalist, and I also enjoy the Jimquisition by Jim Sterling.
My problem is douchebags like Joe who act completely unprofessional and then start crying and shouting when they get called out on it. Either get your shit straight or be ready for people to call you a jackass, but I'm sure he's used to being called a jackass.
staticneuron
Member
The onus is on you when you expect more than what is presented. I am sorry but I didn't see Joe refer to himself as a Journalist. So exactly what standard are you holding him up to?
Exactly, he is yet another trumped up You Tuber with an angry persona shtick.
Just another name on a list of talentless fools with a web cam trying to leach a living from the people that actually matter in this industry i.e. the developers.
He voices opinions, commentates news, conducts interviews and reviews games for a large audience. He is fulfilling the role of a journalist whether he claims to be one or not.
BouncyFrag
Member
Angry Joe should do a review of this thread. AJ, make this happen. Lots of potential with this that shouldn't be left unused.
Talentless? Really? Since the beginning of times there is people who do stuff and people who critique stuff and people who critique the critiques. Devs NEED people like Joe or ProJared or the gaming journalists to do promotion and make people think about what they buy.
I wish I had the talent and charisma that Joe have to make entertaining videos days after days coming with new ideas for sketches and costumes.
He's not an "angry" persona. Hell, most reviews he does he's smiling ear to ear talking about how much he loved a mechanic of the game. And yet he still critique harshly the stuff he do not find good. He's fair. He's not a guy like the Irate Gamer who copied the character of AVGN. He's his own guy with his own stuff.
The job of Journalist existed in the past to propagate news. With the internet, where I can see a car crash happening in China on 1080p video from 10 different angles, journalists are not as defined anymore. Anybody can report and critique news. Not only that but written reviews will likely die too, since you can put more for less efforts with videos.
Bornstellar
Member
*Reads thread*
Yikes.
For what it's worth, Titanfall IS a really awesome game IMO. I'd also say most of the points Joe makes about the game are pretty accurate.
Yikes.
For what it's worth, Titanfall IS a really awesome game IMO. I'd also say most of the points Joe makes about the game are pretty accurate.
Messofanego
Banned
Which was resolved in like 5 pages, it's just now repeating in cycles.
I haven't watched much Angry Joe. I know I didn't like that Titanfall review though. It's 30 minutes that could have been cut down to, I 'unno, 20-25 if he'd rehearsed his dialogue, wrote it for brevity and edited out the botches and fat. Maybe people prefer the naturalistic dialogue. I like that out of podcasts and LP's, but not so much reviews. I guess this is a different sort of review, one more entertainment-oriented. That's fine.
I do think he made fair points about the lack of social features. Just not points I couldn't have gotten from asking anyone who's played the game. Also couldn't help balking at the comment about it being scary if people can compare a certain Titanfall component to Brink. If that's not some sort of fallacy, I don't know what is. Like, because a certain component of a game can be measured against a worse game, we're supposed to entertain a general sense of dread about the former game as a whole? Maybe I misheard him though. Long video, not gonna check.
In any case, ISN'T TWITTER A BLAST, GUYS!?
I do think he made fair points about the lack of social features. Just not points I couldn't have gotten from asking anyone who's played the game. Also couldn't help balking at the comment about it being scary if people can compare a certain Titanfall component to Brink. If that's not some sort of fallacy, I don't know what is. Like, because a certain component of a game can be measured against a worse game, we're supposed to entertain a general sense of dread about the former game as a whole? Maybe I misheard him though. Long video, not gonna check.
In any case, ISN'T TWITTER A BLAST, GUYS!?
DyslexicAlucard
Member
Oh, there's no doubt the thread is cyclical. But not everyone can monitor it the whole day, and some will just be discovering it now. It makes sense that those people will want to chime in, even if the zeitgeist will have passed it by already.
Ivory Samoan
Gold Member
staticneuron
Member
An entertainer can do those things as well, right? Anyone can be an entertainer. You can do so how ever you choose but normally modern journalist are those that follow a method and that method is normally taught via school or within the trade.
Would you call anyone that is in your town trying to enforce laws and "protect" the citizens while wielding a gun a cop?
Do you find that anyone who that is knowledgeable about some laws and is a good personal speaker a lawyer?
What about a person that claims to be a doctor?
Yea, just because you may do something similar doesn't mean that people would or should recognize you as a member of a certain profession. Especially if you haven't claimed to be one yourself.
In Germany with have this saying: "Getroffene Hunde bellen" and that's pretty fitting here. Meaning, Joe hit the nail on the head and IGN can't take it.
IGN got called out on their BS and they felt embarrassed so IGN guy wrote some sarcastic twitter posts about it and started a stupid argument about a 0.1 score difference. Ridiculous.
Even on this forum people made fun of that particular piece of IGN hype-writing months ago. IGN has become the poster child of inflated review scores and the incestuous relationship between media and publisher for a reason and now they just will have to live with that reputation.
IGN got called out on their BS and they felt embarrassed so IGN guy wrote some sarcastic twitter posts about it and started a stupid argument about a 0.1 score difference. Ridiculous.
Even on this forum people made fun of that particular piece of IGN hype-writing months ago. IGN has become the poster child of inflated review scores and the incestuous relationship between media and publisher for a reason and now they just will have to live with that reputation.
R_thanatos
Member
Since when did it became a youtubers against develloppers ?
What about everyone in the middle ?How can you make this kind of statement and ignoring the entire gaming ecosystem that rely on information between develloppers and consummers that youtubers are only a part of..
I think you masterfully missed the point
Roland1979
Junior Member
More prove that IGN simply cannot be taken serious.
MisterSamMan
Member
Thanks for the beautiful summary! The argument was really unbearable to read.
RpgN
Junior Member
Gotta say, I'm surprised to see certain negative comments against Joe in an exaggerating way. Some of them also explicitly try to say negative things about 'youtubers' as a whole.
It seems to me that some neogaf comments come from the 'journalist' side who dislike and fear 'youtubers'.
It seems to me that some neogaf comments come from the 'journalist' side who dislike and fear 'youtubers'.
Agreed here on all counts.
AkimbO_Arcana
Banned
Angry Joe sucks and IGN guy sucks too but at least he has a point, funny how everyone is jumping on him.
But I guess it's deserved for that preview 'piece' OP linked. Fucking disgusting...
But I guess it's deserved for that preview 'piece' OP linked. Fucking disgusting...
Angry Joe is a passionate fan. For that I appreciate his work even if it doesn't always echo my sentiments, but I dont expect it to either.
IGN is a big business outlet where critical analysis takes a back seat to propagating the carefully constructed PR campaigns. Either that or racing to scoop hot news stories, resulting in incidents like Metal Gear Triology.
Ign have a poor reputation due to a history of poor work. I'll always take angry Joe's heart on sleeve missteps over ign's cynically constructed lies.
I can't wait to see the inevitable Jimquisition about how important 0.1 really isn't. It's just a fucking rounding error.
IGN is a big business outlet where critical analysis takes a back seat to propagating the carefully constructed PR campaigns. Either that or racing to scoop hot news stories, resulting in incidents like Metal Gear Triology.
Ign have a poor reputation due to a history of poor work. I'll always take angry Joe's heart on sleeve missteps over ign's cynically constructed lies.
I can't wait to see the inevitable Jimquisition about how important 0.1 really isn't. It's just a fucking rounding error.
Haunted
Member
There's only two ways twitter bitch fights end. One participant deletes his account or makes it private or both realise how shameful their behaviour has been and apologise.
case in point!Posting this again in case people are too lazy to read the revious page.
ChawlieTheFair
pip pip cheerio you slags!
While that's an issue, it doesn't excuse what Joe did, or for that matter what Dan did either.
Point is, everybody is shitty, but they apologized, so lets eat cake!!!
Like ign.
Yeah sort of pisses me off when they say they don't have real jobs. Personally I like youtubers who review stuff not just video games because they can cut through the corporate bull and tell me about the product without worrying about some mega corporation company over their heads.
TheContact
Member
Like B+ or A-
Very close scores but in different categories. With their rating system it makes sense that .1 makes a difference.
For real? I get people not liking his style and persona.
He is anything but talentless.
Leaching a living from the developers?
Did you ever watch even one of his reviews? Its really detailed with suggestions for improvement, far better than any reviews from the traditional media.
And i for one had bought many games mainly because of his reviews.
Angry Persona?
He is always smiling 90% of the time during the reviews pointing out the joy he felt during with some mechanics and some level or whatever.
I get it. You don't like the guy. But that doesn't justify calling him a "talentless fool".
It seems to me that this was a big misunderstanding on both parties. Dan thought that Joe was misquoting their review on purpose while Joe was trying to demonstrate the hype surrounding the game. Any way glad that they have sorted it out as joe have tweeted and this show that both of them are mature.
Custard Trout
Member
No one actually likes IGN right?